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Old 08-13-2012, 02:54 PM   #61
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Mango and ZHP- you guys should note and possibly look into the differences between Sachs Touring Class and Sachs advantage. Sachs Advantage is supposed to be much much better
Reread my first post in this thread. I then hinted at the same thing in my response to you.

Mango: I really don't give a damn about the inner isms of all the CAs. The ZHPs are much better than the non-ZHPs, and Meyle is not the most respected brand in the universe. After all most if not all of their stuff is made in China. And yes their FCABs are nice, I have them.

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Old 08-13-2012, 02:59 PM   #62
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Hey Guys, I have a quick question. I am changing to Meyle HD RSMs with z3 reinforcement plates and M3 RTABs with limiters.

But I was thinking if I have to get the alignment done after RTABs why not do the FCABs as well. Also getting a little steering wheel play and vibration on hard braking.

Hence, checking some parts on BMA and came accross Meyle HD FCABs.
Do you guys recommend Meyle HD bushing set(just bushings and screws) pno: 37306015502 or along with the meyle HD bushing support(carrier) with the bushings pressed in pno: 37306072502?
I am pretty sure that the CAs are stock on mine.


Also, it says that "only to be used with updated brackets". So, if I buy just the bushings, will I be able to fit them in the stock carriers?
When was the brackets updated? I have an 01
Just buy the bushings with the housing. At that point you don't need to figure out how big your current bushings are, because the included housing eliminates that as a potential issue. It's also a much harder job if you don't buy them with the housing.
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Old 08-13-2012, 03:04 PM   #63
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Just buy the bushings with the housing. At that point you don't need to figure out how big your current bushings are, because the included housing eliminates that as a potential issue. It's also a much harder job if you don't buy them with the housing.
Thats what I was thinking to do as well, but the housing also says that "only to be used with updated brackets". Thats the part I am confused about.
Did the control arms get upgraded somewhere during the production line?
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Old 08-13-2012, 03:06 PM   #64
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Thats what I was thinking to do as well, but the housing also says that "only to be used with updated brackets". Thats the part I am confused about.
Did the control arms get upgraded somewhere during the production line?
Read the notes here:

http://store.bimmerworld.com/meyle-h...sets-p704.aspx

I can also highly recommend Bimmerworld in general.
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Old 08-13-2012, 03:36 PM   #65
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Read the notes here:

http://store.bimmerworld.com/meyle-h...sets-p704.aspx

I can also highly recommend Bimmerworld in general.
Thanks, I checked realoem and seems like they updated the bushing carrier with 66mm since 02/2001.
My car is 06/2001. So the meyle HDs should fit.
Thanks again.
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Old 08-13-2012, 04:06 PM   #66
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Regarding the steering coupler, if you don't get to it while you're doing the FCABs, you only really need the driver side tire to be removed while the front of the car is on jacks to replace it.

I used this when I replaced mine and it's like a 20 minute job.

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...8&postcount=14
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Old 08-14-2012, 11:04 AM   #67
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Best deal for sport package replacement shocks at the moment. Ignore the listed production date, these are the high quality early E46 sport struts from an OEM manufacturer and will fit on any non-M non-Xi E46.

The BOGE Turbo struts are around $40-$50 cheaper each than you'll find the Sachs Advantage struts anywhere, and they are the same thing. Only one front (left and right) left, so whoever gets this kit, that's it!

Rockauto, search the part numbers from this screen shot:

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Old 08-14-2012, 11:12 AM   #68
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Reread my first post in this thread. I then hinted at the same thing in my response to you.

Mango: I really don't give a damn about the inner isms of all the CAs. The ZHPs are much better than the non-ZHPs, and Meyle is not the most respected brand in the universe. After all most if not all of their stuff is made in China. And yes their FCABs are nice, I have them.
In terms of what? Because they're stamped BMW? Your implications may be true, but lets hear some meat behind it other than "they're SOOO MUCH better."

It's a stationary metal arm with one balljoint on either end. The balljoint either moves within it's socket (not talking about rotation or pivoting movements) or it doesn't. So lets hear how two perfectly functioning-as-intended solid metal arms with immovable balljoints differ from one another. What makes one "much better" than the other? Just curious!

And guess what, some BMWs are made in China. Theres also plans to add more factories there.

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Old 08-14-2012, 11:16 AM   #69
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I will be replacing my front control arm bushings this weekend. First time it will be done on my vehicle and it has 107k miles on her. As of right now, the car tracks horribly. I can't keep her straight even if she was on rails. I purchased the HD's.
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Old 08-14-2012, 11:22 AM   #70
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Yeah, well, I don't know if you've driven the F10 and/or F30, but based on those two cars I'm not surprised that they're moving to China for some manufacturing. The new cars are mediocre at best.

If you search Lemforder vs Meyle, you'll find on M5 board (or another forum, don't remember) a guy who put one of each (control arm) on his car. The Lemforder had the tiniest amount of play at 40k and the Meyle was gone.

Here's my proof. Non-ZHP CAs are wear items consistently from 100-130k tops, I have experience with this. On my ZHP now (110k) and my old zhp (155k) the original control arms had/have not even the slightest amount of play in the ball joints.

If you'd like to take me to the plate on this, I will make a video of the differences between end links. Febi and Meyle are a bit "sticky" to get the balljoint moving, Lemforder glides with even force from the start.

I have noted the same difference with various water pumps. GRAF and Geba pumps make slight clicking noises when you start rotating the impeller by hand, and Bosch, BMW and Stewart pumps are silent and easy to move. Could this mean nothing? Yes, but it is more than likely an indicator of bearing and construction quality.

What makes CAs different is the same as what makes anything else different. Quality of the components used, in this case the difference is all in the ball joint. You don't have anywhere near 100k on Meyle CAs so quite frankly, you don't have a leg to stand on in this argument. ZHP CAs are the stronger, safer bet. Meyles may be equal, but based on their other parts they are more than likely not.

EDIT: Here's a little meat for you:

http://www.bimmerboard.com/forums/posts/900983

Last edited by Grande D; 08-14-2012 at 11:27 AM.
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Old 08-14-2012, 11:28 AM   #71
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Yeah, well, I don't know if you've driven the F10 and/or F30, but based on those two cars I'm not surprised that they're moving to China for some manufacturing. The new cars are mediocre at best.

If you search Lemforder vs Meyle, you'll find on M5 board (or another forum, don't remember) a guy who put one of each (control arm) on his car. The Lemforder had the tiniest amount of play at 40k and the Meyle was gone.

Here's my proof. Non-ZHP CAs are wear items consistently from 100-130k tops, I have experience with this. On my ZHP now (110k) and my old zhp (155k) the original control arms had/have not even the slightest amount of play in the ball joints.

If you'd like to take me to the plate on this, I will make a video of the differences between end links. Febi and Meyle are a bit "sticky" to get the balljoint moving, Lemforder glides with even force from the start.

I have noted the same difference with various water pumps. GRAF and Geba pumps make slight clicking noises when you start rotating the impeller by hand, and Bosch, BMW and Stewart pumps are silent and easy to move. Could this mean nothing? Yes, but it is more than likely an indicator of bearing and construction quality.
My Graf water pump still spins silently and smoothly. No noises whatsoever. about 30k miles on it. I had my car on a lift the other day and I checked my Meyle balljoints for play. 30k miles. No play whatsoever. Same w/ my endlinks.

I've experienced brand new Lemforder (even ZHP arms) where some of their balljoints were hard to move by hand and some moved very loosely.

Sometimes one loose and one stiff on the SAME arm. This has absolutely nothing to do with balljoint construction and is an invalid/poor test and has nothing to do with the quality of the balljoint.

The balljoint is supposed to pivot. And FWIW, my Meyle balljoints were extremely stiff and difficult to move by hand (Just saying). Is that reason enough to say they're superior to OE arms? no.

I remember TitaniumCranium saying he has over 100k on his Meyle arms and the balljoints are still solid.

At the end of the day, even if the Meyle balljoints fail, they're replaceable for pennies so it's really moot. For the price, Meyle is a great value and does what it's supposed to do.
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Old 08-14-2012, 12:54 PM   #72
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My Graf water pump still spins silently and smoothly. No noises whatsoever. about 30k miles on it. I had my car on a lift the other day and I checked my Meyle balljoints for play. 30k miles. No play whatsoever. Same w/ my endlinks.

I've experienced brand new Lemforder (even ZHP arms) where some of their balljoints were hard to move by hand and some moved very loosely.

Sometimes one loose and one stiff on the SAME arm. This has absolutely nothing to do with balljoint construction and is an invalid/poor test and has nothing to do with the quality of the balljoint.

The balljoint is supposed to pivot. And FWIW, my Meyle balljoints were extremely stiff and difficult to move by hand (Just saying). Is that reason enough to say they're superior to OE arms? no.

I remember TitaniumCranium saying he has over 100k on his Meyle arms and the balljoints are still solid.

At the end of the day, even if the Meyle balljoints fail, they're replaceable for pennies so it's really moot. For the price, Meyle is a great value and does what it's supposed to do.
I gave you meat and all you could back with was a heap of shiit. I'm not the first to question Meyle quality. I have Meyle FCABs on my car, and had them on my last car. I don't think they'll last much past 30-40k miles. Meyle is a good value, not great, and Lemforder parts are superior. If you plan to drive your car 100k+ miles before you sell it, take Lemforder over Meyle everytime. Titaniumcranium does say he has no issues, but there are plenty of complaint/issue threads to go around as well.

My educated guess is that Meyle quality is much closer to that of Febi (good- not great) than it is to Lemforder. A ball joint with lots of stiction that is jerky when moved by hand is not as good as one that is smoother. Will it practically make a difference? Neither of us are qualified to say for sure. I also doubt you've "experienced" that many E46 CAs that you are qualified at all to bash Lemforder or BMW quality.

Where did you find the balljoints for pennies? For all four, I see a price of $115, which is not insignificant.

You bought Meyle (I've bought Meyle too)- it's not crap, but BMW/Lemforder parts are better. Get over it.

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Old 08-14-2012, 01:00 PM   #73
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I gave you meat and all you could back with was a heap of shiit. I'm not the first to question Meyle quality. I have Meyle FCABs on my car, and had them on my last car. I don't think they'll last much past 30-40k miles. Meyle is a good value, not great, and Lemforder parts are superior. If you plan to drive your car 100k+ miles before you sell it, take Lemforder over Meyle everytime. Titaniumcranium does say he has no issues, but there are plenty of complaint/issue threads to go around as well.

My educated guess is that Meyle quality is much closer to that of Febi (good- not great) than it is to Lemforder. A ball joint with lots of stiction that is jerky when moved by hand is not as good as one that is smoother. Will it practically make a difference? Neither of us are qualified to say for sure. I also doubt you've "experienced" that many E46 CAs that you are qualified at all to bash Lemforder or BMW quality.

Where did you find the balljoints for pennies? For all four, I see a price of $115, which is not insignificant.

You bought Meyle (I've bought Meyle too)- it's not crap, but BMW/Lemforder parts are better. Get over it.
I've rebuilt three E36 M3s with Lemforder ///M parts. I'm no stranger to BMW/Lem parts.
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Old 08-14-2012, 01:47 PM   #74
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Yeah, well, I don't know if you've driven the F10 and/or F30, but based on those two cars I'm not surprised that they're moving to China for some manufacturing. The new cars are mediocre at best.

[/url]
BTW, the way a car drives isn't indicative of its manufacturing country of origin. Obviously steering/suspension design and tuning are directly responsible for that. The F10 and F30 are facing some criticism due to the way they drive because of the electrically-assisted steering. That has nothing to do with the cars being made in China (which they're not--I was simply stating some are and there's future plans to)

By your logic, Porsche 911s (991) are made in China. They're facing the same criticisms due to the new electric steering design.
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Old 08-14-2012, 01:52 PM   #75
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Meyle is not the most respected brand in the universe. After all most if not all of their stuff is made in China.
This is so stupid. I can't stand when people spout this **** on the forums. I guess I'll just have to restate what's already been beaten to death in other threads by me and others:

In today's globalized society, basing the perceived quality of a part on it's country of origin is incredibly naive and ignorant. Yes, there are countless examples of junk made in China that should have never passed a quality inspection, but still made it to store shelves (probably because there was no QA). However, many respected, trusted and well known brands have manufacturing operations set up in China. It's economics. The cost of labor and other variables make manufacturing in China very attractive. Does this automatically indicate that these parts are junk, coming from China? Absolutely not. The quality control and assurance practices maintained by a firm which produces quality parts is the same across the board, no matter where the parts are made.

It's all about the company that manufactures the part, not where it's made. There are countless examples of this. The first two that come to mind for me are the Apple iPhone sitting next to me and the Apple MacBook Pro I'm typing this on.
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Old 08-14-2012, 03:31 PM   #76
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Good thread, good read, but not a fan of pumping the Meyle HD control arms. No personal experience here, just the thousands of hours I've done reading up on these control arms over the years. There are varying theories out there about why BMW did not make the control arms from the factory with replaceable ball joints, and if it made sense, (saving all that aluminum from the entire control arm) then they would have done it.

Bottom line here is: till you're blue in the face about control arms, and then you *might* be able to decide which are best on your car for your needs.

Currently, I've had OE control arms, which I stupidly replaced with a cheap azz Hamburg Technic kit from ebay (we're talking less than $300 for both control arms, bushings and brackets, tie rods and end links), only to have the lower ball joint get completely destroyed when hitting a pothole once. Granted, the same thing could happen with OE arms, but I doubt it would have been that bad. This ball joint was so destroyed that when I jacked the car up I could literally move the whole wheel an inch or two in either direction because of that blown ball joint.

Just so happened that I had already purchased the amazing ZHP suspension kit from Turner for around $500 that came with ZHP control arms, 4 new OE sport shocks, bump stops, sway bar and sway bar bushings. GOD I wish they had that deal forever!!!! I should have bought several at that price.

My current set up is by far the best, so tight up front, so much feedback from the road, so amazing.

Just put some Lemfoerder control arms and bushings on the wife's wagon, work great for that car.
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Old 08-14-2012, 04:54 PM   #77
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This is so stupid. I can't stand when people spout this **** on the forums. I guess I'll just have to restate what's already been beaten to death in other threads by me and others:

In today's globalized society, basing the perceived quality of a part on it's country of origin is incredibly naive and ignorant. Yes, there are countless examples of junk made in China that should have never passed a quality inspection, but still made it to store shelves (probably because there was no QA). However, many respected, trusted and well known brands have manufacturing operations set up in China. It's economics. The cost of labor and other variables make manufacturing in China very attractive. Does this automatically indicate that these parts are junk, coming from China? Absolutely not. The quality control and assurance practices maintained by a firm which produces quality parts is the same across the board, no matter where the parts are made.

It's all about the company that manufactures the part, not where it's made. There are countless examples of this. The first two that come to mind for me are the Apple iPhone sitting next to me and the Apple MacBook Pro I'm typing this on.
Yeah well, my computer was made out of pressure treated 2x4s in the USA woo woo!

I'm sorry if I offended you. The country of origin does not always determine the quality, but it quite often does. I have nothing against China per se (don't like there government at all) but auto parts and automobiles that come out of China are generally garbage. MTC is the main one I can think of, and Meyle gets their stuff made in China too- though they contract other manufacturers.

As far as companies go, Meyle (as a name) is nothing. They do not manufacture parts, they contract. Their base is located in Germany so they can write "Germany" all over their parts. They do have not historic reputation to uphold like BMW or Mercedes might, they have nothing.

I'll leave it at this: when a company moves manufacturing from Germany, Austria, Mexico, Canada, Brazil, or the USA to China, generally the quality (you can be assured) is not going to get better, and it will probably get worse.

BTW Mango: To me BMW has lost touch with their roots. Making more SUVs, redundant vehicles, poseur garbage M cars, ruining the M name, and manufacturing cars in China are all indicative of that imo.

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Old 08-14-2012, 05:24 PM   #78
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BTW Mango: To me BMW has lost touch with their roots. Making more SUVs, redundant vehicles, poseur garbage M cars, ruining the M name, and manufacturing cars in China are all indicative of that imo.
BMW and BMW ///M cars have never been better. Every aspect of the vehicles is vastly improved over their predecessors.

If you want BMW to continue making cars, you'll understand the need to expand and diversify their lineup. No competing means no profit. No profit means no more BMWs.

And I like when people bring up this "NO MORE RAW BMWS!!!" claim.

Well... seriously... what brand does offer these "raw" cars you want? Scion FR-S? Mitsubishi? Subaru? You do understand BMW is a premium entry-level luxury/luxury brand, right?
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Old 08-14-2012, 06:53 PM   #79
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Yeah well, my computer was made out of pressure treated 2x4s in the USA woo woo!

I'm sorry if I offended you. The country of origin does not always determine the quality, but it quite often does. I have nothing against China per se (don't like there government at all) but auto parts and automobiles that come out of China are generally garbage. MTC is the main one I can think of, and Meyle gets their stuff made in China too- though they contract other manufacturers.

As far as companies go, Meyle (as a name) is nothing. They do not manufacture parts, they contract. Their base is located in Germany so they can write "Germany" all over their parts. They do have not historic reputation to uphold like BMW or Mercedes might, they have nothing.

I'll leave it at this: when a company moves manufacturing from Germany, Austria, Mexico, Canada, Brazil, or the USA to China, generally the quality (you can be assured) is not going to get better, and it will probably get worse.

I will agree with you that most no-name auto parts coming from coming China are garbage, but not Meyle. I will also have disagree with you about a reduction in quality when manufacturing is moved to China or other less developed nations. That is simply not true. This is why we have quality assurance and quality control standards. All Meyle parts are manufactured under conditions that meet or exceed ISO 9001:2000 and ISO/TS 16949 standards. These standards indicate that no matter where the factory is located (US, Germany, China, Mars, etc.) the parts manufactured at that factory are to the correct spec without variance.

I did not buy any of my Meyle parts under the assumption they were made in Germany. I was fully aware of how the company operates and I purchased my parts with confidence and they continue to serve me well to this day.

So in the end, no, I will not rest assured that when a manufacturing operation moves from a developing country to an emerging economy that quality will suffer, if the firm adheres to quality control standards, the parts are the same.
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Old 08-16-2012, 05:23 PM   #80
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BMW and BMW ///M cars have never been better. Every aspect of the vehicles is vastly improved over their predecessors.

If you want BMW to continue making cars, you'll understand the need to expand and diversify their lineup. No competing means no profit. No profit means no more BMWs.

And I like when people bring up this "NO MORE RAW BMWS!!!" claim.

Well... seriously... what brand does offer these "raw" cars you want? Scion FR-S? Mitsubishi? Subaru? You do understand BMW is a premium entry-level luxury/luxury brand, right?
Funny that you say they've never been better. With the amount of money you spend maintaining your car you'd be well on your way to having one.

Having said that, BMW's new cars are fvcked. BMW used to have the best mix of luxury/quality and sporty qualities, now they may as well be badged Lexus. Lexus isn't a bad brand if that's what you're looking for- but its not what I'm looking for. The F30 is shiit. The F10 looks like a Buick. both of them have steering lifted from something more akin to a Ford Fusion than sports car. They are incredibly imprecise and frustrating. Why did they delete both the fill and drain plugs on their new diffs? To make the cars disposable, not to keep them running. You are starting to seem less intelligent than I thought.
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