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-   -   Help me troubleshoot this transmission/clutch issue.... (http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=992330)

tlester 06-15-2013 10:56 AM

Help me troubleshoot this transmission/clutch issue....
 
Hi Guys -

So, I know I need a new clutch and flywheel because I'm getting some slipping. I had posted another thread about my clutch issues here: http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthr...836&highlight=

So, here are some new observations that I'm hoping the wiser folks here can use to help me pinpoint this issue. I haven't been driving it at all until I can work on it, but then yesterday my wife's jeep's radiator cranked in half, so I had to go rescue her. Anyway... here's what I noticed:

1. It's still very difficult to get in and out of gear when I depress the clutch. However... I seem to be able to clutchless shift just fine (i.e. rev-matching). Timing my shifts just right, and I can drive no problem.

2. When using the clutch pedal and it doesn't want to not come out of gear, I can give it a bit of a rev and it'll come out fine.

3. There seems to be some inconsistency in the pedal feel. It's subtle, but it's there. In fact there were moments where I had released the clutch all the way and I had my foot just barely touching the pedal (no pressure) and then later I felt the pedal come towards my foot just slightly... first time I thought it was my imagination, but after a few other times, I realized it was definitely happening in the pedal.

So... what would these additional symptoms point to?

lszlszx 06-15-2013 02:12 PM

Difficulty shifting can be the master, or slave cylinder too, but if it slips that just means the clutch is worn out.
Clutchless shifts are hard on the syncros.

tlester 06-15-2013 04:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lszlszx (Post 15505014)
Difficulty shifting can be the master, or slave cylinder too, but if it slips that just means the clutch is worn out.
Clutchless shifts are hard on the syncros.

Yeah... I'm thinking master or slave cylinder... or possibly the throw off bearing. What's the best way to troubleshoot the cylinders other than replacing them?

sunsetcoast 06-15-2013 07:38 PM

If you haven't flushed the fluid yet, start with that. The slave cylinder is very low and moisture can collect there. It is not hard to get to to inspect or replace.

tlester 06-15-2013 07:41 PM

Help me troubleshoot this transmission/clutch issue....
 
Flushed the transmission fluid or flush the clutch line?


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sunsetcoast 06-15-2013 08:29 PM

Clutch. Tranny fluid doesn't affect clutch operation, but, if it has been 100K, it's time to change the tranny fluid, too

tlester 06-16-2013 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sunsetcoast (Post 15505541)
Clutch. Tranny fluid doesn't affect clutch operation, but, if it has been 100K, it's time to change the tranny fluid, too

So... does that mean drain out the whole break fluid reservoir and then refill and bleed? Or just bleed out enough fluid from the clutch line to bring fresh(er) fluid into the line?

sunsetcoast 06-16-2013 10:43 AM

Many cars have separate reservoirs for brakes and clutch, but the e46 is not one of them. Bleed the entire system: if there is water in the clutch line, there will be water in the brake lines, too. Fresh fluid from each cylinder all the way to the top of the reservoir. It is only $10 and not difficult...just a hassle if you don't have a partner.

Just flush the fluid at least every 2 years (or whenever you do the brakes) and there shouldn't be any problem.

jdstrickland 06-16-2013 10:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lszlszx (Post 15505014)
Difficulty shifting can be the master, or slave cylinder too, but if it slips that just means the clutch is worn out.
Clutchless shifts are hard on the syncros.

+1 on the master cylinder.

The slave will leak to the outside and a puddle of fluid will be on the ground under the bellhousing and there will be fluid loss. The master will leak internally, no puddles anywhere nor any fluid loss.

If a clutch is needed, one of the symptoms is that the engine speed will climb faster than the vehicle speed. This is commonly noticed in about 3rd gear and going up hill. You shift into 3rd and press the gas to speed up, you will feel the engine speed increase but the vehicle speed remains flat. I don't know what makes you think you need a clutch, but what you have described makes me think you need a clutch master cylinder. Smart money would also replace the clutch slave cylinder, but the master is your problem.

jdstrickland 06-16-2013 10:54 AM

THERE IS NO MOISTURE IN THE BREAK (SIC) FLUID THAT GOT THERE BY ENTERING THE SLAVE CYLINDER.

If moisture gets in that way then brake fluid would surely get out, and this would be the major malfunction calling for your attention. You might have moisture in the system but it did not get there because the slave cylinder gets water splashed upon it.

tlester 06-16-2013 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jdstrickland (Post 15506326)
+1 on the master cylinder.

The slave will leak to the outside and a puddle of fluid will be on the ground under the bellhousing and there will be fluid loss. The master will leak internally, no puddles anywhere nor any fluid loss.

If a clutch is needed, one of the symptoms is that the engine speed will climb faster than the vehicle speed. This is commonly noticed in about 3rd gear and going up hill. You shift into 3rd and press the gas to speed up, you will feel the engine speed increase but the vehicle speed remains flat. I don't know what makes you think you need a clutch, but what you have described makes me think you need a clutch master cylinder. Smart money would also replace the clutch slave cylinder, but the master is your problem.

Yeah... two different problems, I realize that, but I definitely have a bad clutch. That was apparent before I started having shifting problems. My clutch slips like mad. If I punch it in 3rd or 4th gear, the RPM's will race without car speed increasing. That and I get wobble from the clutch as it engages, which I think is probably a worn out flywheel.

But that was all happening before I started having shifter problems and pedal feel problems.

I haven't seen any puddles in the garage, so I guess it's not leaking from the slave cylinder. However... I agree. If I end up replacing the master, I might as well replace the slave at the same time and get it over with. They are fairly cheap, so why not.


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