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Old 10-08-2013, 09:40 PM   #1
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Tuning an HPF car for 50/50 water meth

I want to share my experience with other guys who may want to switch from 100 % meth to 50/50 water meth injection.

The benefits:
- Run more boost and gain tons more torque and more HP over just meth or even race and meth.
- don't have to worry about corrosion
- don't have to worry about meth absorbing water over time whereby dangerously diluting it.
- don't have to mess with purging the system when it sits for more than two weeks.
- safer u don't have to worry about waiting to blow up ur manifold
- steam cleans ur motor as u drive
- engine EGTs run cooler and the motor is happier.

The risks of 100% Meth

-This is what AEM has to say on there website about running Meth:

"Methanol is a toxic and highly flammable chemical. 100% Methanol ignites easily and burns vigorously with an almost undetectable flame. Methanol can be absorbed through the skin and even small amounts can cause blindness or even death. Using this fluid at high pressures, without dilution, in an under-hood environment with nylon lines and push-to-connect fittings is very unsafe. The performance advantages of using greater than 50% methanol concentrations are small, if they exist at all. However, the safety issues are very real and far outweigh any perceived benefit of running high concentrations of methanol."


Note: tuning is an art and can be done in many creative ways depending on the tuner. This is just the way I found that worked for me. In the end it's all math that's used to get an analog engine to preform to its full potential reliably. I have used many resources , countless hours of tuning myself and spent many hours with several tuners. I say this as I did not invent this by myself. I'm more of a collector of knowledge and like to apply it practically. I like to say: "why bother knowing something if ur not going to use it.... and if u use it and its fun share it"

I'll be posting what u need to set it up safely on an unlocked AEM. If u need ur AEM unlocked give Jim Reed a jingle. He's excellent in helping out.

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Old 10-08-2013, 10:58 PM   #2
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Tuning an HPF car for 50/50 water meth

Things to make sure r in working order

1- Fuel pump. Make sure u r the fuel pressure stable at high rpm and boost. That means 72 psi at idle with vacuum disconnected or 62 psi with vacuum line connected ( plus or minus 4 psi is ok). Then u can add 1 psi for every pound of boost u run (fuel regulator is a 1:1 raising rate) . So my car runs 25psi so that means I'm running 97 pounds of fuel pressure. That's a lot and U will need a pump that can maintain that if ur setup doesn't. The stock pump is not enough even with the Walbro inline 255. I suggest the Walbro 415 e85 pump with radium install kit. It's internal pressure release valve is set to start to open @ 97psi which is perfect for r high base fuel pressure, verses the Walbro 400 gas which begins to open @ 87psi. Also the E85 pump has 10% more volume at higher fuel pressures. If u do this make sure u swap the 20 amp fuse for a 25 amp fuse. FYI : fuse number 54 in glove box.

Pic of Walbro 415 E85 Pump & Radium install kit
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2- Check the duty cycle of the primary injectors at full boost and high rpm. Make sure u r under 85%. U can log this in the AEM using "Injector Duty Primary" parameter. This is important because HPF used the meth as a fuel supplement . So the meth added fuel capability to the fuel system and we r now going to change that and use meth and water as a coolant to raise the detonation threshold to support several more pounds of boost. So it's a different philosophy altogether. U may need to change out ur injectors if u run out of duty cycle. It depends on how much they r flowing. Most of u will be ok.. I changed mine to FIC1100 and I'm only at 47% duty cycle at full boost, so I have lots of head room. Remember the injectors flow is rated at 43 .5 PSI so the flow is going to be higher with r higher base fuel pressure . So mine r actually flowing at 1350 cc. If anyone wants or needs to change their injectors to FI1100. I can get u setup with the proper batt offset tables and fuel map reconfiguration. Just PM me and I'll gladly help u out.

3- Really sticky tries ur going to need them.


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Old 10-08-2013, 11:17 PM   #3
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Tuning an HPF car for 50/50 water meth

Now for the mixture / home brew

I use 99.9 % pure Methyl Hydrate. It's is more potent than de nurtured alcohol and burns faster. Which means more power and more boost.

The mixture I use is 1 litre of water to 1.3 litres of Meth. This gives a perfect 50/50 mix. U can also go by volume and that's ok works out to 44% water to 56% meth. The only thing u need to do is run the same method of mixing as u tuned with. It needs to be consistent and accurately measured each time. Do not guess.

As for water: distilled water is best as it avoids any mineral build up in the system. I use regular tap water if I'm out of distilled. It will not effect performance either way.

Once mixed a chemical change takes place. It will no longer be Meth. The point is that it will keep for a long time without changing. Meth on its own absorbs water if any air gets to it. This problem is eliminated. When mixed 50/50 the mixture becomes non flammable and can be stored for a year.

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Old 10-08-2013, 11:40 PM   #4
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thanks for sharing
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Old 10-09-2013, 12:17 AM   #5
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Tuning an HPF car for 50/50 water meth

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thanks for sharing
Ur welcome. I'll be posting the process I used on my 9:1 built motor. The process can be applied for both low and high compression only the amount of boost, amount of fuel to pull, and timing would be different.


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Old 10-09-2013, 11:34 AM   #6
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Tuning an HPF car for 50/50 water meth

If ur new to the AEM I would get a few books familiarize ur self on the concepts on tuning EFI. AEM documentation is excellent with AEMPro. There r also excellent videos of how to tune on u tube. Download the AEMPro software and familiarize ur self with it. AEM tuner is a good learning tool as well as the help guide is built in explaining the various functions. (FYI Aem tuner itself doesn't not work with HPF AEM)
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Old 10-09-2013, 12:13 PM   #7
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Tuning an HPF car for 50/50 water meth

The first thing u need to do is establish the base tune Gas AFRs. Log them in the AEM under fast and review them after a full pull in low boost. Note the Gas AFRs (should be around 10.8 to 11.2) at this time us should also note the 02 feedback values. ( this needs to be setup in the log as well) the AEM should be taking out 5% fuel as HPF set this up for safety. U need to know this number as it will help later in figuring out the amount of fuel to pull in 50/50 tuning. If ur running richer than 10.8 and ur pulling 5% fuel with 02 F/B then u need to take some fuel out of the TPS based Map until u get ur targets. The logs will tell u the rpm and throttle to locate the correct cells. It's important to adjust the cells around it and then calculate for transition smoothing.

Note: I opted to retune the TPS Fuel MAP to be spot on without 02 FB above 12PSI for safety. The reason is if the 02 sensor fails it usually fails rich and the AEM will pull fuel and cause a dangerous lean condition. With 02 F/B off I don't have this issue or worry. I also can accurately dial in the base tune and pull fuel for high boost without having to compensate for 02 feedback percentages making the poor little AEM work hard needlessly thus eating up valuable CPU resources. I also don't trust the AEM V1 to have the CPU power to adjust accurately enough at the 02 F/B rates required. (Hence a good reason for the advent of the infinity platform with ample CPU resources) Some of u may notice fuel smell at times and puffs of black smoke under hard acceleration. This is because the AEM is too slow to act and is often way rich initially in boost as the AEM tries to catch up. This issue is also eliminated when 02 F/B is turned off in boost when combined with Accell fuel sensitivity tuning. I will touch on how to tune this in further posts.

Ensure u have no knock in the motor. Monitor retard on knock 1 and 2. Theses need to be logged under fast data logging. Also when u do a pull go through the higher gears 3rd , 4th and to 5th is fine. Why? Because u get boost spikes as u shift and this can cause slight knock especially with an SMG trans as the anti lag keeps the boost up between shifts when the AEM pulls timing thus reducing torque for the quick shift. We want all knock out of the motor no matter how small or short duration for all conditions. This is premiss for all the tuning we r going to do.

Now check the logs to make sure u have no knock retard at all. U can setup AEMlog to set an alarm to warn u automatically when u open the log. Monitoring knock volts will not help u. Knock happens so fast that AEM logging rates can't see all possible knock events even at 250 samples a second. The retard u can see which is the best indicator and happens before the HPF knock siren goes off. (the knock siren is hard wired for a certain amount of sustained knock signal before it goes off. This is not accurate enough for r tuning purposes. (Its more like a last resort warning for the driver to let off and check out what's going on)

If u have any knock retard then u need to locate the rpm and boost in which it is happening reviewing the logs. Open AEMPro and locate timing map. Remove timing in that area adjusting the exact location and the one above and before and after it. Reducing by initially 1 degree in the main cell and half a degree in the surrounding ones. Then do a run through the gears. If u have a person with u can do this live. The Dyno does not give u real world conditions. Since my tune was for new injectors , upgraded turbo I prefer road tuning on top of a Dyno tune then verify with Dyno again. Since HPF cars have been had extensive dyno tuning and development a road tune is good from the get go and the verify on Dyno all is good. I like using the Dyno Afr gauge and boost to verify what my AEM is reading. I always go with the leaner of the two factoring in some loss if the dyno 02 is way back in the muffler.

Once u have this data and know that the motor is happy then ur ready to start the 50/50 tune. Stay tuned


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Old 10-09-2013, 07:09 PM   #8
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Re: Tuning an HPF car for 50/50 water meth

Can we get your numbers on pump meth first? And psi.

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Old 10-09-2013, 09:51 PM   #9
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Tuning an HPF car for 50/50 water meth

Quote:
Originally Posted by InDiGlOM3 View Post
Can we get your numbers on pump meth first? And psi.

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I only have my pump and meth numbers from HPF with my old 6776. I made 649wheel and 509 torque. Hpf folded before sending me the tune for my 6766 so it's been all custom. I have not tuned for pump and meth and I don't want to risk it.

Others have made 697 to 723 wheel and 559 to 569 torque respectively with 6776 meth and pump depending on exhaust. I already make 634rwhp / 550 torque on 94 pump & 671rwhp / 630 torque with H20 injection.

I'm running 19 psi on pump 23 psi on H2O and 24 psi on 50/50 (haven't dynoed 50/50 yet)

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Old 10-12-2013, 07:41 PM   #10
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Tuning an HPF car for 50/50 water meth

To put things in context I think it would good just to share the basics of how the HPF meth system works, parts, and is setup in the AEM.

HPF system uses a FJO 1000 cc / min selinoid. (now Holley EFI) It is set to activate if above 3psi. The Sure Flow (p/n 8000 941 2600 / 1.1 gal / min 100 PSI) meth pump is set to activate at 1 psi above 2500 rpm.

The meth system is all setup and calibrated with AEM NOS Fuel and Timing augmentation maps. These setting are added to the base fuel and timing maps including all fuel and timing trims for air / water temp etc... The AEM NOS function is set to run above 3 psi and 3000 rpm and at least 70% throttle.

There is a 150psi AEM pressure sensor on the output of the meth pump. The Aem monitors the pressure and only activates the high boost Switch , NOS Map, and meth selinoid if the meth is above 75psi high and below 115psi. If the pressure drops or exceeds the threshold then the system automatically disarms defaulting back to low boost and base map. There is also a meth filter mounted next to the meth pump and is inline prior to the nozzle.

So as u can see there r a number of parameters that have to be met in order for the system activate which in my opinion makes it very good. The issue that could a arise that is not covered is if the selinoid failed as there is no actual flow condition or fault detection of the selinoid. If this happens with pure meth mix it would be a big problem. If it happens with the 50/50 it would be less of a problem as we will not be relying on as a fuel supplement. I have a knock warning gauge that flashes in the car prior to knock siren so I could let off the gas should something happen. I have been pondering the idea of installing the AEM meth flow gauge that would trigger a shut down of the meth system if the flow dropped for any reason below a certain point. It would be a great failsafe addition for the system.

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Old 10-14-2013, 12:09 AM   #11
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Tuning an HPF car for 50/50 water meth

The AEMpro HPF 50/50 tuning process assuming ur base tune in low boost has no knock and it running fine with proper AFRs.

1 ESTABLISH BASE & LOG. Now setup ur internal log in the AEM to full data sampling. Under / Setup / Internal Logging / Change Rate - toggle up arrow to reach 250 samples a sec. Thats 3 minutes of logging. Set the log to come on at 1PSI of boost by selecting "Load at Least" type 1 and press enter. This way we r only going to log the Boosted runs. So 3 minutes is a lot of boost time.
Log settings consist of 7 Fast and 8 Slow parameters that can be logged. Here r the Parameters to log.

Fast: Engine speed,Engine Load, Knock 1 retard, Knock 2 Retard, O2#1, 02# FB Value, Ign Timing,
Slow: Throttle,Air Temp, Coolant Temp, Boost WG Out,Acell Trigger Count, Switches #1, primary injector duty

Run Car in low boost and do a few pulls in 3rd and 4th and download logs. We r going to need them.

2 NOS MAP. In the NOS menu select Nitrous, U will see tow tables one for timing and one for fuel. They will have values based on RPM and Load already setup for 100% Meth. This is where we r going to adjust for 50/50 timing and fuelling which is applied to the base Fuel and Timing Maps. In the Nitrous Menu change the NOS fuel area that have values in them (3000 rpm to 8100 from just under 1psi all the way to max load. In my case 33PSI) to -1 and Timing Map area to 1. U do this by highlighting the area and right clicking the mouse and select "Set Value" trype the Value and then Press enter.

3 BOOST. Under Boost Control / Advanced / Boost Target Methods / RPM / TPS Dependant u will see a RPM and Load table with ur high boost in PSI. For example a stage 2.5 is set to 23.5 PSI. We need to set this to the low boost setting. highlight the whole Map and right Click select "Set Value" type ur low boost number (Stage 2.5 is 15.5psi ) and press enter. The whole Map will now have the new value. Note : If u have Traction Control u need to change under advanced the VSS Dependant / Boost Target Speed Table / Table. Enter the low boost value by highlighting the whole row of boost numbers. For example I changed mine from 23.5 to 15.5 PSI.

We r doing this because we r going to establish the proper AFR drop for the 50/50 mix and then tune it for that boost level. Then we r going to work r way up to max boost while tuning the whole boost range and develop r new NOS fuel and timing numbers.

4 LOAD THE GUN. Now fill the Meth tank after it has been purged of the 100% Meth. Remember 1.3 Litres of Meth to 1 Litre of Distilled water. This will net a 50/50 mix by Weight. Make sure u prime the pump with the nozzle end of the meth line un hooked. Reconnect line.

5 SHOOT THE GUN. Find a safe uninhabited part of Mexico City. Turn on the Meth system and now go run the **** out of ur car and have fun...

Note: u will find that there is little power gain and maybe even some loss... that's normal.. we haven't tuned it for power yet. If u feel the car has some bogging this is normal. We will tune that out. It's a result of the need for more timing. Remember we have the NOS fuel and timing maps r set low. We r going to work r way up to the Power believe me... The water / meth occupies area that was used for fuel. Fuel creates power. Water creates vaporization thus cooling and has a steam engine effect which makes some additional power as it expands. The meth does burn and in fact slows down the burn as does water. That's why we need more timing as the flame front slows we need to advance to burn it more effectively. Since the real power comes from the ability to increase boost as the detonation threshold has now been increased. We want to tune all the areas of boost for optimum. IMO It's a mistake just to tune high boost.

6 ASSESS TARGET. Now download the logs and load them in AEMlog. Setup to see all the parameters. Now move the cursor aloong the boosted run data. Now look at the rpm, load , rpm , 02 AFR as well as 02Feedback. Note these. Water / Meth will add .5 to 1 point AFR to ur base AFR depending on rpm (which u logged previously in base tune) so if u had a base Afr on gas of 11.2 u now will have a base AFR of 10.2 to 10.7 with 50/50. (02 F/B is a factor that needs to be considered)

----- to be continued -----


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Old 10-14-2013, 01:35 AM   #12
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Tuning an HPF car for 50/50 water meth

--- continued ----

With the 50/50 AFR numbers we want to adjust the NOS fuel map. So if we remove fuel via the NOS map we will be effectively raising the gas tune to approach 12.2 which is best safe Afr for max torque. (this is what I'm after. Not horsepower per say. It will come as a result of the torque) so we want to get the AFR on meth to the same as the gas only AFR. In the end 11.5 AFR on 50/50 was what I went for.

I would note the area of the log that needs leaning out and make that adjustment to the nos map using negative numbers. Since 02feedback is enabled it will automatically pull fuel or add fuel by a max of 5%. So u will be fighting against this and need to compensate accordingly.. If u noticed the way HPF did the NOS fuelling u will see large amounts of fuel being removed up to 28% in some cases. That's because HPF has 5% rich fuel map for safety. So u will see from ur base tune that 5% is being pulled already. So if we pull 1 percent of fuel we need to pull 6 % but then the 02 feedback will add the fuel back up to 5%. So u need to take this unto account. If u look at ur base tune and see the % that is being pulled u will use that number plus the 5% positive fuel number u will need for example 5% 02/FB pull 11% of fuel to get 1 Percent effective. (I avoided all this by tuning my boost without 02 feedback. It's up to u.)

I like to work in 1 to 2 percent increments of fuel reducing. Then do a pull and repeat until proper AFR is reached as stated above.

We now want to add timing. We won't need much. On my 9:1 motor I have 2 to 3 degrees of timing added to base. We only want to add enough timing so that the engine does not bog and runs smooth all the way to redline. Knock retard needs to be monitored and u need a co pilot to do this. If he sees any he YELLs at u and u let off the gas... Then take some timing out and repeat if necessary (.5 degree) after reviewing the log and seeing where it took place. ( we r only dealing with the possibility of slight knock as we r making only small changes and working r way up. Low boost this is not an issues as much as full boost)

IMO timing is not to be maxed out with 50/50 we only want enough for the engine to run crisp and smooth. Remembering we will be making the real power when we increase boost. U should see some at this point. If u look at ur AIT numbers in the log u will see them stable and relatively low. Mine r 18C to 22C at this boost level. The real cooling is in the cylinder itself where vaporization causes the cooling by as much as 100 degrees taking the heat out of the cylinder thus making a denser charge. Since water has an infinite octane value we gain the ability to run leaner. turbo cars do this normally by adding additional fuel to cool the cylinder. We don't have to do this as the 50/50 does this. So we make more power by being in the rich best torque AFR as stated earlier.

This whole process is repeated for each boost level. More on that to come...

------ to be continued -------


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Old 10-14-2013, 07:24 AM   #13
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I'm really enjoying reading your posts.

I believe the above is the tip of the iceburg with relation to tuning meth/water injection. With a fixed flow rate for the injection mixture, you miss out on optimum ratio. Sure you compensate for the mixture with timing and fuel trims, but you end up with full affect at lower RPMs, and partial affect at higher RPMs. With a constant flow nozzle, the mass flow per injection cycle decreases as RPM rises.

To take advantage of the full potential of water/meth injection, you would want to maintain a similar ratio of air/meth+water/gasoline across the entire power band. For example, if you were injecting 1000 CC of water/meth at 4000 RPM, and getting maximum effect, you in theory would want 2000 CC @ 8k RPM. The only way to do this is with some type of flow control valve. Obviously when I mention "air", I mean total mass flow of air.

I believe the 3rd parameter to the injection control strategy would be inlet air temp. I do not believe that boost if an effective measure of the "quality" of the air entering the engine. You could have 15 psi manifold pressure, low IATs, and oversaturate the air mixture with Meth/water. Boost does mark the potential for taking advantage of injection, but it is probably not the best parameter to base a variable flow system on.

Then there's the topic of pre-turbo injection to increase the adiabatic efficiency of the compressor wheel.

Just thought I'd throw some "what if" ideas into a great thread.

Keep up the info sharing!
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Old 10-14-2013, 11:26 AM   #14
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Tuning an HPF car for 50/50 water meth

Quote:
Originally Posted by PEI330Ci View Post
I'm really enjoying reading your posts.

I believe the above is the tip of the iceburg with relation to tuning meth/water injection. With a fixed flow rate for the injection mixture, you miss out on optimum ratio. Sure you compensate for the mixture with timing and fuel trims, but you end up with full affect at lower RPMs, and partial affect at higher RPMs. With a constant flow nozzle, the mass flow per injection cycle decreases as RPM rises.

To take advantage of the full potential of water/meth injection, you would want to maintain a similar ratio of air/meth+water/gasoline across the entire power band. For example, if you were injecting 1000 CC of water/meth at 4000 RPM, and getting maximum effect, you in theory would want 2000 CC @ 8k RPM. The only way to do this is with some type of flow control valve. Obviously when I mention "air", I mean total mass flow of air.

I believe the 3rd parameter to the injection control strategy would be inlet air temp. I do not believe that boost if an effective measure of the "quality" of the air entering the engine. You could have 15 psi manifold pressure, low IATs, and oversaturate the air mixture with Meth/water. Boost does mark the potential for taking advantage of injection, but it is probably not the best parameter to base a variable flow system on.

Then there's the topic of pre-turbo injection to increase the adiabatic efficiency of the compressor wheel.

Just thought I'd throw some "what if" ideas into a great thread.

Keep up the info sharing!
Glad u like... I agree that progressive controller would be the best. Like u said it would ramp up as demand increases. This is something I will look at in the future and possibly go with direct injection mounting at the bottom of the runner on the intake manifold. For now I'm limited to what the HPF system is designed to do which is full on and as u say using the AEM to compensate for the flow.

The way I see if over saturation is happening at low rpm is by the AFR drop when injecting 50/50. As a rule of thumb If the drop is greater than 1 point then then system is spraying too much. The way to adjust that is by moving the rpm in which the system sprays. Currently I have it at 3000 rpm and will adjust rpm to where it makes power. I'm thinking around 3800rpm is my guess with my experience with H20 and how the car feels. I have found through extensive testing that it doesn't drop more than .8 AFR so it's ok to adjust using NOS fuel map to dial it in. As u mentioned I really end up sacrificing top end power this way but in mid range where the torque is highest is perfect. If I had a progressive controller I could make the adjustment with it or even add a second stage nozzle.

With a progressive controller we would still have to lean out the mixture in the NOS map to get to the optimum AFRs for gas. The reason is we cannot get to the best AFR for torque on gas alone with a turbo, as it will knock before we ever get close to that number, hence tuners using the rich gas mixture concept for knock deterrence in boost and embarrassing turbo puffs of black smoke ensue. So the only way to tune this out and get to r target AFR is with injection on.


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Old 10-14-2013, 12:57 PM   #15
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Well you're way ahead of me from a practical standpoint. While my ideas may be well developed, all I've got is a pile of parts that don't run yet.
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Old 10-14-2013, 05:20 PM   #16
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Tuning an HPF car for 50/50 water meth

---- continued ------

Tuning for each boost level.

Firsts let's explore how HPF has setup there breakpoints for the map vacuum / boost resolution. This is directly correlates to the AEM 5 bar map sensor and used in conjunction with the TPS sensor which has its own breakpoint table which will be left untouched.

This is the base timing map below which shows on the left column the boost breakpoints. This presents a problem. While HPF configured the map for a kit that needed to be versatile we r going to need more resolution for best results for timing and fuelling accuracy with 50/50 meth.
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Here is a pic of my modified breakpoints. Notice how much more boost resolution there is. There was redundancy in the lower range which could be used. If u look at the previous U will see the difference in the map in the lower vacuum range. This has been tightened up gaining 3 breakpoints of resolution which was added to the boost side.

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If u would like to do this to ur tune its not that difficult but an involved process to make sure all is lined up correctly. Areas affected r: 02 target map, Wastegate duty cycle map, timing map, NOS timing and fuel maps, so they need to be all adjusted with the corect values. When it comes to the values for the new boost levels. U interpolate between the new cells and the old ones. For example: after changing the breakpoints select timing map and highlight each row one at column a time selecting 15.5 psi through 19.5 right click mouse and select " calculate " the timing numbers will be filled in for 17.48 psi automatically. Do this for each new breakpoint. ( we only select the columns because we want to keep the adjacent rows the same.) As for the 02 feedback u do not do this u just repeat the values as the r all the same above 15.56 psi.

FYI : Make sure u save a copy of ur tune when doing any of this and do it offline from the car. U can later upload the new calibration. I've been running this new resolution map and all I can say is the car is amazing with all the boost levels dialled in. My VSS based boost control works fantastic with 50/50 combined with Traction Control. I will possibly open up a thread on how to dial TC in as a well for various tires and Traction Conditions including wiring it up if u don't have it already

----- to be continued ------

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Old 10-26-2013, 02:43 PM   #17
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Tuning an HPF car for 50/50 water meth

Dynoed 50/50 brew today. 722 RWHP 650 rwtrq . Stock section 2 ... Motor ran great... Power drops off after 7k because of restricted exhaust. I still have to add my exhaust cut out. Ill post comparisons and graphs.


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Old 10-26-2013, 02:44 PM   #18
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Great results, congrats Anthony!
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Old 10-26-2013, 05:03 PM   #19
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Tuning an HPF car for 50/50 water meth

So arriving at he dyno we did a pull with my 50/50 tuning untouched. Made 714 right out of the gate and 645 torque. So it told me my approach to tuning 50/50 was very close.

The torque graph is Pump gas running in low boost 19.5 psi as compared with hi boost 25.5psi with 50/50. Mix. U will see we made over 653 rwhp and 600 rear wheel torque with 94 octane pump gas. Still with stock section 2 which kills my top end.

The reason low boost map had such a gain in torque and hp is attributed to my changing of the breakpoints. As such allowed more resolution for timing in my base map. Which netted me 28hp and 50 foot lbs from the previous dyno session with nothing else changed. That's was a big surprise although the car pulled hard scrambling for traction in 3rd so I new something was up.

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The 50/50 blend netted 722 rwhp & 652 rear torque (75 horsepower 52 rear wheel torque gain above 4k and was constant.) Also keeping in mind the exhaust being the restriction. This was compared to the new low boost numbers. The actual gain from the previous Dyno numbers was 90 hp and 100 torque. So it doesn't look like much gain but I should see close to 800 hp 700 torque at the wheel with the exhaust change and as such the 50/50 will really come into its own. Low boost will see some gains as well my guess approaching 700hp

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Note: U will see a little dip @ 4000 rpm in the first graph which was the meth being too rich... It was flattened out after the fuel reduction. Also from the span of 4000 rpm to 5000 there is 270 foot lbs of torque gained which obviously happens very quickly and incredible to feel in the car.

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Old 10-26-2013, 08:17 PM   #20
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Tuning an HPF car for 50/50 water meth

One thing to note the intake temps were between 20 and 33 Celsius in high boost which isn't that bad consider we were in a sealed off dyno chamber for a few hours. The coolant temp was 80c and under heavy boost approached 93 Celsius. I have decided to put an aftermarket radiator as I would like to see the temps about 80c max. I will have the radiator modified / coolant system to accept standard thermostats so I have more temperature range options and easier access. My oil temps never went past 100c but I like to see it closer to 80c max so I'll be making so some changes there as well using a diverter valve and inline oil thermostat should do the trick.

I'll be posting more on the tuning aspect of 50/50 to completion. I recently helped a fellow HPF enthusiast convert over to the new map with breakpoints and 50/50... He's a happy camper


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