E46 BMW Social Directory E46 FAQ 3-Series Discussion Forums BMW Photo Gallery BMW 3-Series Technical Information E46 Fanatics - The Ultimate BMW Resource BMW Vendors General E46 Forum The Tire Rack's Tire Wheel Forum Forced Induction Forum The Off-Topic The E46 BMW Showroom For Sale, For Trade or Wanting to Buy

Welcome to the E46Fanatics forums. E46Fanatics is the premiere website for BMW 3 series owners around the world with interactive forums, a geographical enthusiast directory, photo galleries, and technical information for BMW enthusiasts.

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact contact us.

Go Back   E46Fanatics > Everything Else > The Off-Topic > Political Talk

Political Talk
You may discuss anything regarding politics in this forum ONLY. If you cannot respect others opinions, your access to this forum will be removed.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 12-13-2012, 09:26 AM   #61
NOVAbimmer
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: VA
Posts: 12,061
My Ride: 14 Impala FXST M796
I have a cousin who's a non-union worker for GM, she's doing just fine. In fact, she's doing fine enough that she went back to it after leaving for a while to pursue another career.
__________________
NOVAbimmer is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 10:07 AM   #62
phrozen06
NA V8
 
phrozen06's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: 39°27'33"N 77°58'04"W
Posts: 7,491
My Ride: E46, E92 M3, R32 VW
Send a message via Yahoo to phrozen06
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lair View Post


Nice. So you work for GM?
Quote:
Originally Posted by bimmerfan08 View Post
Maybe
Slushbox E46's have GM Transmissions. Right?
__________________

S65: 4.0 Liter, V8, 414 hp @8,300 rpm, 295 lb/ft @3900 rpm, 445 lb, DOHC, 12:1 C/R, crankshaft 44 lb, wet sump.
2 oil pumps,double vanos variable valve timing, EMS: MSS60, 8 electronically controlled individual throttle butterflies.
4 valves per cylinder, cracked trapezoidal connecting rods, brake energy regeneration. Ion-flow combustion monitoring.


Last edited by phrozen06; 12-13-2012 at 10:08 AM.
phrozen06 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 10:48 AM   #63
tock172
Beachtown Bill Collector
 
tock172's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: San Diego
Posts: 2,826
My Ride: '99 Techno Violet M3
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lair View Post
The UAW didn't suffocate Detroit. GM management and their bean counter-designed rolling piles of crap suffocated Detroit.

Nobody whined about unions when GM was netting $7K on each bloated, hideous, gas sucking SUV it produced. Now *suddenly* the unions are the problem. Give me a fvcking break.
Bullshit. In order to meet the ridiculous financial requirements of the unfunded pension liability, GM has to cut corners wherever possible. The end result is a terrible consumer product. I hate GM vehicles. UAW pretty much owns GM at this point.
__________________


1999 Techno Violet Metallic BMW M3
2005 Audi B6 S4 quattro 6MT
2004 BMW 330i
1986 BMW 535i

tock172 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 10:53 AM   #64
Lair
Modded ///Member
 
Lair's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Downtown
Posts: 320
My Ride: 330ciC
Quote:
Originally Posted by tock172 View Post
Bullshit. In order to meet the ridiculous financial requirements of the unfunded pension liability, GM has to cut corners wherever possible. The end result is a terrible consumer product. I hate GM vehicles. UAW pretty much owns GM at this point.
Bullshit. Management is to blame for every problem GM has. They designed the vehicles, built the vehicles, marketed the vehicles, and signed the union contracts.
__________________

Congratulations.
Lair is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 11:10 AM   #65
tock172
Beachtown Bill Collector
 
tock172's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: San Diego
Posts: 2,826
My Ride: '99 Techno Violet M3
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lair View Post
Bullshit. Management is to blame for every problem GM has. They designed the vehicles, built the vehicles, marketed the vehicles, and signed the union contracts.
They signed the union contracts because they had no choice. UAW has a chokehold on GM and the government is obviously on the side of UAW.
__________________


1999 Techno Violet Metallic BMW M3
2005 Audi B6 S4 quattro 6MT
2004 BMW 330i
1986 BMW 535i

tock172 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 11:14 AM   #66
Lair
Modded ///Member
 
Lair's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Downtown
Posts: 320
My Ride: 330ciC
Stop lying. They had a choice. They've always had a choice.

Why don't you point a finger at the tools that are running the company instead of the people who work for it?
__________________

Congratulations.
Lair is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 11:25 AM   #67
bimmerfan08
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Williamsburg VA
Posts: 4,887
My Ride: Phoenix Yellow M3
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lair View Post
Stop lying. They had a choice. They've always had a choice.

Why don't you point a finger at the tools that are running the company instead of the people who work for it?
That's your opinion. Why are they tools? Because they are not aligned with your morals? I thought morals were a bad thing. Boo-hoo
__________________

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xcelratr View Post
"They". Again with this idea that white people are a singular organism with a single will.

Individuals make choices and take actions. Sometimes their race informs their choices and actions, sometimes it does not.
bimmerfan08 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 11:28 AM   #68
Lair
Modded ///Member
 
Lair's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Downtown
Posts: 320
My Ride: 330ciC
They're tools because they can't make a profit because UNIONS!
__________________

Congratulations.
Lair is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 11:32 AM   #69
customisbetter
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: East Lansing
Posts: 255
My Ride: 02 325xi
I'm psyched about this right to work stuff. Now I get a pay raise since I won't have to pay dues to my awful and worthless union.
__________________
customisbetter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 12:51 PM   #70
Green_Shine
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: North
Posts: 373
My Ride: Back seat riding
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lair View Post
The UAW didn't suffocate Detroit. GM management and their bean counter-designed rolling piles of crap suffocated Detroit.

Nobody whined about unions when GM was netting $7K on each bloated, hideous, gas sucking SUV it produced. Now *suddenly* the unions are the problem. Give me a fvcking break.
No way did the unions unwillingness to budge on the average salary with benefits of 130k/year for line workers, 7 weeks paid vacation and full pay for retirees while sales declined to foreign automakers have anything to do with it. No way.

Unions who demand a grotesque amount of money over the fair market value for a position only leave two options - pass the cost to the consumer, which hurts sales. Or create an inferior product with limited options of production because a company's hands are tied paying over priced labor. Which hurt sales.

The union mindset of greed and hatred toward the very company which feeds it killed the union. UAW would rather have GM go under and lose 100% of a job forever instead of making salary concessions.
__________________
Green_Shine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 02:23 PM   #71
bimmerfan08
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Williamsburg VA
Posts: 4,887
My Ride: Phoenix Yellow M3
Quote:
Originally Posted by Green_Shine View Post
No way did the unions unwillingness to budge on the average salary with benefits of 130k/year for line workers, 7 weeks paid vacation and full pay for retirees while sales declined to foreign automakers have anything to do with it. No way.

Unions who demand a grotesque amount of money over the fair market value for a position only leave two options - pass the cost to the consumer, which hurts sales. Or create an inferior product with limited options of production because a company's hands are tied paying over priced labor. Which hurt sales.

The union mindset of greed and hatred toward the very company which feeds it killed the union. UAW would rather have GM go under and lose 100% of a job forever instead of making salary concessions.
Thank you again for shedding meaningful light. Hopefully Lair understands
__________________

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xcelratr View Post
"They". Again with this idea that white people are a singular organism with a single will.

Individuals make choices and take actions. Sometimes their race informs their choices and actions, sometimes it does not.
bimmerfan08 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 03:17 PM   #72
rdsesq
ouroboros autorotica
 
rdsesq's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Cali...the only state that matters
Posts: 1,452
My Ride: 2002 330i
Quote:
Originally Posted by Green_Shine View Post
No way did the unions unwillingness to budge on the average salary with benefits of 130k/year for line workers, 7 weeks paid vacation and full pay for retirees while sales declined to foreign automakers have anything to do with it. No way.

Unions who demand a grotesque amount of money over the fair market value for a position only leave two options - pass the cost to the consumer, which hurts sales. Or create an inferior product with limited options of production because a company's hands are tied paying over priced labor. Which hurt sales.

The union mindset of greed and hatred toward the very company which feeds it killed the union. UAW would rather have GM go under and lose 100% of a job forever instead of making salary concessions.
Let me ask you a question.
You get a home loan at 4.5% fixed over 30 years. 10 years into the loan, the bank comes to you and says "Hey, we really shouldn't have made that loan and we are not profitable anymore because making these type of loans. We want you to re-fi your house back to us at 8.75% so we can make a profit. How about it?"

What are you gonna tell the bank?
__________________
"The existence of life is a highly overrated phenomenon."
-- Dr Manhattan

quis custodiet ipsos custodes
rdsesq is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 03:50 PM   #73
Green_Shine
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: North
Posts: 373
My Ride: Back seat riding
Quote:
Originally Posted by bimmerfan08 View Post
Thank you again for shedding meaningful light. Hopefully Lair understands
Thanks. My guess is he refuses to understand. Ignorance is bliss.


Quote:
Originally Posted by rdsesq View Post
Let me ask you a question.
You get a home loan at 4.5% fixed over 30 years. 10 years into the loan, the bank comes to you and says "Hey, we really shouldn't have made that loan and we are not profitable anymore because making these type of loans. We want you to re-fi your house back to us at 8.75% so we can make a profit. How about it?"

What are you gonna tell the bank?
I would answer "I do not have an ARM". I don't understand how that question is relevant to short term, organized labor contracts.
__________________
Green_Shine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 03:58 PM   #74
bimmerfan08
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Williamsburg VA
Posts: 4,887
My Ride: Phoenix Yellow M3
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdsesq View Post
Let me ask you a question.
You get a home loan at 4.5% fixed over 30 years. 10 years into the loan, the bank comes to you and says "Hey, we really shouldn't have made that loan and we are not profitable anymore because making these type of loans. We want you to re-fi your house back to us at 8.75% so we can make a profit. How about it?"

What are you gonna tell the bank?
Loan =/= salary contract
__________________

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xcelratr View Post
"They". Again with this idea that white people are a singular organism with a single will.

Individuals make choices and take actions. Sometimes their race informs their choices and actions, sometimes it does not.

Last edited by bimmerfan08; 12-13-2012 at 03:58 PM.
bimmerfan08 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 04:08 PM   #75
casino is no lie
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: CDT
Posts: 76
My Ride: M54B30
Quote:
Originally Posted by bimmerfan08 View Post
Loan =/= salary contract
Legally binding contract = legally binding contract
__________________
casino is no lie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 04:15 PM   #76
Lair
Modded ///Member
 
Lair's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Downtown
Posts: 320
My Ride: 330ciC
Quote:
Originally Posted by Green_Shine View Post
I don't understand
Yes, we know.
__________________

Congratulations.
Lair is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 04:44 PM   #77
bimmerfan08
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Williamsburg VA
Posts: 4,887
My Ride: Phoenix Yellow M3
Quote:
Originally Posted by casino is no lie View Post
Legally binding contract = legally binding contract
I get your point.

But still vast differences between the two. A more appropriate example would be a contract between the federal government and a contractor.
__________________

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xcelratr View Post
"They". Again with this idea that white people are a singular organism with a single will.

Individuals make choices and take actions. Sometimes their race informs their choices and actions, sometimes it does not.
bimmerfan08 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 05:27 PM   #78
rdsesq
ouroboros autorotica
 
rdsesq's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Cali...the only state that matters
Posts: 1,452
My Ride: 2002 330i
Quote:
Originally Posted by casino is no lie View Post
Legally binding contract = legally binding contract
Exactly. Why should somebody invalidate a contract if it is not in their interest to do so. (take a loss in benefits, wages, etc...)

Some people are talking like the unions should do mgmt a "favor" and re-do the legally binding contract, just because the mgmt can't be profitable under that contract. That is not labor's issue nor is it labor's fault.

Thinking a union should re-do their contract to help mgmt be profitable is as silly as asking somebody to re-fi their house at a higher rate so the bank can be more profitable. "Hey, corporation....you entered into a legally binding contract. Now it sucks to be you....well tough $h!t." Companies will lay people off at the drop of a hat to save a penny on earnings the next qtr and think nothing of it. Then they want labor to "play nice" and help them out and think of the community. Bleep that.
__________________
"The existence of life is a highly overrated phenomenon."
-- Dr Manhattan

quis custodiet ipsos custodes
rdsesq is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 05:54 PM   #79
MDydinanM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: East Coast
Posts: 751
My Ride: is a ///M
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdsesq View Post
Exactly. Why should somebody invalidate a contract if it is not in their interest to do so. (take a loss in benefits, wages, etc...)

Some people are talking like the unions should do mgmt a "favor" and re-do the legally binding contract, just because the mgmt can't be profitable under that contract. That is not labor's issue nor is it labor's fault.

Thinking a union should re-do their contract to help mgmt be profitable is as silly as asking somebody to re-fi their house at a higher rate so the bank can be more profitable. "Hey, corporation....you entered into a legally binding contract. Now it sucks to be you....well tough $h!t." Companies will lay people off at the drop of a hat to save a penny on earnings the next qtr and think nothing of it. Then they want labor to "play nice" and help them out and think of the community. Bleep that.
Good points in this post.
__________________
Retired: 06 e46 BMW ///M3 Silver Grey SMG (sold)

Current: 08 e60 BMW DINAN ///M5 Interlagos Blue SMG
DINAN 3.91 Differential, Stage 2 Suspension, Free-flow exhaust, Stage III Software, Front strut braces,
High Flow Air mass meters and intakes, 13% Underdrive pulley, RPI Scoops. 12.5mm TMS Spacers
MDydinanM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 06:05 PM   #80
bimmerfan08
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Williamsburg VA
Posts: 4,887
My Ride: Phoenix Yellow M3
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdsesq View Post
Exactly. Why should somebody invalidate a contract if it is not in their interest to do so. (take a loss in benefits, wages, etc...)

Some people are talking like the unions should do mgmt a "favor" and re-do the legally binding contract, just because the mgmt can't be profitable under that contract. That is not labor's issue nor is it labor's fault.

Thinking a union should re-do their contract to help mgmt be profitable is as silly as asking somebody to re-fi their house at a higher rate so the bank can be more profitable. "Hey, corporation....you entered into a legally binding contract. Now it sucks to be you....well tough $h!t." Companies will lay people off at the drop of a hat to save a penny on earnings the next qtr and think nothing of it. Then they want labor to "play nice" and help them out and think of the community. Bleep that.
Thinking like Lair now...

Unions should have some consideration and not be greedy grubbing hustlers.
__________________

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xcelratr View Post
"They". Again with this idea that white people are a singular organism with a single will.

Individuals make choices and take actions. Sometimes their race informs their choices and actions, sometimes it does not.
bimmerfan08 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Censor is ON





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:42 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
(c) 1999 - 2011 performanceIX Inc - privacy policy - terms of use