Just Got Back From the Gun Show (Again)

I'm both freaked out and fascinated by guns (weapons in general). I've never fired a gun, and I'm not sure I want to.

BUT.

These threads always get my attention, and I love seeing photos and descriptions of well built machines like these. I've always liked the look of the Glocks, and I have never ever read a bad thing about them (as a product).

Note that I'm not 'freaked out' by guns in a 'liberal' anti-gun way - moreso in a "Jesus, I could kill someone with this" kind of way. And, my 'fascination' with them is definitely as a collector and in appreciation of well built tools.

Ken

Originally Posted by ken@bimmertools

I'm both freaked out and fascinated by guns (weapons in general). I've never fired a gun, and I'm not sure I want to.

BUT.

These threads always get my attention, and I love seeing photos and descriptions of well built machines like these. I've always liked the look of the Glocks, and I have never ever read a bad thing about them (as a product).

Note that I'm not 'freaked out' by guns in a 'liberal' anti-gun way - moreso in a "Jesus, I could kill someone with this" kind of way. And, my 'fascination' with them is definitely as a collector and in appreciation of well built tools.

Ken

You should fire a gun, its not as bad once you get past the sound, recoil, and you learn the safety of firearms. I clay target shoot for fun and enjoy it.

Originally Posted by ken@bimmertools

I'm both freaked out and fascinated by guns (weapons in general). I've never fired a gun, and I'm not sure I want to.

BUT.

These threads always get my attention, and I love seeing photos and descriptions of well built machines like these. I've always liked the look of the Glocks, and I have never ever read a bad thing about them (as a product).

Note that I'm not 'freaked out' by guns in a 'liberal' anti-gun way - moreso in a "Jesus, I could kill someone with this" kind of way. And, my 'fascination' with them is definitely as a collector and in appreciation of well built tools.

Ken

It is not a responsibility to be taken lightly. Guys are joke around in here about guns and stuff, but I am sure they take it more seriously in the real world. I do.

Yes, you could take someone's life, but you could also save someone's life. That is how I look at it. You walk into a laundry mat and 3 guys are raping a girl. What do you do? Now what do you do with 15 rounds of 9mm in your hand?

Guns are serious business. Think about it though, the last time you were speeding or not coming to a complete stop at a red light, did you think to yourself "wow - I could have killed someone today" ?

Respect, training, comfort, and responsibility are needed for gun ownship just like they are needed for driving a 3000lb missle 70 mph that wont stop for 150ft.

JMHO

Still waiting on my G34 that's on order. Now I REALLY can't wait...

Originally Posted by Reedo302

Still waiting on my G34 that's on order. Now I REALLY can't wait...

The had some 34 comps there. I cant afford the ammo to make that my target pistol, so I got the Ruger .22

The G19s are in such high demand they had to ship a shipment from Austria without the American markings. Pretty neat.

Originally Posted by glockman9c

It is not a responsibility to be taken lightly. Guys are joke around in here about guns and stuff, but I am sure they take it more seriously in the real world. I do.

Yes, you could take someone's life, but you could also save someone's life. That is how I look at it. You walk into a laundry mat and 3 guys are raping a girl. What do you do? Now what do you do with 15 rounds of 9mm in your hand?

Guns are serious business. Think about it though, the last time you were speeding or not coming to a complete stop at a red light, did you think to yourself "wow - I could have killed someone today" ?

Respect, training, comfort, and responsibility are needed for gun ownship just like they are needed for driving a 3000lb missle 70 mph that wont stop for 150ft.

JMHO

Short of the vigilante portion of your post, I agree 100%. I am quite pro-gun ownership, and even more so for people who are as serious as the hobby demands. I think my in-born unease with guns is that (in general) their purpose is to injure or kill. Again - I don't have a problem with that purpose - they are necessary tools sometimes, whether hunting or self defense. The only thing stopping me from wanting to own a gun myself is the root unease I have with the power to kill.

I also agree that driving bears the same responsibility. You can easily kill as quickly with a car as with a gun, but the car itself was not built for that purpose. I didn't buy a car with that intent, nor would I take a car to a facility and practice driving it into targets shaped like a torso. Accidents happen, and I am comfortable with the responsibility of due care.

Understand that I'm not arguing the point about guns being more dangerous than cars, just trying to verbalize my PERSONAL feelings and visceral reaction to them. It is truly just a 'nervous' thing, and not about a "guns are bad" platform.

Originally Posted by ken@bimmertools

Short of the vigilante portion of your post, I agree 100%. I am quite pro-gun ownership, and even more so for people who are as serious as the hobby demands. I think my in-born unease with guns is that (in general) their purpose is to injure or kill. Again - I don't have a problem with that purpose - they are necessary tools sometimes, whether hunting or self defense. The only thing stopping me from wanting to own a gun myself is the root unease I have with the power to kill.

I also agree that driving bears the same responsibility. You can easily kill as quickly with a car as with a gun, but the car itself was not built for that purpose. I didn't buy a car with that intent, nor would I take a car to a facility and practice driving it into targets shaped like a torso. Accidents happen, and I am comfortable with the responsibility of due care.

Understand that I'm not arguing the point about guns being more dangerous than cars, just trying to verbalize my PERSONAL feelings and visceral reaction to them. It is truly just a 'nervous' thing, and not about a "guns are bad" platform.

I dont consider stoping someone from getting robbed, raped, or killed a vigilante act. Its legal, expected, and sometimes required by law. Besides helping others, unfortunately, it is still needed in this day and age to protect your family and yourself.

Sometimes, there is nothing else that will do.

Dont get me wrong, I respect your caution. If more people were more cautious and responsible, guns would not have to black cloud stigma that they do.

Thought I would share some interesting posts on GunBlast...


Love your site, I'm concerned that Hallie says that Bobbies don't carry guns, this is false, we have armed response units in the UK and armed police in our airports etc, wherever they are needed. Increasingly they are forced to carry anti stab vests as knife crime has soared there, 5 needless deaths a week average. Since hand guns have been banned, gun crime has risen in the UK, they have even had to set up OPERATION TRIDENT to deal with the unusual level of violence from a certain section of our male youth, the only people using hand guns are the criminals, sometimes even better armed than the police. The good news is the majority of the time it is to wipe each other out, but still proof that handgun bans don't work.

Our Olympic team has to travel abroad to train, PC gone mad and yet no reduction in crime, just the punishment of law abiding citizens that the government doesn't trust even if they do win medals. Women may not even have mace, a pen knife or a sharpened comb in their handbag as should they kill their attacker and that would mean they (the woman) had premeditated killing someone.

I had enough and moved to a European country that allows me to keep firearms at home and in the car if not on my person, but only after a years worth of paperwork, medical approval (yearly) and gun club attendance, my neighbours questioned by the police as to if they have any objections, paperwork controls every 3 months, a limit of 7 central fire handguns/semi autos/ex military calibre bolt actions inclusive submitted for authorisation again every 3 years with the police (a 6 month process).

This country has less gun deaths than the UK for an equal population, Criminals here don't buy guns legally, they don't do paperwork, intruders KNOW that there is at least a shotgun under the bed of the vast majority of homes, we have the legal right to shoot them within our house if they are carrying a gun and refuse to leave, we may not shoot someone in the back, fair enough, we may not shoot someone with a knife, but then would he hang around faced with a 12 gauge or a 300 win mag? Shooting someone means sitting in jail until proven innocent and probably banned from having guns thereafter, but importantly still alive.

Even if my new government was to go English on us, hunting rifles will never be banned, and we will at least sleep at night knowing that we have the right to protect our own lives, something that has been stolen from the English because the human rights of the aggressor must be guarded and that keeping that first world war bayonet or a kitchen knife next to the bed means that you are just waiting to murder the first innocent burglar/rapist in the course of his work.

Jesus loves life, the martyrs and He gave their lives for our sins but I would rather ask Him forgiveness for defending mine and my neighbours and winning.

Keep fighting for your rights, they are quashed only too easily.

------------------------------------------------------

Hi Jeff, I wanted to mention that when I read your comments page I was a bit ashamed at the other Australian who raised the pro gun control issue - so I thought I should contribute to your outstanding website.

As a Australian who lived in the USA for 2 great years I came from a background filled with media rubbish about the USA. Hard line stuff - with the only information available to me being shootings and mass murderings and right to carry issues - which if you believed the hype - meant that every American citizen was a gun carrying nutbag who would shoot you for any reason. (hence your other writers views)

Nothing could have prepared me for what I found in the America - a nation of freedom loving people who were amazingly generous and intelligent - who didn't understand the word "No". The USA is the last place in the world with true freedom who people appreciate personal responsibility for their actions.

I never felt safer in any other country than I did in America, I have experienced far more crime and antagonist behaviour in Australia then at any time in the USA. And its because you have more respect for each other as a result of being one of the only places in the world where freedoms are a part of your rock solid law.

The other "Australian" who mentioned school shootings and violence forgets the fact that so much world wide attention was given and that a school is one of the last places in America where a mentally sick person can be assured of meeting no armed resistance - which is why they do not attack peoples homes or police stations - because their run for glory will be cut very short.

----------------------------------------------

I thought those were interesting comments from non-Americans.

Originally Posted by glockman9c

I dont consider stoping someone from getting robbed, raped, or killed a vigilante act. Its legal, expected, and sometimes required by law. Besides helping others, unfortunately, it is still needed in this day and age to protect your family and yourself.

I agree, though a carry permit is several lightyears beyond consideration when you're speaking to someone like me who's got trepidations about basic ownership. Protecting my home and family would be the sole reason for it (aside from the potential sport of target shooting), which brings up a whole new avenue for my personal paranoia to go screaming down.

For now, I'll admire from a distance. I respect your dedication to the topic and hobby, and hope you never have to use your weapons for anything but sport. Or zombies, of course.

I'm thinking of heading to that show right now actually...I might wanna pick up a Glock while I'm there and I definitly need ammo. How does stuff work at a gunshow if your still waiting on your CCW though? Do they send the gun to your FFL for the 3 day period or what?

I will tell you that there will come a day when I want to go to the range or try trap shooting. I know SO many gun owners and enthusiasts that have offered the same thing (thanks for that, btw). One of my clients is a BIG TIME hunter. Like, he's held the world championship for pigeon shoot competitions for several years. He has a very large barn that is dedicated to his big game collection. He goes on at least one "expedition" each year for something crazy.

I told him I'd never fired a gun, he looked at me and said "Well that's just silly." Part of me agrees.

He then offered to buy me a "little girl's shotgun" with fringes and a bell on it.

AND - I have no fear of accidental discharge or any sort of unintentional shooting. The true basis of the fear is that little in-born nature that sets your mind thinking "If I point this at that person and pull the trigger, I will kill him." This is different than the thought "I WANT to kill that person". To me, the feeling is much like being in any other dangerous situation and realizing that with a single conscious decision, I can exact damage or death on myself or someone else - think being on a roof, tall ladder, scuba diving, anything that can give you (or me) shivers due to the required caution. Driving doesn't do that to me, so I don't equate that situation to this.

Again, this has been me trying to describe my own personal, difficult-to-rationalize freak-factor when it comes to guns. I realize I'd get over it with experience and training - and aside from not needing a 129087123987th distraction or hobby, I can see doing that one day.

Originally Posted by david05111

I'm thinking of heading to that show right now actually...I might wanna pick up a Glock while I'm there and I definitly need ammo. How does stuff work at a gunshow if your still waiting on your CCW though? Do they send the gun to your FFL for the 3 day period or what?

Yea, you might not get a good deal after all that. Shipping, your FFL fee, etc.

One single purchases like that, sometimes its better to make friends with your local gun store/range.

Call your local stores first. $500 is a good price for a common Glock. (17,19,22,23)

PS - The shows comes to Jax...

City: Jacksonville, FL
Location: Jacksonville Fairgrounds
Date: April 25 - 26, 2009

Show Hours: Sat 9-5 Sun 10-5
Entry Fee: $8

Wow, page 2 is srs bsns.

Ken - You have the proper mindset about guns. Most people start off with a natural fear of them, it's only rational. After you shoot, and get familiarized with them is when you start understanding their purpose/use. The fear of a Negligent Discharge (ND) combined with the mindset of "i could kill someone with this" is the proper one to have when handling firearms anyways. When you get the opportunity, go out and pull the trigger sometime. You won't regret it.

Originally Posted by glockman9c

Yea, you might not get a good deal after all that. Shipping, your FFL fee, etc.

One single purchases like that, sometimes its better to make friends with your local gun store/range.

Call your local stores first. $500 is a good price for a common Glock. (17,19,22,23)

PS - The shows comes to Jax...

City: Jacksonville, FL
Location: Jacksonville Fairgrounds
Date: April 25 - 26, 2009

Show Hours: Sat 9-5 Sun 10-5
Entry Fee: $8

I went to the show since I was in Daytona already. I have to say that I was not impressed in the slightest and didn't find a single deal to my liking. The ammo was grossly overpriced beyond what I can get it at the range or down the street at my local FFL and there were no really good deals on firearms. The prices they were asking for the Glocks were an absolute joke (some guy wanted 600+ for a Glock 30 (.45 acp).

It was a cool trip, but I was very disappointed...in fact, the only thing I got close to buying was a Benelli M4 shotty but they were fairly uncooperative during negotiations.

Originally Posted by CRZY BMW

Your French. You cant own a gun, let alone known how to use it...

j/k

I have shot several handguns. I can own a gun, I have just to practice shooting for one year before buying the first.

I am french but I Do Know the difference between you're and your.

surrender monkey is kidding

Originally Posted by jacques chirac

I have shot several handguns. I can own a gun, I have just to practice shooting for one year before buying the first.

I am french but I Do Know the difference between you're and your.

Nice

Originally Posted by david05111

I went to the show since I was in Daytona already. I have to say that I was not impressed in the slightest and didn't find a single deal to my liking. The ammo was grossly overpriced beyond what I can get it at the range or down the street at my local FFL and there were no really good deals on firearms. The prices they were asking for the Glocks were an absolute joke (some guy wanted 600+ for a Glock 30 (.45 acp).

It was a cool trip, but I was very disappointed...in fact, the only thing I got close to buying was a Benelli M4 shotty but they were fairly uncooperative during negotiations.

You went to the one in Orlando today?

If so, I dunno.

I paid way under MSRP for all three guns (had printouts with me) and paid within 10% of internet pricing for ammo.

Of course, there will be some people going for max profit, but I saw AR-15 mags as low as $20!?!



Maybe everyone sold more on Sat than they thought they would or something.

Originally Posted by glockman9c

You went to the one in Orlando today?

If so, I dunno.

I paid way under MSRP for all three guns (had printouts with me) and paid within 10% of internet pricing for ammo.

Of course, there will be some people going for max profit, but I saw AR-15 mags as low as $20!?!



Maybe everyone sold more on Sat than they thought they would or something.

I went down looking for the glock, ammo, and maybe some stuff for my AR or a 12 gauge.

The .45 auto ammo I saw was 30 bucks for 50 rounds (I got the same stuff last week for 25) and I wanted 1000 rounds. (Thats an additional 200 bucks I would have had to pay.) They had very little .380, but I can understand that. The .223 was pricey too (I can get 1000 rounds for like 360 here and it was more there.)

The Glock was just outrageous...I can get a Glock 30 with nightsights in Jax for ~550...the ones they had at the show were the same price without the night sights so no savings there...

The Mossberg was a decent buy, but it wasn't the specific gun I was looking for.

And a Lasermax laser was like 5 bucks off, which was hardly worth the time.

I'm glad you got some good deals but I was out of luck I guess...

Originally Posted by david05111

I went down looking for the glock, ammo, and maybe some stuff for my AR or a 12 gauge.

The .45 auto ammo I saw was 30 bucks for 50 rounds (I got the same stuff last week for 25) and I wanted 1000 rounds. (Thats an additional 200 bucks I would have had to pay.) They had very little .380, but I can understand that. The .223 was pricey too (I can get 1000 rounds for like 360 here and it was more there.)

The Glock was just outrageous...I can get a Glock 30 with nightsights in Jax for ~550...the ones they had at the show were the same price without the night sights so no savings there...

The Mossberg was a decent buy, but it wasn't the specific gun I was looking for.

And a Lasermax laser was like 5 bucks off, which was hardly worth the time.

I'm glad you got some good deals but I was out of luck I guess...

If you can get a Glock 30 for $550 with nightsights in Jax any day of the week, you need to start buying some Glocks my friend.

Glock 30 with nightsights retails for $699! Nightsights are a $70-$100 upgrade. $550 is a great everyday price.

To me the show is as much about convience as anything. It is close, in stock, and I walk out with my guns. I always get good deals.