Wine for all you Dummies (LOTS of info)

Great write up! I have been trying more and more wines, and this really helps. I have finally gotten past the "alcohol smell" and started to actually smell the actual flavors of the wine. It helps to read the bottle before you taste it in the beginning to know what you are "looking" for, or it did for me. I love the different reds, there are SOOO many different flavors, even with specific wines like Cabernet. I had a bottle of 75 Cabernet at a restaurant in Hilton Head not too long ago, and really enjoyed it. I have also enjoyed trying different types of Rieslings. I have a long way to go! Thanks for the write up!

glad you are enjoying them and i'm happy i could help

any other questions just lemme know bud, and keep on enjoying

I've always wondered:

Why are white wines served cold while red wines served at around room temp?

Originally Posted by SoCalRealtor

I've always wondered:

Why are white wines served cold while red wines served at around room temp?

primarily taste and smell... and just to set the records straight, "cold" and "room temp" are not the way reds and whites should be served (sorry, i def sounded like a prick/snob saying that)

For a quick explanation...

Each wine has a particular temperature to be served at... depending on the chemical composition of the wine, the notes, the alcohol content, the type of grape used, the fermentation process and basically the final outcome of the wine, temperature can change the way it smells and taste a lot

as for why whites have to be colder... i would imagine because they have no tannins, but i'm not certain of that

White wines however are more floral in the nose... what happens to a wine when it is served too warm... you get a hot alcohol smell to it which will do the following

1. you won't be able to detect all (if any) of the bouquet since the warm temperature is causing you to smell mostly alcohol
2. taste.... that crispness of a nice white wine will be replaced with a hot tasting, bitter mess... blarg


Same with a red wine... when it is served to warm, it doesn't go down very well...

on the contrary, when wines are served too cold, the temperature of the wine will:

1. Mask the bouquet... the wine will smell dull, boring, no aroma's will stand out
2. Taste follows smell.... bland tasting in your mouth...

this goes with white wine as well

Rule of thumb

If a red is at room temp (65-70) put in the frig 20-30 minutes before serving
If a white is in the frig, take it out 20-30 min before serving

Red wines should be served on average between 57-59 degrees... clearly some say 55, some others say 61... but to be safe, high 50's is a good temp for reds.... this temperature will allow you to explore the different aroma's of the wine and try to pick apart the complexity of the flavors... also at this temperature, a nice red wine should leave a relaxing cool feeling in your mouth after drinking it...


White wines are almost always served too cold... sure a white wine right out the fridge is refreshing, however you are robbing yourself from the aromatics of the wine because 37 degrees is covering up everything.


if you want to find out for yourself... buy 2 of the same bottles and test them out at a bad temp (too cold for white, too warm for red) and compare them to the same wine served at the optimum temp

this thread is really appreciated. if you have time, could you offer any recommendations on this wine list?

http://boulevardrestaurant.com/winelist.html

thanks

Originally Posted by rockwell

this thread is really appreciated. if you have time, could you offer any recommendations on this wine list?

http://boulevardrestaurant.com/winelist.html

thanks

lol i would love to, however there is like a thousand wines on that list... could you be more specific? lol

anyways, what do you plan on eating, and how much do you want to spend?

those are the two most important questions

Laura bought me a bottle of 1992 Silver Oak Cabernet... Alexander Valley

That wine will deserve a well thought out post/review

nice! i have a bottle of Chateau Souverain merlot from Alexander Valley do you know anything about it? i've recently started to get into wines thanks to this thread bro

Originally Posted by kpxl1023

nice! i have a bottle of Chateau Souverain merlot from Alexander Valley do you know anything about it? i've recently started to get into wines thanks to this thread bro

i've had the cabernet a couple of times... personally i think it is definitely a good bottle, but there are some other wines in the same price range that i would prefer (markham, hanna, and simi come to mind)

i haven't had the merlot, but after reading about it, it seams like it is a bit smoother than your average merlot... well oaked... pair it with a nice fatty red meat or even some game... venison, NY sirloin strip, porterhouse...

or (my personal favorite with merlot) either a grilled margherita pizza (robust, not one of those poosay chopped fresh tomato ones, something with character) or some homemade lasagna

i find merlots go very well with a good deep red sauce

after reading this thread, i'm sure you get a good idea how to taste and get a feel for the wine... so make sure you come back and let me know how it is, i'm always up for trying new bottles

don't forget... if it is literally at room temp, open the bottle up for an hour or so prior to drinking (or decant it for an hour) and 30 min before serving, put it in the frig to bring it down to roughly 60-62 degrees



enjoy!

Originally Posted by JJR4884

i've had the cabernet a couple of times... personally i think it is definitely a good bottle, but there are some other wines in the same price range that i would prefer (markham, hanna, and simi come to mind)

i haven't had the merlot, but after reading about it, it seams like it is a bit smoother than your average merlot... well oaked... pair it with a nice fatty red meat or even some game... venison, NY sirloin strip, porterhouse...

or (my personal favorite with merlot) either a grilled margherita pizza (robust, not one of those poosay chopped fresh tomato ones, something with character) or some homemade lasagna

i find merlots go very well with a good deep red sauce

after reading this thread, i'm sure you get a good idea how to taste and get a feel for the wine... so make sure you come back and let me know how it is, i'm always up for trying new bottles

don't forget... if it is literally at room temp, open the bottle up for an hour or so prior to drinking (or decant it for an hour) and 30 min before serving, put it in the frig to bring it down to roughly 60-62 degrees



enjoy!

Had it for dinner tonight, paired it with homemade Italian sausage and peppers and it was I chilled the bottle for like 25 mins which i really appreciated since it wasn't warm and it made it very refreshing. I highly recommned it

Im not a wine expert yet so im not gonna get too technical yet so bear with me i used to drink only beers but im slowly starting to get into wines so its starting to get fun.

I brought home a bottle of La Crema 2007 pinot noir and Santa Margherita pinot grigio any thoughts on those?

Originally Posted by kpxl1023

Had it for dinner tonight, paired it with homemade Italian sausage and peppers and it was I chilled the bottle for like 25 mins which i really appreciated since it wasn't warm and it made it very refreshing. I highly recommned it

Im not a wine expert yet so im not gonna get too technical yet so bear with me i used to drink only beers but im slowly starting to get into wines so its starting to get fun.

I brought home a bottle of La Crema 2007 pinot noir and Santa Margherita pinot grigio any thoughts on those?

La Crema.... great bottle... one of the few "cheaper" Pinot Noir's that are really worth a bargain.... That and Mark West... Paid about $20 for it right? Good deal... Pinot Noir's are a very sensitive grape (very thins skins) so to get a good Noir, you'll need to spend some money... La Crema is an awesome deal.

I would have suggested that with the sausage and peppers, but to change it up a bit... have it with a nice piece of baked salmon. Be liberal with the black pepper.. the spice in it compliments the wine, and brings out the dark fruitiness of it as well...

As far as the Santa Margherita... one of my most favorite Pinot Grigios... Light, crisp, citrus-y, acidic..... have with shellfish.... It is a little too strong/not sweet enough for oysters/littlenecks on the halfshell, but i think it would pair up nicely with some alaskan king crab legs... they have a bit more flavor than lobster, so it will be able to stand up to the wine a little more

mmmmmmmm

if you don't want to go that route... i think the crispiness of it will pair up nicely with a fatty white fish... Chilean Sea Bass comes to mind... I have a thread on how to sear and bake it... go check it out, it would be bommmb with that Santa Margherita

nice write up...still have the write up you pm'd me over a year ago man

lol wow.... impressive

Originally Posted by JJR4884

lol wow.... impressive

thanks, comes in handy and the wine.tv is saved in my favorites...watch it every now and then


yo
read both of your PMs

personally i would say start with red, however its more risky since they are a lot different than white wines and definitely more difficult to get used to. red wine i would definitely say is an acquired taste...

but, starting with red is the way to go. like a guitar.. the electric is easier to play (white) but the acoustic (red) is where its at


anyways, i'm not sure of the wines in your area so I can't give an exact name to look for, but there are some types of wine that are great to keep an eye on.

for white wines, try to stay away from california... a lot of them (especially chardonnays) tend to be over oaked, over acidic, over sweet, and so forth. great example of that is kendall jackson... one of the more popular chardonnays in the country, however absolutely horrible in my opinion. as a new wine drinker, you want something that is easy drinking..... so, i'm not going to start you off with anything too deep

here are a few names you might recognize

Robert Mondavi.... his Pinot Noir is surprisingly good. Shouldn't cost more than $9 a bottle, light-med bodied, low acidity, and pretty well balanced. Pinor Noir grapes do not have a very thick skin, therefor wines from a Pinot Noir will not be as heavy/dry/musky as say a Petit Verdot or a Petit Syrah.... So look for a Pinot Noir.... don't look for a French one, it is very hard to find a good quality French wine.... If you want a great French red wine, expect to pay $100 or more (generally speaking, there are still good $20 bottles but lets stick to the basics right now)

Pinot Noir, California.... can't go wrong with it. Something light like that could go with a lighter red meat like Filet, however Merlot might be a little better fit for Filet. Better would be with a nice grilled pizza, but a lighter flavored pizza... bruschetta like.... fresh tomatoes, bright flavors (basil).... also, pinot also goes great with dark meat of turkey/chicken, game, pork, and AWESOME with veal..... i would also suggest it with any salad that has fruit in it, cranberries, pears, etc also you'd be surprised, pinot noir will go with fishes such as swordfish, tuna, salmon, and so forth (not shellfish however)

so we move on........ Merlot....... little bit heavier, and dryer than pinot noir.... this is a wine that goes great with a zesty marinara sauce, a heavier pizza, red meat, dry cheeses, and so forth.... Sterling (california) makes a GREAT merlot, and can be had for about $23ish dollars.... however, if you can keep an eye out, look for an italian wine called "Nero D'Avola" It is a red wine similar to "Merlot" but is just innnnnnncredible. Nero D'Avola's are usually between $15-$20 a bottle and I have yet to have one that I didn't like..... Another "Merlot-like" to look for is spanish. I'm not too familiar with the companies, but if you spend $15 on a Rioja or Ribero del Duero, you won't be disappointed. Keep in mind this is the region that the wine is from, so its similar to a Merlot, but it is the region of the wine
Ribero del Duero = one of my favorite regions ever, never disappointed with the wines from there I wish i had more about Merlot, however i am very partial to cabs

And we move on to my favorite... Cabernet Sauvignon.... now your playing with the big boys haha... j/k
Definitely drier, heavier in the mouth, almost bitter compared to the pinot noir (but that is why this is an acquired taste....) California has great cabs for cheap too.... Just to name a few (ranging between $11 and $18)
337, Rodney Strong, J Lohr (meh, not great anymore but still good,) St Francis, Aquinas, Louis Martini, Chateau St. Michelle (this is from washington, not as good as a few years ago, but still worth the $16)

If your pocket allows, don't pass up on Simi, Franciscan, and Markham.... Simi and Franciscan are $24ish... Markham is closer to $30, all Cabernets worth every penny


So, Cali cabs are out of the way... lets talk about some others that you can't pass up. Chile and Argentina. Their cabernets are INCREDIBLE.... Chilean cabs are to die for, and for the price, most of them are better and less $$$ than comparable Cali cabs. This whole wine this is a marketing game.... the price of wine doubles in this country strictly becuase it is from "Napa Valley" Fortunately for us, when California wines are the God of wines in this country, other wines from around the world (better wines) need to make their bottle look more appealing to the American eye....so, lower price is the best way to do that. So when I tell you that I can find a $7 Chilean cabernet that is better than a $22 cabernet from "Napa Valley" i'm not kidding

Cabs are the heaviest of reds, so they go great with heavier steaks (porterhouse, sirloin, ribeyes, and i guess you could say filet, however some cabs can overpower the more delicate flavor of filet) Venison and Bison are also great meats that go with cabernet.... heavier pasta dishes, starchy dishes, etc etc etc.... however it shouldn't be a science (yet) if you enjoy the wine, drink it with something somewhat appropriate.... don't worry about making the perfect match every time. i drink cabernet with salmon..... technically i should be drinking pinot noir or even merlot, however i drink it because i prefer it.....

haha, i have to send you 2 pms because this one is too large, so i am copy/pasting the rest of this one in the next one LOL
...continued lol

so white wines, although i don't drink many, i do have a few to keep an eye out for.

first off, if you like shellfish, find a white wine from new zealand or south africa. the new zealand wine will most likely be a sauvignon blanc... if you see a couple, ask for some help from the liquor store you go to. there should always be someone there to help with wine choices. sauv blancs from new zealand are INCREDIBLE and cheap, however some of them are a little too sweet for my liking. sauv blancs are lighter, fruitier, and more crisp than a chardonnay.... this is the wine i would serve with very light/sweet cheeses, oysters and clams, shellfish (esp lobster) white fish, and shrimp. there area few wines i have had from south africa as well, one that i will never forget is Spier Discover Steen........ very light, crisp, and citrus-y... one or my fav whites and haha, its on the 2 for $16 rack LOLLERS

on to a more heavy wine.... its called "Suove" it is an italian white wine that is a little heavier from Verona (i believe.... somewhere around northern italy) I enjoy heavier white wines, however most of the chardonnay's (besides Chalk Hill, $60) from California are way too overpriced for the value, and they are way too buttery and oaky.

French whites are good... Sancerre is a french chardonnay and i gotta say, for the $15-$20 range that they start from.... definitely worth paying a little more rather than a $15 Kendall Jackson from Cali, seriously I used to like that chardonnay until i explored more whites, now i hate it lol. Another one is Vouvray.. it is made from a "Chenin Blanc" grape, so if you see that around, pick it up. It is a sweeter wine, but tastes good and is a great beginner wine since its easy on the pallet. The Sancerre and Suove would go great with white meat of course... but heavier dishes... Chicken Francais (or Piccata) for example... Fettucini Alfredo, Salmon, and either dessert cheeses or softer/sweeter cheeses (so, not parmigiano lol)

As for the Vouvray, OMG it goes perfect with port wine cheese, if you have the chance to try the two out together

and that is pretty much it bud, hope that is enough to get you started.... listen to this rule tho, and i will explain........ when you drink a red wine, if it is left out at room temp..... put it in the fridge for 20 minutes before you open it........ for a white wine, take it out of the fridge for 20 minutes before opening

reason being?

70 degrees is too warm for any red wine... when the temperature of the red wine goes up, the notes and taste of the actual alcohol increase a lot.... so a red wine served too warm will smell like rubbing alcohol, and taste very hot in your mouth. chilling it for a good 20 minutes should bring it down to 57-60 degrees.... which is a save temp for any red wine.
here is a test, get two bottles, chill one for a little bit, and leave the other one........ smell both, taste both, and tell me if you can notice how important the temp of the wine is

for the white wine........... staying at 37 degrees in the fridge is too cold.... when a wine is too cold, it will completely cover the flavor and the smell of the wine... so leaving it out for 20 minutes or so will let it warm up.... 45-48 degrees is a decent temp for white wines. You will get more bouquet out of the wine and will be able to pick up on the notes of the wine a lot easier.......... however if it gets too warm, you'll smell that alcohol-ness to it like the red... (white wine at 60 degrees will smell like vodka lol)

so, thats about it
lemme know what else you need bud


two things i would do

get a wine journal, write down what you taste, what you smell, etc
try to think of fruits such as blackberries, strawberries, cherries, apples, pear, etc etc etc
think of other scents such as oak, spices, natural smells like wood, rocks, soil, mushroom/fungus, mold, etc etc

write it down....... smell the wine fast, then smell it slow.... you will pick up different notes and you will eventually get the hang of it



second... drink two wines at the same time, that way you can smell one, then smell the other. taste one, then taste the other. get a feel for one, see how heavy/light it is, then do the other.

ha........ wow

i remember writing that.... i was at laura's, she needed me to do something and i said "hold on one sec i'm just writing this thing quick quick"

20 min later she came to take a look was was like "WTFFFFFFFFF??????????????"

Originally Posted by JJR4884

ha........ wow

i remember writing that.... i was at laura's, she needed me to do something and i said "hold on one sec i'm just writing this thing quick quick"

20 min later she came to take a look was was like "WTFFFFFFFFF??????????????"

well thanks for putting my needs/wants before hers

anytime

Originally Posted by JJR4884

anytime

Subscribed, Russo.

jjr, i just want you to know:
i buy cheap wine and drink it with ice. sometimes i mix some seltser in it. and i think it tastes better than any expensive wine ive ever had