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Old 09-30-2012, 02:36 PM   #1
Grendelsbane
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Is a E46 with FI a super car?

I am just wondering how people would define a super car and if a M3 with a HPF kit or a AA kit (or any other kit one could name) would classify as a "super car" in their book.
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Old 09-30-2012, 02:46 PM   #2
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Not at all

Back when the e39 m5 was made, a sub-5 second 0-60 was considered super car territory, and many considered it to be one.

Now I think super car territory is <4 seconds for a 0-60 time.

Just my 2 cents.
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Old 09-30-2012, 02:48 PM   #3
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I think I remember caranddriver describing anything over 120k as a "supercar". Some people think it's 0-60 time, others think it's entry price.
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Old 09-30-2012, 03:04 PM   #4
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When I hear "Supercar" I think exotic, I would not classify an ///M3 or M5 an exotic. Rare yes but exotic no...

Watch some Top Gear, Clarkson will show you how to differentiate the two.
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Old 09-30-2012, 07:57 PM   #5
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When I hear "Supercar" I think exotic, I would not classify an ///M3 or M5 an exotic. Rare yes but exotic no...

Watch some Top Gear, Clarkson will show you how to differentiate the two.
+1 They preview all the cutting edge super cars...
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Old 10-04-2012, 12:07 PM   #6
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Old 10-04-2012, 12:08 PM   #7
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When I hear "Supercar" I think exotic, I would not classify an ///M3 or M5 an exotic. Rare yes but exotic no...

Watch some Top Gear, Clarkson will show you how to differentiate the two.
Clarkson will also tell you that his favorite car in the world to drive is the M5

seem strange the guy who tests all the supper cars would say this no?
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Old 09-30-2012, 03:09 PM   #8
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It can't be a supercar without exclusivity.

When there are teenagers driving m3's on here it's not ever going to be a supercar
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Old 09-30-2012, 03:21 PM   #9
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I wouldn't consider R8 a super car either. These foreign government official's wankster sons driving these sub $150,000 "supercars" around the school parking lot

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Old 09-30-2012, 03:47 PM   #10
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No way. It is a fast car, but far from a super car. Just like a 69 camaro with a blown motor that does 10 seconds in the 1/4 is a very fast car, but not a super car.

Super cars in my book are cars that have a high entry price, were at the top of their game during the era they ran off the production line, and are exclusive vehicles. I.E. in my book a countach is still a super car even though a new vette which is not a supercar out performs it.

Also, and this is key, you cannot turn a car into a super car, it is born that way.
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Old 09-30-2012, 04:06 PM   #11
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No way. It is a fast car, but far from a super car. Just like a 69 camaro with a blown motor that does 10 seconds in the 1/4 is a very fast car, but not a super car.

Super cars in my book are cars that have a high entry price, were at the top of their game during the era they ran off the production line, and are exclusive vehicles. I.E. in my book a countach is still a super car even though a new vette which is not a supercar out performs it.

Also, and this is key, you cannot turn a car into a super car, it is born that way.
+1

I would rather own a perfectly modded sports car than a super car or exotic though
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Old 09-30-2012, 04:30 PM   #12
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+1

I would rather own a perfectly modded sports car than a super car or exotic though
I rather be poor and drive a 12 years old BMW than be rich.

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Old 09-30-2012, 05:09 PM   #13
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sub 3.5 seconds 0-60 and exclusivety means super car... V8 R8 isn' a supercar... A V10 R8 is... GTR is relatively cheap... in my book a supercar...
The new M5/M6 is tricky.. i think out of the box they are no supercars..
But look at what many of us did with the 335i/135i it went from 300hp to 500hp with just a few mods.. if we can do that with the new M5/M6 and make it into the 800+hp monster, and it has the factory option of Crbon Ceramic brakes i think it might graduate into a supercar territory..
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Old 10-01-2012, 09:04 AM   #14
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Definitely not a super car... Doesn't include the price tag, the exclusivity, or even the performance. If you think about it, modern supercars are 3.5 second 0-60 cars and even the fastest of E46s can't hit those marks. When you also include the lack of track ability, it really starts to hurt any claims of "supercar" status.

That said, a stage 2 AA or HPF is a sick car.
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Old 10-01-2012, 12:15 PM   #15
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Also, and this is key, you cannot turn a car into a super car, it is born that way.
Pretty much sums it up right here. Super cars are designed from the initial Design Review Board for the intent to be a super car. Materials, chassis design, engine development/placement are designed for speed/handling and cost is a very low factor since it will have that super car title. Would you ever consider a widebody Mazda Miata with a turbo Ls1 prepped for the track a super car? It could certainly devastate most supercars in almost every performance specification but at the end of the day...it's still a Miata ya know.

"High End Sports Car" seems to fit the bill for a FI M.
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Old 10-03-2012, 08:31 AM   #16
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Would you ever consider a widebody Mazda Miata with a turbo Ls1 prepped for the track a super car? It could certainly devastate most supercars in almost every performance specification but at the end of the day...it's still a Miata ya know.

.
But what a Miata...

500+ HP N/A LS-3

Texas SCCA Solo National tour winner in X-Prepared. (Vs) Nissan GTR's.

Car is what you make of it. I plan on dropping the Stage 1(initially) AA Supercharger in my 99' 328i, dropping some weight, probably put it on Ohlins or AST suspension, 315 Hoosier R-comps and then I'll be playing with GTR's in Street Modified class on a budget under $10k and with a tire change, still be able to daily drive it.

Any car can be super, and in my book, if you are beating supercars, then your car is "Super"



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Old 10-03-2012, 10:20 AM   #17
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But what a Miata...

500+ HP N/A LS-3

Texas SCCA Solo National tour winner in X-Prepared. (Vs) Nissan GTR's.

Car is what you make of it. I plan on dropping the Stage 1(initially) AA Supercharger in my 99' 328i, dropping some weight, probably put it on Ohlins or AST suspension, 315 Hoosier R-comps and then I'll be playing with GTR's in Street Modified class on a budget under $10k and with a tire change, still be able to daily drive it.

Any car can be super, and in my book, if you are beating supercars, then your car is "Super"


Super clean, super fast and super car performance for sure! But "super car", no. Plain and simple, car is engineered to be a super car from day 1. Sports cars can merely have super car performance, not the title. And I think it deserves mention that a supercar is mass produced (quantities are generally low). A highly modified sports car is generally a one off piece with individual tweaking for suspension and tuning.

Plus, can you guys think of many supercars that don't have sex appeal. M3 is a wonderful car but drop 100k+ in it and it still won't be as sexy as a Mclaren F1 or an Aventador, but it might beat that a** on any type of track.
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Old 09-30-2012, 03:54 PM   #18
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Old 09-30-2012, 04:28 PM   #19
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Old 09-30-2012, 05:18 PM   #20
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It's a little like what Louis Armstrong said about jazz: if you have to ask, you'll never know.
BMW hasn't made a supercar since the M1.

http://www.edmunds.com/car-reviews/f...he-bmw-m1.html
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