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Forced Induction Forum Sponsored by Active Autowerke
Discuss supercharging, turbocharging and even nitrous and water injection here.
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Old 06-01-2009, 07:05 PM   #141
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Oh i done all the motor build stuff to a T I was looking at the turbo install project and how they did the install. who car is that
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Old 06-01-2009, 07:14 PM   #142
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Thats Julio's car. Edit - aka bluejeansonfire
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Old 06-01-2009, 07:31 PM   #143
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bluejeansonfire View Post
Well, you can PM him, he posted in this thread... Activ3....
...are you speaking of horizontal porting?
Wait a minute, I meet him in person a few years ago as i was down in orlando and he came by to see the car and I checked out his. Didn't he use to have a supercharger
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Old 06-01-2009, 07:45 PM   #144
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Wait a minute, I meet him in person a few years ago as i was down in orlando and he came by to see the car and I checked out his. Didn't he use to have a supercharger
Yeah. he has a supercharger... a c38, he didn't get rid of it.

Ritos, your posts are hard to read, edit if you must.
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Old 06-01-2009, 07:55 PM   #145
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Julio is bluejeansonfire, has a black 330 coupe, David is Activ3, has a 328 sedan. They both post on E46nonM.

Julio has the technique tuning turbo, David has an Active C38.
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Old 06-01-2009, 08:35 PM   #146
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Ok so it is Julio that i need to chat with. I meet David before in Orlando.
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Old 07-26-2009, 05:16 PM   #147
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Being that this thread is basicly about what the M54 engine can handle... Well, I'm kinda curious but what allows the E46 M3 to have a higher RPM range compared to even the highest E46 non M, the ZHP that is at 6,800rpm vs the M3 that is at 8,000rpm?
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Old 07-26-2009, 07:46 PM   #148
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Being that this thread is basicly about what the M54 engine can handle... Well, I'm kinda curious but what allows the E46 M3 to have a higher RPM range compared to even the highest E46 non M, the ZHP that is at 6,800rpm vs the M3 that is at 8,000rpm?
There are a number of weak points to the M54 in terms of rev range.

The biggest immediate factor is valvetrain. You can upgrade the M54 stuff to solid lifters, better valve springs, better retainers, and eliminate concerns of valve float, but you'll then encounter the next worrisome part, which is the intense rod angle that the M54 runs. I don't know how the S54/M54 rod angles compare, but I do know S54 already has awesome retainers, and a solid lifter setup with really sweet provisions for valve adjustments, something the M54 was never designed for.

Unless you spend over 8k on engine work you really aren't going to see the ability to gain anything from reving higher on the M54.

M54 discussed here is all 3.0L engines. The 2.2 or 2.5L could be rev'd a lot higher without the rod angle issue, but the displacement sacrifice would make it a wash essentially.
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Old 07-26-2009, 08:14 PM   #149
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rooz View Post
Being that this thread is basicly about what the M54 engine can handle... Well, I'm kinda curious but what allows the E46 M3 to have a higher RPM range compared to even the highest E46 non M, the ZHP that is at 6,800rpm vs the M3 that is at 8,000rpm?
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There are a number of weak points to the M54 in terms of rev range.

The biggest immediate factor is valvetrain. You can upgrade the M54 stuff to solid lifters, better valve springs, better retainers, and eliminate concerns of valve float, but you'll then encounter the next worrisome part, which is the intense rod angle that the M54 runs. I don't know how the S54/M54 rod angles compare, but I do know S54 already has awesome retainers, and a solid lifter setup with really sweet provisions for valve adjustments, something the M54 was never designed for.

Unless you spend over 8k on engine work you really aren't going to see the ability to gain anything from reving higher on the M54.

M54 discussed here is all 3.0L engines. The 2.2 or 2.5L could be rev'd a lot higher without the rod angle issue, but the displacement sacrifice would make it a wash essentially.
You put this together well. But there are more obstacles still in making the m54 rev that high. The oiling system is based on the m50, which is restrictive as it builds with rpm, I know the piston oil squirters can't deal with the pressures, but that's just a design characteristic of hydraulic lifters. This engine was designed as a hydraulic liftered motor. The euroS50-based S54 is designed to be a solid liftered motor. To achieve the higher revs, BMW raised the block's deck to accommodate a taller rod to rev out with a better rod angle, despite the yet longer stroke. Not to say that pistons speed is low. To get an idea on how much BMW invests into the S54 vs the M54, do a price check on factory valves. You'll never find a valve for the M54 that costs more than what BMW charges for the S54. I paid a third the price of exhaust valves for an S54, for a full set of inconel and stainless valves. The only restriction of the M52 based frankensteins is their rev limit. I love how they go from s52 blocks to m52 blocks to get strength on cylinder walls, but they ditch the m52's comparatively trouble free crank for the 89.6mm crank that has knocked more oil pumps apart than I'll ever know. And according to an engine builder in South Florida I spoke with recently, after 7,200 rpm, the oil pump is coming apart, even the VAC upgrade I have, he has shredded after 7,200... The trick is: stay under 7,200. I'm chillin' hard with a built engine I plan to rev a good bit under that.

But with turbo boost, the torque comes on so early, it so makes up for the seemingly anemic rev range.
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Old 07-27-2009, 08:22 AM   #150
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So in essence in order to be "safer" when you are in the high RPM's with the 330 engine you should go with "solid lifters, better valve springs and, better retainers"?
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Old 07-27-2009, 08:57 AM   #151
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So in essence in order to be "safer" when you are in the high RPM's with the 330 engine you should go with "solid lifters, better valve springs and, better retainers"?
well, i think you're safe to 7k with what you have, and there isn't much to be had beyond that. Especially considering all the other high-revving weaknesses of the m54b30.

But to rev safely beyond that, typically hydraulic lifters are out of their operating range. The rest of the valvetrain is matched appropriately to the car's stock redline. You dont want valvesprings too stiff, that's just creating more load for your chains to turn, it's more wear on the cams. The retainers are matched to the valvespring. some newer engines are really pushing the use of hydraulic lifters for high revving applications. The 350z goes to 7,500 stock. That's really, really high for hydraulic lifters. I'm not sure what they did with those lifters, but I'm fairly certain that f you try to do that with your m54, it would probably leave a valve open.
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Old 07-27-2009, 04:43 PM   #152
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With a small displacement engine like the M54, there are 3 ways to make more power: increase RPMs, increase cylinder pressure, or both. Most chose to increase cylinder pressure by way of supercharging, turbocharging, or nitrous injection.

There are a couple of M54 builds that have the potential to increase RPMs, but for various reasons the owners have not pursued it.

I have so few hours on my M54 race engine that I would not take what I'm doing as an example of what is possible. I see high RPMs for fractions of a second then I shift....there is very little time spent in the "problem zone". That said, I have a very unique crank damper that I think is a big part of the solution to the RPM problems. Only time will tell if it helps.

What ever approach an enthusiast decides to take, it will take money, and boatloads of it at that, to make the M54 a 400+rwhp monster.
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Old 04-15-2012, 03:06 PM   #153
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It was mentioned earlier that the M54 engine was designed to bee the hydraulic lifter motor. I have been wanting to convert to a solid lifter setup and have been researching it.
Could one lower the tension on the oil pump relief spring when running a solid lifter setup to lower the peak pressure and take some load off the pump as RPM increases?
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Old 04-16-2012, 06:55 AM   #154
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It was mentioned earlier that the M54 engine was designed to bee the hydraulic lifter motor. I have been wanting to convert to a solid lifter setup and have been researching it.
Could one lower the tension on the oil pump relief spring when running a solid lifter setup to lower the peak pressure and take some load off the pump as RPM increases?
The spring pressure is controlling how much oil is dumped back into the pan instead of circulated through the block. The pump still is going to do the same amount of work....pumping the same volume of oil.

The other thing that is going to happen is that while you get a little bit less flow to the top end of the engine, you'll get a little bit less flow to the bottom end of the engine. (Which I realize is your point)

If you are NEEDING to run solid lifters, it's because you've got a cam setup for a higher RPM power band. The engine is going to need more oil with higher RPMs, not less.

Hydraulic lifters don't have oil flowing through them, it's a dead-head system that simply keeps oil inside the lifter bucket. Maybe I should cut one of these in half just to show how little oil we are talking about....

Also, anyone I've seen running solid lifters on an M52/S52/M54 runs a dry sump.
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Old 04-17-2012, 03:47 PM   #155
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ALl this talk of how the weak point of our engines is the aluminum block, yet no one address it! I did, I had mine cryo treated and it has handled well over 450 rwhp and rwtq.
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Old 12-19-2012, 04:17 PM   #156
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ALl this talk of how the weak point of our engines is the aluminum block, yet no one address it! I did, I had mine cryo treated and it has handled well over 450 rwhp and rwtq.
Where and how much did that cost you?
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Old 12-19-2012, 07:39 PM   #157
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Where and how much did that cost you?
The place I go to and local to me:
http://www.nitrofreeze.com/services/...fleet/engines/
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Old 12-20-2012, 02:51 PM   #158
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Thanks I'm definitely getting this done
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