HPF Stage 2.5 M3 Has a New Tune with More Power!!!!

Why The New Tune

We just finished testing the new Billet wheel turbo from Precision which gave JP a lot of time to spend tweaking the tune for the stage 2.5. The reason for investing 2-3 weeks and several turbos in 3 different stage 2.5 M3's was to fix a problem that Scott Wheeler was having. In Scott's M3 (HPF Stage 2.5) on long pulls to 190mph the HPF safety knock siren would go off often between 170 to 180mph. He would then lift and was unable to do his 200mph pull. Most stage 2.5 customers don't hit these higher speeds because most E46 M3's are still limited to 165mph by the factory speed governor. Scott had his speed limiter removed by Active Autowerke.

The First Solution Tried

Our first solution for Scott was to reduce the timing, so we dropped the timing back a couple times in his M3. We pulled a total of 8 degrees of timing from our standard map and the knock siren still went off above 170mph. This is also why his car went from a 5.85 60-130mph to a 6.3 60-130mph. Since we couldn't datalog his car remotely we wondered if the air was possibly getting too hot on these long pulls and triggering a pre-ignition event causing our safety knock siren to go off. Scott wanted to try our stage 4 intercooler which we didn't have a tune for, and we wanted to possibly try a bigger turbo that would make colder air.

The Second Solution Tried

Our 2nd solution was to try a different turbo which would require us to have cars in house to test with and a different turbo to try. We chose to try the new Precision 67 Billet wheel with an H cover as we liked the improvement we achieved with the new 71 billet H cover in our stage 3 turbo kits. What we found after testing these side by side in 2 different M3's was that we gained some on the top end but the quick spool was compromised. After much discussion we determined that for the horsepower gains we saw on the big end it wasn't worth the loss in spool on the small end. So we decided to not use the Billet wheel 67 turbo w/H cover from Precision on our stage 2.5 kit.

The Final Solution

What we determined after 2-3 weeks of testing was that the low compression motors for stages 2.5, 3 and 4 make a bit more natural noise than the high compression engines from the factory. The natural noise of an engine is defined in the EMS in a table which relates RPM to knock volts. Anything above the values you specify trigger the safety knock siren to go off, they also trigger a timing retard to protect the engine along with a quick burst of extra fuel to instantly drop EGTs. JP originally had this knock noise table the same for all our our M3 turbo kits (stages 1-4). During the past couple weeks he re-defined it for our built motors turbo kits (stages 2.5, 3 and 4) to reflect the built engine which allowed him to adjust the tunes and pick up power. Our new HPF Stage 2.5 tune now makes even more power with less boost as you can see from the graphs below.

Adjusting this knock table to the natural frequencies of the engine makes the safety knock siren now go off when pre-ignition truly occurs.

Precision 67 Billet Wheel H-Cover vs 67 Cast Wheel S-Cover (Cast Wheel Chosen)



Stage 2.5 Tune Change (Original Turbo) - Pump Gas



Stage 2.5 Tune Change (Original Turbo) - Race Gas

Nice work guys. Its always great to see a tuner go back and refine existing products to add value to the customer, especially in this case where there is not and immediate ROI for the tuner.

I just cried..so beautiful..car going down next week for my retune..awesome work guys..

Great work Chris! And Major props to Jp! Any stage 2 love?

Wowza, does this mean All I have to do is send my ECU in for the retune? Do I have to pay anything?

Originally Posted by xcoolnessx

Wowza, does this mean All I have to do is send my ECU in for the retune? Do I have to pay anything?

Just send the ECU and we'll upgrade your tune for free. However.... you could return the favor by making some more videos.

Originally Posted by Ravi

Great work Chris! And Major props to Jp! Any stage 2 love?

Thanks Ravi... I definitely think you've maxxed out the stage 2. Just take the step to 2.5 or 3...
Chris.

Originally Posted by HPF Chris

Just send the ECU and we'll upgrade your tune for free. However.... you could return the favor by making some more videos.
.

Now that is what I call CUSTOMER SERVICE!!! I'll send mine out Monday as I want to drive the car over the weekend Yes, I owe you vids and I will have some, I promise.

time for a new plate (700 RWHP)

Originally Posted by xcoolnessx

Now that is what I call CUSTOMER SERVICE!!! I'll send mine out Monday as I want to drive the car over the weekend Yes, I owe you vids and I will have some, I promise.

Hell ya, I always loved your runs and it's been a while!

Great job to Chris and crew.

Cant wait to get my car back and hopefully break some records.

Originally Posted by HPF Chris

Just send the ECU and we'll upgrade your tune for free. However.... you could return the favor by making some more videos.



Thanks Ravi... I definitely think you've maxxed out the stage 2. Just take the step to 2.5 or 3...
Chris.

No Problem! haha, Yea you are right, but i got this stupid boost bug! I might take your stage 4 off your hands!!!

Amazing, you guys always seem to raise the bar!

Bunch of questions for Chris:


1) 750cc injectors should be just around 80% duty cycle for 600rwhp -- is the meth injection really supplying 100rwhp worth of fuel or are you running higher fuel pressure (>70psi at 25psi boost)

2) Did you happen to try the billet wheel with the S-cover?

3) Do you know what kind of gains a stage 2.5 car could expect from:
a) CF intake
b) stage 3+ exhaust (the above dynos are still on the stock rear section, correct?)
c) stage 4 intercooler

4) With the revised knock threshold tables, should we expect new numbers (and tunes) for stage 3 and stage 4? (and have you seen/considered the new Garret GTX-R turbos for stage 4+?)



And once again, major props for the ongoing R&D

Why are the lower compression motors more knock noisy?

Awesome.... Chris!! Im impressed again. Close enough to 700rwhp for me. There goes the 60-130 time again!

Originally Posted by SPDu4ea

Bunch of questions for Chris:


1) 750cc injectors should be just around 80% duty cycle for 600rwhp -- is the meth injection really supplying 100rwhp worth of fuel or are you running higher fuel pressure (>70psi at 25psi boost)

2) Did you happen to try the billet wheel with the S-cover?

3) Do you know what kind of gains a stage 2.5 car could expect from:
a) CF intake
b) stage 3+ exhaust (the above dynos are still on the stock rear section, correct?)
c) stage 4 intercooler

4) With the revised knock threshold tables, should we expect new numbers (and tunes) for stage 3 and stage 4? (and have you seen/considered the new Garret GTX-R turbos for stage 4+?)



And once again, major props for the ongoing R&D

Well, i know the OEM FPR is 5.0bar so that ~71psi. And, I believe the regulator is 1:1 ratio... so they would be about ~93psi in boost, if the regulator is 1:1 ratio.

Originally Posted by docwyte

Why are the lower compression motors more knock noisy?

It's fairly common (and probably completely unrelated to compression ratio). Engines built for big power need to reliably handle a lot more heat & pressure than stock, so they usually have tolerances set slightly larger (looser) than factory builds. This results in more mechanical/background noise...

Originally Posted by BadBoostedBmwM3

Well, i know the OEM FPR is 5.0bar so that ~71psi. And, I believe the regulator is 1:1 ratio... so they would be about ~93psi in boost, if the regulator is 1:1 ratio.

holy crap, I'm used to seeing 40-50psi base pressures in Supras. Makes sense now...

Chris, awesome results. This should be good for a slightly faster 60-130 for the 2.5.

Originally Posted by xcoolnessx

Now that is what I call CUSTOMER SERVICE!!! I'll send mine out Monday as I want to drive the car over the weekend Yes, I owe you vids and I will have some, I promise.

Can't wait to see some new vidz from you!