Change your belt tensioners!

[Minnoe07]

Well, I was driving out of a car wash and all of sudden I hear a screeching noise and my power steering goes out. Pulled over and looked at it for a second. Couldn't find anything wrong. Figured it was the power steering pump that went bad. So started the car back up and starting heading home and my power steering came back up.

I was like, hmmm..... if it was the pump, then it wouldn't just decide to start working again. So anyways, I drive home just fine. I get in and decide to poke around a little bit. Start it up and makes a little noise. Turn it off, Turn it back on, look under the hood and the serpentine belt is halfway off the supercharger pulley. :yikes:

So I run and turn the car off and it dawns on me, the belt tensioner went bad. So I start tearing into it and remove the belt tensioner. This is what i find.

http://i112.photobucket.com/albums/n161/Minnoe07/BMW/Belt%20Tensioner/2009_0202Image0008.jpg

http://i112.photobucket.com/albums/n161/Minnoe07/BMW/Belt%20Tensioner/2009_0202Image0006.jpg

Suck. Well, when I remove the belt tensioner, a piece of aluminum falls of of somewhere else. Well, crap....... So I look and I find out it is part of the mounting points for the belt tensioner. So a new one can't go on b/c the belt tensioner can't be remounted as a mounting point broke.

So I get it towed to the dealership. They come back and say that the mounting point was the oil filter housing and it must be replaced. Cost: $2200. :cry:

So now my car is at an independent shop fixing it for around $1300-$1500. That is just for the oil filter housing. They are going to replace my radiator hoses, thermostat, expansion tank, and water pump while they are in there.

Lesson: CHANGE YOUR BELT TENSIONER!! Especially you ESS TS people. I just wish somebody would have told me to change the belt tensioner more often than what i was planning. The advice they gave me: every 15,000 miles.Seems kind of excessive since I made it to 65,000 miles. Although the supercharger has only been on the car for 25,000 miles. I will probably end up changing it every 30,000.

Happy motoring.

[MachRc]

ouch..2200 hundred!!!!!!!


i want to scream together with you!!!!!!!!!!! zomg!

[Activ3]

You can replace that hydraulic tensioner for a spring loaded one. AAs sc kits come with a different spring loaded tensioner that replaces that one, I wasn't sure why, but I guess that's why.. sorry to hear that man.

As for the oil filter housing, that sounds a bit expensive.. I've helped a friend change one before, and I think the actual part was like $350... The actual swap itself isn't very hard either.

[Dirtboy]

Guess I'll be changing mine out when I get back. :eek:

[Minnoe07]

Yea, if I had a weekend with a friend and a daily driver than I would definitely be doing it myself.

What is this spring loaded belt tensioner? Is it the same body with a spring instead of hydraulics? If it is, then it might not be much help as you can see that the actual hydraulic didn't break. If it isn't, then it definitely might be worth looking into. Anything to prevent it from happening again. This is putting me out a lot of money.

[BimmerDude18]

Yea, if I had a weekend with a friend and a daily driver than I would definitely be doing it myself.

What is this spring loaded belt tensioner? Is it the same body with a spring instead of hydraulics? If it is, then it might not be much help as you can see that the actual hydraulic didn't break. If it isn't, then it definitely might be worth looking into. Anything to prevent it from happening again. This is putting me out a lot of money.The spring doesn't have the hydraulic piston part, its a radial spring that puts tension on the belt, instead of the pulley arm being in tension from the hydraulic piston, the arm is in torsion from the spring.

The tensioner I had on my E36 was the spring type and it didn't break like that, but I've also never seen that happen before.

[BadBoostedBmwM3]

You can replace that hydraulic tensioner for a spring loaded one. AAs sc kits come with a different spring loaded tensioner that replaces that one, I wasn't sure why, but I guess that's why.. sorry to hear that man.

As for the oil filter housing, that sounds a bit expensive.. I've helped a friend change one before, and I think the actual part was like $350... The actual swap itself isn't very hard either.

Yea... I'm pretty sure bmw sell a "kit" per-say to change to the spring loaded one or vice-versa. Of course, it will be expensive.

[Minnoe07]

Anybody have a picture or a place where I could source one?

And I know the hydraulic tensioner is the "updated" version when they changed tensioners a long time ago.

[paraklas]

I still don't get why the hydraulic tensioner is an upgrade from BMW. More parts to break and more expensive.
I have the spring loaded one and the only thing I replaced was the deflection pulley from the tensioner because it was noisy. That's all.

[Safar]

Actually with the hydraulic tensioner you can also replace just the pulley. Interestingly when I did my belts & pulleys I had to replace the entire mechanical tensioner on the A/C belt, because I couldn't get a seperate pulley for that one.

What I'm interested in is how the OP's hydraulic tensioner broke in half like that. Was it because the pulley seized or something?

[paraklas]

Actually with the hydraulic tensioner you can also replace just the pulley. Interestingly when I did my belts & pulleys I had to replace the entire mechanical tensioner on the A/C belt, because I couldn't get a seperate pulley for that one.


The A/C tensioner comes as a single part in the parts catalogue but you can replace the pulley only. I did it 2 weeks ago. The deflection pulley was the same as the main tensioner one.

[Activ3]

I'm not sure what car the spring tensioner came off of, maybe an e36? I'm also really not sure how yours broke like that...

[BadBoostedBmwM3]

I still don't get why the hydraulic tensioner is an upgrade from BMW. More parts to break and more expensive.
I have the spring loaded one and the only thing I replaced was the deflection pulley from the tensioner because it was noisy. That's all.

Actually the hydraulic is less expensive by a couple of dollars.... and according to my dealer they are supposed to last twice as long.
Actually with the hydraulic tensioner you can also replace just the pulley. Interestingly when I did my belts & pulleys I had to replace the entire mechanical tensioner on the A/C belt, because I couldn't get a seperate pulley for that one.

What I'm interested in is how the OP's hydraulic tensioner broke in half like that. Was it because the pulley seized or something?

And, I just changed my belts, pulley, and tensioners too. I didn't know you could buy just the pulley assemble alone.
Where did you get yours from?

[Minnoe07]

The pulley itself was not siezed. It moved freely and was bolted down correctly. It had no free play in it.

The only reason I could think of why the tensioner would break like that is because of the pulley configuration of the ESS supercharger system. But, I don't know for sure. If my case is the first of the tensioner breaking like this, then this is the only thing that really separates me from other tensioner failures. Hopefully nobody else with a TS2 will have a tensioner failure like I did, but I guess time will tell. Better if we don't find out. I will definitely be changing mine out every 30K miles.

Just as a reference, here is the belt routing for the ESS TS. Not a pic of my car though. I'm not that hardcore. :lmao:

http://i112.photobucket.com/albums/n161/Minnoe07/BMW/ESS%20TS2%20Install/Idlerbeltroute.jpg

[330i ZHP]

i broke two of the support brackets and one oil filter housing due to that cursed design - I am running that tensioner on the sedan and the older spring loaded tensioner on the wagon - the wagon squeals under load....

ugh and to replace the tension er (the hydraulic unit) you have to buy the parts since there isnt a single tensioner unit to purchase.

[330i ZHP]

http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd62/smoulton0204/100_5106.jpg
http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd62/smoulton0204/100_5105.jpg
http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd62/smoulton0204/100_5104.jpg

that was the first one - and when it broke I thought for sure I had thrown a rod or spun a bearing

I replaced the bracket (the part broken) and later used it on the install for the wagon. The bracket broke again and that time took out the oil filter housing. Luckily, I had a spare one...so I used the old style spring type pulley I had. That is the one that squeals

[Safar]

And, I just changed my belts, pulley, and tensioners too. I didn't know you could buy just the pulley assemble alone.
Where did you get yours from?


Dealership. It's number 6 on this graph (atleast on my car, don't think there's any difference between years)
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=BM51&mospid=47618&btnr=11_2190&hg=11&fg=18

[330i ZHP]

I think he has the old style tensioner

[330i ZHP]

number two on this page

old style tensioner from a 323 (http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=AM33&mospid=47718&btnr=11_2205&hg=11&fg=18)

[Safar]

Fair enough, I thought we were taking about the hydraulic tensioner though (new one).

The one you snapped, Stuart, was that also on your TS2 car?

[Minnoe07]

Dang, I feel bad cause it happened to you too, but I feel better knowing I wasn't the only one. I just hope all the other ESS TS people learn from us and avoid this costly fix yet cheap prevention.

[330i ZHP]

Fair enough, I thought we were taking about the hydraulic tensioner though (new one).

The one you snapped, Stuart, was that also on your TS2 car?

yes, the first time on the new motor build on the sedan and the second time with a new bracket but added to the wagon motor - both ts2+

Dang, I feel bad cause it happened to you too, but I feel better knowing I wasn't the only one. I just hope all the other ESS TS people learn from us and avoid this costly fix yet cheap prevention.

I would like to isolate the problem - and if you add the prices to buy a complete new unit it is like $300

[Minnoe07]

If I remember correctly, the complete kit for the hydraulic tensioner cost less than $200 from the dealership. That comes with all the bolts, washers, and pulley. Still it sucks to have to replace something often when it shouldn't need to it.

My only solution right now is to change it more frequently. I think the ESS pulley system definitely has something to do with how the belt tensioner breaks. The only way to get around it is if ESS comes with a new way to reroute the belt or make a beefier belt tensioner me thinks.

[330i ZHP]

can you give me a dealer or part number? Also, I have absolutely no problems with the older style pulley setup and the hydraulic tensioner. With the newer style pulley setup I cannot run the hydraulic (or at least that is my experience) and why I am running the older style tensioner with the newer style pulley configuration from ESS

[330i ZHP]

I have asked Aj and Hans for some input on this.

[Minnoe07]

Good idea. Hopefully they will have some input on this. For anyone who needs to get their tensioners replaced, I don't think they have an option on a new or old one because BMW only stocks the new style now.


Hmmm.... maybe I should ask AJ about moving me back to the old pulley setup. Unfortunately, when I moved to the new pulley setup, I threw the old stuff away. Suck......

[paraklas]

I was thinking to get this. (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/BMW-E31-V12-V8-M3-M5-E36-E46-BILLET-6082-PULLEYS_W0QQitemZ220270322724QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_CarsParts _Vehicles_CarParts_SM?hash=item220270322724&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1683%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318 ) Combined with a spring loaded tensioner it should be pretty much bulletproof?

[Safar]

I think you can replace the older style (mechanical) A/C belt tensioner with the newer hydraulic tensioner. Would that work the other way around as well (i.e. use an A/C mechanical tensioner for the accessory belt)?
If so, an easy fix would simply be a matter of swapping both tensioners.

[Sales@ESS]

Hello,

Our idlepulley setup will fit both the old and new style tension system.
The tension assembly is located between the water pump pulley and crank pulley. Both stock and ESS belt loop has the exact same loop around the tension pulley.
It is in other places of the belt loop that ESS is different from the stock belt loop. The supercharger pulley and the new idle pulleys does not impact on the tension assembly in any way. The only stress on the tension assembly is the stress created from the tension in the spring or the hydraulics in the new style tension system.

It is important that the belt used is not to short. This means the tensioner could be hitting into the metal in maximum tension position. If you look at the tension pulley when the car is running you can see that is moving a little forth and back all the time. This is to take up small unbalances / movements from all the pulleys on the front of the engine.

We recommend to only use Contitech belts and to use the recommended length from ESS.

I have not seen many belt failures on this cars, but after seeing the problem with this cars I will recommend customer to change the tensioner when they install the kit. Especially if the car has 50000miles or more on the clock. This could be a cheap insurance to prevent this from happening. We will include this as a service point in our service guide for this kits.

Regards

Hans @ ESS

[mav909]

would this have been less likely to happen without a supercharger?

[330i ZHP]

would this have been less likely to happen without a supercharger?

it can - not saying it will...it is more likely if you have the earlier mechanical tensioner


Hans,

Thank you for the reply.

Stuart

[Minnoe07]

Thanks for the reply. I will be changing mine out every 30K miles to prevent the same thing from happening.

Currently I am running the new hydraulic belt tensioner from BMW and the updated idler setup for the ESS TS2 setup. The belt is the original that was sent from ESS with the new idler pulleys.

Is it possible that the belt that you send is just long enough to where it is close to maxing out the arm on the hydraulic tensioner? Would a shorter belt help the situation without slipping the belt?

I did go over 20,000 miles on the hydraulic setup with the ESS TS2 but probably 2/3 of the way through those miles, I switched to the updated idler setup that was sent by ESS. I don't know if that exacerbated the problem.

Either way, I now have a brand new tensioner on and have approximately 66,000 miles on the car. I'll let you know if it breaks before another 30,000 miles.

[330i ZHP]

I was not able to get a "part number" for ordering the hyd tens from BMW - but there is a service bullitan stating to change to the hyd from mech on earlier cars

Can anyone provide me with an ordering solution other than spending $300+

[Safar]

What about just replacing the baseplate instead of the whole assembly? That seems to be the part that breaks all the time. The hydraulics may very well still be good.

[MarvelPhx]

I think too short a belt is the problem Hans mentions that can happen. If the tensioner is pulled in to max reach, any stress on the belt during power transitions and you are at the limit already of tensioner movement... Something would have to give.

Ive seen these fail on stock cars (famous on the E36s too), but running too small a belt on the stock or TS-equipped kits can def cause it to happen sooner.

Always better to check them, make sure they are not maxed in movement range, etc when you check belts as part of maintenance.

[330i ZHP]

What about just replacing the baseplate instead of the whole assembly? That seems to be the part that breaks all the time. The hydraulics may very well still be good.

Regretfully that is what I replaced after the first break - and on the second break it took out the oil filter mount.

[330i ZHP]

I think too short a belt is the problem Hans mentions that can happen. If the tensioner is pulled in to max reach, any stress on the belt during power transitions and you are at the limit already of tensioner movement... Something would have to give.

Ive seen these fail on stock cars (famous on the E36s too), but running too small a belt on the stock or TS-equipped kits can def cause it to happen sooner.

Always better to check them, make sure they are not maxed in movement range, etc when you check belts as part of maintenance.

I can tell you that I cannot install the belt with the newer pulley design and the hydraulic tensioner with the TS2+. The Hydraulic tensioner is pulled to the furthest and the belt will not slip over the tensioner pulley.

I am hoping to switch to the newer style pulley setup when I switch that motor to TS3 and the smaller pulley.

[Whammy]

:eek:

This thread scares me. My tensioner is making noise for the past 3 months (winter in WI). Granted I am not SC/TC, but still scary.

[TxZHP04]

I can tell you that I cannot install the belt with the newer pulley design and the hydraulic tensioner with the TS2+. The Hydraulic tensioner is pulled to the furthest and the belt will not slip over the tensioner pulley.

I am hoping to switch to the newer style pulley setup when I switch that motor to TS3 and the smaller pulley.

Wait, I'm confused now. You currently have the old style or the new style idler pulley setup from ESS?

I have the newer idler pulley setup, as pictured earlier in this thread.
http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showpost.php?p=9359576&postcount=14

Been running this for close to a year now with no problems. I had no issues getting the belt on with the 8.5 psi (TS2+) pulley and the hydraulic tensioner isn't fully compressed with the belt on.

[TxZHP04]

:eek:

This thread scares me. My tensioner is making noise for the past 3 months (winter in WI). Granted I am not SC/TC, but still scary.

You probably just need to replace the pulley. If you have the older mechanical tensioner you could consider upgrading to the newer hydraulic tensioner. I wouldn't wait to address this. You won't likely see the failure discussed here but if the tensioner pulley siezes you'll destroy the belt at which point the water pump, alternator, etc will quit working. Needless to say, you do not want your water pump to quit....

[Navin323i]

Wow... how ironic I came across this thread while doing a search on "belt tensioner".

Currently I have the ESS TS1 in my car and I also have the older style mechanical belt tensioner (part # 11281427252), which I have confirmed that BMW has discontinued thereby requiring us to convert to the hydraulic tensioner setup should the mechanical belt tensioner fail me.
I recently had issues where my steering wheel would become very difficult to turn and all the dash error lights came on. Long story made short, the serpentine belt checked out fine and we replaced the power steering pump and so far the issue has not come back.

Then I recently replaced my mechanical fan clutch with an electrical fan and after doing this my mechanic detected a noise that he hadn't heard before... serpentine belt chirp upon hard acceleration. My mechanic and I spoke with Hans who recommended we replace both the serpentine belt (Contitech 6pk1965 I believe) and the belt tensioner. The chirping itself is relatively minor and my mechanic feels it's not necessary to replace either the belt nor the tensioner at this time, but after reading the thread here I'm wondering:

1) Should I replace my belt tensioner since I have the older mechanical style, my car is supercharged with the ESS TS1, and my 323i has 68,000 miles with the mechanical belt tensioner I have now?

2) There was talk here in this thread about "updated idler pulley setup" from ESS. Is that something I should get for my TS1 setup or do I already have it? My TS1 was purchased March 2008.

3) Is the "spring loaded" tensioner the same as "mechanical" tensioner? Someone here said the AA ones come with this spring loaded tensioner... can we not use this same style tensioner with our ESS setups?

4) Durability-wise is the hydraulic belt tensioner setup less durable than the mechanical belt tensioner setup I have now? If yes then I'm wondering if it's safer for me to keep the mechanical belt tensioner setup I have now.

[Navin323i]

can you give me a dealer or part number? Also, I have absolutely no problems with the older style pulley setup and the hydraulic tensioner. With the newer style pulley setup I cannot run the hydraulic (or at least that is my experience) and why I am running the older style tensioner with the newer style pulley configuration from ESS

What if one has the older style pulley configuration from ESS (I ASSUME that's what I have)... will it matter then if i have the older style mechanical belt tensioner or should I get the newer hydraulic style belt tensioner to avoid the scenario that you and the OP had with the oil filter housing mounting point breaking?

[Odiedog52]

had an AA SC installed about a month ago ... and all the sudden my power steering pump is screeching. It's not the belt making the noise, but the pump itself. So .. do I need a new pump? Or is it the same issue you experienced?

[TxZHP04]

2) There was talk here in this thread about "updated idler pulley setup" from ESS. Is that something I should get for my TS1 setup or do I already have it? My TS1 was purchased March 2008.

You most likely already have the newer idler pulley setup. I have the newer setup and my kit is a month or 2 older than yours. If you check the pic back in post #14, your belt routing should be the same. More specifically, you should see the belt route from the SC pulley between the 2 reddish/brown idler pulleys.

3) Is the "spring loaded" tensioner the same as "mechanical" tensioner?

Yes, spring loaded = mechanical.

[668Ci]

I have a mechanical tensioner and idler pulley for sale brand new if anyone wants. Listen to the OP and replace yours now!:pimpin:

[330i ZHP]

the sedan has the hydraulic and old style pulley setup the wagon has the mechanical and new style pulley setup

[Navin323i]

You most likely already have the newer idler pulley setup. I have the newer setup and my kit is a month or 2 older than yours. If you check the pic back in post #14, your belt routing should be the same. More specifically, you should see the belt route from the SC pulley between the 2 reddish/brown idler pulleys.

Yes, spring loaded = mechanical.

:hi: I'm still here at work and they've blocked all pics so I can't see any pics in this thread... will check when I get home. :)

My mechanic is an authorized AA S/C installer so when we initially contacted Hans we did so to find out whether ESS sells an upgraded belt tensioner like AA does and unfortunately ESS doesn't. I'm assuming the AA spring loaded belt tensioner wouldn't work with our ESS setups, right?

I have a mechanical tensioner and idler pulley for sale brand new if anyone wants. Listen to the OP and replace yours now!:pimpin:

I may shoot you a PM... Is the mechanical tensioner brand new or has it been used?

the sedan has the hydraulic and old style pulley setup the wagon has the mechanical and new style pulley setup

Yeah, I knew that but I was assuming I had the old style pulley setup which may not be the case now as Darren mentioned.

Assuming my setup is the same as your wagon, have you experienced any problems thus far with your mechanical belt tensioner? I've just had that belt chirp sound on hard acceleration... my big dilemma here is whether to keep the mechanical belt tensioner or upgrade to the hydraulic one, although if I have the newer style pulley setup and get the hydraulic one then I may run into the same problem you had with the belt being too tight. :dunno:

[330i ZHP]

I may have found a part number for a complete hydraulic tensioner from BMW - 11287838797

navin - you can update your mech unit to the hydra unit

[Navin323i]

I may have found a part number for a complete hydraulic tensioner from BMW - 11287838797

navin - you can update your mech unit to the hydra unit

:confused: But I thought you said with the new idler pulley system that your sedan has you were unable to use the hydraulic system in that sedan due to the belt being too tight therefore you had to use the old idler pulley system from ESS.

CORRECT on the part number for the complete hydraulic tensioner from BMW... confirmed from Jason@Tischer.

[330i ZHP]

navin - i cannot rule out that the tensioner that broke each time was a used one from the motor I bought and it cold have had a defective part

[330i ZHP]

also, that tensioner for $60 shipped is too expensive - you can buy it cheaper else where the seller is offering it at retail plus shipping (i assume to recoup his costs)

[Safar]

If the problem is the belt being too tight, couldn't you just use a slightly longer drive belt?

[330i ZHP]

yes - but no more than 5mm or so - you do not want the belt too loose or it will squeal like a stuck pig with every use of the throttle

[bmwTuner1]

I changed mine about 3k mi ago :)

sorry to hear about your situation though...

[BadBoostedBmwM3]

Wow... how ironic I came across this thread while doing a search on "belt tensioner".

Currently I have the ESS TS1 in my car and I also have the older style mechanical belt tensioner (part # 11281427252), which I have confirmed that BMW has discontinued thereby requiring us to convert to the hydraulic tensioner setup should the mechanical belt tensioner fail me.
I recently had issues where my steering wheel would become very difficult to turn and all the dash error lights came on. Long story made short, the serpentine belt checked out fine and we replaced the power steering pump and so far the issue has not come back.

Then I recently replaced my mechanical fan clutch with an electrical fan and after doing this my mechanic detected a noise that he hadn't heard before... serpentine belt chirp upon hard acceleration. My mechanic and I spoke with Hans who recommended we replace both the serpentine belt (Contitech 6pk1965 I believe) and the belt tensioner. The chirping itself is relatively minor and my mechanic feels it's not necessary to replace either the belt nor the tensioner at this time, but after reading the thread here I'm wondering:

1) Should I replace my belt tensioner since I have the older mechanical style, my car is supercharged with the ESS TS1, and my 323i has 68,000 miles with the mechanical belt tensioner I have now?

2) There was talk here in this thread about "updated idler pulley setup" from ESS. Is that something I should get for my TS1 setup or do I already have it? My TS1 was purchased March 2008.

3) Is the "spring loaded" tensioner the same as "mechanical" tensioner? Someone here said the AA ones come with this spring loaded tensioner... can we not use this same style tensioner with our ESS setups?

4) Durability-wise is the hydraulic belt tensioner setup less durable than the mechanical belt tensioner setup I have now? If yes then I'm wondering if it's safer for me to keep the mechanical belt tensioner setup I have now.

Navin, I have a 2000 323i with older mechanical belt tensioner too! I just replaced mine like 6 weeks ago (they were squealing).
Anyways, BMW has a kit to retrofit our cars to the hydraulic for like $450!!
So, I went to autozone and bought all my new mechanical belt tensioners. SO, Don't worry you can still get the Mechanical ones!!
FYI, I found that you can still get them through pelican-parts too..

[Navin323i]

Navin, I have a 2000 323i with older mechanical belt tensioner too! I just replaced mine like 6 weeks ago (they were squealing).
Anyways, BMW has a kit to retrofit our cars to the hydraulic for like $450!!
So, I went to autozone and bought all my new mechanical belt tensioners. SO, Don't worry you can still get the Mechanical ones!!
FYI, I found that you can still get them through pelican-parts too..

Thanks for the info!! Did you replace yours with another mechanical belt tensioner or did you convert to the hydraulic belt tensioner

Ok, here's where I'm REALLY confused - ESS owners here please UN-confuse me (LOL)...

Given that I have to replace my belt tensioner at some point (if not now then at some point in the near future since it is the original mechanical belt tensioner that came with my car and has 68k miles on it)... is it better that I get another mechanical belt tensioner or should I get a hydraulic belt tensioner?

My goal here is to have the MOST DURABLE, LONGER LASTING belt tensioner... I don't want to have what happened to the OP here to happen to me since my car is primarily used to transport my baby girl everywhere.

[Navin323i]

UPDATE

Just got off the phone with my mechanic who installed my ESS TS1 S/C.

What our game plan is will be to purchase a brand new Contitech serpentine belt from ESS AND either buy a new mechanical belt tensioner or a new hydraulic belt tensioner (I'm still undecided as to which of these tensioners I should get) and then have my mechanic install both the tensioner and belt at the same time. I will then take the current belt that I have on my car which is still good (less than one year old) and keep that in my trunk as a spare belt to use in the event of an emergency where my serpentine belt were to break for whatever reason.

My mechanic recommended that I replace the serpentine belt every 15k miles, however the tensioner though I don't need to replace that frequently (as in every 15k miles). He also advised that a good thing to check during inspection every year would be all the bolts (I'm assuming for that whole belt/tensioner system area) and make sure they're not loose, damaged, etc.

Another thing I found out is that even though BMW is no longer selling the mechanical belt tensioner, BMW actually didn't make those tensioners... another company did and that company is still around - the company's name might be called Reveal, but I'll need to research that further. Plus there are plenty of companies out there still selling the mechanical belt tensioners (someone mentioned Pelican Parts and I know my mechanic can easily get them from his suppliers too).

[tblue3cibm]

sell me your sc...............your car's rejecting it.

[Navin323i]

sell me your sc...............your car's rejecting it.

:slap: :rofl:

I'll sell you my squealing belt tensioner if you're interested, Anthony... looks like my car is rejecting it. :D

[Minnoe07]

Ok, I found the receipt for my hydraulic belt tensioner plus accesories. Here is the break down.

11-28-1-727-159 Protection cap adj. $4.35
11-28-1-730-532 Mudgaurd $4.35
11-28-1-748-131 Adjusting Pulley $59.99
11-28-1-838-797 Complete hydraulic $86.49

Subtotal $178.57
Tax $10.72
Total $189.29

This is w/ the BMWCCA discount. So I'm sure you can get it cheaper from else where. That includes all bolts, washers, and protetion caps.


Not to scare the person who posted about the power steering pump screeching, but that's exactly how mine start. I heard the noise, lost power steering. Then the belt tensioner completely broke and broke the oil filter housing behind it.

330i ZHP: You couldn't get the belt on with the new idler pulley setup and hydraulic belt tensioner? Was that also with the longer belt? I am currently running the new idler pulley setup, hydraulic belt tensioner, and the TS2 pulley which is bigger than the TS2+. I don't understand how that could be.

[BadBoostedBmwM3]

Thanks for the info!! Did you replace yours with another mechanical belt tensioner or did you convert to the hydraulic belt tensioner

Ok, here's where I'm REALLY confused - ESS owners here please UN-confuse me (LOL)...

Given that I have to replace my belt tensioner at some point (if not now then at some point in the near future since it is the original mechanical belt tensioner that came with my car and has 68k miles on it)... is it better that I get another mechanical belt tensioner or should I get a hydraulic belt tensioner?

My goal here is to have the MOST DURABLE, LONGER LASTING belt tensioner... I don't want to have what happened to the OP here to happen to me since my car is primarily used to transport my baby girl everywhere.

I replaced mine with the mechanical one, but this is my DD so (the kit wasn't worth price in my mind)... With that being said, after seeing the hydraulic tensioner fail (in the OP); i think that i would stick with the mechanical.

Personally, I'd recommend the mechanical one. I mean cars have been using mechanical tensioners for years w/o problems even S/C'd cars.

[330i ZHP]

good updates all - and that part number I gave previously works - I rcvd a complete hydraulic tensioner setup today (minus the bolts)

[blue325ci]

Check out the link below

http://www.partsgeek.com/catalog/2002/bmw/330ci/cooling_system/accessory_belt_tensioner_assembly.html

[Navin323i]

Just a quick update in regards to my current situation...

Tomorrow my mechanic will be removing my current OEM mechanical belt tensioner and replace it with a new OEM hydraulic belt tensioner. I received a brand new Contitech 6pk1965 serpentine belt from Hans@ESS so we will be installing that too... that way BOTH the serpentine belt and belt tensioner will be new, thereby lessening the chances that something bad happens like what happened to the OP here.

After my mechanic removed my mechanical clutch fan and replaced it with an electric fan (my car literally sounded like a jet engine when changing gears since my car used to be an auto and now it's a 5spd manual), my mechanic could hear something he didn't hear before... namely the sound of belt chirp, which we determined is coming from my current mechanical belt tensioner with 68k miles on it.

I'm looking forward to FINALLY getting this resolved tomorrow! :woot:

[bluejeansonfire]

two days ago, my tensioner bit the dust, or so i thought. Something very similar to what happened to the OP happened to me, but I have a turbo, no supercharger. The issue with mine is easily seen. The upper mounting bolt of the tensioner walked out. Leaving all the stress on the lower mounting point, both mounting point are on the oil filter housing. How did that bolt walk out? Bad tensioner? no way, it's tight as hell. Bad pulley bearing? I don't know, it looks very sound. Well, a few days earlier I noticed that I couldn't get to redline, I'm wondering if the loose tensioner was pulling itself into a belt running the opposite direction and causing hell-a friction. Well, anyway, the pulleys both look fine, the idler and the tensioner. Needless to say, this incident ate both of my belts. I have a new oil filter housing, compliments of my friendly nearby e46 race team.

[Navin323i]

Just a quick update in regards to my current situation...

Tomorrow my mechanic will be removing my current OEM mechanical belt tensioner and replace it with a new OEM hydraulic belt tensioner. I received a brand new Contitech 6pk1965 serpentine belt from Hans@ESS so we will be installing that too... that way BOTH the serpentine belt and belt tensioner will be new, thereby lessening the chances that something bad happens like what happened to the OP here.

After my mechanic removed my mechanical clutch fan and replaced it with an electric fan (my car literally sounded like a jet engine when changing gears since my car used to be an auto and now it's a 5spd manual), my mechanic could hear something he didn't hear before... namely the sound of belt chirp, which we determined is coming from my current mechanical belt tensioner with 68k miles on it.

I'm looking forward to FINALLY getting this resolved tomorrow! :woot:

:woot: Car is as good as NEW!!! I don't hear anymore squeal with the hydraulic belt tensioner, plus I replaced the belt with a brand new one from Hans at the same time as replacing the tensioner so I hopefully shouldn't encounter the same issue the OP had anytime soon, though I will have my mechanic inspect the belt and tensioners every year as a precaution.

[Minnoe07]

Yea, you shouldn't have a problem for awhile. I still plan on changing mine every 30K miles. But when the belt tensioner goes, it goes suddenly. IMO, checking it frequently won't prevent what happened to me from happening to you. You should check frequently anyways for belt wear etc. etc. but I don't think it will help prevent this. Not the way the tensioner body breaks in half.

[Safar]

good updates all - and that part number I gave previously works - I rcvd a complete hydraulic tensioner setup today (minus the bolts)

Yah, I can confirm the same. I asked for a 11287838797 at the dealership and got a full assembly (no bolts & pulley though). Cost me around EUR 45 but that includes some taxes. So it should be around $45 - $50.

Question: what's the torque spec on the bolts to the block? I don't want to rip the oil filter housing (M8 bolts, all three).

Thanks!

[Safar]

Yah, I can confirm the same. I asked for a 11287838797 at the dealership and got a full assembly (no bolts & pulley though). Cost me around EUR 45 but that includes some taxes. So it should be around $45 - $50.

Question: what's the torque spec on the bolts to the block? I don't want to rip the oil filter housing (M8 bolts, all three).

Thanks!

Nvrmind, found it. 24Nm.

[todd92]

Hello,

Our idlepulley setup will fit both the old and new style tension system.
The tension assembly is located between the water pump pulley and crank pulley. Both stock and ESS belt loop has the exact same loop around the tension pulley.
It is in other places of the belt loop that ESS is different from the stock belt loop. The supercharger pulley and the new idle pulleys does not impact on the tension assembly in any way. The only stress on the tension assembly is the stress created from the tension in the spring or the hydraulics in the new style tension system.

It is important that the belt used is not to short. This means the tensioner could be hitting into the metal in maximum tension position.

We recommend to only use Contitech belts and to use the recommended length from ESS. If you look at the tension pulley when the car is running you can see that is moving a little forth and back all the time. This is to take up small unbalances / movements from all the pulleys on the front of the engine.

I have not seen many belt failures on this cars, but after seeing the problem with this cars I will recommend customer to change the tensioner when they install the kit. Especially if the car has 50000miles or more on the clock. This could be a cheap insurance to prevent this from happening. We will include this as a service point in our service guide for this kits.

Regards

Hans @ ESS

Not true. If the tensioner pulley is moving back and forth while the engine is running, the hydraulic tensioner is worn out. Mine was moving like that and I replaced it today and the movement stopped. FWIW, the tensioner is a readlly available part, I got a Dayco one at Pep Boys and it looked EXACTLY the same as the OEM part. $50. I had replaced both belts and 3 pulleys the week before and thought the tensioner was OK, but there was still a noise.

[Asbjorn@ESS]

Very few engines has 100% balanced pulleys from factory, the tensioner normally moves a little bit to compensate. There is no need to replace it just because of that. However replacing it as a preventative measure at 30-50K is not a bad idea at all.

[PAiN]

Last week the Power Steering Pump gave up on my 330i TS1.
The axle in the pump snapped.
The kit was mounted august last year by Hans at ESS, he probably knows what he's doing :)

The mechanics had not seen this problem before. How much extra strain does
the blower put on the pulleys in the chain?

[DBear]

You can replace that hydraulic tensioner for a spring loaded one. AAs sc kits come with a different spring loaded tensioner that replaces that one, I wasn't sure why, but I guess that's why.. sorry to hear that man.

As for the oil filter housing, that sounds a bit expensive.. I've helped a friend change one before, and I think the actual part was like $350... The actual swap itself isn't very hard either.

Yea definately sounds like the mechanic is hitting you hard on the housing. PelicanParts.com has it listed for $351.25

[Asbjorn@ESS]

Last week the Power Steering Pump gave up on my 330i TS1.
The axle in the pump snapped.
The kit was mounted august last year by Hans at ESS, he probably knows what he's doing :)

The mechanics had not seen this problem before. How much extra strain does
the blower put on the pulleys in the chain?

There should be virtually no extra strain as belt tension is the same as stock. I have never heard of this issue before. Probably caused by defect in PS pump axle.

[TxZHP04]

There should be virtually no extra strain as belt tension is the same as stock. I have never heard of this issue before. Probably caused by defect in PS pump axle.

Yeah, sometimes things simply fail. I believe Brady, aggieE46, recently mentioned needing to replace his PS pump due to having massive play in the shaft. He doesn't have a SC so this is with a completely stock belt/pulley setup.

[TxZHP04]

I was due to change my belts, SC has been on for a year and the belt was starting to crack. Figured I would play it safe and replace the complete tensioner as well. Good thing I did, here's what I found once I removed the original unit which has just over 82k miles.

309456

I'm very glad I caught this before it broke, probably wouldn't have been too much longer. As with the others, the base plate appears to be the weak link. Notice the web of stress cracks in mine. Barring any manufacturing defects, I suspect this simply isn't a good place to use cast aluminum.

Thanks for the heads up on this potential problem... I'd never have touched the tensioner if it hadn't been for this thread.

[330i ZHP]

I wonder if we should have more material welded in?

good catch on the tensioner

[TxZHP04]

Don't know, welding onto cast aluminum might present it's own problems. Ideally, I'd like to machine a replacement from forged plate aluminum... but I'll probably just make due with the stock piece and replace it a little more frequently. Now, if any of our friendly vendors with machine shop connections wanted to fab something up, I'd be all over it.

[Minnoe07]

I'm glad I could help in catching a potential problem for you.

If a vendor built one, I would buy a reinforced or a new design for the base plate on the tensioner.

[Safar]

+1

[Girmis]

did you have to replace any other parts? Or just the tensioner and the belt?

[Minnoe07]

The tensioner and tensioner pulley. Really don't have to change the belt unless it is worn.

[Minnoe07]

UPDATE:

Just replaced only the tensioner at about 77,000 miles. The old tensioner still looked good. It has been approximately 18,000 miles since the last change. I might try and go 30,000 next time before I change the tensioner now.

On another note, ESS had stated that the coolant in the air/water intercooler and the supercharger oil in the ts supercharger did not need to be changed. Well, I didn't change the supercharger oil BUT I did change the coolant in the exchanger and the coolant was COMPLETELY DISGUSTING. Originally I had but in Prestone 50/50 mix coolant. It came out brownish red. It has been approximately 40,000 miles since I installed the kit. From my personal experience, I would recommend a change interval of at least 30,000 miles for those that have the TS2 kit.

When I get some more time, the correct oil, a measuring device for 120 ml, and blue loctite, I will change the oil on the lysholm charger. I wonder how bad the oil is going to be..... And on a random thought, ESS says that we should not use an aftermarket CAI because of the low filtration qualities and that it will damage the charger. My thought is, if you change the oil in the charger frequently enough,(maybe 15,000-30,000 miles) would it matter if you did not use the OEM filter?

[Dirtboy]

UPDATE:

And on a random thought, ESS says that we should not use an aftermarket CAI because of the low filtration qualities and that it will damage the charger. My thought is, if you change the oil in the charger frequently enough,(maybe 15,000-30,000 miles) would it matter if you did not use the OEM filter?

I think they're talking about the close tolerances between the two screws. Larger particles that can pass through an aftermarket filter may damage the screws.

[lkstaack]

I think they're talking about the close tolerances between the two screws. Larger particles that can pass through an aftermarket filter may damage the screws.
And the oil from a wet gauze filter can contaminate the MAF.

[Minnoe07]

Yea, I guess so. I'm not an expert in supercharging so that's why I asked. I still haven't had the guts to make the change to an aFe intake anyways.

As for the oil on the filter, if you do over oil, then you should be able to just take some MAF cleaner and clean the oil off.

[lkstaack]

As for the oil on the filter, if you do over oil, then you should be able to just take some MAF cleaner and clean the oil off.
This is true. However, consider that the MAF air sensing element is very delicate (not to mention expensive); you risk damaging it every time you touch it with something. Why assume that risk for a part that doesn't provide any gain?