Dyno ????

[elite53]

When you guys get your cars dyno'd where do they usually pull your A/F ratio from?

I have an appointment tomorrow to put my car on the dyno to see how my TS2 is doing and the guy said on the phone that it costs extra to do the A/F ratio because they have to weld in a special bung in the exhaust. He also said he could just use a sniffer in the tail pipe but it's not very accurate and he doesn't recommend it.

Which way did you guy's go on this?

[TxZHP04]

Good question.

I hit the dyno Saturday morning. $60 for 3 runs with A/F so I'm guessing it'll be a sniffer for me.

[elite53]

You got a better deal than me. This place wants $70 bucks for one pull. I can see why more than one pull would be nice but is it necessary? Maybe I should shop around but this place is really close to me.

[Asbjorn@ESS]

Exhaust sniffer will be fine. It reads a little leaner usually but not much.

[elite53]

Thanks AJ... :thumbsup: Also, thank you for all your help with diagnosing my cold start issue. I haven't found it yet but I'm stubborn and I'm not giving up. Be patient with me... :)

[HighBoostin330]

My dynos were from the tail sniffer also.

FYI, below is a picture of the DME for the RPM pick up point. Look for the black wire with a red stripe in the bundle pointed by the yellow arrow and use that as your RPM pick up so the dyno guy does not need to open your engine covers and get it from the ignition coils. Just saves you some hassle.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v175/AzN2k4/mod22ccopy.jpg

[elite53]

Ahh Ha! , thank you... I did not know that. I will definately point this out to them when I get there. Anything else I should know? What about something called SAE smoothing or something like that? I'm not even sure if thats right. I just thought I heard it in a thread somewhere.

[HighBoostin330]

Ahh Ha! , thank you... I did not know that. I will definately point this out to them when I get there. Anything else I should know? What about something called SAE smoothing or something like that? I'm not even sure if thats right. I just thought I heard it in a thread somewhere.

Well it is just the correction factor. There is a SAE, DIN, and STD commonly know correction factors. SAE is what is mostly used on this forum. DIN is what seems to be what ESS uses back in Norway. STD is really what those Mustang people use, since I went to a Mustang performance shop to do my dyno. I would ask for a DIN print out so that it matches what ESS claims on their website. Then get a SAE print out to compare it apples to apples on the forum. My numbers are pretty darn close to what ESS claims and through the dyno and AFR, it can be determined if your car is running correctly or not. :thumbsup:

The less smoothing you have, the more jagged lines you have. If you do a smoothing of 5, it will come out relatively smooth, thus the name.

[elite53]

Do I want this smoothing? Seems like it might hide a problem if I have one.

[HighBoostin330]

Do I want this smoothing? Seems like it might hide a problem if I have one.

From what I hear, most shops use smooth of 5 so as to not cheat power through power output spikes. With a smooth of 5 you can compare it equally to what ESS dynos claim on their website. It should be very smooth power output without major fluctuations. I think other people should chime in on this to get more views about this topic.

[elite53]

Wow! Thanks for all the info. I really do appreciate your help. It's going to help me get the most for my money when I get on the Dyno. :bow:

[HighBoostin330]

Wow! Thanks for all the info. I really do appreciate your help. It's going to help me get the most for my money when I get on the Dyno. :bow:

If you really want the most of your money, bring a USB drive and ask them to transfer the dyno file (.drf) onto your USB drive and you can take it home and download the WinPEP7 program and have a digital copy of your dyno graph that you can see as you change between SAE, DIN, STD, and even uncorrected for environmental factors.

You can also print out as many copies of your dyno graph as you like also. :rofl: I kid I kid.

[elite53]

You laugh......But I might wallpaper my garage with it if it comes out right. :rofl: Thats how much I love this Twinscrew. Sad huh?

[HighBoostin330]

You laugh......But I might wallpaper my garage with it if it comes out right. :rofl: Thats how much I love this Twinscrew. Sad huh?

Better be careful there or else someone is sleeping on the couch tonight. :rofl:

I love my twinscrew also. :)

Goodluck on your dyno! :thumbsup:

[elite53]

Thanks again...






P.S. I'm moving that couch to the garage if that's the case. :4ngie:

[HighBoostin330]

Thanks again...






P.S. I'm moving that couch to the garage if that's the case. :4ngie:

:lmao: You're a funny man. Just be careful when you sleep. :rofl:

No problem on the assistance. Just paying back with info I have learned from others that have taught me. :hi:

[elite53]

Well...I just got back from my dyno runs. I thought I'de post up the results. I'm not sure if the numbers are what they should be so I'm looking for feedback from people that know about this kind of stuff.

My car is a 2002 325Ci and the runs were made on a DynoJet.

Negative feed back is not necessary....Keep in mind that this is just a measly 325Ci. :P

[elite53]

Dynojet Research Inc.
Run Name: C:\DynoRuns\BMW\325ci\\RunFile_004.drf
Run Title:
Run Notes:
Run Date: 4/25/2008 2:52:29 PM

RunFile_004.drf: 62.67 °F 30.35 in-Hg Humidity: 28 % SAE: 0.95 Average Gear

Ratio: 54.34

s RPM x1000 hp ft-lbs Air/Fuel *BooST
0.47 1.80 N/A N/A 15.26 2.24
0.67 1.85 56.02 159.05 14.98 2.19
0.86 1.90 57.21 158.15 14.62 2.23
1.05 1.95 58.83 158.45 14.07 2.36
1.24 2.00 61.24 160.82 13.36 2.46
1.43 2.05 63.60 162.94 12.89 2.61
1.61 2.10 66.08 165.26 12.68 2.71
1.80 2.15 68.63 167.64 12.61 2.80
1.97 2.20 70.71 168.80 12.57 2.87
2.15 2.25 73.01 170.43 12.59 3.19
2.32 2.30 75.48 172.36 12.58 3.50
2.49 2.35 79.26 177.13 12.55 3.74
2.66 2.40 82.92 181.46 12.50 3.94
2.82 2.45 85.78 183.89 12.46 4.08
2.99 2.50 88.06 185.01 12.42 4.15
3.16 2.55 90.26 185.89 12.37 4.19
3.32 2.60 91.70 185.25 12.35 4.24
3.47 2.65 93.95 186.20 12.37 4.33
3.64 2.70 96.67 188.04 12.38 4.64
3.79 2.75 99.32 189.69 12.39 4.86
3.95 2.80 102.06 191.44 12.40 4.83
4.11 2.85 104.69 192.93 12.40 4.95
4.27 2.90 107.27 194.28 12.42 5.17
4.42 2.95 109.71 195.33 12.47 5.39
4.58 3.00 111.50 195.21 12.54 5.63
4.74 3.05 112.63 193.94 12.60 5.83
4.88 3.10 115.06 194.93 12.57 5.96
5.04 3.15 118.56 197.68 12.54 6.11
5.19 3.20 120.67 198.06 12.54 6.37
5.34 3.25 124.02 200.41 12.51 6.52
5.49 3.30 126.23 200.90 12.49 6.61
5.64 3.35 128.25 201.06 12.50 6.79
5.79 3.40 130.23 201.18 12.50 6.88
5.94 3.45 132.96 202.41 12.50 6.81
6.10 3.50 135.18 202.86 12.50 6.93
6.24 3.55 136.69 202.23 12.52 7.13
6.39 3.60 138.70 202.35 12.55 7.22
6.54 3.65 141.92 204.21 12.60 7.32
6.69 3.70 143.71 204.00 12.65 7.55
6.83 3.75 147.19 206.15 12.68 7.64
6.99 3.80 148.88 205.77 12.69 7.66
7.14 3.85 149.34 203.73 12.72 7.95
7.28 3.90 151.41 203.91 12.72 8.23
7.43 3.95 153.56 204.18 12.71 8.35
7.58 4.00 155.94 204.75 12.72 8.39
7.72 4.05 158.35 205.35 12.74 8.39
7.85 4.10 163.31 209.19 12.66 8.38
8.00 4.15 167.99 212.60 12.58 8.35
8.15 4.20 169.95 212.53 12.55 8.28
8.29 4.25 171.46 211.89 12.54 8.29
8.43 4.30 173.44 211.84 12.51 8.41
8.57 4.35 176.69 213.33 12.50 8.36
8.71 4.40 179.26 213.98 12.48 8.18
8.86 4.45 181.23 213.90 12.47 8.37
9.00 4.50 183.17 213.79 12.47 8.70
9.14 4.55 185.83 214.50 12.48 8.74
9.28 4.60 187.24 213.79 12.47 8.71
9.42 4.65 189.99 214.59 12.44 8.69
9.56 4.70 192.31 214.90 12.41 8.66
9.70 4.75 194.86 215.45 12.37 8.64
9.84 4.80 198.21 216.87 12.32 8.84
9.99 4.85 199.77 216.34 12.27 9.19
10.13 4.90 199.14 213.45 12.27 9.33
10.28 4.95 201.67 213.98 12.28 9.33
10.43 5.00 203.69 213.96 12.26 9.12
10.58 5.05 203.73 211.88 12.28 9.09
10.72 5.10 205.09 211.20 12.30 9.27
10.86 5.15 206.70 210.80 12.27 9.60
11.01 5.20 209.08 211.17 12.25 9.93
11.15 5.25 212.84 212.92 12.25 9.90
11.29 5.30 214.65 212.72 12.26 9.74
11.44 5.35 216.20 212.24 12.25 9.43
11.58 5.40 219.11 213.11 12.24 9.28
11.73 5.45 221.10 213.08 12.23 9.31
11.90 5.50 218.22 208.39 12.21 9.46
12.06 5.55 211.77 200.40 12.24 9.62
12.20 5.60 215.94 202.52 12.28 9.74
12.36 5.65 219.39 203.94 12.26 9.89
12.51 5.70 221.90 204.46 12.25 10.00
12.66 5.75 220.99 201.86 12.34 9.78
12.81 5.80 224.23 203.05 12.38 9.81
12.96 5.85 227.86 204.58 12.39 10.18
13.12 5.90 229.20 204.03 12.44 10.29
13.27 5.95 230.11 203.12 12.51 10.31
13.43 6.00 233.13 204.07 12.55 10.46
13.58 6.05 232.60 201.93 12.56 10.55
13.75 6.10 229.85 197.91 12.54 10.46
13.91 6.15 229.75 196.21 12.51 10.02
14.07 6.20 231.40 196.02 12.48 9.96
14.23 6.25 231.39 194.44 12.46 10.37
14.37 6.30 236.91 197.50 12.40 10.21
14.55 6.35 240.73 199.11 12.30 9.88
14.70 6.40 239.77 196.77 12.20 9.92
14.87 6.45 238.94 194.56 12.07 10.01
15.04 6.50 238.99 193.11 11.97 10.16
15.20 6.55 238.08 190.90 11.97 10.38
15.36 6.60 241.43 192.13 12.01 10.48
15.53 6.65 243.24 192.11 12.12 10.55
15.69 6.70 244.59 191.73 12.28 10.70
15.87 6.75 242.24 188.49 12.21 10.45
16.03 6.80 246.10 190.08 12.11 10.01
16.21 6.85 244.00 187.08 12.11 9.66
--------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------
MAX: 16.21 6.85 246.10 216.87 15.26 10.70
MIN: 0.47 1.80 56.02 158.15 11.97 2.19

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

[TxZHP04]

If I'm converting units properly, I think you might be down roughly 20 hp and 20 lb-ft from what's advertised for a 325 TS2.

Whether that means you're looking at an install issue, old clogged cats, or your car is simply an anomoly, I don't have a clue.

EDIT: or maybe I just can't multiply.

[elite53]

Yea, I noticed that too. Thats why I am looking for input. I sent the info to AJ at ESS to get his response too but he is a pretty busy guy so it might be a while before I hear back from him.

Don't forget to post your runs when you get yours done. :)

[elite53]

I have a printout here for the DIN numbers and it says it made 255 DIN/HP and 225 Torque?

By the way....I suck at math. I'de like to thank the public school system for that. :banghead:

[elite53]

One of the things that is confusing me is the boost. This kit is supposed to make 8psi but the boost went up to 10. If thats true it should be making more HP not less?

[EIAlfonso]

One of the things that is confusing me is the boost. This kit is supposed to make 8psi but the boost went up to 10. If thats true it should be making more HP not less?

Where did they measure your boost? If it's just before the manifold it will lose at least a pound of boost until it reaches the chamber.

Did you get a baseline dyno done on the same dyno? If not you maybe trying to figure out where the problem is first, the car or the dyno, before you take any other steps.

[TxZHP04]

Where did they measure your boost? If it's just before the manifold it will lose at least a pound of boost until it reaches the chamber.

Did you get a baseline dyno done on the same dyno? If not you maybe trying to figure out where the problem is first, the car or the dyno, before you take any other steps.

Yeah, this is where the baseline dyno would have been really helpful.

I guess the only way to get to the bottom of things now is to go to the drag strip. :)

[Asbjorn@ESS]

Boost is normal as it is probably measured on the hot side of the IC. 10PSI on the hot side makes aprox 8PSI after the IC cooling the charge down and with the manifold/Laminova pressure loss on the way through.

You have a very strict correction factor of ~0.95 for some reason, what is the exact uncorrected numbers?

I would first make sure the IC is running (feel if the front heat exchanger is hot after a spirited drive). You should be in the 270whp DIN range when all is normal.

[elite53]

Just took the car for a drive. Heat exchanger is cool to the touch but I checked my install and everything appears to be correct. Same as in this picture...

[elite53]

Not sure about the correction factor ....I posted exactly what they gave me. That's all I have.

[elite53]

Boost was taken off the bottom vacuum line. The one with the T-fitting.

[Asbjorn@ESS]

Just took the car for a drive. Heat exchanger is cool to the touch but I checked my install and everything appears to be correct. Same as in this picture...

When the IC system is working the front heat exchanger will be quite warm, almost hot to the touch after a couple WOT runs, the lower manifold hose->pump inlet should be very hot. If heat exchanger/hose feels cool the IC system is not operating correctly. Check if the pump runs and if there is water in the system. Also check that the lower manifold hose has a free, straight fall to the pump intake port. If the IC system does not work you are in reality running a TS1.

a SAE 0.95 correction factor is a lot, go back to the dyno guys and have them give you the .drf files and email them to me, I will compare and check everything, and see what the car actually put down uncorrected (uncorrected is what it really put down).

[Asbjorn@ESS]

Boost was taken off the bottom vacuum line. The one with the T-fitting.

Yes, that is on the hot side of the IC. Your boost reading is perfectly normal.

[elite53]

OK...I just got back from the garage. The pump for the heat exchanger is definately pumping water cause I can hear it flowing through the lines. I have verified that the lines are correctly routed. There is some air in the system that maybe I should try to get out. I can hear the pump cavitating when one of the bubbles hits the impeller but I have bled the lines three times already since the install so I don't think its going to help much. There doesn't seem to be a way to get all the air out of the system.

I'll take it for another drive and beat on it a little harder to see if I get any heat into the heat exchanger.

I'll also try to get those uncorrected numbers from the Dyno guys in the morning.

[Asbjorn@ESS]

OK...I just got back from the garage. The pump for the heat exchanger is definately pumping water cause I can hear it flowing through the lines. I have verified that the lines are correctly routed. There is some air in the system that maybe I should try to get out. I can hear the pump cavitating when one of the bubbles hits the impeller but I have bled the lines three times already since the install so I don't think its going to help much. There doesn't seem to be a way to get all the air out of the system.

I'll take it for another drive and beat on it a little harder to see if I get any heat into the heat exchanger.

I'll also try to get those uncorrected numbers from the Dyno guys in the morning.

It sounds to me like there is not enough fall from the lower manifold hose to the pump inlet, it has to fall in a straight smooth fall, you can not have a U in the hose where the water goes down then up again. The pump will always sound like it is pumping since there will always be water in the bottom of the system which it moves around making noise/vibration, but if there is not a proper fall from the manifold to the pump you will not get proper circulation and the front heat exchanger will not get warm. There will not be any air bubbles down at the pump if there is proper flow to the pump inlet, all air will group at the top of the manifold where it is supposed to be and the water will drain from the bottom of the manifold to the pump, then pumped through the heat exchanger and up to the top of the manifold again.

[elite53]

I finished bleeding the air out of the lines and just got back from beating the piss out of it. WOT as much as possible. There is still no heat in the heat exchanger. The motor is hot as hell but the intake manifold,heat exchanger, and the supercharger are completely cool to the touch. They are barely even warm. Because of this, I can only assume the heat exchanger is doing its job quite well. Otherwise I would think the manifold would get hot. It really isn't possible for me to drive it any harder without being taken straight to jail.

If I put my ear to the elbow at the top of the manifold I can definately hear water flowing into the manifold so I think it is working as designed. The car did seem to be pulling quite hard. It is losing traction in first gear at around 4000rpm and spinning the wheels. The power seems to be all there but I still can't get the heat exchanger hot.:hmm:

I have checked the routing of my hoses and they are as AJ has recommended ( smooth straight fall and no kinks ). Maybe getting that air out of there did the trick but it still doesn't explain the lack of heat. Maybe it is too effecient.:4ngie:

I'll get those numbers AJ requested and send them to him to look over. I may also have to make another dyno run at another shop to see if I get the same results. The car sure feels fast but I would like the dyno numbers to verify it.

AJ are you off for the weekend. I'de like to give you a call and talk to you in person. If I have to wait till monday thats fine too. Thanks for all your help.

[TxZHP04]

It sounds to me like there is not enough fall from the lower manifold hose to the pump inlet, it has to fall in a straight smooth fall, you can not have a U in the hose where the water goes down then up again.

I knew when I saw this post that I was probably going to come up short on the dyno this morning as I definitely have a nice U bend in the lower hose - probably also explains why I initially had such difficulty filling the system with fluid. I'll definitely need to take care of this.

As Asbjorn suggested of elite53's results, I'm basically making TS1 numbers right now as confirmed by my dyno. We did 3 runs and all were nearly identical. I'm only posting one of the runs to make it easier to see what's going on. It looks like the car is pulling timing at 5000 and again at 6100 rpm - this was very consistent across all 3 runs. Presumably this is from 8.5 psi of boost and little/no functional intercooling. The heat exchanger definitely gets warm but never really hot. They didn't have any fans on during these runs but ambient temp was about 60 deg F.

Based on these runs, the guy at the shop (who tunes vettes, GTOs, etc) doesn't think I'll have any problems reaching 320 rwhp after I resolve this cooling issue (remember I still have my ZHP cams, not the FI cams). He was actually very impressed with the numbers he saw today and also offered compliments on how clean the install looked. Even after looking under the hood he still had to ask whether it was stock or not - of course he's not a BMW guy.

Anyway, on to the main attraction. I'll post updated results after I get the intercooler line straightened out, literally, but it may be a few weeks before I can get back to the dyno again.

268802

[EIAlfonso]

I finished bleeding the air out of the lines and just got back from beating the piss out of it. WOT as much as possible. There is still no heat in the heat exchanger. The motor is hot as hell but the intake manifold,heat exchanger, and the supercharger are completely cool to the touch. They are barely even warm. Because of this, I can only assume the heat exchanger is doing its job quite well. Otherwise I would think the manifold would get hot. It really isn't possible for me to drive it any harder without being taken straight to jail.

If I put my ear to the elbow at the top of the manifold I can definately hear water flowing into the manifold so I think it is working as designed. The car did seem to be pulling quite hard. It is losing traction in first gear at around 4000rpm and spinning the wheels. The power seems to be all there but I still can't get the heat exchanger hot.:hmm:

I have checked the routing of my hoses and they are as AJ has recommended ( smooth straight fall and no kinks ). Maybe getting that air out of there did the trick but it still doesn't explain the lack of heat. Maybe it is too effecient.:4ngie:

I'll get those numbers AJ requested and send them to him to look over. I may also have to make another dyno run at another shop to see if I get the same results. The car sure feels fast but I would like the dyno numbers to verify it.

AJ are you off for the weekend. I'de like to give you a call and talk to you in person. If I have to wait till monday thats fine too. Thanks for all your help.

The more efficient the hotter the heat exchanger will be. My hoses were installed in reverse manner, pump was running but nothing was passing through the exchanger, it's hard to tell since the hoses are underneath but they maybe installed incorrectly.

I guess wait till ESS gets back to you.

[elite53]

The dyno place was closed today so I will have to get the uncorrected numbers from them on monday. I will not have time to work on the car till tuesday because of my work schedule but I hope to figure this out quick cause I am going to a Car Control Clinic on wednesday.

Hey Darren- Keep us updated on your progress. Maybe we can help each other figure this out. I'm going to try and get on another Dyno pretty soon and see if my results improve after doing some tinkering around under the hood. Its a pretty simple system so it shouldn't be too hard to figure out. I'm thinking of attaching a short piece of clear tubing at the top manifold connection so I can visually check for flow through the lines??? Sounds kind of goofy I know but I don't know how else I can verify if I'm getting good flow through the system or if it is vapor locked for some reason. I am 100% sure my lines are correctly routed so I think I either still have air in the lines or I somehow got some kind of debris lodged in the impeller of the pump that is hindering flow. Maybe a piece of rubber from when I cut the lines to fit?

[elite53]

Ok, If anyone is still even the slightest bit interested in this....Here is an update on what I've done.

I disconnected the coolant line at the top of the manifold and made myself a reservoir that I could fill up with coolant for the system to draw from without introducing any new air into the system. I then ran the return hose into the top of my resevoir. My thinking on this was that I could accomplish two things.

#1 Visually check that the pump is operating as designed and that I have good flow.

#2 Get any trapped air out of the system that may be vapor locking the system.

When I turned on the key the fluid sort of trickled out for a few seconds followed by a lot of air bubbles. After about 30 seconds the pump started to make a different sound (it got a lot quieter) and then the flow coming out of the return line got much stronger and the air bubbles all went away.

End result....MISSION ACCOMPLISHED. :excited: I forgot to take a picture while I had my homemade contraption hooked up but I set it up when I was done and took one for all to see incase they want to try it. This may or may not solve my lack of HP problem but at least I can be 100% sure my heat exchanger and pump are working properly.

[HighBoostin330]

Ok, If anyone is still even the slightest bit interested in this....Here is an update on what I've done.

I disconnected the coolant line at the top of the manifold and made myself a reservoir that I could fill up with coolant for the system to draw from without introducing any new air into the system. I then ran the return hose into the top of my resevoir. My thinking on this was that I could accomplish two things.

#1 Visually check that the pump is operating as designed and that I have good flow.

#2 Get any trapped air out of the system that may be vapor locking the system.

When I turned on the key the fluid sort of trickled out for a few seconds followed by a lot of air bubbles. After about 30 seconds the pump started to make a different sound (it got a lot quieter) and then the flow coming out of the return line got much stronger and the air bubbles all went away.

End result....MISSION ACCOMPLISHED. :excited: I forgot to take a picture while I had my homemade contraption hooked up but I set it up when I was done and took one for all to see incase they want to try it. This may or may not solve my lack of HP problem but at least I can be 100% sure my heat exchanger and pump are working properly.

That homemade contraption looks like it did the job. Now, you just need to check that after a hard run the Setrab heat exchanger is hot.

So how did you re-attach the hoses to the manifold without inducing air bubbles into the system again? I am a bit confused with this part. :(

[Asbjorn@ESS]

Nice setup! :)

If your IC system is not operating properly the TS software will default to a lower ignition setting and you will loose ~15-25HP.

[elite53]

Well it's a bit hard to explain but I put my thumb over the elbow at the top of the manifold and poured fluid into the diconnected hose. As the hose fills up it trys to level itself at the elbow and if you move your thumb a little bit the air can escape out of the elbow and water will start to flow out of it once the air is gone. Then I plugged them both with my thumbs and stuck them together. There is a small amount that gets in when you move your thumbs out of the way to connect them but it is minimal and nothing like the amount of air that was in there in the first place.

I drove the car a little when I was done but not too hard and when I got home the heat exchanger was still cold which is a bit curious but the temperature outside is in the low 40's and I didn't really get on it. I have no doubt in my mind that I have good coolant flow and no air in the system so I'm not to worried at this moment.

[HighBoostin330]

Well it's a bit hard to explain but I put my thumb over the elbow at the top of the manifold and poured fluid into the diconnected hose. As the hose fills up it trys to level itself at the elbow and if you move your thumb a little bit the air can escape out of the elbow and water will start to flow out of it once the air is gone. Then I plugged them both with my thumbs and stuck them together. There is a small amount that gets in when you move your thumbs out of the way to connect them but it is minimal and nothing like the amount of air that was in there in the first place.

I drove the car a little when I was done but not too hard and when I got home the heat exchanger was still cold which is a bit curious but the temperature outside is in the low 40's and I didn't really get on it. I have no doubt in my mind that I have good coolant flow and no air in the system so I'm not to worried at this moment.

More power to you. You going to dyno again? :)

[elite53]

AJ- I will try and send you those uncorrected Dyno numbers on monday. The shop is supposed to email them to me and then I will send them to you. I completely understand what your saying about the numbers dropping off because if the IC system but I would still feel better if you could look over the numbers for me. It cost me $145 bucks for the Dyno runs so I don't want to have to do it too many more times before figuring this out.:)

[elite53]

Yes. I will Dyno again soon but I have a Car Control Clinic this week so it probably won't be till the week after. My girlfriend is getting a little tired of me spending all this money lately.:rolleyes: I guess I can understand that. I'de probably freak out if she was doing it.

[HighBoostin330]

AJ- I will try and send you those uncorrected Dyno numbers on monday. The shop is supposed to email them to me and then I will send them to you. I completely understand what your saying about the numbers dropping off because if the IC system but I would still feel better if you could look over the numbers for me. It cost me $145 bucks for the Dyno runs so I don't want to have to do it too many more times before figuring this out.:)

Holy cow, how did the price jump to $145 for the dyno runs?! I thought it was like $70 for three runs including AFR readings. :hmm:

Yes. I will Dyno again soon but I have a Car Control Clinic this week so it probably won't be till the week after. My girlfriend is getting a little tired of me spending all this money lately.:rolleyes: I guess I can understand that. I'de probably freak out if she was doing it.

Better get that couch ready just in case. :P

[elite53]

Yea I know!!! They tricked me.

$70 just to put it on the Dyno for one pull.

$45 to use the sniffer for the A/F Ratio.

$10 for each aditional pull ( x2)

I was kind of pissed but I was already there so I just went with it. I called two other shops when I got home and they were all priced about the same. The cheapest was $125 and they are both an hour drive from here. I don't think I've ever heard of anyone else paying these kind of prices?

[elite53]

Right now I'de be happy with just a pillow. Heck, the damn dog won't even sleep on the floor. :rofl::rofl::rofl: Just kidding she's not mad but she is getting frustrated. I kind of am too but I know the end result will be worth it.

[elite53]

Now that I have done three pulls already and my A/F ratio seems to be OK, I wonder if I can skip doing the A/F again to save a few bucks next time?

[fmzip]

That homemade contraption looks like it did the job. Now, you just need to check that after a hard run the Setrab heat exchanger is hot.

So how did you re-attach the hoses to the manifold without inducing air bubbles into the system again? I am a bit confused with this part. :(

I am confused too about this whole topic of "trapped air" in general.....there is no possible way to "completely" bleed the system of air, nor is it suggested that you need to. The instructions stated to fill it til coolant trcikles out, reattach hose, run pump for 30 seconds, refill, reconnect and you are done.

To completely bleed it, you'd need some sort of purge valve. Have you ever purged your cooling system on your car? Take a look at the way your upper radiator hose is designed, it has a bleed valve slightly below the top connection to your reservior/radiator. You could accomplish the same thing with a little creativity if you really intrested in "bleeding" the system more than you aleady have......



Did you get a baseline dyno done on the same dyno? If not you maybe trying to figure out where the problem is first, the car or the dyno, before you take any other steps.


Thanks for this tip Elio when I bought your kit...I am beginning to see why it is so helpful to have a baseline dyno done beforehand.

I hope you get everything straightened out elite53......

[Lemonsqr]

Ok, If anyone is still even the slightest bit interested in this....Here is an update on what I've done.

I disconnected the coolant line at the top of the manifold and made myself a reservoir that I could fill up with coolant for the system to draw from without introducing any new air into the system. I then ran the return hose into the top of my resevoir. My thinking on this was that I could accomplish two things.

#1 Visually check that the pump is operating as designed and that I have good flow.

#2 Get any trapped air out of the system that may be vapor locking the system.

When I turned on the key the fluid sort of trickled out for a few seconds followed by a lot of air bubbles. After about 30 seconds the pump started to make a different sound (it got a lot quieter) and then the flow coming out of the return line got much stronger and the air bubbles all went away.

End result....MISSION ACCOMPLISHED. :excited: I forgot to take a picture while I had my homemade contraption hooked up but I set it up when I was done and took one for all to see incase they want to try it. This may or may not solve my lack of HP problem but at least I can be 100% sure my heat exchanger and pump are working properly.
What is the rate that the coolant squirts out? does it gush out with a lot of force or is it like a water fountain? I just wanted to know what to expect when I do this...

[TxZHP04]

It's not high pressure, more like a water fountain or garden hose (without a nozzle).