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Old 10-30-2013, 03:58 AM   #1
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As Obamacare sets in, so is reality for many Obama voters



A Obama supporter shocked that her premiums are sky rocketing, This is too funny. Who did she think was going to pay for the healthcare of those who didn't have any. Typical socialist, they want to give and give...out of someones else pocket. yeah haha jokes on you, you got screwed but that's not the point here. That's old news.

It's CNN reporting this, not Fox, (although Fox has been doing nothing but covering obamacare seems like 24/7. ) Judging the way I have have seen this news network cheer Obama over the years, this negative reporting may be confusing to some liberals. Up until this point it's been damage control for this admin on all these networks (Economy, Fast & Furious, Benghazi, IRS Scandal, NSA spying.. list goes on.. ) and once in a blue moon they'd post an article critical of Obama just to seem like they have a touch of balance, unlike Fox, their agenda is quite clear, then there is msnbc, which is state run media. This is not a sign of CNN finally reporting and doing their job. What this is a sign of is that the disaster that is Obamacare cannot be damage controlled any longer. When this happens, the networks can either keep reporting b u IIs%t and hope the masses chew it up, or they can dive headlong into the bashing and soak up as many ratings as they can before they can start to damage control again as soon as a glimmer of hope glistens with the next Obama teleprompter speech.


I have to admit, it's nice not having to post something from a "right wing blog" even though these exact increases have been then the buzz for over 2 years on said blogs, funny to see it now on the MSM.

Well the cats out of the bag, this is what people are talking about, ( well anybody that's informed) this is what people are experiencing and they are not happy, this is happening to middle class families across the country. People are being dropped from coverage, then forced by their new social elite to sign up for more expensive DMV healthcare. Before you blame the insurance companies, they are dropping people because they cannot adhere to the new regulations put forth by this new socialist government. Welcome to the new socialist America.

It's going to get so entertaining in the coming 2 months as libs turn on their own. Obama owns this, just watch as he tries to squirm his way out of owning it.

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Old 10-30-2013, 04:09 AM   #2
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Old 10-30-2013, 05:08 AM   #3
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I am confused since in Florida, Obamacare offers 100 different plans including plans at platinum level ($10 copays and 90% coverage) for $200ish per month.

I would like to know who is paying less than that for real insurance by real companies (Aetna, Blue Cross, Cigna, etc.). I have paid up to $600 per month for insurance for just myself as a small business owner.

What your employer or current insurance company does is up to them not the government. My wife's employer kept their insurance the same. She has a choice of any plan from her employer or any plan from the 100 Obamacare offers.

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Old 10-30-2013, 05:19 AM   #4
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As Obamacare sets in, so is reality for many Obama voters

Lol she agrees with the "everyone gets healthcare theory" but she doesn't want to pay for it. What a noob.
I'm so tired of this bullshit. People who don't know what a barrel shroud want to ban guns. People who have no idea how economy and money actually work support a mandated "affordable care act".
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Old 10-30-2013, 06:12 AM   #5
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Lol she agrees with the "everyone gets healthcare theory" but she doesn't want to pay for it. What a noob.
I'm so tired of this bullshit. People who don't know what a barrel shroud want to ban guns. People who have no idea how economy and money actually work support a mandated "affordable care act".
I currently support it and I am a registered republican. People already get care now without paying for it. Just walk into any hospital emergency room at 8pm on a Saturday night. At least with this law people have to be somewhat personally responsible for themselves.

It seems to me so far that everyone who b!tches about is has no real facts to back up why they are so against it. Just name calling and blame is all I hear.

I would be interested in FACTS that show why making all Americans have health care is so evil.

PS - 545 people run this country and Obama does not make laws, congress does.
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Old 10-30-2013, 06:20 AM   #6
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Old 10-30-2013, 06:32 AM   #7
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As Obamacare sets in, so is reality for many Obama voters

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I currently support it and I am a registered republican. People already get care now without paying for it. Just walk into any hospital emergency room at 8pm on a Saturday night. At least with this law people have to be somewhat personally responsible for themselves.

It seems to me so far that everyone who b!tches about is has no real facts to back up why they are so against it. Just name calling and blame is all I hear.

I would be interested in FACTS that show why making all Americans have health care is so evil.

PS - 545 people run this country and Obama does not make laws, congress does.
^^I totally agree with this!!^^


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Old 10-30-2013, 06:38 AM   #8
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As Obamacare sets in, so is reality for many Obama voters

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Originally Posted by GlockMan View Post
I currently support it and I am a registered republican. People already get care now without paying for it. Just walk into any hospital emergency room at 8pm on a Saturday night. At least with this law people have to be somewhat personally responsible for themselves.

It seems to me so far that everyone who b!tches about is has no real facts to back up why they are so against it. Just name calling and blame is all I hear.

I would be interested in FACTS that show why making all Americans have health care is so evil.

PS - 545 people run this country and Obama does not make laws, congress does.
People who currently have health care are going to pay more. Not everyone but some.
People who choose between dinner and rent (without healthcare) are now forced to pay for healthcare with the money they already struggle to hold.
So I'm pretty confused as to who this actually benefits? If someone wants healthcare they can obtain it currently.
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Old 10-30-2013, 06:52 AM   #9
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People who choose between dinner and rent (without healthcare) are now forced to pay for healthcare with the money they already struggle to hold.
Oh, the drama....

They can pay for healthcare or pony up to the very nominal fine for not having insurance.

The penalty in 2014 is calculated one of 2 ways. You’ll pay whichever of these amounts is higher:

1% of your yearly household income. The maximum penalty is the national average yearly premium for a bronze plan.

$95 per person for the year ($47.50 per child under 18). The maximum penalty per family using this method is $285.

The fee increases every year. In 2015 it’s 2% of income or $325 per person. In 2016 and later years it’s 2.5% of income or $695 per person. After that it is adjusted for inflation.

Plenty of time to figure out what would be best for you and the family. If you need regular visits to the doctor then obviously insurance is required. If you're all healthy and only need visits for the occasional infection or incident with a lawn mower then perhaps the fee would be the way to go.
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Old 10-30-2013, 07:19 AM   #10
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Oh, the drama....

They can pay for healthcare or pony up to the very nominal fine for not having insurance.

The penalty in 2014 is calculated one of 2 ways. You'll pay whichever of these amounts is higher:

1% of your yearly household income. The maximum penalty is the national average yearly premium for a bronze plan.

$95 per person for the year ($47.50 per child under 18). The maximum penalty per family using this method is $285.

The fee increases every year. In 2015 it's 2% of income or $325 per person. In 2016 and later years it's 2.5% of income or $695 per person. After that it is adjusted for inflation.

Plenty of time to figure out what would be best for you and the family. If you need regular visits to the doctor then obviously insurance is required. If you're all healthy and only need visits for the occasional infection or incident with a lawn mower then perhaps the fee would be the way to go.
^ and all that is waived if you qualify for medicare/medicade, children care, etc.

It does not affect the truly poor, it affects the scumbags that go through life blowing their money and not "wasting" it on health insurance knowing that they can still go to the hospital for free if they need to.

BTW Catastrophic heath insurance (60%) is like $100 per month BEFORE TAX CREDITS. Get rid of your iPhone or cable and put on your big boy pants if times are tough.
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Old 10-30-2013, 07:49 AM   #11
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Old 10-30-2013, 08:31 AM   #12
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I would be interested in FACTS that show why making all Americans have health care is so evil.
Simple - it comes down to your vision of what our federal government can or cannot compel individuals to do. If you don't believe there is anything wrong with our federal government MAKING you buy medical insurance, then a debate about "facts" is pointless.

However, since this is a massive new social experiment, there are not a lot of "facts" to discuss yet - by which I mean actual experiences. Instead, what can be discussed are logical and realistic expectations that will result under this experiment - things that are not yet known, but can be reasonably predicted.

In my opinion, I think anyone who predicts this experiment will be a net positive for this country are naïve and foolish. I consider the facts that we are now seeing regarding the website disaster, canceled policies, sticker shock, etc. all support my opinion.

Unfortunately, by the time the naïve and foolish come to realize what a disaster this is, it will be too late and impossible to undo it.
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Old 10-30-2013, 08:41 AM   #13
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I would be interested in FACTS that show why making all Americans have health care is so evil.
"Health Care" is a product of someone's education, investment, time and efforts. You cannot just legislate (morally or constitutionally) that person A has an absolute right to person B's time and effort, even if you think the result is a good thing.
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Old 10-30-2013, 08:43 AM   #14
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However, since this is a massive new social experiment, there are not a lot of "facts" to discuss yet - by which I mean actual experiences. Instead, what can be discussed are logical and realistic expectations that will result under this experiment - things that are not yet known, but can be reasonably predicted.
If you go to the enrollment thread I posted a pictorial about the effects of Romneycare in Massachusetts. That should be able to serve as at least a peek into the future of the effect of this legislation, but on a much larger scale (meaning more inefficiencies, problems, etc.).

edit: here

http://pioneerinstitute.org/news/in-...thcare-reform/
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Old 10-30-2013, 08:45 AM   #15
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Simple - it comes down to your vision of what our federal government can or cannot compel individuals to do. If you don't believe there is anything wrong with our federal government MAKING you buy medical insurance, then a debate about "facts" is pointless.

However, since this is a massive new social experiment, there are not a lot of "facts" to discuss yet - by which I mean actual experiences. Instead, what can be discussed are logical and realistic expectations that will result under this experiment - things that are not yet known, but can be reasonably predicted.

In my opinion, I think anyone who predicts this experiment will be a net positive for this country are naïve and foolish. I consider the facts that we are now seeing regarding the website disaster, canceled policies, sticker shock, etc. all support my opinion.

Unfortunately, by the time the naïve and foolish come to realize what a disaster this is, it will be too late and impossible to undo it.
I guess it depends on how you look at it. You could look at it as the govt. trying to control you. To me, if you don't have or want health insurance you are an idiot and most likely part of the reason that health care is so damn expensive that you need health insurance.

How is it any different that requiring you to have car insurance?

Another way to look it is like this - you don't have to have health insurance. The govt is raising every person's taxes by $95 per year. If you have health insurance, ANY HEALTH INSURANCE, congrats! you get a $95 tax credit.

It is all in perspective.

I am not in support of the govt making decisions for me or any other semi-intelligent self supporting person. But I am all for making laws to govern stupid and irresponsible people. And quite frankly, if you don't have health insurance, you are stupid and irresponsible unless you can not afford it or can not get it due to medical conditions. If you can not afford it or have medical conditions, surprise! there are new plans for you to review!

As with all posts by me, its JMO.
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Old 10-30-2013, 08:46 AM   #16
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Oh hay look another l0e3o7 thread, posted at a hearty 5:00AM.

Just get off the overnight construction shift, blue collar redneck?

I would tell you how much of my premiums you're paying for, but the Obamacare website is down But it's okay, all of your money is still going in my pocket for my poor life choices

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Old 10-30-2013, 09:18 AM   #17
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I guess it depends on how you look at it. You could look at it as the govt. trying to control you. To me, if you don't have or want health insurance you are an idiot and most likely part of the reason that health care is so damn expensive that you need health insurance.

How is it any different that requiring you to have car insurance?

Another way to look it is like this - you don't have to have health insurance. The govt is raising every person's taxes by $95 per year. If you have health insurance, ANY HEALTH INSURANCE, congrats! you get a $95 tax credit.

It is all in perspective.

I am not in support of the govt making decisions for me or any other semi-intelligent self supporting person. But I am all for making laws to govern stupid and irresponsible people. And quite frankly, if you don't have health insurance, you are stupid and irresponsible unless you can not afford it or can not get it due to medical conditions. If you can not afford it or have medical conditions, surprise! there are new plans for you to review!

As with all posts by me, its JMO.
It is funny - I enjoy a lot of your posts, but this one reminds me how otherwise reasonable people will not agree. But some of your comments are shocking to me:

- This is IN FACT a case of the government controlling you! No ifs, and or buts about it!

- Aren't free people free to be idiots? I am sure those idiots could find a long list of things that you do or don't do that they view as idiotic!

- Sorry, some people not having medical insurance does not cause costs to increase - this statement is just plain wrong.

- You don't HAVE to buy car insurance if you don't have a car. A better analogy would be requiring EVERYONE to buy car insurance even if they don't own a car. I will not even go into the reasons why auto liability insurance is not at all comparable to medical insurance.

- So you are o.k. with the government taxing you for NOT doing something?

No offense, but you really need to increase your level of cynicism and critical thinking about the role of our federal government. Just because an idea sounds nice and benevolent ("everyone should have great health care") doesn't mean there is a fair and effective way to accomplish that without actually making it worse, or even that government has any legitimate role in pursuing a concept.
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Old 10-30-2013, 09:53 AM   #18
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Old 10-30-2013, 10:08 AM   #19
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- This is IN FACT a case of the government controlling you! No ifs, and or buts about it!
I still disagree, but that is what makes America great.

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- Aren't free people free to be idiots? I am sure those idiots could find a long list of things that you do or don't do that they view as idiotic!
No they aren't free to be idiots when their actions affect others. Smoking in a bar, pissing on a wall in public, etc.

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- Sorry, some people not having medical insurance does not cause costs to increase - this statement is just plain wrong.
I would absolutely disagree with this. When someone walks into a Hospital because they have a cold (which happens all the time since no doctor will see them without money or insurance) and they do not pay their bill, who do you think pays for it? Now think about a serious condition that racks up a $100,000 bill pretty easily. Some of it comes from price increases ($5 for an aspirin) and some of it comes from write offs and or government. They either pay less in taxes due to write off from profits or they receive money from the government that was raised from taxes. Why is it fair that I had to pay $600 per month (cheaper now) for insurance when others don't?

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- You don't HAVE to buy car insurance if you don't have a car. A better analogy would be requiring EVERYONE to buy car insurance even if they don't own a car. I will not even go into the reasons why auto liability insurance is not at all comparable to medical insurance.
Fair enough. How about this. Everyone gets taxed to pay for elementary schools even if they don't have children or the pay to put their children in private schools. Why do people with 8 kids pay less in taxes for schools than people with 0 children?

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- So you are o.k. with the government taxing you for NOT doing something?
They tax for income. Why do people with children get tax breaks that I don't? That is not fair. Why does a single person pay more in taxes than a married one? That is not fair. How is it any different to tax (or not tax credit) someone who does not have health insurance? If I have children I pay less in taxes. That is EXACTLY the same as if I have health insurance I pay less in taxes.

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No offense, but you really need to increase your level of cynicism and critical thinking about the role of our federal government. Just because an idea sounds nice and benevolent ("everyone should have great health care") doesn't mean there is a fair and effective way to accomplish that without actually making it worse, or even that government has any legitimate role in pursuing a concept.
Until we get rid of the political party system and remove ALL financial contributions to campaigns, we will never have a truly effective and efficient government.

JMO.
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Old 10-30-2013, 10:14 AM   #20
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