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Old 11-25-2012, 02:44 PM   #61
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The hardest part of the bench is getting it off your chest, not locking it out, so no, it isn't the most important factor.
Think about this. Who's arms will be lower when the bar is on the chest. The guy with the shorter arms or the longer arms? Think elbow angle. A short armed lifter may have more of a right angle to the arm whereas the long armed lifter will be pushing from much deeper. That alone makes it harder for the long armed lifter to get the bar off the chest. It's the same idea when people bench without going down all the way to the chest. They want to lift more so they shorten the movement. I do agree that the top of the lift doesn't really matter though.

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Old 11-25-2012, 03:14 PM   #62
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Think about this. Who's arms will be lower when the bar is on the chest. The guy with the shorter arms or the longer arms? Think elbow angle. A short armed lifter may have more of a right angle to the arm whereas the long armed lifter will be pushing from much deeper. That alone makes it harder for the long armed lifter to get the bar off the chest. It's the same idea when people bench without going down all the way to the chest. They want to lift more so they shorten the movement. I do agree that the top of the lift doesn't really matter though.

IMHO, it's not about the bar being on the chest. To me, the hardest part about benching is controlling the load on the way down and controlling the load on the way up while keeping my form intact. Sure, the guy with the longer arms may have a further distance to push (..and I use the term "may" because longer limbs mean a different grip position than what is used by someone with shorter limbs; it's all a wash in my opinion. Benching is more variable, unlike....say, a squat or deadlift), but what needs to be done to move the weight is the same regardless of the height of the individual.

To further clarify, there are multiple rings on a standard issue 45 lb. bar. Where I grip the bar (...just outside of shoulder width, pinky fingers or ring fingers on the closest ring from the smooth centered portion of the bar) is different than where my taller, longer limbed buddy grips (..his grip is much wider and closer to the outer ring). Our travel distance is about the same...

....and he puts up more weight than I do, and my bench numbers are strong.

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Old 11-25-2012, 03:59 PM   #63
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IMHO, it's not about the bar being on the chest. To me, the hardest part about benching is controlling the load on the way down and controlling the load on the way up while keeping my form intact. Sure, the guy with the longer arms may have a further distance to push (..and I use the term "may" because longer limbs mean a different grip position than what is used by someone with shorter limbs; it's all a wash in my opinion. Benching is more variable, unlike....say, a squat or deadlift), but what needs to be done to move the way is the same regardless of the height of the individual.

To further clarify, there are multiple rings on a standard issue 45 lb. bar. Where I grip the bar (...just outside of shoulder width, pinky fingers or ring fingers on the closest ring from the smooth centered portion of the bar) is different than where my taller, longer limbed buddy grips (..his grip is much wider and closer to the outer ring). Our travel distance is about the same...

....and he puts up more weight than I do, and my bench numbers are strong.
That is a good point and I do think it varies from person to person but I think in a vacuum the guys with longer arms will usually lift a little less. It's really not much to worry about though. I don't think a few inches in arms will equal more than a few lbs.
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Old 11-25-2012, 04:05 PM   #64
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That is a good point and I do think it varies from person to person but I think in a vacuum the guys with longer arms will usually lift a little less. It's really not much to worry about though. I don't think a few inches in arms will equal more than a few lbs.
I also feel like the stronger the back, the better the bench. The lats/rear delts are significant components of the bench press. In fact, my lats handle majority of the load during the eccentric phase of the press.

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Old 11-25-2012, 05:31 PM   #65
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That is a good point and I do think it varies from person to person but I think in a vacuum the guys with longer arms will usually lift a little less. It's really not much to worry about though. I don't think a few inches in arms will equal more than a few lbs.
See I don't know how you can make that argument. It's just ONE variable out of many, and almost sounds like an excuse for people with long arms so they can have a reason. What about guys with less body fat compared to you/more muscle? Guys that weigh more than you? Guys that have better form and can breathe better? What about guy's that are short and deadlift more...is it cause they have shorter limbs? Or cause they are actually just stronger? Not to sound like a dick, but that's just what it sounds like, an excuse.
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Old 11-25-2012, 05:31 PM   #66
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My bench is embarrassing. That's really all I have to add to this discussion.
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I don't see what is ridiculous by robbing with a sword.A sword in one od the most lethal wepon !!!

It's more easy to kill with a sword than with a gun.

A sword is more frightening than toy-looking gun like glock.

robbing with a sword is a good thing

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Old 11-25-2012, 05:45 PM   #67
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See I don't know how you can make that argument. It's just ONE variable out of many, and almost sounds like an excuse for people with long arms so they can have a reason. What about guys with less body fat compared to you/more muscle? Guys that weigh more than you? Guys that have better form and can breathe better? What about guy's that are short and deadlift more...is it cause they have shorter limbs? Or cause they are actually just stronger? Not to sound like a dick, but that's just what it sounds like, an excuse.
His point is legitimate, if not fully elaborated. A lot of taller guys aren't proportionately large, in that they have comparatively small joints. Small joints are good for aesthetics, bad for big numbers. A number of promising bodybuilding careers have been cut short due to this. Sort of a "quod me nutrit me destruit" thing.


A 6'+ strongman athlete and a 6'+ endurance athlete look very different. Look at Derek Poundstone versus Michael Phelps, for example. There's a 3" difference in height, but the joint issue is still evident.






Now, with that said, does it prevent longer-limbed guys from benching decent numbers? No, certainly not. But to suggest that limb length is solely a cop-out is equally ignorant as suggesting it's the only factor.

It's also easier to take positions that benefit us, and is worth noting that you're below average height and don't have slight joints, so perhaps your view on it is a bit skewed.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jacques chirac View Post
I don't see what is ridiculous by robbing with a sword.A sword in one od the most lethal wepon !!!

It's more easy to kill with a sword than with a gun.

A sword is more frightening than toy-looking gun like glock.

robbing with a sword is a good thing
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Old 11-25-2012, 06:22 PM   #68
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His point is legitimate, if not fully elaborated. A lot of taller guys aren't proportionately large, in that they have comparatively small joints. Small joints are good for aesthetics, bad for big numbers. A number of promising bodybuilding careers have been cut short due to this. Sort of a "quod me nutrit me destruit" thing.


A 6'+ strongman athlete and a 6'+ endurance athlete look very different. Look at Derek Poundstone versus Michael Phelps, for example. There's a 3" difference in height, but the joint issue is still evident.






Now, with that said, does it prevent longer-limbed guys from benching decent numbers? No, certainly not. But to suggest that limb length is solely a cop-out is equally ignorant as suggesting it's the only factor.

It's also easier to take positions that benefit us, and is worth noting that you're below average height and don't have slight joints, so perhaps your view on it is a bit skewed.

To be fair though, the sheer thickness makes the power-lifters limbs appear shorter, but if he didn't have the muscle mass he'd look very different. Add 50+ lbs. of muscle to Phelps' frame and his limbs would look short too.
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Old 11-25-2012, 06:33 PM   #69
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To be fair though, the sheer thickness makes the power-lifters limbs appear shorter, but if he didn't have the muscle mass he'd look very different. Add 50+ lbs. of muscle to Phelps' frame and his limbs would look short too.
While your point is completely valid, my point with the pictures was solely about joint thickness.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jacques chirac View Post
I don't see what is ridiculous by robbing with a sword.A sword in one od the most lethal wepon !!!

It's more easy to kill with a sword than with a gun.

A sword is more frightening than toy-looking gun like glock.

robbing with a sword is a good thing
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Old 11-25-2012, 06:37 PM   #70
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See I don't know how you can make that argument. It's just ONE variable out of many, and almost sounds like an excuse for people with long arms so they can have a reason. What about guys with less body fat compared to you/more muscle? Guys that weigh more than you? Guys that have better form and can breathe better? What about guy's that are short and deadlift more...is it cause they have shorter limbs? Or cause they are actually just stronger? Not to sound like a dick, but that's just what it sounds like, an excuse.
We're not talking about all those things. We're just talking about how arm length affects the lifts. I do 100% agree that their are a ton of variables though.
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Old 11-25-2012, 06:41 PM   #71
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My bench is embarrassing. That's really all I have to add to this discussion.
You still putting up 135 lbs.?
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Old 11-25-2012, 06:50 PM   #72
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You still putting up 135 lbs.?
At least!
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Originally Posted by jacques chirac View Post
I don't see what is ridiculous by robbing with a sword.A sword in one od the most lethal wepon !!!

It's more easy to kill with a sword than with a gun.

A sword is more frightening than toy-looking gun like glock.

robbing with a sword is a good thing
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Old 11-25-2012, 08:11 PM   #73
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We're not talking about all those things. We're just talking about how arm length affects the lifts. I do 100% agree that their are a ton of variables though.
Yes, I agreed and said it plays SOME role, but not a "huge part" that was said before, and blaming the reason someone can't put up big numbers being cause they have short limbs is ignorant.
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Old 11-26-2012, 10:14 AM   #74
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Not really. To a certain extend, but not a "huge role"...blaming poor bench numbers is a way to make an excuse and blame it on something else.
Written poorly I agree... I just wanted to point out the fact height does factor into pushing lifts, not using it as an excuse.

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Your height isn't your problem. It's your workouts (..and quite possibly your form)!
You have to remember, I've had 2 years of proper training where I've gone from a pitiful bench of 95 lbs to 160 lbs, not amazing progress but there's still progress there to discuss. Long road ahead but that's why I get your guys input on workouts so I can do whats best for me. Didn't want that to come across as an excuse, but when I re-read it it does.

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don't question him, he's an expert in everything.
you mad bro? seriously. I do my best to help others with the knowledge I have gained by researching health & fitness topics. You just seem to troll, what a great contribution... If you disagree with things I say, why don't you create an intelligent debate like everyone else?
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Old 11-26-2012, 10:23 AM   #75
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You have to remember, I've had 2 years of proper training where I've gone from a pitiful bench of 95 lbs to 160 lbs, not amazing progress but there's still progress there to discuss. Long road ahead but that's why I get your guys input on workouts so I can do whats best for me. Didn't want that to come across as an excuse, but when I re-read it it does.

There is no doubt that you are dedicated. That much cannot be disputed!
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Old 11-26-2012, 12:41 PM   #76
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There is no doubt that you are dedicated. That much cannot be disputed!
Thanks, I think I am in for the long haul. Dedicated... Minus the 32oz of beer + 10 shots on friday
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Old 11-26-2012, 12:46 PM   #77
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Thanks, I think I am in for the long haul. Dedicated... Minus the 32oz of beer + 10 shots on friday
There's a video of me chugging half a pitcher of eggnog and rum after eating my friends chimichanga after going to the bars the other night.

I promised him I wouldn't eat it and I beat him to the fridge and the egg nog was my punishment.
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Old 11-26-2012, 01:08 PM   #78
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it depends on a lot more things, but it is easy to put truth to the stereotype that the guys with the shorter arms seem to be able to do the most bench.
Of course they can.. it's simple physics. Which is why it's funny when you have a 5'5 guy taunting a dude who is 6'5 and has a two foot larger wingspan.

If you're tiny, you have to push the weight a much shorter distance. A much taller guy pushing an equivalent amount of weight is doing significantly more work. It's no different than the old notion that "the outside of a record is spinning faster than the inner portions". And not only is the distance an issue, but you also have the angle at which the bar hits your chest... dependent upon how "thick" your body is and the length of your arms, that angle will be much different. If you're a thinner guy with longer arms (like myself) your angle will be much steeper... if you're a thicker guy with short arms, you have much less work to do throughout the lift and your angle will be advantageous.

Regardless, I wouldn't trade a single one of my 75 inches for additional weight on a bench press.

Lastly, I've noticed people talking entirely different numbers in here. Some are mentioning their workout weights (10, 8, 6) which is what I did... others are talking max. Anybody making fun of anyone else's numbers is just a dbag.. if people are trying to continually improve, that should be celebrated (regardless of the mark). Would you mock a fat guy for "not losing weight fast enough?". Of course not.

EDIT: FWIW, can anyone in here say they would actually take the strongman look over Phelps or other "cut" athletes? I know I'd take a WR or DB body type over a LB or offensive lineman any day of the week.
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Old 11-26-2012, 01:23 PM   #79
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I was 180-185 putting up 245x6 when I stopped.

Haven't hit the gym in a month and a half, currently at 190. Can't wait to be done with school so I can get back into it.
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Old 11-26-2012, 01:27 PM   #80
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EDIT: FWIW, can anyone in here say they would actually take the strongman look over Phelps or other "cut" athletes? I know I'd take a WR or DB body type over a LB or offensive lineman any day of the week.
Depends on what your goals are. I would love to lift heavy and have a slender lean build, though.
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