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General E46 Forum
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Old 02-24-2010, 10:16 PM   #21
envoid
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@cdrshm: A friend of mine has an E90 that his girlfriend almost ran dry and was misfiring and running horribly so helped reset adaptations for him and at the same time checked to see how things worked with his N56 (love how the turbos sounded when they spun up). It updates much quicker but runs similar, though some things didn't jump around as much so thinking there is still a small intake leak. However, I haven't had a chance to check things on mine today. If you can get readings from your brother, I'd appreciate it but don't want you to go out of your way or anything.

I came across this thread from here in fact where everyone was saying the cold start stalls was the VANOS but for the poster it was the fuel filter. I'm feeling a light rough idle but not sure where from so wondering about both those now (could just be paranoia).

From that thread I also found that you can take 8" of electrical tape, cut it in half, and rap both strips around the DISA's gasket area to build up the seal. I was out today so thinking of trying this tomorrow along with testing to see if the flap actually moves when activated (INPA can do it while the engine isn't running).

@one2si: These lean codes seem to be created by almost a dozen different things... an intake leak (from CCV or its pipes, manifold gasket, intake elbows, or so many other different places), fuel pump (bad regulator or just clogged), VANOS seals, dirty or bad injectors or gaskets, bad oil dipstick gasket (part of CCV), cam sensor, O2 sensors (pre- and post-cat can fail without throwing codes), and even a bad DME. I think there are a few more I'm forgetting, too. It's almost a crap-shoot.

For the codes being tripped twice, I can't figure that one out unless its the amount that sets the SES light; If there's a large leak into both banks then I could see both being tripped at the same time. Though, I'm thinking if the leak is before the individual banks then both are tripped, and if a leak is on/from something that is connected to an individual bank then one is tripped more than the other or solely. The pipe that went bad for me this time was connected indirectly to both banks but was closest to bank1 and I had more bank1 codes than bank2. This is really only a theory and haven't tested it so take it with a grain of salt. If you are hearing 'air' after doing all that work then double-check the connections for the CCV and make sure the pipes are snug in their ports. Also double-check your intake elbows are seated right, have no new cuts/holes, and their o-rings are snug. At least that is what I would start at.

As for the noise I heard, I haven't checked for it today though I will try tomorrow. Might also try more brake cleaner around the engine to see if anything changes, but I haven't had a code since replacing the pipe (well, minus that one that was right after).
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Old 02-26-2010, 09:07 PM   #22
envoid
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Checked for the 'air' sounds and is less. I'm thinking the intake manifold itself is somewhat noisy and can sound like something is letting air in. Now i'm wishing I was around more of these engines with leaking intakes lol

oh and still no SES light but need to check for codes with INPA still.
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Old 03-06-2010, 12:05 AM   #23
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I just wanted to add my story to this very helpful thread, to help keep the info together. My wife's '03 325i (123,000 miles) had a check engine light last week. I took it to a local guy to have the code read. The only code stored was P0174 (Lean on Bank 2). He cleared the code and suggested investigating the 2 boots between the MAF and intake, since it's a common problem. I couldn't find a thing wrong with them visually. I also sprayed starting fluid in all the suspect places looking for a leak and found nothing.

After finding this thread, and others like it, I decided to just go ahead and dig into it, in lieu of having it smoke tested. Here's what I ended up doing:
  • Replaced upper and lower boots from MAF to intake.
  • Cleaned MAF with CRC MAF Cleaner.
  • Removed/Cleaned DISA with CRC Throttle Body Cleaner.
  • Removed/Cleaned ICV with CRC Throttle Body Cleaner.
  • Replaced fuel filter.
  • Replaced both ends of vacuum line that runs from fuel filter regulator to F connector on lower MAF boot.

Let me tell you, I had a few choice words for the hose clamps on the lower boot, where it connects to the intake and ICV. I ended up going to town to get a flexible spinner handle and a flexible " extension, after I struggled with it for a couple hours. Even with the flexible tools, it's still a pain. Anyway, I found a small slit on the backside of the branch of hose that goes to the ICV. It is probably 1/8" long and I'm not certain it pierces the hose entirely, but it probably does and was probably part of the problem.

The MAF looked clean, but I cleaned it anyway.

The DISA was fairly clean and intact. There is a small amount of play in the rotation of the flap, but none in the pin that holds it in. I had the CVV system replaced at the end of last summer, so the tech that did that probably cleaned the DISA then. The gasket looked fine and I didn't add to it with RTV, tape or anything when I put back in. Since it had some play in it, I'm going to replace it soon anyway, so I figured a leaking DISA seal would be an excuse to replace it now. But it doesn't appear to be leaking.

The ICV was gummed up pretty badly and not moving freely. I'm sure this was the first time it has been out. It cleaned up nicely though and is free now.

I read a few posts here that suggested the fuel filter, or injectors, could be the cause of these codes and since it had never been replaced, I decided to pick one up when I got the boots. While I don't really think the fuel filter was the culprit in my case, I'm glad I got it due to what I found below.

When I went to disconnect the F connector on the MAF boot, I noticed that the smaller bottom line was decayed, brittle, and cracked. It broke half into as I was pulling the F connector out of the boot. The other end of this line connects to the fuel filter regulator valve. It was almost in as bad of condition. The line is made of plastic with a short piece of rubber hose on both ends. So what I did was just remove the rotten rubber hose on both ends, lubed the plastic ends with a dab of petroleum jelly, and pushed a another short piece of 5/32" vacuum line up on it. Had I known this line was bad, I would have just picked up a new one when I got the other parts, but since I didn't I had to improvise, as the dealer is 175 miles away. If I had not of replaced the fuel filter, I doubt seriously if I would have thought to check that end. I think this was contributing at the very least.

BTW, after I had done all the repairs, I pulled the codes again and had both P0174 & P0171. I've driven it about 60 miles since the repairs and no codes pending or stored. Got a road trip tomorrow and have my fingers crossed that this issue is resolved. Thanks for the info guys.
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Old 03-06-2010, 12:31 AM   #24
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im not sure if this is relevent or not but when I had those first two codes P0171/P0174. the mechanic that fixed my car said that there was a vaccuum leak and it was, i think, connected to the dipstick hole (an L shape hose connecting to it was worn). he said something about the dipstick hole having some kind of suction. dont know if thats true but what he said fixed my problem. hope i helped
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Old 03-07-2010, 01:05 PM   #25
envoid
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Sorry for not posting in a bit. Since pounding away on this my grandmother passed and I had to drive to NY. Thankfully the pipe is still good and I was able to get the fuel filter on before needing to leave. It was a good test. Actually got 28.3 MPG (per avg on console) while going through VA. I hadn't had a chance to check for codes until today and there are three P0171 and one P0174 in the DME. No SES and they were at different mileages. I have to convert from km to miles to see where exactly they might've happened as right now it seems to be a very weak leak and only surfaces under heavy load (i think). Once I get back home I will probably try the tape around the DISA gasket to see if it changes anything but kinda doubting it'll help. I'll also check the gasket on the dipstick as i really never checked that (thanks for suggesting that HoTbEEmEr).

@DaHammer: how'd the road trip go? any codes?

oh and btw, is it normal to have sand come out of an old fuel filter? lol
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Old 03-07-2010, 01:08 PM   #26
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Forgot to mention that while checking the codes today I had the car idling and checked the exhaust in INPA and the post-cat sensors dropped all of sudden and then picked up again. This was the oxygen reading and not the heater reading. I'm starting to wonder about them, too.
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Old 03-07-2010, 01:49 PM   #27
DaHammer
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Road trip went fine. I put around 500 miles on her since the repairs and no SES light yet. When I was almost home yesterday afternoon I stopped to fuel up and put a container of Chevron fuel injector cleaner in along with 7 gallons of premium gas. Probably put about 50 miles on it since then. I haven't driven it today, but I did go out and pull the codes just now. There is 1 code pending, P0041, which is 02 Signals Swapped. Not sure what that is all about, since the 02 sensors have not been touched on this car, and there is no way the wires have been swapped. Prehaps the DME got confused or my scanner is one. Anyone have any ideas?
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Old 03-24-2010, 07:15 PM   #28
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Had same problem and it ended up being clogged fuel injectors.
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Old 03-24-2010, 07:19 PM   #29
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I recently had codes p0170 p0173 p1188 p1189 and it was a vacuum leak in the valve cover that caused them. They actually went away on their own and have yet to return 200 miles later.
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Old 03-24-2010, 08:07 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by willsbma View Post
I recently had codes p0170 p0173 p1188 p1189 and it was a vacuum leak in the valve cover that caused them. They actually went away on their own and have yet to return 200 miles later.
How did you figure out it was a vacuum leak in the valve cover. were u getting the rough idle? or any other symptons beside the codes?
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Old 03-24-2010, 09:14 PM   #31
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The idle was pretty steady. I did some searching around here and someone else mentioned the codes and how they went away after they changed the MAF and fixed a small leak in the VCG. I figured it's much cheaper to check out the VC than to replace the MAF and the next day my CEL shut off.
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Old 03-30-2010, 08:27 PM   #32
envoid
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I think I have finally fixed my leak. I've been reading more while buried in other things and found this thread showing the differences between the seals of an old DISA and a brand new one. Somewhere in there someone mentioned that once you remove an older DISA it can create a leak even if it wasn't prior. Mine (below) seems to be just a little too shrunken to seal properly so did the double-wrap of electrical tape to it. I wanted to take pics of it wrapped but totally forgot and was sort of in a rush to get the intake back together.

How I did this was to take the tape while on the roll and wrap it around the gasket area twice, making sure the edge of the tape was against the bigger part of the DISA housing. I made sure to cut it with a razor blade right before the overlap so not to create a small highpoint. Then I took the razor and trimmed the excess just above the gasket area, basically cutting it in half (though this wasted that part of the tape). When I mounted it in the manifold it was definitely tighter fitting and needed the screws to fully sit in the manifold.

So it seems that if you have an older DISA and you remove it from the intake manifold you probably need to tape the gasket or use RTV sealant to seal it up again.



Now, I need to fix my LR window regulator and someday find a window switch 'cap' (the black plastic thing you actually touch to move the window). And replace the rear bumper/fender clip. then something else probably.
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Old 03-30-2010, 08:51 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by envoid View Post
I think I have finally fixed my leak. I've been reading more while buried in other things and found this thread showing the differences between the seals of an old DISA and a brand new one. Somewhere in there someone mentioned that once you remove an older DISA it can create a leak even if it wasn't prior. Mine (below) seems to be just a little too shrunken to seal properly so did the double-wrap of electrical tape to it. I wanted to take pics of it wrapped but totally forgot and was sort of in a rush to get the intake back together.

How I did this was to take the tape while on the roll and wrap it around the gasket area twice, making sure the edge of the tape was against the bigger part of the DISA housing. I made sure to cut it with a razor blade right before the overlap so not to create a small highpoint. Then I took the razor and trimmed the excess just above the gasket area, basically cutting it in half (though this wasted that part of the tape). When I mounted it in the manifold it was definitely tighter fitting and needed the screws to fully sit in the manifold.

So it seems that if you have an older DISA and you remove it from the intake manifold you probably need to tape the gasket or use RTV sealant to seal it up again.



Now, I need to fix my LR window regulator and someday find a window switch 'cap' (the black plastic thing you actually touch to move the window). And replace the rear bumper/fender clip. then something else probably.
so is your light good to go? i might have that same issue ..
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Old 03-31-2010, 09:25 PM   #34
envoid
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Yeah no light. Actually, never really had a light since changing that one CCV pipe but was getting the same codes stored in the DME (P0171,P0174). But I did clear the codes when I changed the pipe and have cleared them since putting the tape on the DISA. Not too many miles but no codes so far.
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Old 04-26-2010, 09:47 PM   #35
envoid
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hate to bump this but finally checked for codes with INPA and nothing at all since the tape went on. so it was definitely the DISA.

now to find time, money, and patience to attack that oil hose that really is leaking.
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Old 11-18-2012, 11:13 PM   #36
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Hello everyone, I am new and this forum has been a very good help. I did want to point out that a small hose from dip-stick tube up to my CCV was the culprit. There was a very small hole in the hose causing intermittent code events causing a lean codes.

This BMW hose will fail at about 80 to 120k miles depending on oil conditions around the engine. It appears the Germans haven't figured out how rubber hoses breakdown over time with oil. This is the first thing you you should look at .
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Old 11-19-2012, 05:14 AM   #37
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Not sure how you found a thread this old to bump as your first post??

Suggest you read all the links below in my signature since you are new.
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Solve your misfires, lean codes, rough idle - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=897616

Fuel pump failures - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=929501

Temp Info - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=964491

Hidden OBC Menu - Check Voltage, Temps, Fuel Level - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=239619

E46/E39 GM5 Door Lock Info - www.bmwgm5.com

Lower hose fan switch O-ring - BMW #13621743299
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Old 11-19-2012, 06:23 AM   #38
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Hey Klarcher, welcome to the forum.

JFOJ's threads are excellent resources to find/resolve the problems. That hose was a pain for me too. See picture attached. The hose was redesigned. The original had a 90 degree fitting which caused the problem/hole created from the bend right after the length of the fitting itself. The new fitting/hose has a 45 degree angled fitting which allows the hose to lay/flow more downward eliminating that bend/flaw in design. I just put mine in recently; hopefully it corrects the problem.

JFOJ--Thanks for the threads/they helped me(don't think I thanked you in previous post).
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