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Old 11-23-2012, 04:54 PM   #21
jessehell
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The CEL is not on while driving.
I have a windows 7 64 bit laptop
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Old 11-23-2012, 06:09 PM   #22
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http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthr...pa+soft+64+bit

A bit concerned that the CEL is not on at this moment??

Guess you will need to see if PA Soft/BMW Scanner 1.4.0 yields any additional info.
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Old 11-23-2012, 06:17 PM   #23
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Thanks for the link.
Not having the CEL on makes trouble shooting even more perplexing. I'm wondering if my ecu doesn't need a reflash. I drove almost 20k miles with the vacuum hoses to the fuel pressure regulator and the secondary air valve broken/disconnected and had no idea. This may have set a trend in the ecu?

Last edited by jessehell; 11-23-2012 at 06:17 PM.
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Old 11-23-2012, 08:56 PM   #24
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Do not worry about the ECU for the moment.

You may have some Pending codes???

Have you had the O2 sensors pass Readiness?

What Readiness Codes are still not cleared?

Suggest you read and try to follow the attached document.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf Federal Drive Cycle Test Procedure.pdf (213.1 KB, 83 views)
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Old 11-23-2012, 11:35 PM   #25
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Secondary air, o2, catalyst, evap, and o2 heater all report incomplete
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Old 11-24-2012, 07:12 AM   #26
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I would start with trying to sort the O2 sensors first.

The O2 heaters are important for the O2 sensors to actually warm up fast enough to then get the O2 sensors to pass.

First thing I would do is check the fuses for the O2 Sensor heaters. You may also need to make sure you have power on the O2 Sensor heater wires.

Usually if the O2 sensor heater is open, the DME will through a code for this?

Also time exactly how long it is taking your engine to go into closed loop on a cold start.

Based upon the Fed Drive Cycle, it looks like close loop should happen around 2 to 5 minutes? If you are not going into closed look before 5 minutes, this is likely part of your problem, O2 sensor heaters not working and/or O2 sensors too lazy??

How old are the primary O2 sensors?

If you need to replace them, check Amazon for Bosch sensors, usually around $50 each.
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Hidden OBC Menu - Check Voltage, Temps, Fuel Level - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=239619

E46/E39 GM5 Door Lock Info - www.bmwgm5.com

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Old 11-24-2012, 11:58 AM   #27
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From cold, in 35 degree temps, it took 4.5 mins idling to go into closed loop this morning.
I don't know if any of the o2 sensors have been replaced. Car has 125k on it.
I'll look for blown fuses next, I can try to check voltage on heater wires too.
After driving 15 mins and then idling again post cat sensors read .7v bank 1 and .08v bank 2. Seems low on bank 2
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Old 12-02-2012, 12:45 PM   #28
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So after temporarily giving up and driving the car not according to any standard procedures, the o2 sensor and catalyst monitors have set. o2 heater, evap, and secondary air still report as not ready.
While doing a thruway drive cycle I notice that every time i let off the gas and coast the car reverts to open loop due to insufficient engine load/deceleration.
I haven't received the bmw specific scan tool yet. And my rear view mirror just fell off a couple days ago. fml
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Old 12-02-2012, 02:48 PM   #29
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Drive on the highway, about 50 miles and try to drive it 55-60mph, without braking/stopping. And for the evap monitor, leave it overnight at the shop that will do the inspection and have them do the inspection the next day.

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Old 12-02-2012, 05:54 PM   #30
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I realized that I misread my phone earlier as I was inspecting the SAP valve. The monitors that are not ready are Catalyst, O2 Heater, and Evap.
I just checked and the o2 heater fuse in the dme tray is not blown. Still no codes or SES light and I have about 700 miles on the car of me trying to set these monitors.
I really have no idea why the secondary air and o2 sensor monitors suddenly switched to ready after I had given up on drive cycles
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Old 12-06-2012, 09:21 PM   #31
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Update:
bank 2 post cat o2 appears to have issues. Stays at .1v after warmed up while other side is a constant .7v. New Bosch is on its way from amazon.
I threw a P1093 pending code tonight. Pre cat fuel trim too rich bank 2. Perhaps this is related to the bad post cat sensor??
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Old 12-08-2012, 10:01 PM   #32
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Update:
Found the sensor in question to be loose in the bung. Tried tightening it and running the car but it made no difference on voltage readings. I replaced it due to possible damage. Voltage readings seem to be moving around a little now and read perhaps what they should at that sensor.
The pending code also cleared. I need to do a drive cycle and see if anything changes with the obd monitors
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Old 12-09-2012, 10:46 PM   #33
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Did 2 more drive cycles tonight. No change. That o2 sensor I replaced is still pegged at .1v after driving and the monitors still won't set.
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Old 12-10-2012, 05:19 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jessehell View Post
I realized that I misread my phone earlier as I was inspecting the SAP valve. The monitors that are not ready are Catalyst, O2 Heater, and Evap.
I just checked and the o2 heater fuse in the dme tray is not blown. Still no codes or SES light and I have about 700 miles on the car of me trying to set these monitors.
I really have no idea why the secondary air and o2 sensor monitors suddenly switched to ready after I had given up on drive cycles
I have been following this thread with interest.
Normally O2 sensor heater monitor is completed very early since it is monitored continuously in closed loop operation.
I am suspecting O2 sensors are not functioning properly. It appears that your O2 sensor system is borderline such that it will not set the fault code but not good enough to pass the test. If there is a wiring issue, a fault code will be set already. You may test it by disconnecting one sensor.
Catalytic convertor monitoring uses the signal from O2 sensors (all 4), and bad O2 sensor signals may explain why it is not set either.
You mentioned that you have Torque. If it is not a Torque Pro, please buy Torque Pro and log the following signals: engine rpm and all O2 sensor signals. Start logging 10 seconds before starting engine and stop two minutes after the secondary air pump stops. Here is how they should look like with new pre-cat O2 sensors. Post cat O2 sensors are less than 50K miles.

http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showpos...8&postcount=75

If you can't plot them, you can send me a CSV file.

Here is the EVAP system test criteria I wrote. There are more post about how I observed EVAP system monitoring in that thread.

http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showpos...0&postcount=28

Last edited by dslboomer; 12-10-2012 at 05:19 PM.
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Old 12-10-2012, 10:33 PM   #35
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Thanks for the reply. I have torque pro. I can log those sensors in the morning when the car is cold again.

As for the evap, I have done 20+ min drives, in the morning with proper fuel levels, and idled for the time required. I know there is an "every other time" requirement with this test. Does that mean I need to do two successful 20 min drives meeting all prerequisites in a row? I may not have ever done them consecutively.
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Old 12-11-2012, 12:20 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jessehell View Post
Thanks for the reply. I have torque pro. I can log those sensors in the morning when the car is cold again.

As for the evap, I have done 20+ min drives, in the morning with proper fuel levels, and idled for the time required. I know there is an "every other time" requirement with this test. Does that mean I need to do two successful 20 min drives meeting all prerequisites in a row? I may not have ever done them consecutively.
Look forward to seeing your data.
Does evap test need to meet two consecutive test requirement? That's is a good question, but I am not so certain. My guess is that they don't need to be consecutive. Don't take my word for it though because I don't know the actual BMW's logic. Please try to meet the requirement consecutively to disprove me.

In addition, you don't need to let it idle. Actually evap test is conducted after engine is turned off. Here is a quote from my old post.

"I also saw the EVAP system ready after arriving at work, and car turned off. I could hear a couple of clicking sound from the trunk area within probably 10 seconds of engine shut-off. I monitored the emission status with the Torque Pro, and I saw the status change. My bluetooth OBD scanner was still able to communicate to DME while engine was shut off. I guess that was what DME "follow up mode" we saw in the BMW manual. Try this while sitting in the car listening for the clicking noise with your scanner connected."
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Old 12-11-2012, 05:21 AM   #37
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I have been a bit silent on this as of late as I want not exactly sure where to direct anyone next.

There could still be a wiring problem that the DME cannot detect, but before we go there, I think what DSLBoomer mentioned is a good idea. Comparing to a known good car at this point is probably the most helpful thing you can do.

As for the Evap, I am not 100% sure, but this may not clear until all other stages clear?? I know Evap can be the hardest and last thing to clear at times.

I also think there are things that may still need to be checked and verified on the Evap system that do not get mentioned often. Charcoal canister, hoses associated with the charcoal canister, Evap solenoid,gas cap. I believe on some if not all cars there is an air/vacuum pump that does run after the car is shut down. Not knowing the full history on the car, hard to know if there was an accident, damage or for some reason a part of the Evap system was removed. All in all except for the gas cap being loose, not installed and the Evap solenoid, the Evap system is pretty trouble free, this is why there is little info out there on it??? I have never had any issues with Evap systems other than the Evap solenoids.

Maybe time to get on RealOEM and start looking at what Evap parts your car may have.

Also simple test for your problem O2 sensor is to possibly just unplug it and see where the Voltage goes, also you can possibly swap wiring sides, if the harnesses reach, just to see if the problem follows the harness, which I suspect it may.

I will post a few things up later that I was hesitant to post as they are WORSE case situations.
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Hidden OBC Menu - Check Voltage, Temps, Fuel Level - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=239619

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Old 12-11-2012, 05:32 AM   #38
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Not exactly your issue, but you may have a similar problem?? Not sure how these issue happened either??

http://www.e46fanatics.com/forum/sho...php?p=14119717

There was another thread I cannot seem to find where the DME pin was totally melted in half inside the DME. I think the person actually repaired the melted pin with a wire jumper and was able to get things working??

The question is why did/do these problems happen and what was done to resolve them.

Again, this may not be your issue, but may be work popping to the connectors and top of the DME for inspection??
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Hidden OBC Menu - Check Voltage, Temps, Fuel Level - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=239619

E46/E39 GM5 Door Lock Info - www.bmwgm5.com

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Old 12-11-2012, 10:25 PM   #39
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Here is my o2 sensor log from today


Last edited by jessehell; 12-11-2012 at 10:28 PM.
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Old 12-11-2012, 11:00 PM   #40
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Nice job to plot them out.
Now you can clearly see that O2-21 is good, but O2-11 is bad.
You need to replace the O2-11 (Bank 1, pre-cat sensor) for sure.
One odd thing is that post cat sensors are starting at 0 volt instead of starting around 0.4 volt. And they took almost 3 minutes to go alive. My bet is that rear sensors are going bad too.
Amazon seems be the best source (cheapest) for Bosch OEM-fit O2 sensors.

I will do following steps.
1. Replace O2-11 and see if it is the silver bullet
2. If that didn't fix, disconnect one of post-cat O2 connector and see if that sets codes for O2.
3. If codes are set with a disconnected post-cat O2 sensor, replace both post-cat O2 sensors.

For Evap test, drive with the gas cap removed and see if it sets the evap code.
If no code is set, then either evap test criteria are not met or your DME needs reprogramming.

Last edited by dslboomer; 12-11-2012 at 11:02 PM.
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