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-   -   DCS on or off? (http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=774557)

smoke96 06-28-2010 03:25 AM

DCS on or off?
 
hey guys, i just did a search but didn't come up with not one result and i assumed this would have been covered 1000 times already. Ive slowly but surely been doing suspension work prepping my car for a track run. im looking for opinions. due to my last car being the car that i learned everything on, including aggressive driving and drive lines and that car having no traction control im very accustomed to handling a vehicle without it. Ive noticed that when taking my car on some turn that when my mind tells me to react to a situation, my reaction is sometimes counter acted by dcs and will freak me out. not in the sense of not having control but in the sense of when your buddy is driving his car and your in the passenger seat and he maneuvered a certain way and you expected different so you were kind of thrown off. this is what bothers me about the dcs. my question is weather or not it is advisable to track your vehicle with the dcs turned off? ive tried to get used to it but im not too keen on the car "handling" the situation for me. thank in advanced for the input fellas.

teamdfl 06-28-2010 06:08 AM

Leave the electronic nannies on until your instructor tells you to turn them off.

ChasCan 06-28-2010 06:21 AM

I started tracking my xi with the dsc on in the beginning. As my skills improved the, dsc became a hinderance, so I now leave it off when on the track. Chas

bigjae1976 06-28-2010 11:45 AM

I used to turn it off before I got my LSD. My car understeers so I never really had to worry about a spin unless I did something retarded. Then I got my LSD...spun my car 4 turns after I turned it off.

Now I keep it on. It provides good and safe feedback on whether or not I am being smooth on the throttle. So I get punished with slow lap times vrs spinning the car or going off the track.

I find DSC is not obtrusive if I'm being smooth on the throttle .

Kubica 06-28-2010 11:47 AM

Definitely turn it off in the dry on an xi (as soon as you feel comfortable with the track).

The other good reason to do this is to save your brakes!!!!!

e46techtuner 06-28-2010 09:29 PM

My car is a 2000, so it can only be on or off. I left it on until I got comfortable driving at speed. Now its always off even in the rain.

AL330CI 06-29-2010 12:11 AM

In AutoX, I turn it off to lear to handle the car. In high speed track sessions, i leave it on. The consequence is too high to risk.

smoke96 06-29-2010 01:04 AM

thanks for the input fellas. its just so damn hard to get used to the car trying to correct me.

bigjae1976 06-29-2010 01:45 AM

Usually, it means you did something wrong. You can either have DSC or a wall intervene??? I don't mind it.

My goal from EVERY track event is to drive my car home.

drivrswntd 06-29-2010 07:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kubica (Post 11930982)
Definitely turn it off in the dry on an xi (as soon as you feel comfortable with the track).

The other good reason to do this is to save your brakes!!!!!

And your instructor feels comfortable :)

You will be best off leaving it on for the first couple of sessions to get used to the track, brake points, proper techniques, turn in, track out, etc. There will definitly be a point where DSC will be kicking in and it will be hampering your ability to learn and expand your skills and at the point it would be a good idea to turn it off. Your instructor will definitly be able to help you get to that point.

Kubica 06-29-2010 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drivrswntd (Post 11934776)
And your instructor feels comfortable :)

You will be best off leaving it on for the first couple of sessions to get used to the track, brake points, proper techniques, turn in, track out, etc. There will definitly be a point where DSC will be kicking in and it will be hampering your ability to learn and expand your skills and at the point it would be a good idea to turn it off. Your instructor will definitly be able to help you get to that point.

Drivrswntd was my instructor last year- this man knows what he's talking about!

Oh, and on the xi, it's on or off. There is no pushing the dsc button for 10 seconds to disable it completely.

drivrswntd 06-29-2010 11:59 AM

Steve you going to NHMS on the 29th with White Mountain chapter?

Chrissy 06-29-2010 09:22 PM

My 1st few times around the track I usually have it on. Once I learn the turns like most people say it starts to be a hinderance. I end up turning it off during every session. One of the bimmer guys at my last track day had a very interesting shirt on. It said DSC OFF!

bigjae1976 06-30-2010 03:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChrissyB (Post 11937761)
My 1st few times around the track I usually have it on.

Especially smart until you get a little bit of heat in the tires and brakes.
:thumbup:

drivrswntd 06-30-2010 07:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigjae1976 (Post 11939191)
Especially smart until you get a little bit of heat in the tires and brakes.
:thumbup:

You know when the most incidents usually happen at a track day? Instructor's first session and you can guess why. lol

nocab72 07-02-2010 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drivrswntd (Post 11934776)
And your instructor feels comfortable :)

You will be best off leaving it on for the first couple of sessions to get used to the track, brake points, proper techniques, turn in, track out, etc. There will definitly be a point where DSC will be kicking in and it will be hampering your ability to learn and expand your skills and at the point it would be a good idea to turn it off. Your instructor will definitly be able to help you get to that point.

+1 - On until it starts pissing you off and getting in your way.

Funny story, had fellow M3 track guy come up to me a few weeks ago in the paddock, he was complaining that his car was so slow out of the corners, said it felt like it has no "go" until he was fully tracked out and straighted up, then it would take off! After a short discussion, we realized he had been leaving his DSC ON.

I told him to turn it off, but BE CAREFUL exiting the corners because I knew he had gotten used to just matting the right pedal down hard and I didn't want him to throttle oversteer and wreck his beautiful M3. After the next session he was beaming happy (and kept it on the track).

Kyle

blablac 07-02-2010 05:33 PM

I use to drive a 240 with an LSD, stiff engine / transmission / solid diff mounts / very tall gear on the diff / 10lb flywheel and very grabby clutch. That car taught me how to be smooth on and off throttle, I ended in the grass once or twice and then started to get much better at it.


Now since I got the bimmer with the electronic nannies I'm not so careful and I will floor it and let the car take care of the rest.

SL Blak Soldier 07-02-2010 06:54 PM

off... my car has wheel lift, so the sensor detects a slower speed on one wheel and dsc goes off for no reason. so mine is always off.

rnitti 07-07-2010 02:00 PM

There's a great article by Randy Pobst in this months SCCA SportsCar Magazine that talkes about this. His general rule is that if in doubt leave it on.

Autocross is a safe place to learn the limit of your car with and without DSC. The track, not so much.

If you're 100% confident in your ability, go for it on track, if not, leave it on.

Also remember, no amount of DSC can protect you from stupidity.

SKIPPY PB 07-09-2010 01:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smoke96 (Post 11930146)
hey guys, i just did a search but didn't come up with not one result and i assumed this would have been covered 1000 times already. Ive slowly but surely been doing suspension work prepping my car for a track run. im looking for opinions. due to my last car being the car that i learned everything on, including aggressive driving and drive lines and that car having no traction control im very accustomed to handling a vehicle without it. Ive noticed that when taking my car on some turn that when my mind tells me to react to a situation, my reaction is sometimes counter acted by dcs and will freak me out. not in the sense of not having control but in the sense of when your buddy is driving his car and your in the passenger seat and he maneuvered a certain way and you expected different so you were kind of thrown off. this is what bothers me about the dcs. my question is weather or not it is advisable to track your vehicle with the dcs turned off? ive tried to get used to it but im not too keen on the car "handling" the situation for me. thank in advanced for the input fellas.

Umm im not sure how to respond exactly.

But you must understand that the DSC system replicated the function of an LSD by applying the brakes to the inside wheel to make it tavel at a slower speed than that of the outside wheel. If I am correct, ive been e36'ing so i may be outdated.

Now there are 3 stages of DSC. On which is grandma gay and I dont even remember all its function and dont want to explain or know them. Then there is half off when you press the DSC button which works by making the open diff simulate the actions of an LSD.

Then there is the 10 second hold for turning yoru DSC all the way off whcih will give you an open diff at the rear end.

For going fast you want it half off cause itll make your car grill the road better, BUT there is a probelm to this.


I know from first hand experiance which is why I hate the japanese. Electronics can fail and doing 80 mid corner after getting a brake job done, first day with 1200 gran worth of parts a reputable shop ****ed up the job and messed up a sensor. Long story short my DSC would turn FULLY OFF because it wasn't working properly and it does that as a fail safe. Longer story short it went off mid corner and let me tail out causing a crash and me to put the car down.

If you are going to race I suggest you look into the function of the DSC system and decide whether you can live with out it. I suggest you get an LSD in the rear.


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