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Gun Talk
Are you a gun fanatic as well? If so, you'll want to talk to other owners about what you own in this forum.

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Old 01-25-2013, 03:37 PM   #2681
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It definatly could be forever. Try calling direct,be honest,cool and calm and I'm sure they are more than happy to work with you.

sent from my ATARI sc1224
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Old 01-25-2013, 04:05 PM   #2682
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What's a good Carbine intro DVD? Magpul? (Learned a lot from the Dynamic Handgun DVD)

I'm taking a Rifle course in March, but would like to better familiarize myself before then.
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Old 01-25-2013, 05:35 PM   #2683
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There are numerous videos, but the best ones by far are those put out by Panteao Productions. Look for videos with Pat Rogers, Travis Haley and Paul Howe.
http://www.panteaoproductions.com/dvds

Stuff from them will be by far the best you can get for information prior to going to any training course. I would put Pat Rogers at the best, but Paul Howe and Travis Haley both are excellent. The issue is that if you are going to start absorbing information, you want it to be the best information possible, and it needs to be as generally/universally applicable as possible. By this I mean that you should be able to take the skills from the video and be able to use them to some effect in an actual course without having significant conflict. Magpul videos have some proprietary techniques that have very little carry-over, but a lot of the general tactics are pretty universal. They're decent videos, but not the best anymore. There will always be conflict between training systems, but if it's minor, it's not an issue. However, sometimes there are major conflicts and there is very little carry-over, so if you learn a system and then take a completely different one, you will be at a disadvantage because now you have to learn a whole new system while trying to disregard a system you've already started to inculcate.

As a case in point, you can take training from Trident Concepts with Jeff Gonzalez, and then go to an EAG Tactical course and be "up to speed". In contrast, if you take an ICE/Combat Focus Training course with Rob Pincus, you will be well behind the curve at a Trident Concepts "Level 2" course.

Point being, be aware of the training you are taking, who is teaching it, what they teach, and consider your training decisions accordingly. The last thing you want is to develop training scars before you ever go to actual training. OR, the last thing you want to do is to learn decent tactics and then go somewhere that will disregard skills and cause "scars".

Where are you planning to train?
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Old 01-25-2013, 08:11 PM   #2684
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You make a pretty good point about conflicting instructions/techniques. I took a pistol course recently (after training with the Magpul DVDs for about a year) and there were a few such instances where techniques varied.

Being open minded, plus not wanting to be that jackass in class who does sh!t his own way, I tried to adapt. The resulting cognitive dissonance made me look like a retard when running certain drills, plus it slowed me down (took me about half the class to unlearn). FWIW, after the class I decided to keep a few of Magpul methods, because it made more sense to me (or maybe I'm just biased due to familiarity)

I checked out previews for all three instructors above and will probably decide on one soon, my only question is whether Travis is still teaching the proprietary techniques from the Magpul dvds? (since he has his own outfit now)....in which case I will skip his course.

I'm planning to train with a guy here locally (ex SF) who has some pretty good reviews (will eventually move up to the National training schools once I get up to speed)
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Old 01-25-2013, 08:58 PM   #2685
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Everything you learn is a tool for your tool belt. You can use what you like, so long as you know how to use it correctly, make it work for you, and you know WHY you are using it. My tactics used to be 100% Magpul, but I then did other training and it took a while to ditch the Magpul training scars. Particularly the "Magpul Flick" magazine change. Interestingly enough, Steve Fisher does not agree with everything in that curriculum, but he's required to teach it by Magpul.
I am a pretty big EAG Tactical zealot as many will attest to, and I went to a Trident Concept course this past fall believing that I may not run things the way he wants. However, I knew that it was my responsibility to give it a try for the duration of the course, and to do otherwise was not only not fair to myself, but to Jeff Gonzalez for putting in the time to train me. Afterwards, I am now about 90% EAG and 10% TRICON in my tactics. There was a lot of carry-over, but some stuff was different and EAG had the edge in many things, but a couple things from TRICON really did make more sense. It's all about adopting what you need and storing away what does not work for you. I'm a perpetual student, so this will continue to evolve and adjust.
I flushed out everything I learned in the Army, as it's basically now worthless for my needs.

Travis took some stuff with him to Haley Strategic, but he left a bunch behind as well. Part of his reason for leaving was because he couldn't do what he wanted to with Magpul.
Magpul videos do have a wealth of information though. I have intention to train with both Haley Strategic and Costa Ludus in the future. I may do an HSP Handun course and Rifle course out in Michigan this spring if I can swing it, and maybe next year do a Costa Ludus 7.62 Heavy SA course. A training group run by a cop buddy of mine is looking at booking a Costa Ludus 7.62 Heavy SA course next year up here in MN. They each offer something different.

If you have the Magpul stuff, it might be better to go with something completely different like Pat Rogers or Paul Howe.
I will say that if you get the Pat Rogers video, you WILL laugh your ass off.
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Old 01-27-2013, 06:51 PM   #2686
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Roger that
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Old 01-28-2013, 04:43 PM   #2687
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i know people generally dislike bushmaster, but for just range/target work, are they really that bad?
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Old 01-28-2013, 04:48 PM   #2688
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i know people generally dislike bushmaster, but for just range/target work, are they really that bad?
for the average shooter, no they really arent. my first rifle was a bushmaster and it hasnt had a hiccup so far doing drills or taking it to the range and blasting away. however if you were to take a class or want to take your skills to the next level i would reccomend getting a better, more reliable rifle
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Old 01-28-2013, 10:01 PM   #2689
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for the average shooter, no they really arent. my first rifle was a bushmaster and it hasnt had a hiccup so far doing drills or taking it to the range and blasting away. however if you were to take a class or want to take your skills to the next level i would reccomend getting a better, more reliable rifle
For the price difference, I couldn't justify buying a Bushmaster. A Colt was only $150 more...
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Old 02-04-2013, 10:29 PM   #2690
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I bought (2) 30-round mags from a guy at work about a month ago... He had sold his AR years ago, had no use for them. They were a little rough (scratches - no dents, lips were fine) -- Comes up to me today, "You'll never guess what I found & bought today...." -- He just happened to walk into a local "big box" outdoors store. They had a Bushmaster on the shelf all decked out in MagPul gear. He paid $2100 there on the spot for it.... no joke... could have sold it for $4,500 before he even got out the door of the store. Guy offered him $3,000 cash - counted it out.... My co-worker declined. This guy turned to his buddy that was with him, says "you got cash on you?" - Pulled out $1500....

My co-worker still has the gun....but also has the guy's card... lol

Regardless, He doesn't want his mags back....
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Old 02-04-2013, 10:34 PM   #2691
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Bushmasters are now selling north of 2? Man the craze hasn't died down at all.
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Old 02-04-2013, 10:38 PM   #2692
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Bushmasters are now selling north of 2? Man the craze hasn't died down at all.
It was from this store's "custom shop" -- it was brand new, but decked out in MagPul gear I guess. I cannot remember if he said it HAD optics, or if it was just optics ready. It was a busy day.....
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Old 02-04-2013, 10:52 PM   #2693
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I'd consider selling the gun for that at that point. Damn.
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Old 02-05-2013, 01:05 AM   #2694
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Consider? I would definitely have taken $4500. Tell the guy I've got a colt and I'll cut $500 off the deal so they can outfit it with Magpul stuff or whatever. $4000 for my colt and I'll even cover shipping lmao (not the m16 obviously lol)
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Old 02-05-2013, 07:46 AM   #2695
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Tampa guys, Shooters world has PMAGS for $30. Also, they have a Grand Opening this Friday where they are supposed to have Shields and more AR parts too. Thinking of grabbing a shield for the lady.
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Old 02-05-2013, 07:49 AM   #2696
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Tampa guys, Shooters world has PMAGS for $30. Also, they have a Grand Opening this Friday where they are supposed to have Shields and more AR parts too. Thinking of grabbing a shield for the lady.
Can I order them from them over the phone?
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Old 02-05-2013, 08:16 AM   #2697
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I'm not sure I could have walked away from that deal. $4k for my Colt??
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Old 02-05-2013, 09:22 AM   #2698
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I'd consider selling the gun for that at that point. Damn.
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Consider? I would definitely have taken $4500. Tell the guy I've got a colt and I'll cut $500 off the deal so they can outfit it with Magpul stuff or whatever. $4000 for my colt and I'll even cover shipping lmao (not the m16 obviously lol)
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I'm not sure I could have walked away from that deal. $4k for my Colt??
It'd be a tough one...

The only reason I'd have a hard time actually selling it, is that I'm close with my gun dealer. I'd be afraid of pissing him off after he saved a Colt for me...

In this guy's situation - buying retail over the counter at a big box retailer - I'd have sold for $4,500..... but tried for an even $5k lol
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Old 02-05-2013, 12:26 PM   #2699
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Can I order them from them over the phone?
this just in... THey will only sell one per customer...
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Old 02-05-2013, 10:31 PM   #2700
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this just in... THey will only sell one per customer...
If you can buy one for me and ship I can PayPal you
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