E46 BMW Social Directory E46 FAQ 3-Series Discussion Forums BMW Photo Gallery BMW 3-Series Technical Information E46 Fanatics - The Ultimate BMW Resource BMW Vendors General E46 Forum The Tire Rack's Tire Wheel Forum Forced Induction Forum The Off-Topic The E46 BMW Showroom For Sale, For Trade or Wanting to Buy

Welcome to the E46Fanatics forums. E46Fanatics is the premiere website for BMW 3 series owners around the world with interactive forums, a geographical enthusiast directory, photo galleries, and technical information for BMW enthusiasts.

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact contact us.

Go Back   E46Fanatics > Tuning & Tech > Suspension & Braking

Suspension & Braking
Have some questions about suspension or brake setups for your E46 BMW? Get all your answers here!

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 08-05-2008, 06:21 PM   #1
vdubkid
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Frederick, MD (Minneapolis, MN)
Posts: 336
My Ride: 2004 325i
Lowering Springs

Hey fanatics,

I just installed some Moven MVR reps, in eighteen inches. Sitting on stock suspension, the wheel gap is even more unbearable than with the stock rims.

So I'm wondering just how bad is it to only get a set of springs to lower the ride? I know it could possibly mess up the shock rates, but what else could go wrong?

I don't have the money for anything more than springs, so getting a full suspension upgrade is out of the question. I could just leave it be until I can do it right, but I'd like it to at least look good until I can afford something better.
__________________
vdubkid is offline   Reply With Quote
Ads by Google

Guests, get your FREE E46Fanatics.com membership to remove this ad.
Old 08-05-2008, 06:53 PM   #2
Allure
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Anywhere in an Hour
Posts: 967
My Ride: Is Slower Than Yours
Go with H&R Sport, should be fine with stock shocks. Or you could go with H&R Race for a while and then get new shocks.

Last edited by Allure; 08-05-2008 at 06:56 PM.
Allure is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-05-2008, 08:28 PM   #3
vdubkid
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Frederick, MD (Minneapolis, MN)
Posts: 336
My Ride: 2004 325i
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stankia View Post
Go with H&R Sport, should be fine with stock shocks. Or you could go with H&R Race for a while and then get new shocks.
H&R Race, eh?

Ride softness isn't really an issue to me. My dad's got an e60 M5, and the stiffest setting for the EDC is just fine.

I'll check prices though. I'm working with a tight budget.

EDIT: $200 from jlevi, eh? Not bad. But how quickly should I get some shock absorbers?
__________________

Last edited by vdubkid; 08-05-2008 at 08:30 PM.
vdubkid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-05-2008, 09:27 PM   #4
Allure
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Anywhere in an Hour
Posts: 967
My Ride: Is Slower Than Yours
They should hold at least a year.
Allure is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-06-2008, 12:15 AM   #5
vdubkid
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Frederick, MD (Minneapolis, MN)
Posts: 336
My Ride: 2004 325i
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stankia View Post
They should hold at least a year.
Ok, that should give me enough time to get money together for some shocks and the like.

Thanks for the answers.
__________________
vdubkid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-08-2008, 11:24 PM   #6
vdubkid
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Frederick, MD (Minneapolis, MN)
Posts: 336
My Ride: 2004 325i
Sorry to keep bumping this, but I'm a noob and don't know anything about the suspension.

In a couple weeks I'll be driving to Maryland from Minnesota, fully loaded for college, and my rear wheels rub with weight on them.

So I need some stiffer springs to prevent rubbing, but I'm worried about getting much lower in the back:


The fronts are still ridiculously high though


So would putting some H&R Race springs be a terrible idea, or should I go with their Sport springs? What tools would be needed to install? How much would it cost to pay a shop to do it?

Most importantly, would getting stiffer springs make rubbing more of an issue?
__________________
vdubkid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2008, 11:09 AM   #7
vdubkid
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Frederick, MD (Minneapolis, MN)
Posts: 336
My Ride: 2004 325i
Bump. I'd really like to find this stuff out guys. If you can't tell me, could I get an e-mail address of someone that could?
__________________
vdubkid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2008, 11:53 AM   #8
pat
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: St Louis, MO
Posts: 1,247
My Ride: e92 M3 / Camaro SS
Send a message via MSN to pat Send a message via Skype™ to pat
So on your sig pic you seem pretty dropped unless that is just a photoshop. You should definitely get H&R Race. If you go sport, you will be disappointed and will end up spending more when upgrading to new shocks and springs. Get race, you shocks will hold up OK for awhile, then upgrade shocks and you are set to go. I think some folks mix the race springs with Koni shocks / struts.

As far as subbing, what kind of offsets did you get? Lowering your car is not going to make your rubbing any better. When you take it in for alignment, let them know you'd like a little more negative camber in the rear as long as it is within spec. This should also help with clearance.

Pat.
__________________
pat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2008, 12:33 PM   #9
vdubkid
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Frederick, MD (Minneapolis, MN)
Posts: 336
My Ride: 2004 325i
Quote:
Originally Posted by patroklai View Post
So on your sig pic you seem pretty dropped unless that is just a photoshop. You should definitely get H&R Race. If you go sport, you will be disappointed and will end up spending more when upgrading to new shocks and springs. Get race, you shocks will hold up OK for awhile, then upgrade shocks and you are set to go. I think some folks mix the race springs with Koni shocks / struts.

As far as subbing, what kind of offsets did you get? Lowering your car is not going to make your rubbing any better. When you take it in for alignment, let them know you'd like a little more negative camber in the rear as long as it is within spec. This should also help with clearance.

Pat.
Yeah, the sig is photoshopped. That's about where I'd like it to be.

The wheels are et38, and I'm sold on the H&R Race springs.

Will the car definitely need an alignment after I install the shocks? I took it in for one not two weeks ago, and it cost me more than these springs will.
__________________
vdubkid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2008, 12:54 PM   #10
vdubkid
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Frederick, MD (Minneapolis, MN)
Posts: 336
My Ride: 2004 325i
And thanks a lot for the answers, by the way.
__________________
vdubkid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2008, 02:01 PM   #11
tiggaatl
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: El Paso, TX
Posts: 1,268
My Ride: 05 330i ZHP
Send a message via AIM to tiggaatl Send a message via Yahoo to tiggaatl
I would actually suggest the H&R sport springs. I'm on 19's with the stock ZHP shocks, and it's great. I got no gap in the rear, and very very minimal gap in the front. I didn't have to roll my fenders, and I don't rub at all under a full load. If your car is rubbing on the stock set up, then you probably need shock now. Putting race springs on bad shocks is not a good idea. It'll rub even worse. Also, if you're gonna pay someone to install the springs, you should wait, and get shocks and springs done at the same time. It doesn't make sense to pay for labor twice.
__________________
~"I mod, therefore I am"~

Last edited by tiggaatl; 08-09-2008 at 02:04 PM.
tiggaatl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2008, 02:47 PM   #12
maxm50
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: San Luis Obispo, CA
Posts: 129
My Ride: 1999 Steel Blue 328i
My vote would be move to college, save up, THEN do springs and shocks all at once. That way you don't have to do the labor twice, and you won't have to deal with the worries of rubbing under a load of dormroom stuff.

Rubbing is not so much an issue of ride height as it is wheel/tire geometry. If your wheels and tires will rub at full compression, then it doesn't matter one bit which springs you have. Springs will only change how often you hit that rub point, not whether or not it exists. It should be fixed with fender rolling or different wheels/tires either way.

If it were me, I'd go with the Sport, not Race. The more you slam a car, the less useful it becomes, IMO. And you'll start to really mess with suspension geometry and affect bushing life. Get the sport springs and then get swaybars - that will give you a better handling and more comfortable ride than the Race springs ever would.

But that's just me

Edit: Also - asking how long stock dampers will "last" with aftermarket springs is an exercise in futility. You will greatly accelerate the wear rate of the stock dampers, period. Most typical consumers never replace dampers unless they're blown. For those of us that care about the way a car rides and handles and can appreciate the difference between a brand new set of dampers and one with 70k miles on them, we know that they are a wear item just like tires and brakes. If you are going with a lowering spring with a higher than stock spring rate (which it damn well should be), then you need a damper to match. Otherwise you'll have an underdamped suspension and you'll bounce down the freeway like a slammed Civic. And I'll laugh at you. So in conclusion, NO you will probably not "blow" your dampers. YES it will not ride like it should. YES you will not be getting the full benefit of springs without replacing with aftermarket, stiffer dampers. YES you will accelerate the wear of your current dampers until your car rides like a trampoline.

Hope I helped Good luck man!

Last edited by maxm50; 08-09-2008 at 02:54 PM.
maxm50 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2008, 03:25 PM   #13
vdubkid
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Frederick, MD (Minneapolis, MN)
Posts: 336
My Ride: 2004 325i
Quote:
Originally Posted by tiggaatl View Post
I would actually suggest the H&R sport springs. I'm on 19's with the stock ZHP shocks, and it's great. I got no gap in the rear, and very very minimal gap in the front. I didn't have to roll my fenders, and I don't rub at all under a full load. If your car is rubbing on the stock set up, then you probably need shock now. Putting race springs on bad shocks is not a good idea. It'll rub even worse. Also, if you're gonna pay someone to install the springs, you should wait, and get shocks and springs done at the same time. It doesn't make sense to pay for labor twice.
Quote:
Originally Posted by maxm50 View Post
My vote would be move to college, save up, THEN do springs and shocks all at once. That way you don't have to do the labor twice, and you won't have to deal with the worries of rubbing under a load of dormroom stuff.

Rubbing is not so much an issue of ride height as it is wheel/tire geometry. If your wheels and tires will rub at full compression, then it doesn't matter one bit which springs you have. Springs will only change how often you hit that rub point, not whether or not it exists. It should be fixed with fender rolling or different wheels/tires either way.

If it were me, I'd go with the Sport, not Race. The more you slam a car, the less useful it becomes, IMO. And you'll start to really mess with suspension geometry and affect bushing life. Get the sport springs and then get swaybars - that will give you a better handling and more comfortable ride than the Race springs ever would.

But that's just me

Edit: Also - asking how long stock dampers will "last" with aftermarket springs is an exercise in futility. You will greatly accelerate the wear rate of the stock dampers, period. Most typical consumers never replace dampers unless they're blown. For those of us that care about the way a car rides and handles and can appreciate the difference between a brand new set of dampers and one with 70k miles on them, we know that they are a wear item just like tires and brakes. If you are going with a lowering spring with a higher than stock spring rate (which it damn well should be), then you need a damper to match. Otherwise you'll have an underdamped suspension and you'll bounce down the freeway like a slammed Civic. And I'll laugh at you. So in conclusion, NO you will probably not "blow" your dampers. YES it will not ride like it should. YES you will not be getting the full benefit of springs without replacing with aftermarket, stiffer dampers. YES you will accelerate the wear of your current dampers until your car rides like a trampoline.

Hope I helped Good luck man!
Alright, wow. Thanks for all the info! I was planning on waiting to do a full suspension upgrade when I can, but I was a bit worried about ride height for my drive to Maryland.

I'll wait to mess with the suspension until I can do it right.
__________________
vdubkid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2008, 03:53 PM   #14
simsima325
'a certain moderator'
 
simsima325's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Hyattsville, MD
Posts: 37,725
My Ride: Honda Civic
H&R Cup Kit is only like $550. Get that when you can, and ur set. Ya, no sense in doing anything before you drive MN to MD, enjoy the nice ride for the trip, then lower.
__________________
-Brendan
simsima325 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2008, 04:06 PM   #15
dfjaws
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: MN & VA
Posts: 1,458
My Ride: '08 E90 M3 / '02 Z3
Quote:
Originally Posted by simsima325 View Post
H&R Cup Kit is only like $550. Get that when you can, and ur set. Ya, no sense in doing anything before you drive MN to MD, enjoy the nice ride for the trip, then lower.
+1 Thats a great setup and not to expensive either! By the way, I grew up in Rochester, MN. I miss that place.
dfjaws is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2008, 04:16 PM   #16
chanlon7
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Michigan
Posts: 342
My Ride: 03' BMW 330xi
where are u finding the cup kit for 550?
chanlon7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2008, 04:49 PM   #17
simsima325
'a certain moderator'
 
simsima325's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Hyattsville, MD
Posts: 37,725
My Ride: Honda Civic
one of our site sponsors had it at 549 i think. forget who.
__________________
-Brendan
simsima325 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2008, 05:19 PM   #18
maxm50
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: San Luis Obispo, CA
Posts: 129
My Ride: 1999 Steel Blue 328i
Quote:
Originally Posted by vdubkid View Post
Alright, wow. Thanks for all the info! I was planning on waiting to do a full suspension upgrade when I can, but I was a bit worried about ride height for my drive to Maryland.

I'll wait to mess with the suspension until I can do it right.
Good decision. I'm currently waiting until after my 2500 mile drive from Ohio back to CA before I install my Koni FSDs and OEM sport springs... and Hotchkis sways. My car will be loaded with all my stuff, too

Funny how the rear of a non-sport car rides at what I think is an OK height, but the front just looks way too high. I just put 18" ET38 wheels on my car too, and the wheelgap is killing me too!

Oh, and if a spring/damper change is anything like it was on my Miata, it's definitely a job you'll only want to do once. And if you're paying someone else to do it, it's definitely a job you'll only want to pay for once.
maxm50 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2008, 11:35 PM   #19
pat
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: St Louis, MO
Posts: 1,247
My Ride: e92 M3 / Camaro SS
Send a message via MSN to pat Send a message via Skype™ to pat
Spring + shock / strut is a real easy DIY... it's a lot better to get the whole kit if you can. I had the cup kit and it will give you a good balance between sportiness and comfort. When I got it, I bought it from tirerack and it was the cheapest I could find. This was like 2 months ago. To fix your rubbing issue, you need to determine what is rubbing where, etc...
__________________
pat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-10-2008, 12:30 AM   #20
simsima325
'a certain moderator'
 
simsima325's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Hyattsville, MD
Posts: 37,725
My Ride: Honda Civic
you could also buy a used set of coilovers, perhaps.
__________________
-Brendan
simsima325 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Censor is ON





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:18 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
(c) 1999 - 2011 performanceIX Inc - privacy policy - terms of use