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Gun Talk
Are you a gun fanatic as well? If so, you'll want to talk to other owners about what you own in this forum.

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Old 03-21-2012, 11:25 PM   #1
Locutus09
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Removing Thumb Safety on M&P

Good Idea?

I have a M&P40c that has an external thumb safety that I want to remove. Since this gun will become my CCW, I feel that a thumb safety (even if I keep it off) might, by accident, flip on if SHTF.

It looks pretty darn easy:



I already ordered plugs to cover up the holes. As I read, this is standard on all of the models that are NON-Thumb safety already:



Any reason why I SHOULDN'T do this? Or am I doing the right choice?
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Old 03-21-2012, 11:49 PM   #2
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Here's my philosophy on external mechanical safeties on pistols:

1911s have thumb safeties because they tend to have super light triggers and very light hammer release.

HKs have safeties so you can decock the gun, or carry it like a 1911 with the thumb safety.

Berettas have safeties because Privates and 2nd Lieutenants are idiots.

M&Ps have thumb safeties because police agencies wanted them on there for "liability" reasons because they don't know how to train their officers how to keep their damn booger hooks off the trigger until they're on target.

If you feel like you want it off, take it off and see how you like it. I've been CCW carrying a Glock for 8 years, and I haven't Tex Grebner'd myself yet. When it comes to a CCW gun, I am a firm believer in the minimalist philosophy. The more simple, the better.
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Old 03-22-2012, 03:57 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reedo302 View Post
If you feel like you want it off, take it off and see how you like it. I've been CCW carrying a Glock for 8 years, and I haven't Tex Grebner'd myself yet. When it comes to a CCW gun, I am a firm believer in the minimalist philosophy. The more simple, the better.
lol@bold

I shot a friends m&p9 this weekend and I loved the gun, but the thumb safety seemed unneeded. The trigger safety is enough for me for a carry piece. I love the safety on my xd40, but have no issues with the lack of a safety on my kel-tec.
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Old 03-22-2012, 05:02 AM   #4
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lol@bold


Mine has no thumb safety. Wouldn't want it any other way.

Sent from the Bamavarian Nexus.
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Old 03-22-2012, 06:47 AM   #5
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I would just buy the version without a safety.
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Old 03-22-2012, 09:26 AM   #6
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I got an interesting email from S&W when I contacted them about removing the External Safety

Quote:
Hello,

Unfortunately we are not allowed to perform that type of service due to BATF regulations.

Regards,

Dave
Looks like it'll stay on
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Old 03-22-2012, 09:40 AM   #7
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Is that because no one is allowed to, or just they can't because they're a manufacturer?
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Old 03-22-2012, 09:57 AM   #8
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Is that because no one is allowed to, or just they can't because they're a manufacturer?
I think it's because of legal reasons that I've been researching. If you remove a safety for CCW on a gun that originally had a safety, lawyers can attack it.

Couldn't tell you TBH.
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Old 03-22-2012, 10:07 AM   #9
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I think it's because of legal reasons that I've been researching. If you remove a safety for CCW on a gun that originally had a safety, lawyers can attack it.

Couldn't tell you TBH.
So they sell a version without a safety to begin with while the internal mechanisms of the firearm work exactly the same.
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Old 03-22-2012, 10:14 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Locutus09 View Post
I think it's because of legal reasons that I've been researching. If you remove a safety for CCW on a gun that originally had a safety, lawyers can attack it.

Couldn't tell you TBH.
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Originally Posted by SPDSKTR View Post
So they sell a version without a safety to begin with while the internal mechanisms of the firearm work exactly the same.
Civil attorneys will attack anything. This is easily countered by an expert pointing out that the safety had nothing to do with you pulling the trigger intentionally. For every attorney that would argue this, there's an expert that could rebut it.
I certainly don't know what the BATFE is declaring, but to me it sounds like an issue for S&W, not the average user. Unless the modification makes it prone to being considered a Saturday Night Special? Might be worth you contact the ATF over.
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Old 03-22-2012, 12:28 PM   #11
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This seems like asking BMW to remove the governor on your car.

My philosophy is to overcome your hesitation about the thumb safety through training. Learn how to draw, de-safe, and aim in one motion, and shoot like that every time. With time spent on the range, I could shoot my issued M9 just as quickly and effectively as my glock
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Old 04-06-2012, 11:05 PM   #12
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Best not to remove any safety, Back in the day I heard of several cases of people removing colt series 80 FP safeties (a internal drop safety) and getting nailed on a justified shoot just because they removed a safety that's only job was to lock the firing pin incase the gun was dropped and the hammer jumped the sear.

Removing the thumb safety would be a field day for them, "gun nut removes safety"

Now, from my humble experiance the thumb safety should always be used if the firearm has one. If you cant handle it you may want to stop carrying all togeather.

As far as guns go I'm a 1911 guy. I own a small business that deals with used 1911 parts... but I wont carry a 1911 cocked and locked, especially the MIM crap thats getting pumped out today. Even with the safety on your hammer is resting on two hooks that are roughly .020 thick (less if the trigger has been messed with) IF something breaks (remember I sell used parts) and they some times do, a 1911 can run out of control until the pistol is empty in a worst case situation. I've broken two sears myself, one lead to the pistol going NFA, the hammer followed the slide until the mag was empty, a novice would/could have shot himself in the face.

I will carry a M9, when you decock a m9 that gun is completely 100% safe, you cant make it go off until you flip that safety and pull the trigger.

Last edited by tailo; 04-06-2012 at 11:12 PM.
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Old 04-07-2012, 12:59 AM   #13
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Now, from my humble experiance the thumb safety should always be used if the firearm has one. If you cant handle it you may want to stop carrying all togeather.
When I carried my M9 in-theater, I ran condition 2 (hammer decocked and safety off). However, when I ran my 1911 back in the day for CCW, I carried condition 1.
If a gun has a thumb safety, it's a good idea to use it. However, I'm the kind of person who only believes in the need for a mechanical safety for guns like a 1911 and Browning Hi-Power. For everything else, a decocker is more than enough if they even have a hammer.



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I will carry a M9, when you decock a m9 that gun is completely 100% safe, you cant make it go off until you flip that safety and pull the trigger.
You can decock it and leave the safety off and it still won't fire. 13lb trigger pull =
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Old 04-07-2012, 08:44 PM   #14
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actually, theres a simple trick that will reduce both the DA and SA trigger pulls.

Average: 4.75lb's DA trigger pull, 3.25 lb's SA 100% reliable.
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Old 04-07-2012, 09:00 PM   #15
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I just avoid the issue by never buying one. Hated that gun with a passion for the 8 years I had to use it.
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Old 04-07-2012, 09:09 PM   #16
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actually, theres a simple trick that will reduce both the DA and SA trigger pulls.

Average: 4.75lb's DA trigger pull, 3.25 lb's SA 100% reliable.
yes, and if you perform an unauthorized modification to a government-owned firearm, you can face some serious trouble.
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Old 04-07-2012, 09:14 PM   #17
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Anyways, thumb safety is out...finally. Blanks are in place.

Here's to condition 0 carry.
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Old 04-07-2012, 10:35 PM   #18
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Lets just say I wanted a "correct as possable" m9 so I started with a civilian m9, stripped it down to a bare frame and rebuilt it using all USGI parts.

Theres a m9 floating around SF land right now with a plastic trigger, mag release, safeties, and lanyard loop. My m9 is USGI correct except for the m9 prefix serial number.

But yeah, a simple 1911 main spring will reduce your trigger pull by a pretty good amount and still have enough balls to be reliable. I know (and have done the work myself) on several issue m9's.

It really depends on who you are if modifing your firearms is allowed in the military. Note the stock carving and the custom cheek rest....
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Old 04-07-2012, 10:50 PM   #19
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There are a lot of things floating around in SF land that would land non-SF commanders in prison, or at very least relieve them of their commands.

Not saying it's necessarily wrong what you people do over there, but it's not generally applicable to the rest of the military. You guys ask for the space shuttle and it shows up the next day fueled up and ready to go. We ask for a box of pencils and need to justify the request to three levels of supply.
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Old 04-07-2012, 11:10 PM   #20
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It is what it is, as far as SF supply goes just about every thing is off the books. Most of it is used once or twice and then sold off for next to nothing, "lost in transit" is the usual speal.


My experiance is most of these types, and I am friends with a hand full, are half past bat shit insane....

Last edited by tailo; 04-07-2012 at 11:27 PM.
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