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-   -   School bans transgender first-grader from girls' bathroom (http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=973540)

rdo1990 02-28-2013 08:44 AM

School bans transgender first-grader from girls' bathroom
 
This will be interesting to see thoughts about this

Cliffs: 6 Year old born with male genitalia, identifies as female. Was accepted in using the girls bathroom at school until first grade. Now home schooled. The child is transgender.

Discuss or read below. I URGE you to click the link. Picture of child in question is there. (Pink hair)

Now, this brings up questions in regards to the recognition of gender identity. When does an individual realize this? Could this be a manifestation of environmental factors vs intrinsic/hormonal factors at such an early age in life.

Quote:

Coy Mathis and her parents, Jeremy and Kathryn, will be guests on "Starting Point" live Thursday in the 7 a.m. ET hour.

(CNN) -- A transgender rights group announced Wednesday that it has filed a discrimination complaint in Colorado on behalf of a first-grader who was born a boy but identifies as a girl.

The filing stems from a decision announced last December by officials at Fountain-Fort Carson School District that Coy Mathis could no longer use the girls' bathroom at Eagleside Elementary.

Mother Kathryn Mathis said she and her husband were shocked.

"We were very confused because everything was going so well, and they had been so accepting, and all of a sudden it changed and it was very confusing and very upsetting because we knew that, by doing that, she was going to go back to being unhappy," she told CNN. "It was going to set her up for a lot of bad things."

Coy was born with male sex organs but has identified as female since she could express herself, her mother said. The child had attended classes during her kindergarten year with no problems and no complaints from anyone at the school, Mathis told reporters at the Colorado Capitol in Denver, where she was flanked by her husband, Jeremy, and four other children.

Wearing a girl's winter coat, Coy stood behind her mother.

Afraid bullies would make fun of her daughter, Kathryn Mathis said she pulled Coy out of school during winter break.

"In the end, we just want what is the best for Coy," Mathis said about the complaint. "We want her to be able to go back to school and be treated equally without discrimination and harassment."

Attorney Michael Silverman of the Transgender Legal Defense and Education Fund, which is representing Coy, said the complaint -- which was filed with the Colorado Civil Rights Division -- is intended to have an impact beyond a single family or school.

"For many transgender people, discrimination is a daily part of life. Unfortunately for Coy, it has started very early," he said, adding that the complaint is a "test of Colorado's Anti-Discrimination Act."

"The world is going to be looking at the school," he said, which can "send a message to the world and teach tolerance, fair play and equal rights."

A girl's life

For most of the past year, Coy has dressed as a girl.

Coy's passport and state-issued identification recognize her as female.

Transgender kids: Painful quest to be who they are

Kathryn Mathis said she got a call "out of the blue" from the school in December saying that Coy could use the boys' bathroom, gender-neutral faculty bathrooms or the nurse's bathroom, but not the girls' facilities.

The district "took into account not only Coy, but other students in the building, their parents and the future impact a boy with male genitals using a girls' bathroom would have as Coy grew older," a letter the family's attorney received in December said.

"However, I'm certain you can appreciate that, as Coy grows older and his male genitals develop along with the rest of his body, at least some parents and students are likely to become uncomfortable with his continued use of the girls' restroom."

In a statement Tuesday, the district's attorney, W. Kelly Dude, said: "The district firmly believes it has acted reasonably and fairly with respect to this issue. However, the district believes the appropriate and proper forum for discussing the issues identified in the charge is through the Division of Civil Rights process. The district is preparing a response to the charge which it will submit to the division. Therefore, the district will not comment further on this matter out of respect for the process which the parents have initiated."

"It's sad that the Mathis family had to file a civil rights complaint in order for their daughter to be treated equally," said Herndon Graddick, president of the Gay & Lesbian Alliance Against Defamation, in a statement. "The students clearly aren't the only people at this school who need more education."

A little-studied group

Transgender children experience a disconnect between their sex, which is based on their anatomy, and their gender, which includes behaviors, roles and activities, experts say.

For the general public, transgender identity may be a new concept, though many might recall Chaz Bono, the child of entertainers Sonny and Cher. Born female, Bono underwent a transition in his 40s to become a man. He wrote in his book "Transition" that, even as a child, he had been "aware of a part of me that did not fit."

He appeared last year as a man on "Dancing with the Stars," in part, he said, to destigmatize being transgender.

Being transgender no longer a mental 'disorder' in diagnostic manual

Comprehensive data and studies about transgender children are rare. International studies have estimated that anywhere from 1 in 30,000 to 1 in 1,000 people are transgender.

Some children as young as age 3 show early signs of gender dysphoria or gender identity disorder, mental health experts who work with transgender children say.

These children are not intersex -- they do not have a physical disorder or malformation of their sexual organs. The gender issue exists in the brain, though experts do not agree on whether it's psychologically or physiologically based.

Many transgender people report feeling discomfort with their gender as early as they can remember.

Transgender job seekers face uphill battle

Gender identity is often confused with sexual orientation. The difference is that "gender identity is who you are, and sexual orientation is who you want to have sex with," said Dr. Johanna Olson, a professor of clinical pediatrics at the University of Southern California, who treats transgender children.

Children around age 3 are probably not interested in sexual orientation, she said. But experts say some children who look like they will be transgender in early childhood turn out to be gay, lesbian or bisexual.

Differences in schools

School policies toward transgender students vary across the United States.

In New York, for example, the law says students can't be discriminated against on the basis of their gender identity.

But in Maine, a court ruled in November that a school district did not violate a transgender student's rights when she was told she couldn't use the girls' bathroom.

Gender nonconformity is not a disorder, group says

Dude, the Colorado school district's attorney, has said there is nothing in that state requiring public schools to permit transgender students to use restrooms intended for the gender with which they identify.

He added that the Fountain-Fort Carson School District adheres to the Colorado Anti-Discrimination Act in all respects: "Coy attends class as all other students, is permitted to wear girls' clothes and is referred to as the parents have requested."

She also has easy access to bathrooms other than the girls', Dude said.

Coy's case will be the first to challenge a restroom restriction under the state's anti-discrimination act, the Transgender Legal Defense and Education Fund said.

For now, the first-grader is being home-schooled.

Girl Scouts accept transgender kid, provoking cookie boycott

Reaction to Coy's story

CNN's online audience has responded to this story with a range of questions and comments, with many saying the child is too young to comprehend gender differences. Mostly, posters said they felt sorrow for Coy as a child who is struggling.

"Just let the kid use the gender-neutral bathrooms. When he/she is a teen, if he is still convinced he is a girl, maybe then you can get into it with the school," said commenter EDM.

"This kid is going to have a hard enough life if he really is transsexual, why start fighting battles now, when he should just be blissfully ignorant"?

Transgender teacher sues school for alleged discrimination

Commenter AlawJ said the story left a "negative impression of the parents."

"My rash view may be unfair, but I remember being that age and have helped raise 9 nieces and nephews. One wanted to be a firetruck and ran around making truck noises. Another one of the boys liked to play dress up with the girls," AlawJ wrote. "My fiance's little brother always wore dresses as well. But, at the end of the day, the parents are there to be the adults and make decisions for them.

"I also am a little weary when you read a story where the parents are filing lawsuits for their 6 year old child's rights."

Editor's note: A previous version of this story quoted certain reader comments that were harshly critical of Coy's parents. We removed these comments because we decided they did not increase understanding of this complex and personal issue.

CNN's Cristy Lenz and Madison Park contributed to this report.
Source: http://www.cnn.com/2013/02/27/us/col...er-girl-school

choxor 02-28-2013 09:00 AM

Yeah, read that yesterday. While I have no problem with transgendered, I read in another article that his/her parents could tell at 18 months old that he/she was "drawn to everything girl". That's a little disconcerting.

I'd totally plow its red-headed mom, though.

SLVR JDM 02-28-2013 09:01 AM

He's a boy. Use the boys bathroom.

IdahoToyo 02-28-2013 09:04 AM

http://youtu.be/HHjZOt_ckM0

Carskibum 02-28-2013 09:27 AM

Has a penis, that's a boy.

I'm transgender today, I'm gonna go in the girls locker room at the gym this afternoon. But tomorrow I'm going to be all man, baby.

casino is no lie 02-28-2013 09:29 AM

That kid has a rough childhood ahead of it.

Volvoguy 02-28-2013 09:43 AM

"Kathryn Mathis said she got a call "out of the blue" from the school in December saying that Coy could use the boys' bathroom, gender-neutral faculty bathrooms or the nurse's bathroom, but not the girls' facilities."

This...

The school has gone out of it's way to accommodate him.

Simple solution, if the school says no.. then take the kid out of the school. If all the school systems say no, then go to another school district, if they say no, then homeschool.

Your rights does not mean you can impede on someone elses.

P.S. the principle is probably thinking " I did not sign up for this shizzz" lol

SHOoff11 02-28-2013 09:53 AM

That kid is going to catfish someone in the future.

2000_328CI 02-28-2013 10:00 AM

Weird scenario and I don't really know how you "handle it". That said, the parents should speak with private schools in the area and come up with a solution. The government, via public schools, should do what is best for the masses, not for individual, odd circumstances like this one. To say that "anyone who identifies as a girl can now use the woman's restroom" sets a very odd norm.

Can't imagine growing up as a guy thinking I'm a girl.. and I find it strange that science still doesn't have an answer for causes this.

JonJon 02-28-2013 10:07 AM

He's freaking 6 years old... Stop putting him in dresses and start treating him as a male. A child at SIX is not capable of the reasoning involved to "change" their gender.


Either way.... male parts? Male bathroom

Carskibum 02-28-2013 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2000_328CI (Post 15205689)
Weird scenario and I don't really know how you "handle it". That said, the parents should speak with private schools in the area and come up with a solution. The government, via public schools, should do what is best for the masses, not for individual, odd circumstances like this one. To say that "anyone who identifies as a girl can now use the woman's restroom" sets a very odd norm.

Can't imagine growing up as a guy thinking I'm a girl.. and I find it strange that science still doesn't have an answer for causes this.

This is a moderate response I didn't see coming.

Someone at 6, let alone 18 months, may display male or female characteristics but then raising them at a young age to complete forgo their anatomical attributes is an act of lunacy. The child may one day develop and see that as their path but deciding for them at such a young age makes no sense.

rdo1990 02-28-2013 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2000_328CI (Post 15205689)
Weird scenario and I don't really know how you "handle it". That said, the parents should speak with private schools in the area and come up with a solution. The government, via public schools, should do what is best for the masses, not for individual, odd circumstances like this one. To say that "anyone who identifies as a girl can now use the woman's restroom" sets a very odd norm.

Can't imagine growing up as a guy thinking I'm a girl.. and I find it strange that science still doesn't have an answer for causes this.

As a parent, how do you credit your 6 year old child's claims to belonging to a specific gender?

Historically, when a child is born, gender is determined by genitalia. In this case, when this child was delivered she was a male. Where in the 6 years of life was this child reassigned to the other sex and what circumstances led the parents to making that decision? (ie What in your right mind would bring us to their conclusion?)

2000_328CI 02-28-2013 10:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carskibum (Post 15205707)
This is a moderate response I didn't see coming.

Someone at 6, let alone 18 months, may display male or female characteristics but then raising them at a young age to complete forgo their anatomical attributes is an act of lunacy. The child may one day develop and see that as their path but deciding for them at such a young age makes no sense.

This. I remember years ago California was pushing for legislation that would disband the notion of "gender based bathrooms" on the premise that it discriminated against those who were "unsure of their gender/sexuality".

To me, asking children at that age to determine "how they identify" is just moronic.
Quote:

Originally Posted by rdo1990 (Post 15205712)
As a parent, how do you credit your 6 year old child's claims to belonging to a specific gender?

Historically, when a child is born, gender is determined by genitalia. In this case, when this child was delivered she was a male. Where in the 6 years of life was this child reassigned to the other sex and what circumstances led the parents to making that decision? (ie What in your right mind would bring us to their conclusion?)

I agree. Personally, I don't think that a child has any ability to determine their gender at such a young age. If the parents started dressing a boy in female clothes, growing their hair out, and having them participate with the girls in all social settings, of course the boy will "adapt".. that's the amazing thing about human beings.

But I also have difficulty saying that this "girl" innately would feel "masculine" if the parents hadn't raised them in such a strange fashion... simply because I don't have a medical background to make such a judgement.

All I know is that if I had a girl in public school and there was a boy, dressing as a girl, in the restroom with her, I would be pissed.

LeMansteve 02-28-2013 10:14 AM

Kudos to the parents for 100% supporting their child. However, I hope they don't push the bathroom issue too hard on the school. This is, what, a 1-in-a-million issue? No public school should have to support such fringe issues.

casino is no lie 02-28-2013 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonJon (Post 15205705)
He's freaking 6 years old... Stop putting him in dresses and start treating him as a male. Child abuse

Forcing a child to conform to your preconceived notions of gender roles/norms when their gender identity differs from their biological gender can be seen as child abuse when taking into considering the emotional distress caused by your rejection of who your child is as a person.

I can only imagine your disappoint had you fathered a gay son.

choxor 02-28-2013 10:25 AM

What about the parent's preconceived notions about what gender he/she is supposed to be.

They say they noticed it at 18 months old. Seriously? They should support the kid's choice, but it seems like they're pressing him/her in the direction of their choosing. Kids want to be astronauts, firefighters, ninjas, and dinosaurs. At 6 do you really think he has completely figured out his sexual identity? Even before hitting puberty?

There's a difference between being supportive and championing your own beliefs at the expense of your kid's childhood.

ghorn 02-28-2013 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonJon (Post 15205705)
He's freaking 6 years old... Stop putting him in dresses and start treating him as a male. A child at SIX is not capable of the reasoning involved to "change" their gender.

Well, yeah. I'd presume they just know what they are, like anyone else.
Reminds me of this story:

http://youtu.be/1xht0hw3nMA


People are afraid to admit, for some reason, that people are born ghey/transgendered.

JonJon 02-28-2013 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by casino is no lie (Post 15205745)
Forcing a child to conform to your preconceived notions of gender roles/norms when their gender identity differs from their biological gender can be seen as child abuse when taking into considering the emotional distress caused by your rejection of who your child is as a person.

I can only imagine your disappoint had you fathered a gay son.

Do you have any children? Specifically a 5-6 year old?

I played with cabbage patch dolls when I was 5, I even let my cousins dress me up. Did my parents force me to sit when I pee'd, put me dresses or demand my schools accept that I should use the girls room?

This kid might in fact turn out to be transgendered, ***, whatever.... but at 6? This is more nurture than nature IMHO

casino is no lie 02-28-2013 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonJon (Post 15205763)
Do you have any children? Specifically a 5-6 year old?

Do you have any transgender children? Specifically a 5-6 year old?

JonJon 02-28-2013 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by casino is no lie (Post 15205770)
Do you have any transgender children? Specifically a 5-6 year old?

Well, my 5 year old daughter did ask me to play GI Joe the other day. Quick.... lemme force her to use the wall urinal


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