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-   -   Boosted Vanos Upgrades (http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=871427)

Commanderwiggin 09-19-2011 03:00 PM

Boosted Vanos Upgrades
 
Has anyone done anything with their Vanos units when adding boost to their cars? Been looking at the DrVanos but was wondering what else is out there, recommended and why?

mvrk10256 09-19-2011 03:04 PM

Besian seals. Dr Vanos units are over priced.

MarcusLSB 09-19-2011 03:34 PM

I'm also looking to replace (or upgrade) my Vanos. Would be curious to know if there are any options.

flipm3 09-19-2011 09:23 PM

Dr. Vanos Cam Bolts
Dr. Vanos Cam Sprocket
Dr. Vanos Exhaust Hub
Beisan Systems Vanos Sealing Plate
Beisan Systems Vanos Solenoid
BMW Vanos Filter

That's what I would ideally like to do for my VANOS overhaul and preventative maintenance...but man it's expensive, haha.

Rockyminator 09-19-2011 09:28 PM

Mine is really noisy while driving, or at least it's noticeable to people outside the car... Wonder if I need mine replace.. I ran it by HPF and they said it's normal with these kits so I don't really know what to do.

Bdave 09-19-2011 11:03 PM

I have an early HPF built motor. Did they bother to upgrade the Vanos at all when they did/do the rebuild. You would think at least the o rings wouldnt you?

Commanderwiggin 09-19-2011 11:10 PM

I talked with HPFBranden today and he asked John about it and I guess they just do some seals and stuff...John didn't know anything about any upgrades or mods for the vanos.

I was impressed how the Dr.Vanos kits got rid of the ticking or knocking...but Dr.Vanos seems retarded expensive imo. Mine is only noticeable at startup but I do think that it has gotten louder over the last year but then again my hearing isn't what it used to be :P

MSpired 09-20-2011 12:22 AM

I did DrVanos right before my car was sent up to HPF

Commanderwiggin 09-20-2011 12:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSpired (Post 13600810)
I did DrVanos right before my car was sent up to HPF

And...:rofl:

MSpired 09-20-2011 12:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Commanderwiggin (Post 13600811)
And...:rofl:

I don't know if DrVanos has come out with new products, but when I sent mine in, it was just for a complete rebuild. I needed it due because after the couple head gasket failures I had with the VF kit, the vanos was acting up. Probably due to all the milkshake that went through the vanos system.

So, did it make more power? Who knows since there was no before or after comparisons. I believe my car was one of the first 2.5's to make over 700rwhp, but I think that had more to do with the replacement in tank Bosch 044 rather than anything with the vanos. Some minor head work could also be attributed to that too though.

MarcusLSB 09-20-2011 12:42 AM

Its $1800 with a $600 core.. making it about $1200 right? Yeah thats expensive but not nearly as expensive as what they want for the intake/exhaust shafts.. and gears etc.. I priced a Dr.Vanos out today with all the upgraded gears/shafts/etc.. it was like $3k.. wtf

MSpired 09-20-2011 12:44 AM

Yea, I think I paid right around 1k for a full vanos rebuild... If you are building your motor and have high miles, especially if they are hard miles.... I think it's worth it for the peace of mind.

Rockyminator 09-20-2011 01:51 AM

So what happens if the Vanos is not replaced/rebuilt and it fails? According to John at HPF, the Vanos unit is suppose to be louder than normal due to the HPF's EMS. In other words the cars DME isn't able to quiet the Vanos unit down like it does in an M3 with no turbo. They also said the noise is usually louder with the rebuilt motors, stage 2.5 and up. Gave me peace of mind but I'm still afraid it will fail. What happens if the Vanos does fail?

bluejeansonfire 09-20-2011 02:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bdave (Post 13600604)
I have an early HPF built motor. Did they bother to upgrade the Vanos at all when they did/do the rebuild. You would think at least the o rings wouldnt you?

the head and everything on it is left stock. HPF builds the bottom end to take boost, vanos maintenance has nothing to do with boost or power. I mean, very easily you could 'might as well' yourself to thousands of dollars of expenditures in little things like that on a motor... and i've definitely have been down that road a few times, and it's usually unnecessary.. but aren't inconel valves and ti retainers cool?

Commanderwiggin 09-22-2011 03:15 PM

Well I spoke with Raj from Beisan Systems a few moments ago and he has some very interesting things to say about the S54 Vanos.

Basically from what I gathered there was an earlier BMW euro engine design that had the general "Exhaust Tab" clearance set lower than the current S54 that uses the exact same setup minus the difference in clearance. The S54 tab clearance is higher which appears to cause more rattle and risks failure of these tabs. Raj is developing a sleeve kit to solve this and should be released soon.

In addition the bolts on the Intake side I believe are a common issue with rattling loose.

The solenoid failure is also another issue.

I believe he said the seals aren't the biggest issue but may as well replace them while we're in there.

From what I can summarize, a rattle kit, seal kit, solenoid kit, and some thread-locker on the the bolts for exhaust/intake sides is probably the best solution. I've linked this thread in an email to Raj so he can hopefully comment on it and reduce the amount of phone calls he gets as he's just in the process of finishing this up atm for product release.

And from what I can gather at a significantly lower cost than the Dr.Vanos kit which from what others have said is extremely overpriced for a basically stock OEM unit that has just been cleaned and could possibly yield the "Ticking timebomb" effect later.

M3_POWER 09-22-2011 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Commanderwiggin (Post 13609919)
Well I spoke with Raj from Beisan Systems a few moments ago and he has some very interesting things to say about the S54 Vanos.

Basically from what I gathered there was an earlier BMW euro engine design that had the general "Exhaust Tab" clearance set lower than the current S54 that uses the exact same setup minus the difference in clearance. The S54 tab clearance is higher which appears to cause more rattle and risks failure of these tabs. Raj is developing a sleeve kit to solve this and should be released soon.

In addition the bolts on the Intake side I believe are a common issue with rattling loose.

The solenoid failure is also another issue.


I believe he said the seals aren't the biggest issue but may as well replace them while we're in there.

From what I can summarize, a rattle kit, seal kit, solenoid kit, and some thread-locker on the the bolts for exhaust/intake sides is probably the best solution. I've linked this thread in an email to Raj so he can hopefully comment on it and reduce the amount of phone calls he gets as he's just in the process of finishing this up atm for product release.

And from what I can gather at a significantly lower cost than the Dr.Vanos kit which from what others have said is extremely overpriced for a basically stock OEM unit that has just been cleaned and could possibly yield the "Ticking timebomb" effect later.

There has been many cases of late model M's that had their exhaust tabs sheared off.

Commanderwiggin 09-22-2011 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by M3_POWER (Post 13609971)
There has been many cases of late model M's that had their exhaust tabs sheared off.

Yes that's one of the main issues it seems...the earlier euro design had a tighter clearance that isn't as prone to failure. Looser clearance...more knock...more failure.

lutzperformance 09-22-2011 04:23 PM

+1 for DR Vanos, we use them quite a bit!

Never had an issue, and they provide very quick professional service!

MSpired 09-22-2011 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lutzperformance (Post 13610158)
+1 for DR Vanos, we use them quite a bit!

Never had an issue, and they provide very quick professional service!

x2

Their service when I dealt with them was top notch!

faelar 09-22-2011 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Commanderwiggin (Post 13599050)
Has anyone done anything with their Vanos units when adding boost to their cars?

Delete the VANOS and have your cams re-ground with a wild turbo profile :excited::excited:

The guys that get real serious about drag racing these S54's.. deleting the VANOS will end up making sense IMHO.


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