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View Poll Results: Manual 325i or auto ZHP?
Manual 325i 56 56.00%
Auto ZHP 44 44.00%
Voters: 100. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 05-13-2017, 08:21 AM   #81
OnTheFence
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Originally Posted by jaymtz80 View Post
HAHAHHAA, you're joking right? Because if your not, you are just talking out of your ass. My auto ZHP will go straight to the redline. No 325i regardless of auto or manual will beat the ZHP Auto.
We are not talking about stoplight drag racing.
Do you know about the power curve of your engine? Max HP is around 6000 rpm.
When you slow down to enter a turn, you need to let go of the gas.
An auto tranny does not downshift BEFORE entering a turn, in order to be at high RPM's as you exit the turn.
To do this, you need a manual since you are reducing throttle while simultaneously needing to maintain/increase RPMs.
Impossible in an auto tranny since it can not anticipate downshifting for a turn since it does not have eyeballs.
This is, in fact, the raison d'κtre of a manual; to be able to control what gear you are in.
I find that young riicer kids know very little about track performance driving since all they do is upgrade bumpers and wheels.

Like I said, with a manual gearbox, you can use all the power all the time by keeping the rpms above 4000 at all times.
This is why it effectively doubles your horsepower.

Last edited by OnTheFence; 05-13-2017 at 08:26 AM.
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Old 05-13-2017, 08:36 AM   #82
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Originally Posted by OnTheFence View Post
There is absolutely no comparison.

A manual 325i will blow the doors off the auto ZHP

A 325i can be shifted at 6000 where it makes about 200hp
A ZHP AUTO will typically shift itself at 3000 where it makes about 125hp

Having a stick shift is like DOUBLING your useable horsepower instantly.


Your living in a fantasy world if you believe that all that BS.

The steptronic when placed into sport mode will stay in gear until it's shifted (but it will protect the motor by shifting into the next gear when you hit redline). In non-sport mode when you hit full throttle the transmission goes into kick-down mode and it will shift close to redline. Steptronics have lockup torque converters so once you hit a certain rpm the torque converter is directly locked just like a manual.

If you want a near manual experience with a steptronic put paddle shifters in and it's a lot of fun.

330i ZHP
235 hp @ 5900 RPM
222 ft-lbs @ 3500 rpm
Redline 7200 rpm
0-62 6.1s (manual) [BMW literature]
I've read somewhere that the auto was the same spec because they use an aggressive 3.64 diff instead of the manuals 3.07 diff
[car and driver]

330i
225 hp @ 5900 RPM
214 ft-lbs @ 3500 rpm
Redline 6500 rpm
0-62 6.8s (manual) [BMW literature]
[edmonds]

325i
184 hp @ 6000 rpm
175 ft-lbs @ 3500 rpm
Redline 6500
0-62 7.6s (manual) [BMW literature]
[edmonds]
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Old 05-13-2017, 02:08 PM   #83
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I was only referring to generic auto boxes, not StepTronic.
Yes, you can keep revs high with manual StepTronic downshifting.

But Steptronic "sport" mode does not upshift at redline.
It shifts at like 3500 instead of 3000.

Last edited by OnTheFence; 05-13-2017 at 02:09 PM.
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Old 05-13-2017, 02:18 PM   #84
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Originally Posted by TitaniumCranium View Post
330i ZHP
235 hp @ 5900 RPM
222 ft-lbs @ 3500 rpm
Redline 7200 rpm
0-62 6.1s (manual) [BMW literature]
I've read somewhere that the auto was the same spec because they use an aggressive 3.64 diff instead of the manuals 3.07
it uses a 3.64 instead of the usual 3.38 but it still does the 0-60mph in 0.5sec longer than its manual counterpart. this is from BMW literature. because torque convertor.
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Old 05-13-2017, 03:16 PM   #85
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Originally Posted by OnTheFence View Post
I was only referring to generic auto boxes, not StepTronic.
Yes, you can keep revs high with manual StepTronic downshifting.

But Steptronic "sport" mode does not upshift at redline.
It shifts at like 3500 instead of 3000.
Once again, no. You have no idea what you are talking about.

Put your foot down in a 330i auto, ZHP or not and it will go to redline.

Last edited by jaymtz80; 05-13-2017 at 03:17 PM.
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Old 05-13-2017, 03:19 PM   #86
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Originally Posted by jaymtz80 View Post
Once again, no. You have no idea what you are talking about.

Put your foot down in a 330i auto, ZHP or not and it will go to redline.


True, my 2 litre in sport mode will also redline if I floor the pedal to the ground, I don't need the steptronic function for that.



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Old 05-13-2017, 08:20 PM   #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OnTheFence View Post
We are not talking about stoplight drag racing.
Do you know about the power curve of your engine? Max HP is around 6000 rpm.
When you slow down to enter a turn, you need to let go of the gas.
An auto tranny does not downshift BEFORE entering a turn, in order to be at high RPM's as you exit the turn.
To do this, you need a manual since you are reducing throttle while simultaneously needing to maintain/increase RPMs.
Impossible in an auto tranny since it can not anticipate downshifting for a turn since it does not have eyeballs.
This is, in fact, the raison d'κtre of a manual; to be able to control what gear you are in.
I find that young riicer kids know very little about track performance driving since all they do is upgrade bumpers and wheels.

Like I said, with a manual gearbox, you can use all the power all the time by keeping the rpms above 4000 at all times.
This is why it effectively doubles your horsepower.
No... you're wrong... you can be in any gear you want in a Step and keep it that way; wanna stay at +4000 RPM? Go for it, just keep it in 2nd or 3rd (or whatever -- depends on how fast you're going) just like a manual; it will not shift for you (if you're in M-mode, of course). Coming up on a corner? Downshift a gear or two just like a manual -- exact same technique (minus fancy foot-action, of course).

Also, remind me never to buy a car from you... you definitely fit the profile of someone that has a manual and beats the living crap out of the car... who the hell keeps their car at 'optimal' HP range when they drive, given it's at 5900 RPM???
Quote:
Originally Posted by OnTheFence View Post
I was only referring to generic auto boxes, not StepTronic.
Yes, you can keep revs high with manual StepTronic downshifting.

But Steptronic "sport" mode does not upshift at redline.
It shifts at like 3500 instead of 3000.
No, you can't save yourself by saying that... this whole thread was specifically about E46 manual 325 vs auto ZHP, and you're very well aware of that.

Also, SD will shift more aggressively but it depends on what you're doing... floor it and it will NOT shift until wayyyy up in the RPM range (let's not even get into Kickdown)... if you're simply cruising, then yes, naturally it'll shift in the 3K RPM range, given that you're still in automatic mode (hence it being called "Sport Drive").
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Old 05-13-2017, 08:34 PM   #88
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I've never understood the appeal. I also don't buy the sitting in traffic argument - I do a whole lot of that myself, and it's no big deal.
I take exception to this statement... do that crap for a decade in LA-style traffic, and then tell me how your knees are doing. Commute in stop-and-go for an hour or two EACH WAY, and see. I should know -- EVERY ONE OF MY FRIENDS developed knee problems from that crap; you have NO idea how much long-term damage that constant clutch/brake/accel crap does, especially if you're tall... and then, sometime in your early to mid-30's, you quietly get an auto... you know, 'for the wife' or some such excuse from the "manuals all the way, yo!" die-hards.
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Originally Posted by avantgarde View Post
What I found with all my other cars (automatics) is that my knee starts to hurt... a lot... after about 15-20 minutes of gas-brake, gas-brake, cooaaast. You have to use quite a bit more force to keep the car from rolling forward, and more force to bring it down from speed with automatic transmissions.
Sadly, this is also true... although my left knee suffers that damn burn far faster than my right.
Quote:
With my manual 325xi, i've found myself being that douche keeping lots of car lengths between me and the people in front of me when I see traffic come to a stop 20-30 cars ahead. it allows me to use overrun fuel cut to save gas.
Well, a) you're a douche , and b) you can't do that here (and LA ain't the only place)... you do that at all and you'll immediately have people cut you off and take up that space you were leaving, forcing you to tap the brakes or engage a gear or whatever the situation calls for. Trust me, it sucks THAT much.
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Old 05-13-2017, 08:48 PM   #89
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I take exception to this statement... do that crap for a decade in LA-style traffic, and then tell me how your knees are doing. Commute in stop-and-go for an hour or two EACH WAY, and see. I should know -- EVERY ONE OF MY FRIENDS developed knee problems from that crap; you have NO idea how much long-term damage that constant clutch/brake/accel crap does, especially if you're tall... and then, sometime in your early to mid-30's, you quietly get an auto... you know, 'for the wife' or some such excuse from the "manuals all the way, yo!" die-hards.
I've said it before in this thread and I think it bears repeating, that sounds like more of an LA problem than a manual problem. Sure makes me glad I live somewhere that isn't hell for a car enthusiast.
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Old 05-13-2017, 08:59 PM   #90
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I've said it before in this thread and I think it bears repeating, that sounds like more of an LA problem than a manual problem. Sure makes me glad I live somewhere that isn't hell for a car enthusiast.
Yep, absolutely! If you're a car enthusiast, you can enjoy your car OUTSIDE of commute hours as long as you avoid the MAIN parts of LA (basically, anywhere where you could conceivably see the Hollywood sign, all the way towards any beach).

Basically, it sucks for driving... I've been stuck in bumper-to-bumper traffic at 11pm on a weekday, for fu's sakes!



P.S. Our weather still kicks your weather's ass...
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Old 05-13-2017, 09:18 PM   #91
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Originally Posted by Alex323Ci View Post
it uses a 3.64 instead of the usual 3.38 but it still does the 0-60mph in 0.5sec longer than its manual counterpart. this is from BMW literature. because torque convertor.
Sure, but in the real world, a lot of variables come to play. Especially with the guys who drive manuals.

But of course every manual driver here makes perfect shifts in milliseconds every time when going for maximum 0-60, 1/4 mile etc. straight line acceleration.
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Old 05-13-2017, 09:20 PM   #92
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Originally Posted by Sicily1918 View Post
Yep, absolutely! If you're a car enthusiast, you can enjoy your car OUTSIDE of commute hours as long as you avoid the MAIN parts of LA (basically, anywhere where you could conceivably see the Hollywood sign, all the way towards any beach).

Basically, it sucks for driving... I've been stuck in bumper-to-bumper traffic at 11pm on a weekday, for fu's sakes!



P.S. Our weather still kicks your weather's ass...
Maybe, but earthquakes, gestapo-like emissions regulations, socialism, $300K bungalows when that money would buy a mansion here, gas prices, etc etc...

I'll take the humidity and occasional tornado watch. YMMV.
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Old 05-13-2017, 10:14 PM   #93
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Well, a) you're a douche , and b) you can't do that here (and LA ain't the only place)... you do that at all and you'll immediately have people cut you off and take up that space you were leaving, forcing you to tap the brakes or engage a gear or whatever the situation calls for. Trust me, it sucks THAT much.
LMAO! I know, I know!

I hate me for it, but when the road is only two lanes wide, and there's an 18 wheeler, or a Prius in the left lane next to me, I'm relatively safe from lane jockey antics. When there are more than 3 lanes I keep it high and tight because like you said, people WILL jump in and fill that space quickly completely negating your fuel savings, LOL!.
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Old 05-13-2017, 10:40 PM   #94
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Originally Posted by OnTheFence View Post
There is absolutely no comparison.
A manual 325i will blow the doors off the auto ZHP
A 325i can be shifted at 6000 where it makes about 200hp
Since when does the 325i make 200Hp
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Old 05-13-2017, 11:35 PM   #95
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LMAO! I know, I know!

I hate me for it, but when the road is only two lanes wide, and there's an 18 wheeler, or a Prius in the left lane next to me, I'm relatively safe from lane jockey antics. When there are more than 3 lanes I keep it high and tight because like you said, people WILL jump in and fill that space quickly completely negating your fuel savings, LOL!.
Hahaha!

Hey, are your Prius drivers as bad as ours? Ours only drive two ways: they either drive far slower than traffic, or far faster... the latter also tailgate a lot.
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Old 05-14-2017, 02:49 AM   #96
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Hahaha!



Hey, are your Prius drivers as bad as ours? Ours only drive two ways: they either drive far slower than traffic, or far faster... the latter also tailgate a lot.


I love Prius and other hybrids, the more fuel is left for our cars.
Okay, they drive like 90 year old women, that's true...


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Old 05-14-2017, 06:27 AM   #97
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Since when does the 325i make 200Hp
Sorry, I was using the E90 data
http://www.e90post.com/forums/attach...1&d=1113664722

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Old 05-14-2017, 12:16 PM   #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OnTheFence View Post
I was only referring to generic auto boxes, not StepTronic.
Yes, you can keep revs high with manual StepTronic downshifting.

But Steptronic "sport" mode does not upshift at redline.
It shifts at like 3500 instead of 3000.
The OP's question was discussing the desire between a 325 manual and a 330 ZHP auto, which IS a steptronic so that misdirecting logic doesn't apply here.

This is not a "generic" automatic, it IS a Steptronic.
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Old 05-14-2017, 12:24 PM   #99
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Originally Posted by OnTheFence View Post

Like I said, with a manual gearbox, you can use all the power all the time by keeping the rpms above 4000 at all times.
This is why it effectively doubles your horsepower.
I think you should probably just stop commenting and stop acting like you know anything about cars this is one of the biggest croc lines I have ever read.

Now your talking about e90s all the sudden which really doesn't change much in the context to which you are referring. Please stop embarrassing yourself.
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Old 05-15-2017, 05:41 AM   #100
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^^ Get in a car with standard Auto and try to downshift 2 gears while being off the throttle while slowing down for a sharp turn.
I find that young riicer kids know very little about performance driving since all they do is upgrade bumpers and wheels.

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