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Political Talk
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Old 10-24-2013, 04:10 PM   #61
NFRs2000nyc
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Originally Posted by 'busa View Post
So one of them takes what, only cash, now?

The other finds it more profitable to not have an income than to operate"under Obamacare" which hasn't even really taken place yet?
Not really, its all about operating costs. A doctor taking cash only is CHEAPER for the customer (those that have some money, middle class) and the doctor makes more profit, since not only does he keep 100% of the money (instead of insurance sending him a check for 20% of the bill) but he can fire all of his staff. No need for book-keepers, no need for 3-10 clerks to deal with insurance paperwork, etc. Its much easier. Even if the money was the same (it isn't) it's worth it for doctors not to deal with the insurance BS.
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Old 10-24-2013, 06:03 PM   #62
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Re: The Shutdown Aftermath.

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Originally Posted by NFRs2000nyc View Post
Not really, its all about operating costs. A doctor taking cash only is CHEAPER for the customer (those that have some money, middle class) and the doctor makes more profit, since not only does he keep 100% of the money (instead of insurance sending him a check for 20% of the bill) but he can fire all of his staff. No need for book-keepers, no need for 3-10 clerks to deal with insurance paperwork, etc. Its much easier. Even if the money was the same (it isn't) it's worth it for doctors not to deal with the insurance BS.
Which all sounds like a cogent and concise argument for a single-payer system. I would imagine the chunk of each health care dollar dissipated and thus wasted on such administrative overhead is immense.
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Old 10-24-2013, 06:14 PM   #63
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Which all sounds like a cogent and concise argument for a single-payer system. I would imagine the chunk of each health care dollar dissipated and thus wasted on such administrative overhead is immense.
Single payer systems don't work.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-19577489

Some countries can get them to function (although nowhere near the standard of the US) if they have a homogenous society and heavy taxes, but most are a failure on either end of the spectrum.

Health insurance is no different that house, auto, etc etc. Insurance is insurance. It all runs the same exact way. The only way to fix the issue is to allow interstate competition, have health insurance be completely tax deductible, and reform malpractice laws. The ONLY part of Obamacare I like (well, 2 parts actually) are

1) Pre-existing conditions...I think by law, insurance companies MUST take you, but they also (like bad drivers with bad records) can charge you accordingly.

2) 80% law...that 80% (I'd drop it to 75%) of the money taken in MUST be spent on healthcare and not on administration.

The above will slash premiums by over 80% and most of those in the country with a on the books job will have insurance overnight. The money the government DOESN'T get because people deducted the healthcare premiums from their taxes will be a fraction of what a system like Obamacare will cost.

Im the first person that wants to reform heathcare, but Obamacare isn't it.
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Old 10-24-2013, 09:39 PM   #64
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The Shutdown Aftermath.

Also thought this was interesting. The last reports I read claimed 300,000 people signed up for obamacare. Over 400,000 have had their insurance cancelled.

http://m.nbcnews.com/health/thousand...ces-8C11417913

That means, during this sign up problem (disregarding the fact that the new plans are more expensive) if you get sick after you get your cancellation letter but before you are able to get Obamacare, you're up sh!ts creek.


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Old 10-25-2013, 07:14 AM   #65
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http://washingtonexaminer.com/carefi...rticle/2537782

Carefirst dropping 76,000 insureds due to Obamacare
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Old 10-27-2013, 09:49 AM   #66
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500,000 losing plans in Kalifornia

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner...wesley-j-smith
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Old 10-27-2013, 10:55 AM   #67
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So, can someone explain to me in a succinct and easy to understand manner why insurers are dropping customers due to ACA?

no flaming please.
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Old 10-27-2013, 11:32 AM   #68
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So, can someone explain to me in a succinct and easy to understand manner why insurers are dropping customers due to ACA?

no flaming please.
Maybe running their rounds of people they determine to a considerable/moderate risk? Instead of cutting into profits paying these people's medical bills...leave them find insurance on the marketplace. Insurance companies are holding on to people who will likely not visit a hospital anytime in the future (keep money in vs going out).

Last edited by badfast; 10-27-2013 at 11:33 AM.
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Old 10-27-2013, 04:18 PM   #69
NFRs2000nyc
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So, can someone explain to me in a succinct and easy to understand manner why insurers are dropping customers due to ACA?

no flaming please.
No simple explanation honestly. A big part of it is their added cost (lower profit) of insuring high risk (pre-existing conditions) so it makes financial sense to drop certain patients. Another huge chunk of it is they are getting rid of the plans (not really dropping patients.) Many people (like those in this thread for instance) are healthy adults in the 18-45 group without any real health problems. They are active, they lift bro, they hike, eat right, etc. Before the ACA, people like that could just have a "catastrophic plan" which covers truly unforseen things (breaking bones, heart attack out of nowhere, gun shot wound, whatever) but things like doctors visits, medication, etc are all out of pocket (at a very reasonable cost, far cheaper than paying constantly for insurance.) Those catastrophic plans were very reasonably priced, (under $100 a month in most states) and as a result, many could afford them. Now, insurance companies are forced to include crap that not everyone wants FOR EVERYONE, ie, maternity costs (some women don't want kids right?) and things of that nature. As a result, catastrophic plans are basically against the law, and all the plans these people had are getting sh!tcanned. So, a $100 a month plan is now going to be a $300-$500 a month plan (granted, it will cover more, but the person may never need it/use it/want it,) with a 12K deductible...and many can't afford it, and/or wont get it. One of the easiest ways to look at it is this...

Say you're hungry, and really want a burger...you have a choice (before ACA) where you can go to a restaurant, and grab a burger for $10. Choice #2 (after the ACA) basically forces you to go to a buffet for $40, where they have 401 food items, including burgers. Sure, you get your burger, but you paid for 400 items you had no interest in or didn't want.
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Old 10-27-2013, 04:24 PM   #70
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Maybe running their rounds of people they determine to a considerable/moderate risk? Instead of cutting into profits paying these people's medical bills...leave them find insurance on the marketplace. Insurance companies are holding on to people who will likely not visit a hospital anytime in the future (keep money in vs going out).
Definitely part of it. The can basically jerk people around until the law goes into full effect (as well as enforcement) which can be YEARS. As a result, they can keep the money in house longer.
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Old 10-27-2013, 10:27 PM   #71
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Originally Posted by NFRs2000nyc View Post

Say you're hungry, and really want a burger...you have a choice (before ACA) where you can go to a restaurant, and grab a burger for $10. Choice #2 (after the ACA) basically forces you to go to a buffet for $40, where they have 401 food items, including burgers. Sure, you get your burger, but you paid for 400 items you had no interest in or didn't want.
nice analogy
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