HPF Stage 2 M3 vs Modified Ford GT Supercar

[RACEMX-M3]

I finally completed the install of my kit and had the clutch installed yesterday. I wasted no time lining up against my buddie's modded Ford GT. You may recall the vid of Jesse (IndigloM3) racing the GT in Stage 1 mode and getting pulled a bit. Add me to the list of meth addicts. :D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7cIH0LpivOI

[03SilverE46Conv]

WOW, what are the mods he's running?

[mark1281]

Sweet run, were you guys doing that somewhere in Dallas?

[tankm3]

Very nice! Was that the only run you guys did? Here's my recent run incase you haven't seen it.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZvQ03VMkko

[turboaddiction]

Poor supercars don't stand a chance to the HPF S2 M3. :rofl:

Nice kill. :thumbsup:

[InDiGlOM3]

Scott, freakin awesome man....did you run him just race gas, no meth to see what happens with you runnin the SMG

[xcoolnessx]

That is freakin awesome! Whoo whooo.... Everyones is scared to run me out here in the bay.

[Jeffxxx]

Ughh I'm going to have to not click these HPF threads anymore. :cry:

[DLSJ5]

Very nice Scott, keep the vids coming!

[TotumDependeate]

nice

[HighBoostin330]

Awesome video! :)

That is freakin awesome! Whoo whooo.... Everyones is scared to run me out here in the bay.

John was ready to run you that one night, but you ended up taking Ardika's car out instead. So when are you going to run John again in your car? :)

[Evil Twin Rob]

That's what we like to see! Damn, I need to find some hot cars to race.

[HPFMTRE]

wow you make me miss my car more and more with all these new videos going up..ill have some up soon!!!

[monkeyjuice5150]

anyone got links to other forum these supercar hang out at? beside the bmw, i want to see what others are saying.

[johnjohnsonS54]

Ughh I'm going to have to not click these HPF threads anymore. :cry:

That makes 2 of us

[leletyM3]

Nice run!!! Just amazing!

[O-Ace]

Nice run! Stable camera work too :thumbsup:

[Laidback]

Amazing run...congrats:)

[rage2]

Poor supercars don't stand a chance to the HPF S2 M3. :rofl:
I dunno about that... I got walked by an 850hp S/C Viper yesterday LOL. On a positive note, I only had to downshift to 5th on the highway to keep up with a 996TT. And part throttle or I would've rear ended the poor guy haha.

[DLSJ5]

Awesome video! :)



John was ready to run you that one night, but you ended up taking Ardika's car out instead. So when are you going to run John again in your car? :)

I thought they did rerun?

Scott what fuel was Mark on? Does the GT even have a race program? Regardless flat out good stuff Brotha!

[A55A55IN]

I finally completed the install of my kit and had the clutch installed yesterday. I wasted no time lining up against my buddie's modded Ford GT. You may recall the vid of Jesse (IndigloM3) racing the GT in Stage 1 mode and getting pulled a bit. Add me to the list of meth addicts. :D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7cIH0LpivOI

sick ****ing run and :bow:

[lrinco01]

WOW !

that was some Good shhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

You guys are going to pressure me to do some drastic thingz...

Like find the funds, to upgrade my recent AA SC to a HPF stg 2/3 and crack the Huge EGO's of some of these S/C or Turbo'd Vette, Viper, EVO's, WRX, AstonMartin DB9's, MERC AMG C63,996TT owners out here in the ATL !!!

THE ones i stay away from and am referring to are ALL BLOWN, TURBO'D OR BIG BOTTLE FED !!!!

In any Case, Good work!!

[MSpired]

Very impressive runs! Congrats!

[2000_328CI]

wish i had the cash for something like that :(

[RACEMX-M3]

Scott, freakin awesome man....did you run him just race gas, no meth to see what happens with you runnin the SMG

The run was race + meth. We haven't done any other runs yet. I don't have a meth switch hooked up so it's a pain to disconnect it.

[RACEMX-M3]

I thought they did rerun?

Scott what fuel was Mark on? Does the GT even have a race program? Regardless flat out good stuff Brotha!

Mark is on pump, he doesn't have a tune for race fuel. He has a smaller pulley on the s/c and cats deleted.

[DLSJ5]

Mark is on pump, he doesn't have a tune for race fuel. He has a smaller pulley on the s/c and cats deleted.

His dyno #'s are crazy with those mods too, well done Brotha!

[SPDu4ea]

Nice job! Any plans for Vbox runs?

[johnjohnsonS54]

Curious if there's any truth to the post on m3forum which suggests the puff of smoke at the end was the product of a blown motor? Somebody supplied a link to a ford forum where they suggest the engine went pop

[T0NT0N]

Curious if there's any truth to the post on m3forum which suggests the puff of smoke at the end was the product of a blown motor? Somebody supplied a link to a ford forum where they suggest the engine went pop

hahahahaha i wouldnt be surprised......it is a ford!

[///M3-QTR]

hahahahaha i wouldnt be surprised......it is a ford!

He was talking about the M3 ...

Is it true ?????

[zracer196]

Maybe someone from HPF (if they know) can put some truth here to what happened (if that is known as well) so it does not get all blown out of proportion and cause people to panic!

[RACEMX-M3]

Hopefully I can mitigate some of the speculation about my car. First of all my motor was damaged at the end of the run vs the Ford GT. I was hoping to have more definitive information before posting, as I'm sure this will now only fuel endless speculation about the cause and full extent of the damage to my motor.

Here's what I know, at the end of the run vs the GT (after letting off the throttle) I see smoke in the rear view mirror. I kill the motor, stop and have the car towed to my house. At first glance it appeared to simply be a blown valve cover gasket and oil burned off the exhaust manifold. I pulled all six plugs and it appears that cylinder one is damaged, broken ring or something else. The remaining 5 cylinders and plugs are fine.

My car is currently on it's way to HPF in Oregan and I will be happy to post more info after they have an opportunity to examine and repair the motor.

This is clearly a disappointment after the time, energy and money I have invested, but damage to a motor is an assumed risk when you mod your engine. I'd like to stress that there is absolutely no evidence at this point that suggests what the cause of the damage is. HPF has 20+ M3's with their turbo kits installed and to my knowledge this is the first car that has experienced this kind of problem.

[sfhondapilot]

Sorry to hear the news and appreciate you posting the update.

[rage2]

When you installed the kit, did you run into the "oil pump wiring backwards" issue as stated in the troubleshooting section? We ran into that on my car, and it dumped a lot of oil in the exhaust, collecting inside the muffler. The oil doesn't really burn off at all from street driving (very light wiffs of smoke out just the furthest left tailpipe) but it does burn off hard on a highway run like you did once the exhaust temps get high enough to "boil off" all that crap in the muffler.

It took about 150 miles of hard running through back highways, and everyone on the run thought I was gonna blow up. Eventually it cleared up once all the crap was burnt off. Oil level didn't move at all once I checked after the run.

I think I had even more smoke than you did in your video. I couldn't even see a bright yellow Fcar following about 6-8 car lengths behind me when it first got hot enough to start burning off.

[RACEMX-M3]

No, the oil pump is fine. There's definitely an issue with one of the cylinders, hopefully it's a simple piston/ring replacement.

[GJGM3]

Good luck on the fix bro!

[jtrejo]

to much smack talking on m3f and they closed thread sux.

[GJGM3]

Yeah, one guy in particular and I thought not deserved.

[LagunaBlau///M3]

Wow nice kill dude. That sucks about the motor though!!!



Does this make it the first HPF m3 that blew some rings on stock internal's?

[RACEMX-M3]

Yeah, one guy in particular and I thought not deserved.

Yes, unfortunate one person is allowed to jack the thread and get it deleted. I don't understand why they don't simply delete the off topic posts and allow the thread to continue.

[HPF Chris]

Scott and I have been working together at figuring out what went wrong with his car and his car is now on it's way to us to get fixed. When people install their own kits, we lose the ability to test and verify everything before the car gets on the road. My preference is to install and test our turbo kits in house before they leave or have our dealer network do it, but for customers around the world like Scott, that is not always an option.

We provide a 200+ page instruction manual that Scott appeared to have followed closely, but we will have to "require" that the customer take their car to a dyno and verify all of the settings before driving it on a street. This would allow the customer to verify the A:F is safe on all 4 maps at every rpm, boost is flat and exact at all rpms, and there are no leaks, or other issues that can be caught before damage can occur to a motor.

Any improper setup or improper functioning of the fuel system, turbo/wastegate system, methanol system, or engine management system can and will have devistating results if not found during the testing phase immediately after the installation is completed.

We'll get Scott's car back up and running and on the road again. I prefer to be building cars for stage 3 and not rebuilding them to factory specs. For those that are interested in installing this kit themselves, "extreme" care must be taken and a rigorous testing phase should be followed after the installation. We will update the instructions to include a more thorough test phase and require dyno testing before these cars see the road.

Take care,
Chris.

[jstaylor]

Dude, Scott, just have them go Stage 3 if they're going to have to rebuild the motor. Don't rebuild to stock.

[turboaddiction]

Hopefully I can mitigate some of the speculation about my car. First of all my motor was damaged at the end of the run vs the Ford GT. I was hoping to have more definitive information before posting, as I'm sure this will now only fuel endless speculation about the cause and full extent of the damage to my motor.

Here's what I know, at the end of the run vs the GT (after letting off the throttle) I see smoke in the rear view mirror. I kill the motor, stop and have the car towed to my house. At first glance it appeared to simply be a blown valve cover gasket and oil burned off the exhaust manifold. I pulled all six plugs and it appears that cylinder one is damaged, broken ring or something else. The remaining 5 cylinders and plugs are fine.

My car is currently on it's way to HPF in Oregan and I will be happy to post more info after they have an opportunity to examine and repair the motor.

This is clearly a disappointment after the time, energy and money I have invested, but damage to a motor is an assumed risk when you mod your engine. I'd like to stress that there is absolutely no evidence at this point that suggests what the cause of the damage is. HPF has 20+ M3's with their turbo kits installed and to my knowledge this is the first car that has experienced this kind of problem.
Stage 3 woohoo! :thumbsup:

[OCswedishM3]

Dude, Scott, just have them go Stage 3 if they're going to have to rebuild the motor. Don't rebuild to stock.

I agree... Dont rebuild the motor to stock form.. I dont know how their warranty works, but if they do find that there is engine damage that was caused by the kit hopefully they would take care of the labor part of the rebuild. So maybe upgrading from stage 2 to stage 3 wouldnt be the normal 20k, but instead $14000 which would be the cost of everything minus the engine build labor... That would be very cool of Chris if he made that offer IMO. Great race though, i was very impressed with the power and the outcome... Just run race fuel from now for the piece of mind, thats what i do..

[DLSJ5]

Yes, unfortunate one person is allowed to jack the thread and get it deleted. I don't understand why they don't simply delete the off topic posts and allow the thread to continue.

Scott did you do any 60-130 runs?

Best of luck with it, the new internals will give you peace of mind.

[RACEMX-M3]

I agree... Dont rebuild the motor to stock form.. I dont know how their warranty works, but if they do find that there is engine damage that was caused by the kit hopefully they would take care of the labor part of the rebuild. So maybe upgrading from stage 2 to stage 3 wouldnt be the normal 20k, but instead $14000 which would be the cost of everything minus the engine build labor... That would be very cool of Chris if he made that offer IMO. Great race though, i was very impressed with the power and the outcome... Just run race fuel from now for the piece of mind, thats what i do..

I was running race fuel + meth. I'm not planning to upgrade to Stage 3, however I am looking into upgrading the internals.

[RACEMX-M3]

Scott did you do any 60-130 runs?

Best of luck with it, the new internals will give you peace of mind.

Did not get a chance to do any vbox runs, but definitely will after I get my car back.

[HPF Chris]

We have determined why Scott's engine failed after he installed the kit himself.

Our HPF stage 2 kit requires the use of 100% methanol (no mix). When methanol is activated and flowing, 20% of the fuel the engine is consuming comes from methanol and 80% comes from the fuel injectors. Our kit has fail-safes built into it that drop boost in case the methanol pressure drops suddenly (run out of methanol), or increases too high (a line blockage) However... if someone adds a restriction to the methanol line, the line pressure can still remain within the safety zone but flow will be decreased by the amount of the restriction causing the engine to run lean and detonate.

Our methanol tanks are shipped with quick disconnect fittings as shown in the pictures below and our instructions also show how to use these quick disconnect fittings. The quick disconnect fittings that come with our kit grab the methanol line from the outside providing a continuous .17" ID. For whatever reason, Scott used non-methanol compliant brass fittings (that don't come with our kit). This dropped the ID from the required .17" to .09". This restricted the flow area to 28% of what it should have been causing substantially less methanol to enter the engine. Methanol is used in these cars not only as a fuel, but an intake charge cooler and an octane booster. When the amount of methanol flow is decreased substantially at high boost, the car will run lean, the air charge will heat up drastically and the overall fuel octane will be decreased. Once this occurs, pre-ignition and detonation will happen very rapidly.

Our kit has safety features for methanol that protect the engine when it is installed as documented. When other parts are added by the purchaser, there is a risk that these safety features can be bypassed as with this particular install.

Here are the pictures...

Methanol tank as shipped with our kits on the left. Methanol tank removed from Scott's M3 on the right.

http://www.horsepowerfreaks.com/miscellaneous/m3turbokit/scottw/P7110032.JPG

Methanol compliant quick disconnect fittings. These hold onto the hose from the outside allowing the full volume to flow through the hose.

http://www.horsepowerfreaks.com/miscellaneous/m3turbokit/scottw/P7110033.JPG

Comparison showing the difference between the fittings. The customer used his own brass fitting on the left, our kit comes with the white fittings on the right.

http://www.horsepowerfreaks.com/miscellaneous/m3turbokit/scottw/P7110036.JPG

This shows the ID difference between the fitting that was used and the fitting supplied with our kit.

http://www.horsepowerfreaks.com/miscellaneous/m3turbokit/scottw/P7110035.JPG

Required ID of the hose on the left (.17"). Customer supplied brass fitting ID on the right (.09")

http://www.horsepowerfreaks.com/miscellaneous/m3turbokit/scottw/P7110030.JPG

[GJGM3]

This should stick it to all the nay-sayers!

Good luck to Scott!

[[TYPE]SS]

wow..the end result is very surprising. so scott~ why did you use the fitting that wasnt provided by HPF?

[yellowssm]

ouch :cry:

[Evil Twin Rob]

I hate to see this happen to anyone. That turned into a pretty expensive fitting. It's a relief to know what caused the failure, though. I think Scott would be crazy not to go stg 3 at this point. I know it's a lot of money, especially right after forking out a ton for the kit, but the motor work needs to be done anyway.

[RACEMX-M3]

SS;8213725']wow..the end result is very surprising. so scott~ why did you use the fitting that wasnt provided by HPF?

HPF shipped the tank to me without the fitting, so I substituted my hardware.

[GJGM3]

As a critical piece in my opinion that should have been supplied unless explicit instructions were given to use a very specific fitting.

[zracer196]

Wow...Sorry to hear that...

At least it is only money and it does not seem like it will hurt you too much!

Good luck and have fun when you get the BEAST back!

[Evil Twin Rob]

HPF shipped the tank to me without the fitting, so I substituted my hardware.

Weird. Mine had the correct fitting when I received it. Even though the correct thing to do would be to call HPF, I admit, I probably would have done the exact same thing you did. Chris' explaination makes perfect sense, but when you're excited to get your new toy on the road, you just don't think about little stuff like that.

[Greg Ogden]

We have determined why Scott's engine failed after he installed the kit himself.

Our HPF stage 2 kit requires the use of 100% methanol (no mix). When methanol is activated and flowing, 20% of the fuel the engine is consuming comes from methanol and 80% comes from the fuel injectors. Our kit has fail-safes built into it that drop boost in case the methanol pressure drops suddenly (run out of methanol), or increases too high (a line blockage) However... if someone adds a restriction to the methanol line, the line pressure can still remain within the safety zone but flow will be decreased by the amount of the restriction causing the engine to run lean and detonate.

Our methanol tanks are shipped with quick disconnect fittings as shown in the pictures below and our instructions also show how to use these quick disconnect fittings. The quick disconnect fittings that come with our kit grab the methanol line from the outside providing a continuous .17" ID. For whatever reason, Scott used non-methanol compliant brass fittings (that don't come with our kit). This dropped the ID from the required .17" to .09". This restricted the flow area to 28% of what it should have been causing substantially less methanol to enter the engine. Methanol is used in these cars not only as a fuel, but an intake charge cooler and an octane booster. When the amount of methanol flow is decreased substantially at high boost, the car will run lean, the air charge will heat up drastically and the overall fuel octane will be decreased. Once this occurs, pre-ignition and detonation will happen very rapidly.

Our kit has safety features for methanol that protect the engine when it is installed as documented. When other parts are added by the purchaser, there is a risk that these safety features can be bypassed as with this particular install.

Here are the pictures...

Methanol tank as shipped with our kits on the left. Methanol tank removed from Scott's M3 on the right.

http://www.horsepowerfreaks.com/miscellaneous/m3turbokit/scottw/P7110032.JPG

Methanol compliant quick disconnect fittings. These hold onto the hose from the outside allowing the full volume to flow through the hose.

http://www.horsepowerfreaks.com/miscellaneous/m3turbokit/scottw/P7110033.JPG

Comparison showing the difference between the fittings. The customer used his own brass fitting on the left, our kit comes with the white fittings on the right.

http://www.horsepowerfreaks.com/miscellaneous/m3turbokit/scottw/P7110036.JPG

This shows the ID difference between the fitting that was used and the fitting supplied with our kit.

http://www.horsepowerfreaks.com/miscellaneous/m3turbokit/scottw/P7110035.JPG

Required ID of the hose on the left (.17"). Customer supplied brass fitting ID on the right (.09")

http://www.horsepowerfreaks.com/miscellaneous/m3turbokit/scottw/P7110030.JPG


So what kind of damage did this do to scott's engine? Will he need a complete rebuild??

[tankm3]

Damn bro, this is a bummer to know something such as this (a plastic fitting) caused the damage.
When you installed it, did you see on the install pics that it showed the fitting to be uesd? I dont mean to add insult to injury here, I'm just curious if you visually saw the fitting in the pics to be used.
I'm sure HPF would have overnighted you the fitting, they did just that for me on more than one occasion.

Nonetheless, I hope all goes well from here on out.

[RACEMX-M3]

It is unfortunate that the fitting was not included with the tank, to be fair the fitting is pictured in the HPF manual. I knew the part was missing and (in hindsight) wish I would have simply called to have it replaced - I chose to fix it myself and accept my portion of the blame for my motor failure.

To HPF's credit they have offered to rebuild my motor to factory specs, reinstall my kit and insure everything is working to spec, at their expense. A huge thumbs up to Chris at HPF for stepping up and taking care of my car. :thumbsup:

There is one other issue to consider here.. with my car at HPF and with the motor coming out, the question remains.. why not just upgrade to Stage 3? or what about an upgrade to Stage 2.5? :4ngie:

What I have opted for is to upgrade to a yet to be announced Stage 2.5 kit from HPF. My motor will be upgraded with the Stage 3 internals, I will have a different ecu program and the car will run only on pump, or pump + meth. 91+ pump = 600 whp and pump + meth = 670 whp. While the upgrade will add about 50 whp over the Stage 2 kit, to me the real value here is the ability to run the car at higher boost on pump fuel. :)

[steelgrey330ci]

christmas is early nice

[LagunaBlau///M3]

There is one other issue to consider here.. with my car at HPF and with the motor coming out, the question remains.. why not just upgrade to Stage 3? or what about an upgrade to Stage 2.5? :4ngie:

What I have opted for is to upgrade to a yet to be announced Stage 2.5 kit from HPF. My motor will be upgraded with the Stage 3 internals, I will have a different ecu program and the car will run only on pump, or pump + meth. 91+ pump = 600 whp and pump + meth = 670 whp. While the upgrade will add about 50 whp over the Stage 2 kit, to me the real value here is the ability to run the car at higher boost on pump fuel. :)

Now that sounds like a good idea. :thumbsup:

[OCswedishM3]

It is unfortunate that the fitting was not included with the tank, to be fair the fitting is pictured in the HPF manual. I knew the part was missing and (in hindsight) wish I would have simply called to have it replaced - I chose to fix it myself and accept my portion of the blame for my motor failure.

To HPF's credit they have offered to rebuild my motor to factory specs, reinstall my kit and insure everything is working to spec, at their expense. A huge thumbs up to Chris at HPF for stepping up and taking care of my car. :thumbsup:

There is one other issue to consider here.. with my car at HPF and with the motor coming out, the question remains.. why not just upgrade to Stage 3? or what about an upgrade to Stage 2.5? :4ngie:

What I have opted for is to upgrade to a yet to be announced Stage 2.5 kit from HPF. My motor will be upgraded with the Stage 3 internals, I will have a different ecu program and the car will run only on pump, or pump + meth. 91+ pump = 600 whp and pump + meth = 670 whp. While the upgrade will add about 50 whp over the Stage 2 kit, to me the real value here is the ability to run the car at higher boost on pump fuel. :)

Class Act.. That is great business ethics on Chris' behalf. :thumbsup: in my book.

[02black330ci]

To HPF's credit they have offered to rebuild my motor to factory specs, reinstall my kit and insure everything is working to spec, at their expense. A huge thumbs up to Chris at HPF for stepping up and taking care of my car. :thumbsup:


Wow, wow, wow!!! That is all I can say. My hats off to HPF for unheard of customer service to the BMW community. I might have to bite the bullet here in a bit and get the kit or just wait for them to do a single turbo conversion for the 335, which would be my choice.

I am glad this had an outstanding happy ending, everyone walked away with more than expected. I can't wait to see the new videos... :str8pimpi

[1badsky]

Who paid for shipping to HPF????

[plaroud]

Who paid for shipping to HPF????

Who cares?

[jstaylor]

Scott, glad to hear you're getting the car taken care of. Chris, that's truly amazing of you guys to take care of him like that, though I'm not surprised. You guys have been a complete class act for all of us that have become customers. Keep up the great work!!

[GJGM3]

Josh - BEEEEEER or wine. LOL! :)

Hope all is well. Looking forward to seeing your car soon!

[1badsky]

Who cares?

YOUR MOMMA CARES :censor:

[azjimi]

Who cares?

At least one person. Maybe more. Anyway, rest easy that most likely no one really cares that you don't care.

[KamPow3r]

HPF...you guys really are amazing...other business and organizations should seriously look at you! My car will soon be with you guys too.

[HPF Chris]

We started pulling our kit off Scott's M3 (that we did not install) and found out the "primary" cause of the failure. The stock fuel pump that's in every E46 M3 flows enough fuel to make up to 550rwhp (give or take 25rwhp). Our turbo system comes with an additional fuel pump that turns itself on when demand is increased past this point. Our kit comes with very thorough instructions that spell out exactly how to install this fuel pump and the wires are clearly labelled as in the pictures below. If the wires to this fuel pump are hooked up backwards, the pump will flow in the reverse direction when the fuel is absolutely required to keep the engine at a safe A:F ratio. This caused his engine to run lean and melted the #1 piston.

http://www.horsepowerfreaks.com/miscellaneous/m3turbokit/scottw/ScottWFuelPump1.jpg

http://www.horsepowerfreaks.com/miscellaneous/m3turbokit/scottw/ScottWFuelPump2.jpg

For those that wish to purchase our turbo system and install it themselves, here's an excerpt from the first page of the instruction manual that comes with each and every kit.

IMPORTANT: READ THE FOLLOWING INSTRUCTIONS CAREFULLY
INSTRUCTIONS FOR PROPER USE:

1) This product is designed for off-road use only. This turbo system is designed to be driven off-road where emissions and state and federal laws do not apply.
2) This turbo system requires a minimum of 91 octane fuel to be run at all times. Failure to run 91 octane fuel or higher knowingly or unknowingly may result in engine knock and engine damage.
3) When the race fuel switch is turned on, this turbo system requires a minimum of 110 octane "LEADED" fuel in the tank. A minimum of 10 gallons of 110 octane "LEADED" fuel must be added to the tank and "ALL" lesser octane fuel must be removed prior to adding the 110 octane fuel. There will always be some remaining gas in the tank due to the tank design which is why a full 10 gallons is required to bring the effective octane rating up. Failure to follow these race fuel switch instructions in full may result in engine knock and engine damage.
4) This turbo system comes with "Octane Requirement" stickers that should be placed on the gauge pod in front of the race fuel LED, on the gas cap and gas door. If you do not have these stickers in these locations, please let us know and we will send them to you for free for you to affix. These stickers are important to remind any driver of these important fuel requirements.
5) This turbo system comes with a keyed race fuel switch. It is recommended that you put this key in the car "only" when you are going to switch to using race fuel.
6) For methanol equipped turbo systems, only use 100% methanol in the supplied methanol tank. If the methanol is diluted or another product is substituted, engine knock and engine damage may result.
7) Any work that is done to your vehicle that fails to follow the exact instructions as specified in our instruction manual may result in engine damage. There are several components that if disconnected, or not hooked up properly could result in engine damage. If you do not have or have lost your instruction manual, please let us know and we will send you one for free.

WARNINGS
1) Failure to follow "ALL" of the above instructions may result in engine knock and engine failure.
2) Do not attempt to repair or replace any component of our turbo system yourself unless you read the instruction manual thoroughly and have turbo installation experience.
3) Change your oil every 2,500 miles with factory BMW oil. The turbo system requires clean engine oil.
4) Change your fuel filter (Edelbrock P/N#8130) every 20,000 miles.

Chris.

[GJGM3]

Does Scott know this already - the post that is?

[HPF Chris]

Does Scott know this already - the post that is?

Yes. Scott had a shop install his clutch after he had already installed his turbo kit. This company removed and reinstalled his fuel pump and hooked the wires up backwards. They also put silicon sealant on the AN oil feed and return lines running sealant material through a very sensitive oil pump and didn't bother tightening one of his transmission to engine bolts leaving it loose and sticking out about 1".

The purpose of this post is not to trash Scott, but to "CLEARLY" state the importance of installation and service. The components of our kit are so critical that we recommend anyone considering letting a shop look at their M3 doing their due diligence and fully investigating their abilities first. We spent 3 months writing a 200+ page instruction manual with 3 full color pictures on every page. These are included with every kit and must be followed explicitly or failures can and will occur.

We currently have another customer's M3 in our shop because he had his clutch swapped at another shop and they failed to tighten the wastegate piping and installed their own homemade gasket instead of using a new one. This caused hot gasses to leak out the side melting all of his O2 sensor wiring. Luckily for him we were able to simply re-wire the O2 sensors and hook them back up.

We want everyone to have a fantastic experience with our product. In order to make this happen, we hope our customers will do their homework before they let a shop work on their M3s. We have authorized various installers around the world that we feel can do and have done a great job for them. They are listed on our web-site. And if you want the same quality as every other kit that leaves our shop, we're more than happy to service them here.

Thanks.
Chris.

[GJGM3]

Thank you Chris for clarifying that.

Scott is a tremendous advocate for not only your product (before his incident), but also your service - there too before. I know this because we've exchanged numerous notes on this on another forum, not that I need any convincing. I've taken a ride in Raj's car and held on to my balls - just amazing!

The point I wanted to make for whatever it's worth, your product and service stands on its own. Certainly those that own it - know it, but I can assure you many who don't have it wish they did.

In any case I would have been utterly surprised had he not known about it as you don't strike me as being the type.

Thank you for bringing excellent products to the market and your service adds to this confidence. I hope down the road I can join the club.

[jtrejo]

where is the fuel pump mounted? can i see a shot from further back?

hope his car is up and running soon

[HPF Chris]

where is the fuel pump mounted? can i see a shot from further back?

hope his car is up and running soon

The fuel pump should not have been removed when the clutch was swapped. It is installed underneath the cover where the fuel filter is and there was no real reason for the shop to remove it.

As we've never had anyone hook up our fuel pumps backwards, we did some testing today on the inline Walbro fuel pump to see what would happen if the polarity was switched. When the wires are hooked up backwards, the pump does not flow in the reverse direction. It does however still allow fuel to flow through it in the correct direction. This would explain why Scott's car still got 80-90% of the required fuel but not the extra fuel the auxiliary fuel pump would have provided.

I see there is some conjecture on another forum that we could change how the wires are connected from our kit to the fuel pump to make it entirely idiot proof. We clearly label these wires + and -, and the fuel pumps are clearly labeled + and -. The instructions also clearly state where to connect them with full color pictures. If a shop does not understand the implications of hooking up an electric pump backwards and decide to ignore the labels on the wires, ignore the instructions and connect them to the opposite labels on the pump then they have no business touching our customers cars. There are sooooo many things that must be perfect when installing our kit. Installers must not only understand how turbo's, wastegates, blow off valves, engines and electronics work, but also understand the implications of a significant mistake like this.

We have had several people install these kits, and created what many consider to be the best instruction manual and kit they've ever seen. We will continue to make improvements to these as need be, but nothing in this world is idiot proof. There will always be someone that surprises you.

Take care,
Chris.

[azjimi]

...nothing in this world is idiot proof. There will always be someone that surprises you.
Chris.

That is so, so true!

[spyfish]

I see there is some conjecture on another forum that we could change how the wires are connected from our kit to the fuel pump to make it entirely idiot proof. We clearly label these wires + and -, and the fuel pumps are clearly labeled + and -. The instructions also clearly state where to connect them with full color pictures. If a shop does not understand the implications of hooking up an electric pump backwards and decide to ignore the labels on the wires, ignore the instructions and connect them to the opposite labels on the pump then they have no business touching our customers cars. There are sooooo many things that must be perfect when installing our kit. Installers must not only understand how turbo's, wastegates, blow off valves, engines and electronics work, but also understand the implications of a significant mistake like this.

We have had several people install these kits, and created what many consider to be the best instruction manual and kit they've ever seen. We will continue to make improvements to these as need be, but nothing in this world is idiot proof. There will always be someone that surprises you.

Hello Chris, I started the conjecture on the other forum. I've been a member here too, but I just have not posted. I have been admired your kits from a distance for quite some time now. I do agree that there are so many things that can wrong and nothing is idiot proof. Everyone knows the saying, we'll just make a bigger idiot right? I really did give a complement when I started my post about the nice ECU connector you use. I stated this fact to point out that HPF doesn't appear to take shortcuts. (And no, I'm not saying this was a shortcut.) I still really wonder why you don't take this lesson (even if it was a customer's lesson) and apply it to future revisions and additional kits? Someone obviously didn't notice the '+' & '-' terminals. I just think you make the effort to make as much of the kit idiot proof as reasonably possible and you improve as you move forward and learn difficult lessons. Can you agree with this idea?

I guess I really posted because I feel like your response was one that was defensive and one that was trying to set expectations. I did not mean to induce such a response. I simply wanted to suggest an improvement in a peaceful manner. I personally ignore all of the you vs them vs us crap out. I just like to see fast cars. :D

[sataraid]

Wow Chris. I applaud HPF offering to rebuild to factory specs. You didnt have to do that. Let me know when you get the 330ci turbo kit rolling. One more thing. WHERES MY DVD. LOL