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Old 10-01-2012, 12:06 PM   #121
mikkemille
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stinger9 View Post
there is yet a third thread out there that discusses this and many on that thread tell of VR gaskets that leak soon after installing them. Mine is leaking now at 16K miles.
My fault for not researching this a bit before purchasing. Lesson learned.


Quote:
Originally Posted by flashtwosix View Post
No need. The compression and heat will make the gasket sit flush. U rather have extra play then for a gasket to have no play at all (too short).
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmax View Post
Anyway, the OE is a little more pliable, but honestly, if you use rtv in the entire half moons...on the vanos seam...tighten down in stages, in the pattern...you might stand a chance. VR had to have known and fixed this issue.

As far as the height of it, I'd been thinking about that and think that a big part of the seal comes not just at the bottom, but at the top of the gasket where it sits in vc itself...so make sure that groove is really cleaned out well.
I "dry-fit" the VR gasket just to see what it'd look like, and tightened down a couple of the bolts (shy of the torque value). It looked like the gasket was compressing pretty good, so I decided to install it. Doing some other maintenance on the car as well, so it'll be a bit of time before I can report on whether it leaks or not.
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Old 10-01-2012, 12:19 PM   #122
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Originally Posted by mikkemille View Post
Doing some other maintenance on the car as well, so it'll be a bit of time before I can report on whether it leaks or not.
Just check it on a regular basis.
Front leak at the half moons (where mine is) is leaking down on CPS connector and then down onto lower rad hose. Could get on belts down there too and cause them to slip.
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Old 10-01-2012, 01:14 PM   #123
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Originally Posted by Stinger9 View Post
Just check it on a regular basis.
Front leak at the half moons (where mine is) is leaking down on CPS connector and then down onto lower rad hose. Could get on belts down there too and cause them to slip.
Exactly the place where my POS victor reinz started leaking after a few thousand miles. Leak was pretty bad at high rpms as expected. I also had a small leak from exhaust CPS o-ring. Replaced with Goetze VCG with black RTV and no leaks so far.
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Old 10-01-2012, 04:32 PM   #124
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Reporting back with my VR VCG.
"at least 3k miles later"

Mine has not leaked again since i went back in there. I was expecting a warped VC, because this time i speak of was the third time opening it up to figure out why the reoccurring leak, which was specifically at the back passenger side corner of the VCG.

I described my method for tightening, and Dmax was kind enough to read my entire post, and had pointed out that i was tightening in an incorrect pattern.


Cliffs:

New Gasket leaked...Twice.

Third attempt reusing the second VR VCG, and Permatex® Ultra Black

Helpful insight from my only friend in Jersey.

Tightened all center studs first then alternate between, and out to the corners.

Perhaps I got lucky and got a good VR VCG, otherwise i would have had two different problems:

1. Bad tightening method
2. VR VCG from a "bad batch"

Just something to consider.
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Old 10-01-2012, 06:45 PM   #125
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^Maybe just got lucky with your gasket, or your tightening pattern was spot on. Still, someone reading the thread should not risk it and go for a VR gasket just to save a few bucks. The problem with Victor Reinz gaskets is wide spread.

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Old 10-01-2012, 07:57 PM   #126
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^Do not mistake my post as a defense on behalf of Victor, but more of a point to follow the proper torque pattern.

I didn't realize VR was a much cheaper priced gasket, maybe my supplier assumed i was trying to save money; however they know me personally, so they know me NOT to be someone who would sacrifice quality, for a few bucks..dunno, maybe that is just what they stock.
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Old 10-01-2012, 08:11 PM   #127
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unless VR has the wrong shape or size, I am going to defend VR and going to say most leaking gaskets are due to improper user install.

I once had a leaking VCG (OE/Genuine BMW) and I found out that it was leaking because I didn't install the gasket dry. I decided to "lube" the gasket.
My friend also had a leaking VCG (OE/Genuine BMW) and it was leaking because the gasket fell off its groves on the cover toward the back.

VR is an OES for gasket and gasket makers for major european automaker (BMW, VW, etc)
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Old 10-01-2012, 08:18 PM   #128
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I didn't take your post as such. I used Victor Reinz in the past with no problems. They are not "that much cheaper" than the competition either, maybe about $5 cheaper than Goetze. However, after I had a problem with my VR gasket, I went online only to see many people having similar problems with their gaskets. For example, see jbeurotech's posts above.

I agree though that bolt tightening pattern is an important aspect of this job. Gotta be double cautious.

Just a friendly warning who

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Old 10-01-2012, 09:55 PM   #129
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flashtwosix View Post
unless VR has the wrong shape or size, I am going to defend VR and going to say most leaking gaskets are due to improper user install.

I once had a leaking VCG (OE/Genuine BMW) and I found out that it was leaking because I didn't install the gasket dry. I decided to "lube" the gasket.
My friend also had a leaking VCG (OE/Genuine BMW) and it was leaking because the gasket fell off its groves on the cover toward the back.

VR is an OES for gasket and gasket makers for major european automaker (BMW, VW, etc)
Now that you mention it I was shocked to watch the youtube vid this afternoon:

where they made the really amateur mistake of LUBING the gasket! Engine 101: install gaskets dry with a little bit of sealer if appropriate. If you lube you create a path for the oil to travel thru. (exception is gaskets where they will twist on)
Kinda presumptuous to assume that all of us with a leak installed incorrectly. We're not the one making it up as we go. We live and breathe this stuff or we wouldn't be here, and don't use a pogo stick to repair our cars.

Last edited by Stinger9; 10-01-2012 at 09:56 PM.
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Old 10-01-2012, 10:21 PM   #130
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Hmmm, replaced 5 VCGs with VR and no leaks on any. Just did my vcg on saturday with VR... Ill keep an eye and comment if anythign goes wrong
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Old 10-01-2012, 10:33 PM   #131
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Hmmm, replaced 5 VCGs with VR and no leaks on any. Just did my vcg on saturday with VR... Ill keep an eye and comment if anythign goes wrong
If we stop to think why this might be so, it could be some bad batches of gaskets. Perhaps some were subbed out to a contractor (country) that strayed too far from the VR normal standards. We'll probably never know 'cause they aren't gonna talk.
So maybe you could get lucky and never have problem. I ignored the warning when people first began to talk, but then when I see weeping at only 16K miles on my gasket, I have to think maybe people are on to something.
Even one bad run of product can certainly ruin a reputation. Look at all the bad press it's received here. Who who hears this is gonna reach for a VR again when it comes time to install a new gasket?

And perhaps some EU gaskets are all OK, and only the bad ones exist in the US?

Last edited by Stinger9; 10-01-2012 at 10:33 PM.
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Old 10-02-2012, 12:55 PM   #132
Victor Reinz
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Valve cover gasket installation

All valve cover and oil pan gaskets constructed from rubber should be put on dry. This includes cleaning oil from the surfaces of the cover and the engine before installation. I cannot speak for Elring, but in the case of Victor Reinz gaskets, if a sealant is needed, it'll be included in the package with the gasket. Both Victor Reinz and Elring are major suppliers to the OE European car manufacturers and in every likelihood, your BMW has gaskets on it made by both companies since OEM platforms are typically supplied, piece by piece.
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Old 10-02-2012, 01:00 PM   #133
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Dear Victor,

It's an honor and a pleasure to have you comment here on our humble e46 board.
Who knew VR lived in Ann Arbor?


And you really drive a Ford? GT-40?

Last edited by Stinger9; 10-02-2012 at 01:01 PM.
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Old 10-02-2012, 01:09 PM   #134
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Originally Posted by Stinger9 View Post
Dear Victor,
It's an honor and a pleasure to have you comment here on our humble e46 board.
Who knew VR lived in Ann Arbor?
And you really drive a Ford? GT-40?
Well, VR is a division on Dana Corp, which has offices in Michigan, so it's not inconceivable to think that he could work there. Probably drives an Explorer or Mustang.
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Old 10-02-2012, 01:12 PM   #135
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Victor Reinz View Post
All valve cover and oil pan gaskets constructed from rubber should be put on dry. This includes cleaning oil from the surfaces of the cover and the engine before installation. I cannot speak for Elring, but in the case of Victor Reinz gaskets, if a sealant is needed, it'll be included in the package with the gasket. Both Victor Reinz and Elring are major suppliers to the OE European car manufacturers and in every likelihood, your BMW has gaskets on it made by both companies since OEM platforms are typically supplied, piece by piece.
Good to see you joined the forum, and the conversation. I was just over at Bavarian Auto Parts in North Hollywood, and I asked them if they ever had any complaints against VR Gaskets, and they hadn't. Funny, they did say that people often pass on the crush.washers, because they feel like they are an extra expense that isnt necessary.

I cannot speak for anyone but myself when i say my first replacement elring gasket leaked, as did my VR replacement, and this was due to a simple mistake on the tightening pattern.
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Old 10-02-2012, 01:20 PM   #136
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Great, I'm gonna be hella pissed if my VR gasket leaks after the install.
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Old 10-02-2012, 01:24 PM   #137
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Victor Reinz

Actually, we live just up the street from the fine folks at Car and Driver. When we need a fix of fine European cars, we just stand on the sidewalk about lunch time and what them drive by!
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Old 10-02-2012, 01:46 PM   #138
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Victor Reinz View Post
All valve cover and oil pan gaskets constructed from rubber should be put on dry. This includes cleaning oil from the surfaces of the cover and the engine before installation. I cannot speak for Elring, but in the case of Victor Reinz gaskets, if a sealant is needed, it'll be included in the package with the gasket. Both Victor Reinz and Elring are major suppliers to the OE European car manufacturers and in every likelihood, your BMW has gaskets on it made by both companies since OEM platforms are typically supplied, piece by piece.
So given that fact that VR gasket is not supplied with a sealant, do you still recommend installation of your gaskets without it?

That's pretty optimistic if you'd ask me. BMW does recommend installation with a sealant around the half moons regardless of the brand of the gasket.
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Old 10-02-2012, 02:00 PM   #139
///MPR77
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So given that fact that VR gasket is not supplied with a sealant, do you still recommend installation of your gaskets without it?

That's pretty optimistic if you'd ask me. BMW does recommend installation with a sealant around the half moons regardless of the brand of the gasket.
Would you ask Sylvania this when they do not supply you with bulb grease?

Would you ask BMW this, or whomever manufactures your brake pads, when they do not supply you with brake pad adhesive?

Not everyone knows about our Halfmoons, his point was clear, as it had to do with the idea of using sealants with rubber gaskets.


Sounds like your setting a trap, just sayin.
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Old 10-02-2012, 03:39 PM   #140
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So given that fact that VR gasket is not supplied with a sealant, do you still recommend installation of your gaskets without it?

That's pretty optimistic if you'd ask me. BMW does recommend installation with a sealant around the half moons regardless of the brand of the gasket.
Very rarely in car life does any gasket come with sealant. Unless it's some exotic material with special application. I like it that way. Don't want to turn this into a paint by numbers kit.
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