Active Autowerke / ASA Powered Gen 5 Supercharger System Official Release

[Jean@ActiveAutowerke]

A new heart for a new Generation. ASA - The charger of choice for The Gen 5 E46 M3 SC System

Today as in the past, Active has stood for innovation, perfection and dependability, virtues aimed at our ultimate objective.- To deliver sheer driving pleasure at all times, pursuing visions, measuring ourselves against the competition and tackling new technological challenges. In May 2008 Catesby Jones took the ASA powered E46 M3 to 7,000 + Victorious Miles in the One Lap of America event, confirming again that Active Autowerke builds the finest E46 M3 Supercharger systems available today.

Retail price on the Gen V kits will be $12,900.00 and the upgrade cost from our Gen 3 kits will be $5,900.00.

Intro Pricing:
Gen V Kit - $11,900.00
Gen V Upgrade - $5,000.00

http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f379/JeanSada/ASAEngineBaySitePic.jpg

Here is an average run from our final testing done on June 30th, 2008. (Both charts are the same run)

Dyno:

Conditions:
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f379/JeanSada/ASA-AADynoConditions.jpg

Power:
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f379/JeanSada/ASA-AAE46M3Dyno.jpg

[Chr325is]

Wrong thread title? You guys are using ASA chargers now?? Why the switch from Rotrex?? What ASA model are you guys using? Looks awesome :thumbsup:

[Boosted_ZHP]

Wow :excited: That is some nice power.

[Jean@ActiveAutowerke]

Wrong thread title? You guys are using ASA chargers now?? Why the switch from Rotrex?? What ASA model are you guys using? Looks awesome :thumbsup:

Thanks. Its not a switch, more like another option. :pimpin:

Wow :excited: That is some nice power.

Thanks :bow:

[Jean@ActiveAutowerke]

Wrong thread title? :thumbsup:

Actually just noticed that. Thanks again.

[Chr325is]

Actually just noticed that. Thanks again.
No problem, new kit looks awesome. Wish I had an M3 to put it on.

[M3_Jaydee]

Why the suddent neeed of an option? just wondering since you've been claiming the rotrex sc is the superior charger availeble for ever.
I don't think this suddent change of heart will go by without a good explanation from you since other vendors found out the + sides a loooong time ago and you guys just keept on pushing the Rotrex as the greatest thing in the world ;)
If I bought a gen 4 kit reasently I would be a little confused by this.
However from owning both a rotrex and ASA based kit this was the best thing you could do.
I just find this a little weird from you side :hi:

[Jean@ActiveAutowerke]

Why the suddent neeed of an option? just wondering since you've been claiming the rotrex sc is the superior charger availeble for ever.
I don't think this suddent change of heart will go by without a good explanation from you since other vendors found out the + sides a loooong time ago and you guys just keept on pushing the Rotrex as the greatest thing in the world ;)
If I bought a gen 4 kit reasently I would be a little confused by this.
However from owning both a rotrex and ASA based kit this was the best thing you could do.
I just find this a little weird from you side :hi:

We are not switching over. We will still over both.

Rotrex kits have their pros and so does the ASA kits. :thumbsup:

[M3_Jaydee]

We are not switching over. We will still over both.

Rotrex kits have their pros and so does the ASA kits. :thumbsup:

ok then, what are the pros of the rotrex now that you know both except the much lower price?

[HighBoostin330]

Congrats on finally using a good compressor. Looks like another similar kit on the market. :)

But I do find it a bit odd that you make approximately the same power at 9PSI when compared to ESS's 7.5PSI. AA does make a bit of more horsepower up top, but approximately the same torque when you do the STD to DIN conversion factor or vice versa. However, this is assuming you are using the TMI-20 compressor.

Can you post the dyno with SAE correction? Thanks. :thumbsup:

[sheefo2k]

Finally!!! congratulation on using one of the best compressors in the world.
I m a huge ASA fan even though i ll be switching to turbo with in next weeks (or else I would continue using my ASA)

Either way good move, which ASA tm??

[OCswedishM3]

Congrats on finally using a good compressor. Looks like another similar kit on the market. :)

But I do find it a bit odd that you make approximately the same power at 9PSI when compared to ESS's 7.5PSI. AA does make a bit of more horsepower up top, but approximately the same torque when you do the STD to DIN conversion factor or vice versa. However, this is assuming you are using the TMI-20 compressor.

Can you post the dyno with SAE correction? Thanks. :thumbsup:

But the thing is AA dyno'd at 100F while ESS did at 60F. Do u know how much more horsepower i get from a 40F temp difference.. I can tell you its more than i get from pump to race fuel... And look at the torque curve difference, the AA kit holds the line much better towards redline while the ESS drops off. U know this really doesnt matter anyways because to this day there arent any S/C'd ESS M3's around california, let alone the US. Cuz if there were we would see vids or hear about them. And i guarantee within a month or 2 there will be more Gen 5 AA kits in the US then any ESS kit in any state. I think VF has more kits nationwide already, and they just started in the e46 M3 market. Another topic though, how do u like your built TS? Having fun with it...

[eurotekm3]

Finally!!! congratulation on using one of the best compressors in the world.
I m a huge ASA fan even though i ll be switching to turbo with in next weeks (or else I would continue using my ASA)

Either way good move, which ASA tm??



turbo is better.......:thumbsup:

[steelgrey330ci]

good job aa nice move with the ASA unit

[HighBoostin330]

But the thing is AA dyno'd at 100F while ESS did at 60F. Do u know how much more horsepower i get from a 40F temp difference.. I can tell you its more than i get from pump to race fuel... And look at the torque curve difference, the AA kit holds the line much better towards redline while the ESS drops off. U know this really doesnt matter anyways because to this day there arent any S/C'd ESS M3's around california, let alone the US. Cuz if there were we would see vids or hear about them. And i guarantee within a month or 2 there will be more Gen 5 AA kits in the US then any ESS kit in any state. I think VF has more kits nationwide already, and they just started in the e46 M3 market. Another topic though, how do u like your built TS? Having fun with it...

Last time I checked, wasn't the dyno correction factor suppose to help compensate for temperature differences? As it is shown on the dyno chart, AA used STD correction and had a correction factor of 1.03. I am sure that ESS had the DIN correction factor lower their uncorrected horsepower ratings. True the high temperatures does lower horsepower, but that is where the correction factor suppose to come in right?

It seems like the correction factor only had a 15RWHP increase from ideal conditions for AA with its 1.03 correction factor.

As for the torque curve, I commend AA for having a nice torque curve, but wouldn't that be expected if your pushing 9PSI? Comparing 7PSI vs 9PSI power curves have a somewhat moot point. But that is just IMO.

Just because you don't see videos or hear about them, doesn't mean they don't exist. Some people just don't surf the forums as we do. As for videos, even yourself you say you are weary of doing straight racing now that your friend got caught.

I personally know of one ESS S/C kit in Seattle running their older kits. There is supposedly another one in Temple City with that same kit. However, there is the new CFR500 kit on the Z4M and VT440 kit on the E46 M3 in Arizona, which was displayed at Bimmerfest and I believe will be at MFest. So there are kits in the US and in California.

As for S/C kit sales in the US, it is all about marketing. That boils down to how well AA and VF can market their products. They push it so much harder on the market. Nice to know that they are doing well in the states. It seems as if ESS allows for their products to speak for themselves without much marketing. If it wasn't for MarvelPhx, ESS wouldn't have even came to Bimmerfest. Good job to AA and VF on their marketing. :thumbsup:

My TS3 is doing well. Thank you for asking. Pulls hard and looks OEM now that all the black anodized parts are in. It met my goal for the project. OEM looks with amazing power. How is your car doing? You have been absent from the forum lately.

[Jean@ActiveAutowerke]

ok then, what are the pros of the rotrex now that you know both except the much lower price?

Honestly this is not the place for that discussion. We have posted countless times on the strong points of the Rotrex. I am sure you know them well as you once had our kit.

I am not trying to build one systems reputation by putting another one down.

The E46 M3 market demanded another option and we have provided that option.

Thanks all. :thumbsup:

Congrats on finally using a good compressor. Looks like another similar kit on the market. :)

But I do find it a bit odd that you make approximately the same power at 9PSI when compared to ESS's 7.5PSI. AA does make a bit of more horsepower up top, but approximately the same torque when you do the STD to DIN conversion factor or vice versa. However, this is assuming you are using the TMI-20 compressor.

Can you post the dyno with SAE correction? Thanks. :thumbsup:

That other company is ESS. From what i hear they make a great kit. I am not here to compare ours to theirs either.

These are our results. We are using the TM20 (TMI-20).

The reason i do not post SAE for F/I cars is because SAE does not take Boost/Forced Indution into consideration. It is however a great way to compare N/A cars around the world.

I used STD to show the vehicle dynoed on that day's performance under the given conditions.

:thumbsup:

[DLSJ5]

But the thing is AA dyno'd at 100F while ESS did at 60F. Do u know how much more horsepower i get from a 40F temp difference.. I can tell you its more than i get from pump to race fuel... And look at the torque curve difference, the AA kit holds the line much better towards redline while the ESS drops off. U know this really doesnt matter anyways because to this day there arent any S/C'd ESS M3's around california, let alone the US. Cuz if there were we would see vids or hear about them. And i guarantee within a month or 2 there will be more Gen 5 AA kits in the US then any ESS kit in any state. I think VF has more kits nationwide already, and they just started in the e46 M3 market. Another topic though, how do u like your built TS? Having fun with it...

Nate, you going this route?

[Dreksc]

How's the install on this supercharger compared to Gen3 kits. Can you do it yourself? Also, what additional mods were on this car during the dyno? I'm assuming this was done on 91 octane? ALso, was this on your mustang dyno, which usually reads low?

[OCswedishM3]

Nate, you going this route?

I made the same power on a DD as this did on a dynojet. I know the ASA flows better though and has a better power and torque curve though than mine. And most people dont realize its the power under the curve that wins races, not the peak number. So i do believe the ASA is a better kompressor and perhaps more powerful. I really dont want to do anything else to my car unless i have the option to build my engine. I dont know what the maximum CFM is on the TM20 unit though? Maybe Jean could PM me or send me some info on this, I would jump on this in a heart beat if i could lower my compression to 10:5:1 and up my boost to ~1bar. I dont think this unit is maxed out at 9psi though, there has to be some more room to play. What do u think?
But if i do go this route, we will run early in the am 1 day with my current setup and then again with the ASA, to see the difference. You should definetly go with the stage 3 upgrade u have available. I would be all over that...

[///JTM3]

AA sorry for thead jack...

Nate, what happened with your friend who got cought racing... PM me if you want...

AA lets see some number with race fuel and meth... :excited:

[Ferm3]

A new heart for a new Generation. ASA - The charger of choice for The Gen 5 E46 M3 SC System

Today as in the past, Active has stood for innovation, perfection and dependability, virtues aimed at our ultimate objective.- To deliver sheer driving pleasure at all times, pursuing visions, measuring ourselves against the competition and tackling new technological challenges. In May 2008 Catesby Jones took the ASA powered E46 M3 to 7,000 + Victorious Miles in the One Lap of America event, confirming again that Active Autowerke builds the finest E46 M3 Supercharger systems available today.

Retail price on the Gen V kits will be $12,900.00 and the upgrade cost from our Gen 3 kits will be $5,900.00.

Intro Pricing:
Gen V Kit - $11,900.00
Gen V Upgrade - $5,000.00

http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f379/JeanSada/ASAEngineBaySitePic.jpg

Here is an average run from our final testing done on June 30th, 2008. (Both charts are the same run)

Dyno:

Conditions:
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f379/JeanSada/ASA-AADynoConditions.jpg

Power:
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f379/JeanSada/ASA-AAE46M3Dyno.jpg



Great Numbers...do you have a video yet?

[Saintly]

Great option to have nice work AA. :thumbsup:

[HPFMTRE]

AA sorry for thead jack...

Nate, what happened with your friend who got cought racing... PM me if you want...

AA lets see some number with race fuel and meth... :excited:

lol

[Jean@ActiveAutowerke]

Please Read:

I am provided a comparison chart comparing our Gen V ASA based system to our Gen 3 Level 2 Rotrex based system.

The chart provided is from our Mustang Dyno. We develop and tune all of our kits in house on our Mustang Dyno. Reason being the Mustang does provide accurate load on the engines, which is better for tuning since it provides real world conditions. As street tuning for hours of WOT runs is illegal and dangerous.

The Gen V Dyno displayed is from our One Lap of America car during testing before the race. The car would be considered detuned compared to the final production kit which is on the car now.

The Dyno will display the HP curve, Torque curve as well as the boost curve.

We use the Dyno Jet so we can compare our results and performance gains to everyone else (so its more of an apples to apples comparison). You will notice the curves are a tad bit more aggressive on the Mustang Dyno due to load.

As you can see our Mustang is very selfish and does not like to provide high horsepower figures.


Chart

Gen V
Gen III
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f379/JeanSada/ASARotrexcompare.jpg

[Matt Q]

Damn!!! And I just installed my Stage 3 - lol.... at least there is something else to now look forward to :)

The chart looks more aggressive earlier.. looks like more low end which is nice.

[jcqnet]

AA What's included with gen V?

[0-60motorsports]

JEAN Nice work, Hopefully i will make up my mind between the Gen V or the VF, But you know you My Bro :D

[battaM3]

aa all the way ^^^^

[Titan 3]

Good show! ASA makes a killer blower. I've always liked the fit and finish of AA's stuff, but that blower seemed sub-par.

[Sudprop]

Ack! Only 4k miles on my new Rotrex kit....Man you guys are just dying to get me to spend another $5k.... :(

[malina]

Jean@ActiveAutowerke,
Since AA's website isn't updated yet with the new M3 SC kit, can you post what's included in this kit?

[greentrbo95gst]

Is ESS using Dynojet to show the SC potential? Both companies should try Mustang Dyno if available in the areas and show more realisting numbers. It's definitely a nice option to have because some people like ASA better than Rotrex.

[HighBoostin330]

Is ESS using Dynojet to show the SC potential? Both companies should try Mustang Dyno if available in the areas and show more realisting numbers. It's definitely a nice option to have because some people like ASA better than Rotrex.

ESS does use Dynojet for their dyno numbers. When you are driving on the road, your tires only have one point of contact. Not two contact points like there is from two rollers on the Mustang Dyno. It is nice that Mustang Dyno has load, but Dynojet has developed the 224xLC for that reason. So both can be used for software tuning.

I had the shop in the Bay Area with a 224xLC dyno my car and do a loaded and free inertia run, the numbers came out almost exact. In addition, if you do the 15%-18% drivetrain loss, it comes out to very close to what manufacturer's numbers claim.

[greentrbo95gst]

One of our local shops recently did a little test to see how close Mustang load-bearing dyno replicates real street load.

The main reason they did this is that it is very vital that the load matches the street when tuning ecu-controlled boost as it is a load-target based system. If the mustang dyno wasn't matching street load then all the tuning of the boost on the dyno would have to be redone or cleaned up again on the street after.

Both plots here are done in 3rd gear, one on the street, one on the dyno. The street plot only goes to 6750 as it was a bit busy on the street at the time.

http://www.norcalmotorsports.org/users/bryan/mods/EVO/tech/mustangDyno_vs_street.gif

[HighBoostin330]

One of our local shops recently did a little test to see how close Mustang load-bearing dyno replicates real street load.

The main reason they did this is that it is very vital that the load matches the street when tuning ecu-controlled boost as it is a load-target based system. If the mustang dyno wasn't matching street load then all the tuning of the boost on the dyno would have to be redone or cleaned up again on the street after.

Both plots here are done in 3rd gear, one on the street, one on the dyno. The street plot only goes to 6750 as it was a bit busy on the street at the time.

http://www.norcalmotorsports.org/users/bryan/mods/EVO/tech/mustangDyno_vs_street.gif

That is all nice, but ESS does the majority of their tuning on the street. Dynos can only do so much in regards to tuning. The Dynojet is used to show numbers and baseline tuning. I am sure the Dynojet load control dynos are accurate as well or else they wouldn't be sold on the market under the Dynojet name. Maybe someone should try your same graphical representation and experiment for the Dynojet load control dyno. Hit up NextGen Performance in Hayward, as they are the only ones in the Bay Area that I know that has a 224xLC.

Lucky for ESS, they have the Autobahn and the 'Ring for actual real street tuning and can drive the cars harder than a normal US customer will ever.

At the end of the day, when people talk about horsepower, Dynojets have still been consistent to manufacturer number when the drivetrain loss of 15-18% is taken into account.

[Jean@ActiveAutowerke]

I don't think the amount of contact points is what is up for discussion. The Mustang Dyno will provide resistance based on the cars weight to provide real world load conditions and etc... This helps greatly when tuning a kit such as ours, this allows us to take our time to properly tune the entire RPM band under different load conditions such as what you would experience while daily driving, etc...

As you can see the charts above the Mustang Dyno is pretty much exactly the same as driving on the street. It is safer to tune on the Dyno and do as few test as possible on the street. We prefer the Dyno or the track. We were able to use what we learned after having our car experience the One Lap of America race and use that to perfect our tuning as well.

The Dyno Jet is great for comparing performance since it is very popular. All of the vendors on this board use a Dyno Jet for final numbers. Which IMHO is fair.

[greentrbo95gst]

Exactly what I was saying. Unfortunately Dynojet numbers do not provide "real" power to the ground. It's very much overestimated, but I know customers love seeing higher numbers than what the car actually is.