E46 BMW Social Directory E46 FAQ 3-Series Discussion Forums BMW Photo Gallery BMW 3-Series Technical Information E46 Fanatics - The Ultimate BMW Resource BMW Vendors General E46 Forum The Tire Rack's Tire Wheel Forum Forced Induction Forum The Off-Topic The E46 BMW Showroom For Sale, For Trade or Wanting to Buy

Welcome to the E46Fanatics forums. E46Fanatics is the premiere website for BMW 3 series owners around the world with interactive forums, a geographical enthusiast directory, photo galleries, and technical information for BMW enthusiasts.

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact contact us.

Go Back   E46Fanatics > Other BMW Models > General BMW Model Discussion

General BMW Model Discussion
All non E46 BMW model questions in here. Look below for E36, E90 and F30 specific forum. For additional model specific forums check out bimmerfest.com!

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 03-24-2006, 09:53 AM   #1
///AZNSLVR
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: Jerzeee / NYC
Posts: 1,086
My Ride: Is F*ing old
Send a message via AIM to ///AZNSLVR Send a message via MSN to ///AZNSLVR
Chris Bangle

http://www.forbes.com/2003/06/02/cx_mf_0602feat.html

http://www.petitiononline.com/STOPCB/petition.html

Chris Bangle is a dumba$$.
I'm kind of happy he did design the new style.
At least our E46 design will look good for another 3-5 years...lolol

CHRIS U SUUUCK! HAHA!
__________________
///AZNSLVR is offline   Reply With Quote
Ads by Google

Guests, get your FREE E46Fanatics.com membership to remove this ad.
Old 03-24-2006, 10:00 AM   #2
crazyro
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Bama
Posts: 829
My Ride: 328i
Send a message via AIM to crazyro
Ok people, STOP BEATING THIS DEAD HORSE. I can't believe how many idiots are in this world. AGAIN, Bangle DID NOT design these cars, but merely approved them. Also, did you catch this?

"But Bangle sincerely disagrees, and, moreover, he is fully backed by the weight of the BMW board of directors (BMW is still largely controlled by the will of the Quandt family), who specifically asked Bangle to move the company's image forward, whether traditionalists like it or not."

Actually, some of the designers who penned some of the very controversial designs were upset that Bangle got all the heat. They want to be known as the ones who changed the BMW look, and yet, as Adrian put it, "Bangle gets all the heat. It's just not fair."

So, PLEASE stop this!
__________________

I love my wife, my boys and my girls.
crazyro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2006, 10:09 AM   #3
MFarrZHP
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 1,211
My Ride: Has 6 speeds
Quote:
Originally Posted by crazyro
Ok people, STOP BEATING THIS DEAD HORSE. I can't believe how many idiots are in this world. AGAIN, Bangle DID NOT design these cars, but merely approved them. Also, did you catch this?

"But Bangle sincerely disagrees, and, moreover, he is fully backed by the weight of the BMW board of directors (BMW is still largely controlled by the will of the Quandt family), who specifically asked Bangle to move the company's image forward, whether traditionalists like it or not."

Actually, some of the designers who penned some of the very controversial designs were upset that Bangle got all the heat. They want to be known as the ones who changed the BMW look, and yet, as Adrian put it, "Bangle gets all the heat. It's just not fair."

So, PLEASE stop this!
True, this horse has no pulse and is getting pummeled. However, Bangle is the design chief, so he is still mostly responsible.

All the new Bimmers, with the exception of the 6 and maybe the new //M Z4 coupe, do not live up to their predecessors' design IMO. BMW needs to hire some of the new designers at Audi.

BTW, that article and petition are really old news.
__________________
MFarrZHP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2006, 10:10 AM   #4
///AZNSLVR
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: Jerzeee / NYC
Posts: 1,086
My Ride: Is F*ing old
Send a message via AIM to ///AZNSLVR Send a message via MSN to ///AZNSLVR
oooops.

I just wanted to start drama. Sowwy. The design still sucks though.
__________________
///AZNSLVR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2006, 10:16 AM   #5
crazyro
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Bama
Posts: 829
My Ride: 328i
Send a message via AIM to crazyro
Quote:
Originally Posted by MFarrZHP
However, Bangle is the design chief, so he is still mostly responsible.
Totally agree. What I'm getting tired of is ignorant people who think that Chris actually designed the new cars and it is somehow his fault. Again, other people designed the new cars. BMW management fully backs these designs. It's just that Chris is the "spokesman," if you will, of these.

The last issue of Roundel magazine has a great write-up. A few editors went to the show and heard Chris speak, which made them appreciate his vision and his ideas. Yes, the designs are VERY controversial. Yes, I agree that they are a far cry from the older designs. Yes, I still like the E39 over E60 any day. However, what's done is done, and it was done for a reason and with purpose. Like it or not. Agree with it or not.
__________________

I love my wife, my boys and my girls.
crazyro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2006, 10:24 AM   #6
FRANCO
Masterdebator
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Southern California
Posts: 1,611
My Ride: Your Mom
Quote:
Originally Posted by MFarrZHP
True, this horse has no pulse and is getting pummeled. However, Bangle is the design chief, so he is still mostly responsible.

All the new Bimmers, with the exception of the 6 and maybe the new //M Z4 coupe, do not live up to their predecessors' design IMO. BMW needs to hire some of the new designers at Audi.

BTW, that article and petition are really old news.
the new designs purpose wasn't to live up to the predecessor's design, but to radically change the direction and how the industry design's cars....in fact, Motor Trend magazine made Bangle the 6th most influential person in the automotive industry, in turn making hiom the MOST influential designer.....

look at the new Audi's, Benz's (S-Class), Mitsubishi's, VW's, japanese cars, even korean cars........specifically focusing on Audi's new NOSE....it's getting a lot of heat from Audi enthusiasts (personally i like it).....but if it didn't go in that direction, sitting next to the BMW's the Audi's (and any other car for that matter) wouldn't draw as much attention as the BMW....

the article is old, and in fact, BMW sales are up and still goin up.....BMW's have always been known to be wolves in sheeps clothing, but BMW wanted to change that and make a more radical stance on the street so people would notice their cars better.....i personally like all of the BMW's (facelifted 7er, 3er, 5er, 6er, Z4)...as well as the the Audi's and others...you gotta think outside the box....people take a long time to change especially when it's something that was so familiar for decades.....i mean look how long it took for the MAN to accept womena and minorities as equals...hahahahah jk jk
__________________

Mods:p46 6000K Headlights,M3 Steering Wheel,LED Taillights,M Footrest,Smoked Turn Signals,Smoked Sidemarkers,MTech II kit,CS Splitters,Gray Instrument Panel, Red Marker DIY,Ion Yellow Foglights/High Beams,Akebono Brake Pads, Smart Chrome/Leather Gear Selector,18" Staggered CSLs

Future Mods:,H&R Sport Springs,Tint,ECIS Intake,M Lip Spoiler,OEM Aluminum Pedal Set,OEM M3 Mirrors
FRANCO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2006, 10:25 AM   #7
Tuscan
I am F1.
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: The Projects of Awesome
Posts: 765
My Ride: Needs a S/C V8.
Send a message via AIM to Tuscan
Bangle is my dad.
__________________
Tuscan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2006, 10:33 AM   #8
cd330
ModZombie Moderator
 
cd330's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Dr. Satan's House of Horrors
Posts: 34,514
My Ride: manual stl gry 330i
__________________
cd330 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2006, 01:50 AM   #9
urban-yan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Canada
Posts: 206
My Ride: 2001 Jeep XJ
Quote:
Originally Posted by crazyro
"But Bangle sincerely disagrees, and, moreover, he is fully backed by the weight of the BMW board of directors (BMW is still largely controlled by the will of the Quandt family), who specifically asked Bangle to move the company's image forward, whether traditionalists like it or not."
true, but I can assure you that an intelligent head of design would see that statement as a two-fold problem: 01) satisfy the Quandt family 02) satisfy bmw traditionalists

It seems to me that bangle was only able to fulfill half that necessary criteria; hence in my book, he's merely half a man. I despise the new bmw interiors, the new e90 is getting flack, and the 7 series had a huge uproar with its last inception. Perhaps bangle's staff were displeased with the full burden barring on him, but you forget every company has a chain of command, and bangle was on top. If the Minister of Finance was responsible for embezzlement would you solely blame his secretary???
urban-yan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2006, 01:06 PM   #10
Unveiled
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by urban-yan
the new e90 is getting flack, and the 7 series had a huge uproar with its last inception.

These types of things tend to be highly exaggerated, especially online. The majority of BMW drivers feel the exact opposite of what you've stated.
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2006, 09:25 PM   #11
a burrito
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Walnut, CA
Posts: 556
My Ride: e90 330i
Send a message via AIM to a burrito
Quote:
Originally Posted by crazyro
Ok people, STOP BEATING THIS DEAD HORSE. I can't believe how many idiots are in this world. AGAIN, Bangle DID NOT design these cars, but merely approved them. Also, did you catch this?

"But Bangle sincerely disagrees, and, moreover, he is fully backed by the weight of the BMW board of directors (BMW is still largely controlled by the will of the Quandt family), who specifically asked Bangle to move the company's image forward, whether traditionalists like it or not."

Actually, some of the designers who penned some of the very controversial designs were upset that Bangle got all the heat. They want to be known as the ones who changed the BMW look, and yet, as Adrian put it, "Bangle gets all the heat. It's just not fair."

So, PLEASE stop this!

YES please. This is the first FACT that i've heard for awhile. Chris Bangle DID NOT DESIGN THE CARS!!!! IF you guys know anything about how a design is worked at bmw, it is suggested by many teams that compete for the job under certain guidelines. So PLEASE, GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT.
__________________

E90 330i. Sparkling Graphite/Black, Step, Burl WT. Sp, Pp, Sunshade Pack., Tint.
a burrito is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2006, 10:37 AM   #12
afshawnt
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Ft. Lauderdale/Austin
Posts: 45
My Ride: E30 M3
I think Bangle is brilliant. The new designs are great in my opinion. The lines, curves, and angles work well together. They move BMW in a forward direction, as have all previous re-designs. Having owned an E30, E46, and soon to be E90, I can't say than any one design is better than the other. The "Bangle Butt" is very similar to the E30 M3, and that is one of my favorites. To each his own. Presently, I'm going nuts because I want to find me an E36 M3.
afshawnt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2006, 10:49 AM   #13
ablaz330ci
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Texas
Posts: 427
My Ride: .e92.335
Quote:
Originally Posted by afshawnt
I think Bangle is brilliant. The new designs are great in my opinion. The lines, curves, and angles work well together. They move BMW in a forward direction, as have all previous re-designs. Having owned an E30, E46, and soon to be E90, I can't say than any one design is better than the other. The "Bangle Butt" is very similar to the E30 M3, and that is one of my favorites. To each his own. Presently, I'm going nuts because I want to find me an E36 M3.
I too love all the new designs except for the whole X3 thing. But when I see an E36 M3 coupe I can't stop staring.
__________________
ablaz330ci is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2006, 11:06 AM   #14
Duke W
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Delawhere?
Posts: 151
My Ride: 2003 325i ZSP 5MT
I agree with the fundamental assessment that the new BMW designs weren't necessarily meant to be good... just dramatic and new. That was the assignment from management and on that level they succeed.

They also succeed since the sales figures keep going up. So all the hatred is moot.

But I will say that on an aesthetic-only level, purely outside the realm of tradition and function, they have some issues that keep them from suceeding. There isn't any stylistic improvement. There's just change for its own sake.

I design things for a living. I understand the process a little. Many of today's cars bear the marks of being translated directly from concept sketch to finished product, with no refinement and development in the details. Mistubishi's cars - the Evo being a conspicuous exception - bear this effect the worst. It's like the first thing they threw on paper is what they ran with, and it shows.

Bangle's designs aren't quite that way, but almost. When you're an architect, you can look at certain buildings and imagine exactly what the rendering looked like that they used to sell the client on the design. You can picture the sketchy happy families walking towards their not-quite-identifiable generic sedan or SUV, and the flags waving in the background, and warm fuzzy markers they used to color it. You kind of automatically imagine the green lollipop trees and the weird blobby blue sky with the random lines through it.

That's what Bangle's designs are like for cars. You can instantly picture the concept sketches he presented to Board of Directors: oversized wheels with a thin strip of rubber around, zero suspension travel, a sort of sky-blue-to-pale-yellow fade down the sides so they look like the body is solid chrome, dark windows, a lot of odd, swoopy action lines slashed across it in a black felt tip to make it look jazzy and fast, and some odd sketchy things at each corner to suggest the lights (really just there to visually anchor the edges of the drawing, but it turns out you need something there anyway, lucky Chris).

The difference between the new Mitsus and the new BMWs is that Bangle has a whole bag full of little ultra-cool detail ideas that he's in love with, and has spent too many sleepless nights picturing in his own head, and overdesigning while he waits for somebody to sell them to. And now that he's found a buyer, he's going to dump as many of them onto the cars as he can while he has the chance.

But the basic proportions of the cars are just mediocre at best. Look at the clunky roofline on that 5. There's no fundamental, organizing theme. It's the "decorated shed" school of building design, applied to cars.

__________________
Duke W is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2006, 11:15 AM   #15
Unveiled
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
I agree with most of the opinions (..and all of the facts) offered within this thread. I think BMW's design team did wonderfully, and sales prove that BMW made the right decision. It brought new people to the brand who were previously bored by the E46 design (...yes, those people do exist), and caused some previously loyal customers to search elsewhere. No automobile manufacturer can please everybody.
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2006, 12:03 PM   #16
James330I
Imported Redneck
 
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: Knoxville, TN
Posts: 881
My Ride: BMW baby 330i 5spd
Send a message via AIM to James330I
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unveiled
I agree with most of the opinions (..and all of the facts) offered within this thread. I think BMW's design team did wonderfully, and sales prove that BMW made the right decision. It brought new people to the brand who were previously bored by the E46 design (...yes, those people do exist), and caused some previously loyal customers to search elsewhere. No automobile manufacturer can please everybody.


I always thought the E46 was rather bland in stock form, espeically the sedan. The 5 was kinda vanilla as well so I would have no prorblems buying the new 5 and 3 if I could. Performance/drivability is what carried these cars.

My E46 is looking realll old.
__________________
------------------------





2001 Dinan 330I 5spd (gone..what an awesome car)
2013 335i 6spd M-sport
2013 Infiniti M37S

James330I is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2006, 02:26 PM   #17
gimpyviper
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: New York
Posts: 1,297
My Ride: 2003 BMW M3 - PYM
Send a message via AIM to gimpyviper
Agreed, purist who think a car company strays too far from a "traditional" design should look at Cadillac and Buick. When the average age of your buyers are octogenarians that's a big issue. BMWs are the "Ultimate Driving Machine" not "old-fart-mobile" and they aren't successful because they keep their designs traditional. If anything you should be happy they've thrown the traditional design a bone and kept the kidney grilles and headlight layouts. Do you think Cadillac is experiencing a renaissance because there's suddenly more octogenarians? Nope two things - Escalade and Pimp My Ride. That's why Cadillac has come back. And I'm sure there are TONS of traditionalist who hate all the new Caddy designs but GM doesn't care because they sell.

Let it go people.... let it goooooooooo

The people who DON'T like the "Bangle" era are in the minority anyway (according to that Forbes poll not scientific, but still...) and no petition is gonna change BMW's opinion because 1) They specifically wanted to bust the mold, 2) More people like them than don't and most critically 3) They sell like hot cakes.
__________________


"Speed has never killed anyone. Suddenly becoming stationary, that's what gets you."
gimpyviper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2006, 02:37 PM   #18
Unveiled
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by gimpyviper

Let it go people.... let it goooooooooo

The people who DON'T like the "Bangle" era are in the minority anyway (according to that Forbes poll not scientific, but still...) and no petition is gonna change BMW's opinion because 1) They specifically wanted to bust the mold, 2) More people like them than don't and most critically 3) They sell like hot cakes.

  Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2006, 11:23 AM   #19
crazyro
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Bama
Posts: 829
My Ride: 328i
Send a message via AIM to crazyro
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duke W
I agree with the fundamental assessment that the new BMW designs weren't necessarily meant to be good... just dramatic and new. That was the assignment from management and on that level they succeed.

They also succeed since the sales figures keep going up. So all the hatred is moot.

But I will say that on an aesthetic-only level, purely outside the realm of tradition and function, they have some issues that keep them from suceeding. There isn't any stylistic improvement. There's just change for its own sake.

[...]

But the basic proportions of the cars are just mediocre at best. Look at the clunky roofline on that 5. There's no fundamental, organizing theme. It's the "decorated shed" school of building design, applied to cars.
Um, sir, you may wanna get a copy of the speech Chris gave at the last car show. Your concept of his thinking and his design seems very faulty.
__________________

I love my wife, my boys and my girls.
crazyro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2006, 01:59 PM   #20
Duke W
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Delawhere?
Posts: 151
My Ride: 2003 325i ZSP 5MT
Quote:
Originally Posted by crazyro
Um, sir, you may wanna get a copy of the speech Chris gave at the last car show. Your concept of his thinking and his design seems very faulty.
He can speechify all he wants. Doesn't mean I buy it or that he carries it off... because neither is true.

[edit] Are you joking?! I'm looking for a transcript of his speech now, but the first thing I ran across is this:
Quote:
Bangle also issued a challenge to young designers not to go for just what is cool but to understand that exterior design is much more complex that putting something out that is hip but won't stand the test of time.
That's precisely what Bangle's studio has done: hung a collection hip, trendy, fussy details on a clunky overall shape. "Elaborate" is not the same as "complex"; a difference Bangle does not understand. I predict that it will not stand the test of time in any way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bangle
"Visual literacy is what car design is all about."
"Form may follow function, but meaning doesn't have to."
So, what is 'literate' and 'meaningful' about Bangle's vision? Bangle's designs are the visual equivalent of James Joyce's Ulysses - some hail it as a towering literary achievement. Others, myself included, see it as an un-constructed, over-intellectualized load of bollocks. You can insist that its meaning is too deep for mere undergraduates to comprehend. I insist that the joke is on you and there isn't any meaning. Emperor's new clothes, anyone?

Understand, I recognize that there is no such thing as bad publicity, and that the BMW sales figures moot all my dislikes and complaints. But bold design is not automatically good. Audi's new face has shaken up the look of their line and added "identity". It also looks like a Blue Whale zooming through a mass of plankton. Does that make it better or worse?

I'm having trouble coming up with a transcript of Bangle's speech, but the quotes I've read sound like any other manifesto I've seen that claims to know the new direction of design. It's going to be the old direction in about 10 years, just like all of them.
__________________

Last edited by Duke W; 03-24-2006 at 02:29 PM.
Duke W is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Censor is ON





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:53 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
(c) 1999 - 2011 performanceIX Inc - privacy policy - terms of use