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ZHP Steering Rack Mod

113K views 281 replies 43 participants last post by  Bali 
#1 ·
I finally got rid of the piece of $hit overboosted steering in my '01 330i. Picked up used '04 330i ZHP rack & pinion for $250 and had a stealer do the install + alignment.
It's a night and day difference; the new rack feels solid and the car drives like a BMW should. Best mod I've done thus far :excited:

The ZHP rack & pinion part # 32136757650.
 
#192 ·
Hello BMW Experts!
So, can anyone tell me what the part # is for the 'least favored' racks that came in the early 330i, pls? My build date is 4/01, right on the cusp of a change.... :hmm:

Murf
 
#195 ·
LittleBear,

That would be BMW part number 32136755065 and 32136755064. (I think one digit increase at the end for remanufactured racks) That's the purple tag 678 rack which comes on the 318, 323, 325, 328, and early 330.

This 32136755065 rack shows up as RealOEM as being installed on early 330s pre 9/01. I believe this would be the infamous overboosted rack.

9/01+ production 330 and subsequently 330 ZHPs switched to 32136757650 or 32136757651 (1 at the end for remanufactured)

The question is do these late model yellow tag racks ending in 712 (32136757650 and 32136757651) bear the same internals whether installed on the regular 330 OR 330 ZHP. :clap:
 
#196 ·
so, mr. mango, i'll be more courteous this time so you don't have to get your mod/admin friends to delete my posts.

where exactly did i say that the zhp rack was differrent or special? i eager to learn from this thread, as well, but you really need to chill out. pointing fingers when you've been proven wrong isn't going to do you any favors.
 
#202 · (Edited)
Mango, just stop. The information is all in front of you you just don't seem to understand it.
The 712 racks are ALL the same. There is no regular 712 rack and there is no zhp 712 rack. The 712 rack IS the zhp rack. It did, however, come on other 3 series at random (it would seem)
If your non zhp 330 came with a 712 rack it is in the minority. The majority came with the 678 zf rack or the TRW rack (purple tag)
 
#203 ·
Mango, just stop. The information is all in front of you you just don't seem to understand it.
The 712 racks are ALL the same. There is no regular 712 rack and there is no zhp 712 rack. The 712 rack IS the zhp rack. It did, however, come on other 3 series at random (it would seem)
If your non 330 came with a 712 rack it is in the minority. The majority came with the 678 zf rack or the TRW rack (purple tag)
lolwut? uhh that's what i've been saying all along. i think you're confused, mate.
 
#213 ·
So far the truth is:

1. There is not a ZHP specific rack (which Mango and company was saying).
2. There are 330's after 9/01 that came with a rack different than the 712 rack (what I was saying, based on my experience on driving other cars)
3. RealOEM is not comprehensive.

Agreed?
 
#215 ·
essentially yes. the 712 rack was only on the zhp but it also came on other 330s. the MAJORITY of 330s did not come with the 712 rack which makes the 712 rack the "zhp rack" but not absolutely exclusive to the zhp. we don't really know what pattern bmw followed in choosing which cars other than the zhp got the 712 rack, but some definitely did.

and also yes, realoem is not an end all resource. it is useful but does not tell us all the little secrets that happened when assembling each specific car.
 
#216 ·
I would rather keep the "steering rack" recall out of this discussion. It was a complete different issue that affected a small number 330's with MY up to 3/01..
 
#222 ·
Loosing hope? :rofl: I don't even own a ZHP, and I could care less if it had a different rack or not. I am here to learn, and I was simply conveying my experience after driving a few other 330s, including those with MY 09/01. And that experience was ZHP steering feel being different than other 330s, that I could not associate with control arms and/or other front end components, but isolated only to the rack itself.

I do not see any information in Rick's posts that contradicts my experience so far, and my 3 deductions above remain valid (you may or may not be sure about item 2, but it is a straightforward deduction based on the information provided so far by Rick).
 
#228 · (Edited)
WOW I mean WOW

OK Lets start fresh from square 1

I have NEVER said that there was a difference in the 712 tagged racks THERE IS NOT***8230;***8230; NUFF said a 712 rack is a 712 rack

WHAT I HAVE BEEN TRYING TO SAY if you will stop long enough to read

There were 3 different racks used on the 330

1 a TRW rack this rack was manufactured by TRW and has NO TAG rack is stamped T R W

2. A purple 678 tag rack with 3 turns

3 a yellow 712 Tag rack also with 3 turns

I questioned what is the difference between the 678 tag and the 712 tag and was told the torsion bars were different giving a different feel. (not going to post the same dirty pictures all over again)

The gear in the 678 tag and the 712 tag are slightly different as well

Based on the 100***8217;s ***8211; 1000***8217;s of cores returned from customers based on what they order and tag numbers given to me on the phone on top of countless hours at core suppliers (where racks are tagged from junk yards) and hours buying cores in junk yards over 26 years. this is the data I have come up with.

What I have seen is anyone who has claimed to have a ZHP has ALWAYS sent in a 712 rack as a core apparently there were other packages as well that shared this rack I have even had a 712 rack returned from a 323

Yes I agree the 678 tag was also used in the 325 that would be why they have the same part number on my site as well (hmmmmmm weird)

If people are so inclined to believe that there is ONE rack and Only One rack used in every 330 so be it. If you would like the addresses for all of the customers that sent back other racks rather than that of the 712 rack from their 330s so you can go beat them to death with a baseball bat ***8230;***8230;***8230;.. well I can***8217;t help you there.

I find it a little funny how after 2 full hours of research you (Mr. Mango) have become angry, I have to wonder if you had done this for 25 + years how you would feel ?

This bickering is just one big circle and the facts have been very confusing, one would wonder if this is intentional just to move the forum up in google searches.

The racks I ***8220;WAS***8221; intending to break down were the 678 tag vs the 712 tag and never the 712 vs the 712, they are the same to think otherwise would be silly. I don***8217;t think this was EVER a debate. I was simply trying to convey that from all of my resources physically touching, holding, handling, building, and sometimes cuddling with rack and pinions as well as discussions with other builders also in the industry for 25 + years that there were 3 rack and pinions used on the 330***8217;s

1. a TRW Rack (rack is stamped T R W )
2. Purple 678 tagged racks
3. Yellow Tag Tagged Racks


To answer an earlier question there is another yellow tag this was on the earlier 330 (2001) and was tag Number 599 this would be the same as the 643 tag (silver) a 3.4 turn unit.

I feel that regardless of any information posted it will turn into some end of the world debate. If I were to state that the pinion was splined, someone would argue that it was not really splined it was broached and splines are made from a broaching machine so they are not called splines ***8230;***8230;***8230;..

Once again I was simply trying to help and seems some people get it and some don***8217;t... I am only posting again to point out that I DID NOT claim the 712 racks were different only that there were different racks on the 330 models if I have not explained this well enough then I am sorry.

Be well
Rack Doc
 
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#230 ·
well, i, for one, will not loose any sleep knowing that the great mango will not be reading my posts.


if i had more time and motivation, i would go back through this thread and quote all of mango's BS he passed on as facts. meh, not worth it to me. he wouldn't even see it since i'm now blocked :)
 
#234 ·
we all know Zhp's aren't special. they ALL have the same rack, however. some e46's, built after 09/01, have the same rack. in an ironic twist, it would appear that mango's e46 IS special, since other e46's have different racks.

i'm eager to read more from the rack doctor regarding this :)
 
#244 ·
Rich stated the fact that he always receives 712 racks from zhp owners no matter what. This isn't just like 40 racks. It's quite a few. I do agree that it would be better to get a reading on exactly how common the 712 rack is outside of just the performance package. But according to rich, all 3 racks were available on 2002-2006 330s
He's the expert so ill take his word. I will edit the post as more information becomes available. But I just wanted to get the basic, usable information out of this thread and compile it into a crap free thread.
 
#245 ·
Rich stated the fact that he always receives 712 racks from zhp owners no matter what. This isn't just like 40 racks. It's quite a few. I do agree that it would be better to get a reading on exactly how common the 712 rack is outside of just the performance package. But according to rich, all 3 racks were available on 2002-2006 330s
He's the expert so ill take his word. I will edit the post as more information becomes available.
well Rich has said a few things and i agree his experience rebuilding E46 racks up to 12 yrs is above anyone else's here. but he is relying on some info from customers or salvage yards. that could be misleading if people provide him with incorrect info or if the rack isn't original equipment. example: he said he has recieved the .712 from a 323. i don't know anyone here that knows more about the 323 than me. the E46 323 never came with the 13.7 ratio rack from the factory. that is a FACT. the 13.7 was introduced later in the 330 after the 323 stopped being made. i have plenty of articles, bmw brochures and internal documents with this info (being an original '00 323Ci owner). the 15.5:1 was the ratio so something is amiss there. retrofitted or mistaken when sent in is a better bet. other unfortunate part of his data is that unless he is pulling it from the car himself, he's relying on someone else's info. i trust him, not the "general Q public" that aren't into cars so much. i doubt he would argue he doesn't get some numbskulls as customers that give him incorrect info from time to time.
the other things is that 330i/ci/cic-zh package were around for what, some 24-28 months for each model left in E46 production. that's not many. and of those late yrs that they were available there were so many more 325/330i/xi/iT/Ci/Cic in zsp and non-zsp. so statistically his shop shouldn't have come across that many 330-zhp .712 racks. if that be the case it would be more reasonable to deduce then if they break down that much for him to rebuild, the .712 rack is flawed(and i'm not saying that). the 330-zhp is the last yrs of each E46 model and "should" not have as many miles as the earlier year(or same years) 323/328/325/330s. so one really should not see that many of them??

i hope this comes off as reasonable/plausible to those reading and not being unwilling to move forward. it's late but i hope the reasoning behind it all solid and presented well enough to consider point presented. thanks.
 
#249 · (Edited)
Just wanted to share a little prt scrn with you this is taken from a ZF internal program (catalog) this was given to me about 10 years ago (or so) and I have found it invaluable

What I would like to point out that with many of the on line catalogs they are simply relaying information that is given to them from Manufactures (Like myself or cardone or ZF) they are also selling parts

You will see that at the bottom of the page here it shows interchanges and you will find many tags that they are saying sell as the same part number this is why many web sites and retail outlets will sell all of the E46 racks as one part number (and paint over the tags)

:facepalm:

Alex Really I have to say that all of my customers are of the utmost skill level Ha ha Just kidding I could not agree more that at times people have no idea what car they are even driving or what year or if it has tires. most commonly people will call and say they need a set (2) rack and pinions for their vehicle. So the fact that I did get a core back from a 323 with a 712 tag may have been a fluke or someone had changed the unit prior. when I followed up with the customer he had no idea and was not the original owner. he just wanted a rack that worked ! :thumbup:

I have conveyed what I have seen as cores returned from customers based on what they purchased (years Models)

Below is a quick glance at the 712 shaft vs the 678 shaft as i Mentioned there is a slight difference in the gear (pitch of the gear) can I take a pinion from one and swap them ......yes !!!!!!



I am sorry I don't have allot of time today to make replies but thought I would post a little more info hope it helps

Be well
Rack Doc
 
#254 ·
Just wanted to share a little prt scrn with you this is taken from a ZF internal program (catalog) this was given to me about 10 years ago (or so) and I have found it invaluable
What I would like to point out that with many of the on line catalogs they are simply relaying information that is given to them from Manufactures (Like myself or cardone or ZF) they are also selling parts
You will see that at the bottom of the page here it shows interchanges and you will find many tags that they are saying sell as the same part number this is why many web sites and retail outlets will sell all of the E46 racks as one part number (and paint over the tags)
Alex Really I have to say that all of my customers are of the utmost skill level Ha ha Just kidding I could not agree more that at times people have no idea what car they are even driving or what year or if it has tires. most commonly people will call and say they need a set (2) rack and pinions for their vehicle. So the fact that I did get a core back from a 323 with a 712 tag may have been a fluke or someone had changed the unit prior. when I followed up with the customer he had no idea and was not the original owner. he just wanted a rack that worked ! :thumbup:
I have conveyed what I have seen as cores returned from customers based on what they purchased (years Models)
Below is a quick glance at the 712 shaft vs the 678 shaft as i Mentioned there is a slight difference in the gear (pitch of the gear) can I take a pinion from one and swap them ......yes !!!!!!
I am sorry I don't have allot of time today to make replies but thought I would post a little more info hope it helps
Be well
Rack Doc
Rich good stuff and thanks for taking the time to post this for us all. :bow:
 
#250 ·
Awesome pictures/contribution, Rich. I'm sure in the future I'll be getting a rack from you. Question, when you rebuild a rack, do you also replace the gearing? Does it normally wear out? Or do you just pull the seals and replace with new ones? In other words, do the racks you sell perform consistently or might there be wear in the teeth/gearing compared to other racks? Do you test for this?
 
#258 · (Edited)
Mango,
This is difficult for me to answer as we are getting into proprietary information as rebuilders we guard our information which is why I was reserved about posting all this already. In the rebuild process shafts are polished (much like a crank shaft is on a machine) we clean up the gears if there is excessive wear we don't play with it we scrap it (this is called fall out in the industry) we use a simple rule If I wouldn't put it on my car I wouldn't sell it to you. (AND I AM VERY FOND OF MY BMW's) as for Quality I would certainly put any of my units against any other builder especially when it comes to bimmers it is very rare we have a failure in a BMW unit this is why I am not afraid to offer lifetime warranty on the units. (we have had on many occasions the installer that likes to cross thread the threads arrrrrrr now that is aggravating)

I'm happy to sell you a unit but out of curiosity if you already have a 712 tagged unit why would you swap ? if you want to upgrade a Z3 rack would be your go to unit. Changing one 712 for another would be like changing a bulb that didn't need to be changed Just curios ?


As for this thread I can say I welcome any information you all can come up with there is never enough information to compile and I am never opposed to calling an audible and changing my listings on my site to better serve my valued customers. Combining numbers is always a blessing to manufacturer as it simplifies things for those placing orders. So In advance I thank you all for your "positive" contributions to our knowledge banks as I mentioned I try to learn something new every day.

I also thought I would toss this out there for fun. On Many occasions I have found OEM cores returned where BMW has placed a pretty sticker over the original tag with later model digits on them (ya just gotta love that) I have seen this most commonly on the 5 series where the only difference was Internal seals and the way the lines were routed this is a prime place where I combined part numbers to simplify things.

Ok gotta run I have Audi's to build tonight :) Oh yeah I also do Audi, Volvo, Mercedes, Honda, Nissan, Toyota, and on and on and on LOL

Be well
Rack Doc
 
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