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General E46 Forum
This is the place to get answers, opinions and everything you need related to your E46 (sedan, coupe, convertible and wagon) BMW!

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Old 11-14-2012, 10:09 AM   #1
klax
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BMW won't recall defective water pumps (but Toyota will...)

I'm sure this will get moved. Interesting to see how BMW, since 1992 and up through at least the E90 series continues to install a water pump that has an excellent chance of failing between 60,000 and 100,000 miles. Yet, Toyota recalls millions of vehicles built from 2001 for the same reason.

Take note BMW.
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Old 11-14-2012, 10:20 AM   #2
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News flash.. bmw really doesnt care much about reliability. At least as a major facet. Sportscars by default are generally more involved to take care of than a family towncar. For toyota it is their livelihood. I personally like cars that are a bit tempermental. Keeps things interesting.

Also bmw has had plenty of warranty extensions, recalls, you're comparing apples and oranges here. I get what you are saying but people have gone well over 100k miles on the originial e46 water pump so. just a mater of looking at the statistics i guess.
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Old 11-15-2012, 10:50 AM   #3
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The only thing defective here is the ridiculous notion that parts are supposed to last forever.


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News flash.. bmw really doesnt care much about reliability. At least as a major facet. Sportscars by default are generally more involved to take care of than a family towncar. For toyota it is their livelihood.
^ this is spot on.

Want a car that will last forever without you spending much money? You're in the wrong brand, buddy.
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Old 11-14-2012, 10:29 AM   #4
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Mine went 148K on the original water pump. Was still working (but I discovered a tiny leak after I took it off) when I replaced it. Same with fuel pump and t-stat.
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Old 11-14-2012, 10:45 AM   #5
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water pumps that only make it at a minimum 60,000 miles???

next you're going to tell me that the valve cover gaskets are prone to failure somewhere after 100,000 miles.
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Old 11-14-2012, 10:56 AM   #6
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It's just not BMW, many manufactures uses plastic impeller water pumps for cost & weight. VW has the same issues, however, on the 1.8l motor the timing belt drives the water pump. If the pump bearing fails, the timing belt jumps, then you are into at least pulling the cylinder head for bent valves!
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Old 11-14-2012, 10:57 AM   #7
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Toyota is recalling just under 700,000 vehichles for defective water pumps. Don't exaggerate numbers please. The other issue was with the steering shaft. That is pretty serious. They recalled a couple million cars for that one.
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Old 11-14-2012, 10:57 AM   #8
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Yea, Toyota > BMW for reliability, anybody who says otherwise is drinking the bmw koolaid.
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Old 11-14-2012, 07:02 PM   #9
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Yea, Toyota > BMW for reliability, anybody who says otherwise is drinking the bmw koolaid.
When it comes to admitting their cars have problems, Toyota is far more reluctant than BMW to do so. They've had a sludge problem in their V6 engines for 20 years and refuse to acknowledge it. Remember the brake recall that they said wasn't a problem for years? Toyota would rather have people die than admit their cars have problems.

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Old 11-15-2012, 08:59 AM   #10
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When it comes to admitting their cars have problems, Toyota is far more reluctant than BMW to do so. They've had a sludge problem in their V6 engines for 20 years and refuse to acknowledge it. Remember the brake recall that they said wasn't a problem for years? Toyota would rather have people die than admit their cars have problems.

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So, are you saying that bmws are more reliable than toyota as a brand? I drive one of those v6 sludge machines with no problems. Toyotas get abused buy stupid drivers and keep going. No one gets flamed for not changing their cooling systems when they own a toyota I can tell you that.
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Old 11-15-2012, 07:53 PM   #11
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So, are you saying that bmws are more reliable than toyota as a brand? I drive one of those v6 sludge machines with no problems. Toyotas get abused buy stupid drivers and keep going. No one gets flamed for not changing their cooling systems when they own a toyota I can tell you that.
Read it again. I did not say BMWs are more reliable than Toyotas.
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Old 11-14-2012, 11:27 AM   #12
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700,000 vehicles for defective Toyota water pumps. How many 3 and 5 series have been sold since 1992?
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Old 11-14-2012, 02:41 PM   #13
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700,000 vehicles for defective Toyota water pumps. How many 3 and 5 series have been sold since 1992?
well BMW made some 4,693,819 E46s. so add E36s, E9Xs and 5 series to the almost 4.7 million number of E46s. I think you get the point that its a lot.
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Old 11-14-2012, 11:33 AM   #14
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and what makes you think that all these water pumps are defective? Because they don't last the life of the car? Find me a pump on a car that does last the life of the car.
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Old 11-14-2012, 11:43 AM   #15
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and what makes you think that all these water pumps are defective? Because they don't last the life of the car? Find me a pump on a car that does last the life of the car.
+1

1) BMW water pumps are not "defective" and are not particularly more prone to failure than any other make. Every car uses a water pump. Water pumps use bearings. The life of a bearing is finite regardless of what part of the globe it's from. So take note BMW at what?

2) With the exception of the short-lived 1990s E36 "plastic water impellar" debacle of the 1990s, BMW pumps are excellent and actually superior to many other makes, including many Japanese pumps I've come across. I can't even begin to tell you how many Japanese cars require water pump/cooling jobs before 100k miles. You don't even want to know what a chore of a job a water pump on a Toyota/Honda V6 (or ANY make V6 or even 4 cylinder for that matter) is.

Again, replace your cooling system every 80k miles and you'll never have a problem. If YOU have a problem with that, then you can't afford to be driving any car.
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Old 11-14-2012, 11:51 AM   #16
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Again, replace your cooling system every 80k miles and you'll never have a problem. If YOU have a problem with that, then you can't afford to be driving any car.
This statement is beyond absurd.

You know how many cars are on the road with over 150k miles are still on their original cooling system? If that were the case, my mom's car will need a new cooling system, my dad's car will need a new cooling system, and my brother's car will need a new cooling system. If I told them all what you said, they'd laugh at me and call me ridiculous.
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Old 11-15-2012, 11:50 PM   #17
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This statement is beyond absurd.

You know how many cars are on the road with over 150k miles are still on their original cooling system? If that were the case, my mom's car will need a new cooling system, my dad's car will need a new cooling system, and my brother's car will need a new cooling system. If I told them all what you said, they'd laugh at me and call me ridiculous.
Agreed. Cooling systems definitely should to be changed at 90-150K, especially because E46's and such are some of the hardest driven cars out there. If you drive like a standard nanny in her Previa, then I'm pretty sure the cooling system AND the water pump will alst the lifetime of the car.
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Old 11-14-2012, 12:31 PM   #18
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Again, replace your cooling system every 80k miles and you'll never have a problem. If YOU have a problem with that, then you can't afford to be driving any car.
Complete bullshit.
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Old 11-14-2012, 11:44 AM   #19
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and what makes you think that all these water pumps are defective? Because they don't last the life of the car? Find me a pump on a car that does last the life of the car.
You my friend are the MAN! I'm making you a UNIFORM RIGHT AWAY!

L, XL, XXL or XXXL??
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Old 11-14-2012, 01:04 PM   #20
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You my friend are the MAN! I'm making you a UNIFORM RIGHT AWAY!

L, XL, XXL or XXXL??
XL-long, please.
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