E46 BMW Social Directory E46 FAQ 3-Series Discussion Forums BMW Photo Gallery BMW 3-Series Technical Information E46 Fanatics - The Ultimate BMW Resource BMW Vendors General E46 Forum The Tire Rack's Tire Wheel Forum Forced Induction Forum The Off-Topic The E46 BMW Showroom For Sale, For Trade or Wanting to Buy

Welcome to the E46Fanatics forums. E46Fanatics is the premiere website for BMW 3 series owners around the world with interactive forums, a geographical enthusiast directory, photo galleries, and technical information for BMW enthusiasts.

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact contact us.

Go Back   E46Fanatics > Tuning & Tech > Suspension & Braking Forum by BimmerWorld

Suspension & Braking Forum by BimmerWorld
Have some questions about suspension or brake setups for your E46 BMW? Get all your answers here!
Sponsored by BimmerWorld

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rating: Thread Rating: 19 votes, 3.74 average. Display Modes
Old 09-19-2013, 09:45 AM   #21
zander271
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 1,366
My Ride: 6spd ZHP/5sp XI
So, you wanna service the rear trailing arm? Definitive Trailing Arm Guide

Mango loving the thread!


Sent from BimmerApp mobile app
zander271 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2013, 09:47 AM   #22
Mango
A full five stars, son
 
Mango's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Southern California
Posts: 22,998
My Ride: M54B30
Quote:
Originally Posted by zander271 View Post
Mango loving the thread!


Sent from BimmerApp mobile app
THANKS BOSS!!
__________________
A lifetime free of problems if you follow my guides
Cooling | Maintenance | Suspension | Vacuum | Supreme Reliability | Details

OVER A MILLION VIEWS
Mango is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2013, 09:48 AM   #23
Zell
Registered User
 
Zell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: wow such city
Posts: 5,760
My Ride: Has no throttle
Quote:
Originally Posted by sunsetcoast View Post
+1. For example, what is the reason to choose the balljoint type bushing from the M3 vs the standard one?
M3 one is going to be beefier and more performance-oriented. To me, that translates into a harder ride, but better performance in turns.

It all depends what you're looking for. If you like the stock E46 ride quality, you'll wanna stay with Lemforder.

How much of a ride difference you'll actually notice is entirely subjective to how picky you are about stuff.
__________________

Last edited by Zell; 09-19-2013 at 09:49 AM.
Zell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2013, 09:51 AM   #24
Mango
A full five stars, son
 
Mango's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Southern California
Posts: 22,998
My Ride: M54B30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zell View Post
M3 one is going to be beefier and more performance-oriented. To me, that translates into a harder ride, but better performance in turns.

It all depends what you're looking for. If you like the stock E46 ride quality, you'll wanna stay with Lemforder.

How much of a ride difference you'll actually notice is entirely subjective to how picky you are about stuff.
yup I thought that was pretty obvious given all the discussions we have here.

non-M.....M3....non-M.... M3... rubber.....metal.....rubber....metal.
__________________
A lifetime free of problems if you follow my guides
Cooling | Maintenance | Suspension | Vacuum | Supreme Reliability | Details

OVER A MILLION VIEWS
Mango is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2013, 10:36 AM   #25
RudyT
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Cincinnati
Posts: 44
My Ride: 2001 330i
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brad W View Post
I've seen a variety of options for the RTAB tool, but even to buy it isn't too big a hit on the wallet. That other bushing set is a bit steep.

What other fancy tools are needed just to get to the point of using that bushing tool set?
For removal, you can rent these two tools from autozone:
OEM/Ball joint/U-Joint press set with 4WD service set
http://www.autozone.com/autozone/acc...questid=119534
OEM/Ball joint adapter set
http://www.autozone.com/autozone/acc...questid=119830


Use the C Clamp and end cap, find the correct sized end, and then use a breaker bar to start pushing the bushing out. Keep going until everything falls out.


Hope that helps!

EDIT: Resized and updated links.

Last edited by RudyT; 09-19-2013 at 10:47 AM.
RudyT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2013, 10:38 AM   #26
jfoj
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Fairfax, VA USA
Posts: 11,064
My Ride: '06 330CiC, '03 M5
RudyT - RESIZE PLZ!

I see you are in process. Thanks
__________________
Solve your misfires, lean codes, rough idle - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=897616

Fuel pump failures - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=929501

Temp Info - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=964491

Hidden OBC Menu - Check Voltage, Temps, Fuel Level - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=239619

E46/E39 GM5 Door Lock Info - www.bmwgm5.com

Lower hose fan switch O-ring - BMW #13621743299

Last edited by jfoj; 09-19-2013 at 10:38 AM.
jfoj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2013, 10:45 AM   #27
Mango
A full five stars, son
 
Mango's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Southern California
Posts: 22,998
My Ride: M54B30
I hope that Autozone tool setup takes into account the "ears" on the new RTABs. otherwise you'll destroy the bushing if you used a half-assed tool. It also appears that the plate used in the above photos is cocked in the photos. This means its going into the trailing arm crooked which increases the likelihood of pressing the bushing in crooked. that will destroy it. be careful with such tools. personally i'd just use the MIS tool. lots of people may rent it to you
__________________
A lifetime free of problems if you follow my guides
Cooling | Maintenance | Suspension | Vacuum | Supreme Reliability | Details

OVER A MILLION VIEWS
Mango is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2013, 10:47 AM   #28
RudyT
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Cincinnati
Posts: 44
My Ride: 2001 330i
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mango View Post
I hope that Autozone tool setup takes into account the "ears" on the new RTABs. otherwise you'll destroy the bushing if you used a half-assed tool. It also appears that the plate used in the above photos is cocked in the photos. This means its going into the trailing arm crooked which increases the likelihood of pressing the bushing in crooked. that will destroy it. be careful with such tools. personally i'd just use the MIS tool. lots of people may rent it to you
Should have mentioned that this was used for removal only. I used Powerflex bushings, so those were hand-pushed in
RudyT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2013, 10:49 AM   #29
Mango
A full five stars, son
 
Mango's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Southern California
Posts: 22,998
My Ride: M54B30
Quote:
Originally Posted by RudyT View Post
Should have mentioned that this was used for removal only. I used Powerflex bushings, so those were hand-pushed in
Yeah that's the thing. Also not sure I'd trust something pressed in with hand pressure that's supposed to be pressed.
__________________
A lifetime free of problems if you follow my guides
Cooling | Maintenance | Suspension | Vacuum | Supreme Reliability | Details

OVER A MILLION VIEWS
Mango is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2013, 10:51 AM   #30
RudyT
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Cincinnati
Posts: 44
My Ride: 2001 330i
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mango View Post
Yeah that's the thing. Also not sure I'd trust something pressed in with hand pressure that's supposed to be pressed.
The Poly's come as a two piece, just coat with the provided copper-based lube, and snap in both sides. Then off for an alignment
http://www.bimmerzone.com/BMW_Perfor...-3608-E46.html
RudyT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2013, 10:58 AM   #31
Mango
A full five stars, son
 
Mango's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Southern California
Posts: 22,998
My Ride: M54B30
Quote:
Originally Posted by RudyT View Post
The Poly's come as a two piece, just coat with the provided copper-based lube, and snap in both sides. Then off for an alignment
http://www.bimmerzone.com/BMW_Perfor...-3608-E46.html
I'm well aware of what they "come with" and how they look.
__________________
A lifetime free of problems if you follow my guides
Cooling | Maintenance | Suspension | Vacuum | Supreme Reliability | Details

OVER A MILLION VIEWS
Mango is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2013, 12:52 PM   #32
Kubica
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Boston
Posts: 4,421
My Ride: 2003 325xi
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mango View Post
If your trailing arm bushing (lower) is in good condition, you can get by with the M3 balljoint upgrade without an alignment.
No that's incorrect.

Camber will be off if you replace the lower bushing with a ball joint.
Kubica is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2013, 12:53 PM   #33
Zell
Registered User
 
Zell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: wow such city
Posts: 5,760
My Ride: Has no throttle
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kubica View Post
I disagree.
I don't know how you can disagree with that, it saves a lot of time looking this stuff up on your own. Just bookmark a thread with all the info and you're done, no more googling. Glad someone did it for me.
__________________
Zell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2013, 12:59 PM   #34
cposk
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Maryland
Posts: 473
My Ride: 08' E90 M3
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kubica View Post
No that's incorrect.

Camber will be off if you replace the lower bushing with a ball joint.
Shouldn't be, there are clear markings on the eccentric bolt/washer. Like Mango said, the bushing needs to be in good condition though. If its shot, then your camber was probably off (and variable) anyway.

ON A SIDE NOTE - I just hit an E46F milestone, being mentioned in a MANGO informative post.
__________________
Uploaded from the Photobucket iPhone App

Last edited by cposk; 09-19-2013 at 01:00 PM.
cposk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2013, 01:03 PM   #35
Mango
A full five stars, son
 
Mango's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Southern California
Posts: 22,998
My Ride: M54B30
Quote:
Originally Posted by cposk View Post
Shouldn't be, there are clear markings on the eccentric bolt/washer. Like Mango said, the bushing needs to be in good condition though. If its shot, then your camber was probably off (and variable) anyway.

ON A SIDE NOTE - I just hit an E46F milestone, being mentioned in a MANGO informative post.
Absolutely correct. If the center-line of the bushing/balljoint is good (good condition) then there will be little to no meaningful difference in bolt location and thus alignment won't be off.

If you're really savvy and knowledgeable, you actually rarely need to align the rear. I've verified time after time again that my alignment is spot on even after replacing stuff. But for all intents and purpose, an alignment is always recommended.

Note I say recommended and not necessary.

Edit:

And yes credit is given where its due. The idea to replace the bushing with balljoint was all you, my friend. Without you, I would not have known. I just couldn't use your home made tool idea.
__________________
A lifetime free of problems if you follow my guides
Cooling | Maintenance | Suspension | Vacuum | Supreme Reliability | Details

OVER A MILLION VIEWS

Last edited by Mango; 09-19-2013 at 01:04 PM.
Mango is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2013, 01:19 PM   #36
sunsetcoast
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: SW Michigan
Posts: 802
My Ride: '99 323i & '00 323iT
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zell View Post
M3 one is going to be beefier and more performance-oriented. To me, that translates into a harder ride, but better performance in turns.

It all depends what you're looking for. If you like the stock E46 ride quality, you'll wanna stay with Lemforder.
Thx, Zell.

I obviously have a lot to lean about rear suspension, but...

How do you define "better performance in turns"?
sunsetcoast is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2013, 01:21 PM   #37
Mango
A full five stars, son
 
Mango's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Southern California
Posts: 22,998
My Ride: M54B30
Quote:
Originally Posted by sunsetcoast View Post
Thx, Zell.

I obviously have a lot to lean about rear suspension, but...

How do you define "better performance in turns"?
More control and feedback at the expense of increased noise and vibration. It also is more expensive. Lots of reasons the non-M did not come that way from the factory. Simply doesn't fit the model.
__________________
A lifetime free of problems if you follow my guides
Cooling | Maintenance | Suspension | Vacuum | Supreme Reliability | Details

OVER A MILLION VIEWS
Mango is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2013, 01:24 PM   #38
Zell
Registered User
 
Zell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: wow such city
Posts: 5,760
My Ride: Has no throttle
Quote:
Originally Posted by sunsetcoast View Post
Thx, Zell.

I obviously have a lot to lean about rear suspension, but...

How do you define "better performance in turns"?
Generally "better performance" will equate to grippier in turns and more direct feedback from the road (e.g. you can feel exactly what the car is doing better and it isn't damped out as much), but there are also other factors depending upon the part you replace. In this case, there are a few different ways it contributes to better performance.

Here's a good read on what the RTABs do.

http://www.rogueengineering.com/bmw/RTAB.html
__________________

Last edited by Zell; 09-19-2013 at 01:25 PM.
Zell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2013, 02:49 PM   #39
dmax
Registered User
 
dmax's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: NJ
Posts: 22,855
My Ride: '99 328i 1.04646 mu
I should probably do mine, huh?

Nice thread, Mang!
__________________


Performing at the Comedy Cove--595 Morris Ave. Springfield NJ reservations 973 376-3840

A recent set Skip to 1:30
dmax is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2013, 02:56 PM   #40
cposk
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Maryland
Posts: 473
My Ride: 08' E90 M3
You will not notice any NVH with the balljoints unless you are a hypersensitive person. These points are not directly connected to the chassis (the vibration has to go through a second bushing to get to the car, either the TA Bushing, Shock/Spring, Subframe bushing). This mod just helps to tighten things up/reduce variation when under load, which will translate to better handling characteristics.
__________________
Uploaded from the Photobucket iPhone App
cposk is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Censor is ON





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:11 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
(c) 1999 - 2011 performanceIX Inc - privacy policy - terms of use