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Old 10-07-2013, 02:31 PM   #1
thinkpad240
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Tire Rotation for Michelin Pilot Super Sport

I need to rotate the rear tires; they are Michline Pilot Super Sport as pictured. It has an asymetrical thread and it says "Outside" on the sidewall facing me. Is the proper rotation ; keep the tire and wheel together and put this in the place of the other rear tire (and wheel) and do the same with the displaced tire (and wheel) so that the word "Outside" is still visible?

It sounds like a easy question, I just want to make sure before I do it.
(I have Pilot Sport before and this tire rotation does not sound the same)
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Old 10-07-2013, 02:40 PM   #2
Alex323Ci
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should be same side back to front and vice versa. Pilot SS have a warranty and they need to be the same size and rotated. same rolling direction and same side facing outward.
you're right, those directions are odd.
sub'd to see what is found out.

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Old 10-07-2013, 03:28 PM   #3
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PROPER rotation is to not rotate.
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Old 10-07-2013, 04:19 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdstrickland View Post
PROPER rotation is to not rotate.
on this car, this
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Old 10-07-2013, 05:56 PM   #5
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I do A with sumitomo htr z iii, same pattern type
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Old 10-07-2013, 06:07 PM   #6
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Re: Tire Rotation for Michelin Pilot Super Sport

I assume you are running a square setup?

If yes, then they could be rotated so that outside marking is always facing outside.

If you had directional tires, then you could only rotate front to back.

If you are staggered and directional then there is no rotating.

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Old 10-07-2013, 06:11 PM   #7
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I assume you are running a square setup?

If yes, then they could be rotated so that outside marking is always facing outside.

If you had directional tires, then you could only rotate front to back.

If you are staggered and directional then there is no rotating.

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Square or staggered, the Owner's Manual says to not rotate the tires.

If square, then you _can_ rotate the tires if you want, you must keep the same tire on the same side of the car, without regard to the directional-quality that a tire may or may not have. But if the owner's manual says that rotating tires is not required, or not recommended (which is what it really says), then why bother?
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Old 10-07-2013, 06:12 PM   #8
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If you are running a staggered setup, that is, wider tires on the rear, then do not rotate.
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Old 10-07-2013, 07:51 PM   #9
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If you read the owners manual for all E46's BMW recommends not to rotate.

The reason is that the suspension on the rear tends to wear tires in the middle of the tread while the fronts tend to wear on the outer endges. If you've owned your car for a while you know what I'm talking about.

Don't rotate.
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Old 10-07-2013, 08:00 PM   #10
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I do A with sumitomo htr z iii, same pattern type
That doesn't work with directional tires.
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Old 10-07-2013, 09:27 PM   #11
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Re: Tire Rotation for Michelin Pilot Super Sport

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Originally Posted by jdstrickland View Post
Square or staggered, the Owner's Manual says to not rotate the tires.

If square, then you _can_ rotate the tires if you want, you must keep the same tire on the same side of the car, without regard to the directional-quality that a tire may or may not have. But if the owner's manual says that rotating tires is not required, or not recommended (which is what it really says), then why bother?
The reason to bother would be more even tread wear, and thus longer tire life. Same reason you rotate tires on any car.




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If you read the owners manual for all E46's BMW recommends not to rotate.

The reason is that the suspension on the rear tends to wear tires in the middle of the tread while the fronts tend to wear on the outer endges. If you've owned your car for a while you know what I'm talking about.

Don't rotate.
This would seem like the perfect scenario for why you would want to rotate. Curious as to why this would be a bad thing.

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Old 10-08-2013, 02:32 AM   #12
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This would seem like the perfect scenario for why you would want to rotate. Curious as to why this would be a bad thing.
Because the wear doesn't have to be even front to back, or inner to outer tire for that matter. Just use it and replace (in pairs) as necessary.

With the new reality of staggered, directional and asymmetric tread designs, rotating tires has gone the way of the 3k-mile oil change.
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Old 10-08-2013, 05:41 AM   #13
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This would seem like the perfect scenario for why you would want to rotate. Curious as to why this would be a bad thing.
Because doing so degrades handling and performance compared to not doing so.

Rotating tires is about making your tires all wear evenly so they last a little longer.
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Old 10-08-2013, 07:26 AM   #14
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Re: Tire Rotation for Michelin Pilot Super Sport

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Because the wear doesn't have to be even front to back, or inner to outer tire for that matter. Just use it and replace (in pairs) as necessary.

With the new reality of staggered, directional and asymmetric tread designs, rotating tires has gone the way of the 3k-mile oil change.
You're statement is 100% wrong. Advancements in tread pattern design and rubber compound have done amazing things to improve grip, cornering stability, hydro planing resistance, etc. All while improving nvh and tire life. However, those advancements have done very little to change tire wear, and nearly all tires are at their best when tread wear is even across the surface.

Improvements in engine tolerances, oil quality and additives in the oil are what lead us to longer oil change intervals, which is reflected by longer recommendations by manufacturers. Tire manufacturers still recommend rotation for best performance and tread life as well as require it for tread life warranties.




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Because doing so degrades handling and performance compared to not doing so.

Rotating tires is about making your tires all wear evenly so they last a little longer.
It does not have to lead to a decrease in handling and and performance if done at the right intervals. Tires that are evenly worn will perform better than those which are prematurely worn in the center or at the outer tread blocks. They will also be quieter.

If you only rotate the tires once every 15k miles then yes, you will be riding on a goofy shaped tire profile that would hurt performance.

My guess is that since bmw is picking up maintenance costs, it is cheaper for them to tell you not to rotate tires than have you in the dealership every 3-5k miles. If they only rotated them at the oil change intervals, then customers would complain about weird steering feel and loud tire noise since you are way past the point where they should have been rotated. The damage is done at that point and can't be reversed.

I'll add the caveat that my statements are true for a street tire on a daily driven vehicle, not a race car. I'm sure that bald rear tires will improve your 0-60 time on dry pavement, but they will have no hydro plane resistance and will be loud as hell.

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Old 10-08-2013, 08:38 AM   #15
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Well a lot of us have staggered, directional tires. No rotation possible.
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Old 10-08-2013, 08:47 AM   #16
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Re: Tire Rotation for Michelin Pilot Super Sport

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Well a lot of us have staggered, directional tires. No rotation possible.
Yup, moot point in that case. It's also another reason for BMW to not recommend rotation as they would then be relying on customers to realize that their specific model with the specific package their car had can't be rotated. Average consumer = dumb & average second owner had no idea what packages are on their car. Anyone on this forum is by default not average by the way.

As I've been searching for new tires lately, I have found that there are significantly fewer directional tires and a lot more asymmetric ones than in the past. Not sure of the exact reasoning for this, but it's good for those that want to rotate.

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Old 10-08-2013, 11:18 AM   #17
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It does not have to lead to a decrease in handling and and performance if done at the right intervals. Tires that are evenly worn will perform better than those which are prematurely worn in the center or at the outer tread blocks.
BMW disagrees with you.

They lay out a lucid rational as to why, no need to guess.
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Old 10-08-2013, 11:27 AM   #18
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BMW disagrees with you.

They lay out a lucid rational as to why, no need to guess.
That's BS.

BMW doesn't want to have to pay for rotating under warranty, plus they will sell more tires.

I would rotate back to front in OP's situation.
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Old 10-08-2013, 12:57 PM   #19
Alex323Ci
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BMW disagrees with you.

They lay out a lucid rational as to why, no need to guess.
Please link us to where BMW rationalizes this , I would like to see it in its full context.
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Old 10-08-2013, 01:30 PM   #20
tachi1247
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Re: Tire Rotation for Michelin Pilot Super Sport

^^ this. I would like to read it as well.

If tires with uneven wear can provide greater performance than even wear tires, BMW should be equipping the cars this way from the factory. It is certainly within the capability of modern tire manufacturing to vary the tread block depths over the width of the tire. And they already spec different tire types for their brand. For example, the pilot sport 2 that came on m3 or m5 (can't remember) were different than off the shelf ps2. Cadillac also had their own unique version for the cts v with a different tread block pattern that eventually lead to the design of the pilot super sport.



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