BEST bang for your buck... ESS TS1 or TS2 ??? Please chime in

[jetskier88]

Just like the title says... im in the market for an ESS TS and i plan on buying it in May (when my warranty expires)... I practically saved up all the money for a TS1 sooner than expected so now im contemplating whether i should save up more for the TS2??? is it worth the extra 2k????

[HighBoostin330]

For the extra cooling benefits and higher boost. It is definitely worth it if you have a manual transmission! :thumbsup:

[Chr325is]

I'd say go for the TS2, if you get the TS1 you'll probably end up wanting the TS2 in a few months anyway.

[jetskier88]

hmm good points.. im just wondering if its gonna be a bigger pain in the ass to install the ts2.... and if im gonnna fuk up my engine by trying to crank out too much power???

[HighBoostin330]

hmm good points.. im just wondering if its gonna be a bigger pain in the ass to install the ts2.... and if im gonnna fuk up my engine by trying to crank out too much power???

The only PITA I can see is running the cooling lines for the heat exchanger. Everything is really compacted into the intake manifold. ESS thoroughly tests their products and would not release it if it had the possibility of ruining your engine. With ESS, you are in safe hands. :)

[jetskier88]

hmm so i guess i think i know where im leaning to lol.. ts2:thumbsup: ha ha... but am i gonna have to replace my clutch also?! i have about 40k miles on it..

[HighBoostin330]

hmm so i guess i think i know where im leaning to lol.. ts2:thumbsup: ha ha... but am i gonna have to replace my clutch also?! i have about 40k miles on it..

Your stock clutch should be fine, but an uprated clutch will not hurt. If you clutch does burn out, then pick up a lightweight flywheel and clutch combo. If I were you, I would drive the stock clutch until it is a goner.

[Lemonsqr]

I would suggest you go ahead and get the TS2. Boost is addictive. I thought the TS1 would be enough for me :tsk: I got the TS1, but will soon be upgrading to TS2 after having TS1 on for about a year...unfortunately this means I have to take the whole SC off the engine, so essentially I am installing the SC twice....so yeah, go with the TS2 :thumbsup:

[ScottKendall]

I've got to play devil's advocate here. I'm seriously considering the TS1 on my 330i. Why would you spend $2K for 25bhp, not to mention the additional pain of hooking up the cooler. Respectfully, ASAed330 had the work done, so I think it is easier for him to say it was worth it. I think the TS1 is just the slickest deal - relatively simple kit, looks stock, and adds tons of power.

There is a related question here, perhaps the ESS folks can clarify. Starting with Pv=nRT relating pressure, density, and temperature. Standard atmosphere is 15 psia (psi absolute). Adding 7 psi gives you 22 psia - 50% more air and 50% more hp. Adding 1psi to that is roughly 5% more air 5% more power or about 25hp assuming no cooling of the charge. I think this supports ESS' point that the supercharger is very efficient and adds very little heat to the air because this calculation only works out if the temperature does not change. So why do we need a cooler for the TS2? Isn't cooling alone supposed to boost power?

[HighBoostin330]

I've got to play devil's advocate here. I'm seriously considering the TS1 on my 330i. Why would you spend $2K for 25bhp, not to mention the additional pain of hooking up the cooler. Respectfully, ASAed330 had the work done, so I think it is easier for him to say it was worth it. I think the TS1 is just the slickest deal - relatively simple kit, looks stock, and adds tons of power.

There is a related question here, perhaps the ESS folks can clarify. Starting with Pv=nRT relating pressure, density, and temperature. Standard atmosphere is 15 psia (psi absolute). Adding 7 psi gives you 22 psia - 50% more air and 50% more hp. Adding 1psi to that is roughly 5% more air 5% more power or about 25hp assuming no cooling of the charge. I think this supports ESS' point that the supercharger is very efficient and adds very little heat to the air because this calculation only works out if the temperature does not change. So why do we need a cooler for the TS2? Isn't cooling alone supposed to boost power?

The cooler for the TS2 allows the engine to continue to make consistent power over long duration to exposed heat - say the midwest heat in the summer or the Arizona desert. Once the temperature increases, the engine will pull timing to safe guard the engine. Thus, if you read up on what AJ has been telling other owners who have steptronics, he recommends them stay with the TS1 to maintain a margin of safety for the transmission and recommends the cooler only if they expose their cars to hot weather in order to keep the increased power gains.

[TxZHP04]

I've got to play devil's advocate here. I'm seriously considering the TS1 on my 330i. Why would you spend $2K for 25bhp, not to mention the additional pain of hooking up the cooler. Respectfully, ASAed330 had the work done, so I think it is easier for him to say it was worth it. I think the TS1 is just the slickest deal - relatively simple kit, looks stock, and adds tons of power.

There is a related question here, perhaps the ESS folks can clarify. Starting with Pv=nRT relating pressure, density, and temperature. Standard atmosphere is 15 psia (psi absolute). Adding 7 psi gives you 22 psia - 50% more air and 50% more hp. Adding 1psi to that is roughly 5% more air 5% more power or about 25hp assuming no cooling of the charge. I think this supports ESS' point that the supercharger is very efficient and adds very little heat to the air because this calculation only works out if the temperature does not change. So why do we need a cooler for the TS2? Isn't cooling alone supposed to boost power?

Check out the actual performance characteristics of a 1.6L Lysholm TS:

http://www.opcon.se/www/files/lysholm/pdf/performance%20charts/diagram_lys1600ax.pdf

Obviously, the charge temperature increases more than you think.

Installing the cooler really isn't all that much additional work compared to the rest of the install.

If you think you'll be happy with the gains from 7 psi and don't mind a little more potential for heat soak, the TS1 may be the best option for you. If there's a possibility you might want to upgrade to more hp later, get the TS2 up front as it will save you time, effort, and money in the long run while providing more consistent hp (ie, during hot weather) in the near term.

[Dirtboy]

The only PITA I can see is running the cooling lines for the heat exchanger.


I installed my TS2+ and the cooling system was one of the easier parts of the install.

And like everyone is saying, once you drive with 7psi, you'll want more. I've got 8.5 and I'm thinking of getting the TS3...:4ngie:

[jetskier88]

I installed my TS2+ and the cooling system was one of the easier parts of the install.

And like everyone is saying, once you drive with 7psi, you'll want more. I've got 8.5 and I'm thinking of getting the TS3...:4ngie:

the problem is that i dont have a lift... do u need one to install the heat exchanger?? do u need to remove the bottom plastic shield off??

[HighBoostin330]

I installed my TS2+ and the cooling system was one of the easier parts of the install.

And like everyone is saying, once you drive with 7psi, you'll want more. I've got 8.5 and I'm thinking of getting the TS3...:4ngie:

I'll give the review in about a week or two. :)

This break-in period is just killing me. :cry:

[ken330i]

Trillion of fanatics are unpatiently waiting for your review :banghead:

I'll give the review in about a week or two. :)

This break-in period is just killing me. :cry:

[HighBoostin330]

Trillion of fanatics are unpatiently waiting for your review :banghead:

:rofl: I doubt trillion of fanatics are waiting. I will have reviews shortly - patience :). The break-in of the engine is really killing me at this point. :banghead:

[ScottKendall]

Check out the actual performance characteristics of a 1.6L Lysholm TS:

http://www.opcon.se/www/files/lysholm/pdf/performance%20charts/diagram_lys1600ax.pdf

Obviously, the charge temperature increases more than you think.

Installing the cooler really isn't all that much additional work compared to the rest of the install.


Great link! (How do you know how much I thought it raised the temp.:P)

So what I think I hear you and ASAed330 saying is that the cooler gives you benefit with heat soak, and this benefit is not seen in any dyno run. As the TS1 kit warms up, the performance "sags" some. It also seems as if the TS2 is a much better foundation if jetskier88 is planning to do additional mods to increase power because he is at a heat limit with the TS1 kit. (BTW it gets dang hot up here in Kentucky too.)

I'm greatful to ASAed330 for his threads. I want to hear the review, but I am more concerned about longterm issues.

[shockin330i]

step FTL :(

[Dirtboy]

the problem is that i dont have a lift... do u need one to install the heat exchanger?? do u need to remove the bottom plastic shield off??


You don't "need" a lift. It makes it easier, but it can be installed without a lift.

[thekubiaks]

Sell the Beamer and get a ZO6 (C5 or C6) . That way you won't wreck your resale value and you'll get a car light years faster across the board... That is what I am doing.... but it is tough to sell a modded Beamer :(

[Minnoe07]

You don't need a lift to install the TS2 but you do need to get under your car. A jack and jackstands will do the trick nicely.

And the TS2 is a much better bargain. If you do want to go TS2 from TS1, you won't have to install the supercharger again. Heatsoak takes much longer to set in and drag your power down. And 25 horsepower doesn't sound like a lot, but how much money will you spend to get an extra 25 hp? And the difference between 1 hr of driving between a TS1 and TS2 is probably even greater.

I went to dyno at a local shop. The operator has obviously seen many FI cars. We did pulls with the car warmed up and at the end, he approached with a suprised look and said, "Wow, whoever designed that supercharger and cooler setup did a good job because your power dropped very little in between runs."

THAT is worth it to me. :excited: