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Old 10-20-2012, 01:22 PM   #1
noobwithazhp
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Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: NC
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My Ride: 04 ZHP
Need some help with a diagnosis

This is a '04 ZHP with 74k miles. Here's the history of the symptoms.

-For a week or so I felt hesitation when accelerating in 5th/6th gear.
-Started getting the same hesitation in 1st/2nd.
-Then car started shuddering real hard on start and in 1st-3rd gear.
-Went in to limp mode once. SES light went on when that happened but went off when I got back down under 2nd gear and hasn't come on again since.
-It still shudders after starting up and pretty much in any gear under 3k rpm's.

First peake tool code check: table 20
27C3 - Thermal Oil Level Sensor
2974 - Precat O2 Sensor Wires/Lines Bank 2
2743 - Misfire Cylinder 5
281E - Variable Air Intake System: Activation

Since then I've been checking codes after every drive. I've been getting the Thermal Oil Level Sensor code almost every time and occasionally the misfire on cylinder 5.

More background info: I was getting some rough idle/stalling a few months ago so I replaced my intake boot which had several large cracks. No stalling since. I also replaced all of my spark plugs and ignition coils/boots.

I also noticed that I was consuming oil a little faster than normal so I looked around and found a small leak coming from the exhaust camshaft position sensor. New sensor and o-ring ordered and on the way.

Do you guys think fixing the camshaft position sensor would resolve the other issues as well since an oil leak could affect the thermal oil level sensor? Not sure if either of those would cause misfires?

Thanks in advance!

Last edited by noobwithazhp; 10-20-2012 at 01:52 PM.
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Old 10-20-2012, 02:45 PM   #2
noobwithazhp
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Too long didn't read?

Can a bad/leaking camshaft position sensor cause cylinder misfires and throw thermal oil level sensor codes?
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Old 10-20-2012, 10:12 PM   #3
noobwithazhp
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Hey OP, we don't want to spoil the suspense. Just put in the sensor and then see what changes if anything. Then determine what is the next most likely thing to fix and do it. Then come here and ask if it will fix all of your cars issues, rinse and repeat until your car is fixed!
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Old 10-20-2012, 10:15 PM   #4
noobwithazhp
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So you're telling me I have to figure it out for myself? Bah, I was hoping for some sage like advice from this awesome community.
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Old 10-20-2012, 10:20 PM   #5
noobwithazhp
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People can see that you're brand new to the forums and they're sick of noobs showing up for advice and not contributing to the community. You must prove yourself! Post some pictures, make some constructive comments, hell, say something immature or controversial just so people will recognize you. This forum might seem like it contains free information but it's a myth. You must become elite before you can get elite advice, at which point you no longer need it. Good luck though!
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Old 10-20-2012, 10:25 PM   #6
scarede46er
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Are you talking to yourself?
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Old 10-20-2012, 10:25 PM   #7
noobwithazhp
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I will become an e46 sage so that I can give myself sage like advice!
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Old 10-20-2012, 10:29 PM   #8
noobwithazhp
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scarede46er View Post
Are you talking to yourself?
Holy ****, you can read this?
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Old 10-20-2012, 10:42 PM   #9
benzovs
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First off I want to start by saying you are hilarious!! Sometimes I'm in need of a good laugh so I log on and read noob posts (I'm a noob myself). For the most part, they don't disappoint. Let's get on with your issue. What you are experiencing is known as a drivability problem, and as such requires drivability diagnostics. One of the most important tools needed to perform drivability diagnostics is a scanner. Not some cheap scanner, a real time scanner with freeze frame. I have seen some actron ones for less than $200, but I can't say whether or not they are any good. My buddy runs his own shop and has a $2500 snap on one.

Even if you had the scanner, you would have to know how to use it. And I don't mean in the sense of turning it one and scrolling through the codes. You would have to know how to interpret the data you are reading and use that to come to a conclusion. When you have issues like you are having the possibilities are almost endless and that's why no one has even ventured to guess. You gave a fair amount of info, but IMO, not enough. Even if you gave us all the info you could possibly think of, the possible causes are easily in the dozen. So... all we would be doing in taking shots in the dark. Theres some sage wisdom/advice for you.
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Old 10-20-2012, 10:52 PM   #10
noobwithazhp
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benzovs View Post
First off I want to start by saying you are hilarious!! Sometimes I'm in need of a good laugh so I log on and read noob posts (I'm a noob myself). For the most part, they don't disappoint. Let's get on with your issue. What you are experiencing is known as a drivability problem, and as such requires drivability diagnostics. One of the most important tools needed to perform drivability diagnostics is a scanner. Not some cheap scanner, a real time scanner with freeze frame. I have seen some actron ones for less than $200, but I can't say whether or not they are any good. My buddy runs his own shop and has a $2500 snap on one.

Even if you had the scanner, you would have to know how to use it. And I don't mean in the sense of turning it one and scrolling through the codes. You would have to know how to interpret the data you are reading and use that to come to a conclusion. When you have issues like you are having the possibilities are almost endless and that's why no one has even ventured to guess. You gave a fair amount of info, but IMO, not enough. Even if you gave us all the info you could possibly think of, the possible causes are easily in the dozen. So... all we would be doing in taking shots in the dark. Theres some sage wisdom/advice for you.
Thanks for the response! I knew that this would be a hard issue so I wasn't really expecting a magic answer. Perhaps rephrasing the question would help.

I wonder if anyone else whose had a leaking exhaust cam position sensor had their e46 throw thermal oil level sensor codes and misfires? Basically I'm looking for some hope that fixing that one sensor could be the answer to all of my current issues...
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Old 10-20-2012, 10:57 PM   #11
noobwithazhp
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Also, does the PA Soft scanner software do what you are referring to? Can I just install that and get some better diagnostics?
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Old 10-26-2012, 01:42 PM   #12
scarede46er
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^Yup! It's a fantastic piece of software.
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Old 10-30-2012, 09:12 PM   #13
noobwithazhp
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Update. Changed the exhaust cam position sensor and o-ring and the oil leak is fixed. Still throwing the same codes daily. I'm hearing a sucking/hissing noise around the disa. After some more researching, that sounds a lot more like what could be causing my drive-ability symptoms but the fault codes are confusing...
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Old 11-14-2012, 03:46 AM   #14
donoharm
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Hi there, I got about the same drive-ability problem with my 323ci, first I thought it was the flywheel... installed a uuc light flywheel+m5 clutch kit and no change (flywheel was shot anyway)

I got new filters,oil, plugs.

the problem occurs exactly between idle and 2500rpm in any gear

if I find a fix before you do I'll post here
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Old 11-14-2012, 05:39 AM   #15
jfoj
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Suggest you read the first link below in my signature.

DISA's are problems, but these engines also have a vacuum rushing noise at an idle due to the plastic instake and ICV configuration, so some of this noise is "normal".

Change plugs if old, replace coil boots and then move #5 coil to a different location and note where you moved it.

Then drive the car and see what happens.
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Solve your misfires, lean codes, rough idle - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=897616

Fuel pump failures - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=929501

Temp Info - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=964491

Hidden OBC Menu - Check Voltage, Temps, Fuel Level - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=239619

E46/E39 GM5 Door Lock Info - www.bmwgm5.com

Lower hose fan switch O-ring - BMW #13621743299
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Old 11-17-2012, 04:50 AM   #16
donoharm
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Thank you jfoj, I cleaned the DISA, it was gummed up bad... in makes nor rattle sound and seems to be working...
after this car seemed to run a bit better, and the jerking droped from 2500rpm to around 2000 and only at full throttle

I also changed coil 5 with coil 2 , the car runs worse now at under 2000rpm

What this really means? have to change coil no5 ? or all of them? can you refer to some aftermarket coils? just got a dud oil level sensor last week from ebay

Next w-e I'm gonna do a subframe repair and change all the bushings... pretty pissed with bmw right now.
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Old 11-17-2012, 06:06 AM   #17
jporter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by donoharm View Post
Thank you jfoj, I cleaned the DISA, it was gummed up bad... in makes nor rattle sound and seems to be working...
after this car seemed to run a bit better, and the jerking droped from 2500rpm to around 2000 and only at full throttle

I also changed coil 5 with coil 2 , the car runs worse now at under 2000rpm

What this really means? have to change coil no5 ? or all of them? can you refer to some aftermarket coils? just got a dud oil level sensor last week from ebay

Next w-e I'm gonna do a subframe repair and change all the bushings... pretty pissed with bmw right now.
Be more pissed at the previous owner(s). Hope you get it solved quickly.
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Old 11-21-2012, 08:36 AM   #18
donoharm
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update, I ordered 2 coils (that was in stock) changed 2&5 coil and all the coil boots, it works )

JP, prev owners kept it stock (and never changed the fuel filter ) but only bmw is responsible for subframe cracks...

gonna try and contribute to the community with a subframe repair(welded plates hand made +carbon fiber/epoxy reinforcement ) with detailed pics .
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Old 11-21-2012, 09:25 AM   #19
RayPooley
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Quote:
Originally Posted by noobwithazhp View Post
This is a '04 ZHP with 74k miles. Here's the history of the symptoms.

-For a week or so I felt hesitation when accelerating in 5th/6th gear.
-Started getting the same hesitation in 1st/2nd.
-Then car started shuddering real hard on start and in 1st-3rd gear.
-Went in to limp mode once. SES light went on when that happened but went off when I got back down under 2nd gear and hasn't come on again since.
-It still shudders after starting up and pretty much in any gear under 3k rpm's.

First peake tool code check: table 20
27C3 - Thermal Oil Level Sensor
2974 - Precat O2 Sensor Wires/Lines Bank 2
2743 - Misfire Cylinder 5
281E - Variable Air Intake System: Activation

Since then I've been checking codes after every drive. I've been getting the Thermal Oil Level Sensor code almost every time and occasionally the misfire on cylinder 5.

More background info: I was getting some rough idle/stalling a few months ago so I replaced my intake boot which had several large cracks. No stalling since. I also replaced all of my spark plugs and ignition coils/boots.

I also noticed that I was consuming oil a little faster than normal so I looked around and found a small leak coming from the exhaust camshaft position sensor. New sensor and o-ring ordered and on the way.

Do you guys think fixing the camshaft position sensor would resolve the other issues as well since an oil leak could affect the thermal oil level sensor? Not sure if either of those would cause misfires?

Thanks in advance!
Precat O2 Sensor Wires/Lines Bank 2 can cause your symptoms including a host of ghost codes so deal with that first. Its dead awkward to get to so you might want to get a shop to do it. Clear codes after the job and see what happens. Exception might be the oil level sensor but on mine you get an orange oil light as well if oil needs topping. You getting that?
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