E46 BMW Social Directory E46 FAQ 3-Series Discussion Forums BMW Photo Gallery BMW 3-Series Technical Information E46 Fanatics - The Ultimate BMW Resource BMW Vendors General E46 Forum The Tire Rack's Tire Wheel Forum Forced Induction Forum The Off-Topic The E46 BMW Showroom For Sale, For Trade or Wanting to Buy

Welcome to the E46Fanatics forums. E46Fanatics is the premiere website for BMW 3 series owners around the world with interactive forums, a geographical enthusiast directory, photo galleries, and technical information for BMW enthusiasts.

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact contact us.

Go Back   E46Fanatics > Everything Else > The Off-Topic > Political Talk

Political Talk
You may discuss anything regarding politics in this forum ONLY. If you cannot respect others opinions, your access to this forum will be removed.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 02-14-2014, 01:30 AM   #1
bimmerfan08
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Cornwallis had his final ass kicking
Posts: 4,891
My Ride: E46 M3
Judge deems Virginia’s same-sex marriage ban unconstitutional

Making progress.

Quote:
Ruling by U.S. District Judge Arenda Wright Allen sets the stage for a possible Supreme Court showdown, though cases from Utah and Oklahoma also are headed that way

A federal judge in Virginia has struck down the state's prohibition on same-sex marriage, joining a growing list of state and federal courts that have granted gay and lesbian couples the right to marry following two landmark Supreme Court rulings in June.

U.S. District Court Judge Arenda Wright Allen's ruling had been expected since the case was heard in her Norfolk courtroom last week. Also as expected, she blocked it from taking immediate effect until appeals are heard. As a result, gay marriages in Virginia cannot begin yet.

"Gay and lesbian individuals share the same capacity as heterosexual individuals to form, preserve and celebrate loving, intimate and lasting relationships," Wright Allen said. "Such relationships are created through the exercise of sacred, personal choices — choices, like the choices made by every other citizen, that must be free from unwarranted government interference."

Her decision follows similar rulings in Oklahoma and Utah, even more conservative states, where federal judges recently struck down gay marriage bans. Those cases are scheduled to be heard a week apart by a federal appeals court panel in April; the Virginia case now joins them in a race toward the Supreme Court.

And in recent days, Nevada state officials decided they could no longer defend the state's same-sex marriage ban, and a judge in Kentucky ruled that the state must recognize gay marriages from other states.

Seventeen states and the District of Columbia allow same-sex marriage. Since the high court last June restored gay marriage rights in California and struck down a portion of the federal Defense of Marriage Act, Hawaii and Illinois joined the passed new laws, and state courts in New Jersey and New Mexico legalized the practice. Nearly four dozen lawsuits remain pending in 24 states.

Wright Allen's opinion, like others in recent months, made note of the high court's ruling last year that the federal law denying benefits to legally married same-sex couples violated the Constitution's guarantees of equal protection and due process.

"The court is compelled to conclude that Virginia's marriage laws unconstitutionally deny Virginia's gay and lesbian citizens the fundamental freedom to choose to marry," Wright Allen wrote. "Government interests in perpetuating traditions, shielding state matters from federal interference, and favoring one model of parenting over others must yield to this country's cherished protections that ensure the exercise of the private choices of the individual citizen regarding love and family."

The judge referred liberally to Supreme Court cases in the past that struck down bans on interracial marriage, state sodomy laws and, just last year, a key section of the federal Defense of Marriage Act.

"Tradition is revered in the Commonwealth, and often rightly so," she said. "However, tradition alone cannot justify denying same-sex couples the right to marry any more than it could justify Virginia's ban on interracial marriage."

Using unusually sweeping language, she concluded: "We have arrived upon another moment in history when 'We the People' becomes more inclusive, and our freedom more perfect."

While gay rights groups heralded the ruling, it was criticized harshly by the National Organization for Marriage, which opposes same-sex unions.

"This is another example of an Obama-appointed judge twisting the Constitution and the rule of law to impose her own views of marriage in defiance of the people of Virginia," said Brian Brown, the group's president. "We hope that the U.S. Supreme Court ends up reversing this terrible decision."

The Virginia ban, passed by voters in 2006, had suffered several blows in recent months. First came the decision by Theodore Olson and David Boies, high-powered litigators who successfully challenged California's Proposition 8 ban last year, to join the legal team representing two gay and lesbian couples. Then came the announcement by newly elected state Attorney General Mark Herring, a Democrat, that Virginia would stop defending its law and join those seeking to defeat it.

Herring hailed Wright Allen's ruling Thursday night. "This decision is a victory for the Constitution and for treating everyone equally under the law," he said. "It is the latest step in a journey towards equality for all Virginians, no matter who they are or whom they love."

Olson, Boies and state Solicitor General Stuart Raphael joined forces at the hearing in Wright Allen's court. They compared the ban on same-sex marriages, civil unions and domestic partnerships to Virginia's discriminatory history of blocking school integration, interracial marriage and the right of women to attend Virginia Military Institute.

"Marriage is a fundamental right. The United States Supreme Court has said that something like 14 times, by my count," said Olson, a former U.S. solicitor general under George W. Bush. The ban "denies them equal dignity because of who they are."

Stripped of the state's backing, the ban was left to be defended by lawyers for two local circuit court clerks whose jobs include issuing marriage licenses. They raised myriad issues, ranging from Virginia's 400-year tradition of heterosexual marriage and states' jurisdiction over domestic matters to the contention that marriage should be reserved for couples that can procreate.

"Marriage and procreation are fundamental to the very existence and survival of the race," said Austin Nimocks of the conservative Alliance Defending Freedom. "Every child has a mother and a father."

Wright Allen said the "for-the-children" rationale fails "because it would threaten the legitimacy of marriages involving post-menopausal women, infertile individuals, and individuals who choose to refrain from procreating."

The couples at the center of the case are Tim Bostic, an English professor, and Tony London, a real estate agent, who filed the lawsuit in Norfolk last July, as well as Carol Schall, an autism researcher, and Mary Townley, who works with special needs youth. Schall and Townley, whose marriage in California isn't recognized by Virginia, have a teenage daughter.

Another lawsuit in western Virginia, filed by Lambda Legal and the American Civil Liberties Union, was certified last week as a class action by federal District Court Judge Michael Urbanski. That means all gay and lesbian couples seeking to marry or have their marriages recognized could be affected by the outcome.
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/n...riage/5473687/
__________________


Quote:
"I think it's very important to have a feedback loop, where you're constantly thinking about what you've done and how you could be doing it better. I think that's the single best piece of advice: constantly think about how you could be doing things better and questioning yourself."

Last edited by bimmerfan08; 02-14-2014 at 08:05 AM. Reason: Auto-save 1392383153
bimmerfan08 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2014, 07:35 AM   #2
Act of God
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: NY
Posts: 334
My Ride: Beach Cruiser
Send a message via AIM to Act of God
Kewl
__________________
“They have the guns and therefore we are for peace and for reformation through the ballot. When we have the guns then it will be through the bullet.” - Saul Alinsky, quoting Lenin

"You don’t burn books because they’re irrelevant. You burn books because you’re terrified that they’re not. You don’t muzzle people who have no audience. You muzzle people only when their voices are amplified far beyond your liking."
Act of God is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2014, 07:52 AM   #3
Cabrio330
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Smyrna
Posts: 127
My Ride: 2005 330cic ZHP
Too bad this judge doesn't know the difference between the Constitution and the Declaration of Independence. Just sayin'....
Cabrio330 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2014, 08:03 AM   #4
bimmerfan08
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Cornwallis had his final ass kicking
Posts: 4,891
My Ride: E46 M3
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cabrio330 View Post
Too bad this judge doesn't know the difference between the Constitution and the Declaration of Independence. Just sayin'....


Hey, hey now. He/she could've fell asleep during politics and government class like a lot us.
__________________


Quote:
"I think it's very important to have a feedback loop, where you're constantly thinking about what you've done and how you could be doing it better. I think that's the single best piece of advice: constantly think about how you could be doing things better and questioning yourself."

Last edited by bimmerfan08; 02-14-2014 at 08:06 AM.
bimmerfan08 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2014, 08:46 AM   #5
Lair
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Sea level
Posts: 321
My Ride: e90, cheap Boxster
Jesus ain't gonna like this.
__________________

Quote:
It's the best years of your life they want to steal.
Congratulations.
Lair is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2014, 09:03 AM   #6
badfast
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Northern Korea
Posts: 560
My Ride: A Car
Love the defense's argument.

Quote:
They raised myriad issues, ranging from Virginia's 400-year tradition of heterosexual marriage and states' jurisdiction over domestic matters to the contention that marriage should be reserved for couples that can procreate.
badfast is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2014, 10:15 AM   #7
NOVAbimmer
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: VA
Posts: 12,593
My Ride: 14 Impala FXST M796
I didn't even realize we had a same sex marriage ban.
__________________
NOVAbimmer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2014, 10:16 AM   #8
Sentaruu
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: NY
Posts: 848
My Ride: Xterra
Quote:
Originally Posted by badfast View Post
Love the defense's argument.
yeah, that's always been something that has irked me.
__________________
Sentaruu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2014, 10:18 AM   #9
NFRs2000nyc
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: NYC/NJ
Posts: 893
My Ride: 2003 FormulaRedS2000
On a similar note...

http://www.ibtimes.com/kansas-bill-c...sbians-1555369

This bill basically is a fight between an individual's right to conduct a business in accordance with their beliefs and freedom vs the right of the protected class...I guess private property rights vs civil rights. I personally believe in discrimination on private property, but that's just my opinion. I think a gay bar owner should have the right to only allow gay men in, a christian bakery should be allowed to only serve catholic weddings, etc, but Im sure Im in the minority on this issue. I don't think it's right for anyone to be forced to do or serve someone they don't want to.
__________________
NFRs2000nyc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2014, 10:33 AM   #10
Sentaruu
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: NY
Posts: 848
My Ride: Xterra
Quote:
Originally Posted by NFRs2000nyc View Post
On a similar note...

http://www.ibtimes.com/kansas-bill-c...sbians-1555369

This bill basically is a fight between an individual's right to conduct a business in accordance with their beliefs and freedom vs the right of the protected class...I guess private property rights vs civil rights. I personally believe in discrimination on private property, but that's just my opinion. I think a gay bar owner should have the right to only allow gay men in, a christian bakery should be allowed to only serve catholic weddings, etc, but Im sure Im in the minority on this issue. I don't think it's right for anyone to be forced to do or serve someone they don't want to.
I agree with you there.
__________________
Sentaruu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2014, 10:39 AM   #11
phrozen06
Registered User
 
phrozen06's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: 39°27'33"N 77°58'04"W
Posts: 7,535
My Ride: E46, E92 M3, R32 VW
Send a message via Yahoo to phrozen06
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lair View Post
Jesus ain't gonna like this.
You mean Yeshua. The letter J didn't come into being until the 1600's. Did Yeshua speak against homosexuality, He did however address adultry? Paul addressed it when he was correcting the Roman Church, and Deuteronomy. Btw King James was a homosexual.
__________________


phrozen06 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2014, 12:16 PM   #12
5ynd1cat3
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Cincinnati
Posts: 485
My Ride: swagger wagon
The tyranny continues.


Sent from BimmerApp mobile app
__________________
5ynd1cat3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2014, 12:22 PM   #13
NFRs2000nyc
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: NYC/NJ
Posts: 893
My Ride: 2003 FormulaRedS2000
Quote:
Originally Posted by 5ynd1cat3 View Post
The tyranny continues.


Sent from BimmerApp mobile app
wut?
__________________
NFRs2000nyc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2014, 01:16 PM   #14
bagher
Registered User
 
bagher's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Vienna, VA
Posts: 17,876
My Ride: Neocon outrage
Send a message via AIM to bagher Send a message via Skype™ to bagher
Quote:
Originally Posted by NOVAbimmer View Post
I didn't even realize we had a same sex marriage ban.
pretty sure only missionary position sex with your wife is legal in VA
__________________
** Removed **
bagher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2014, 01:36 PM   #15
NOVAbimmer
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: VA
Posts: 12,593
My Ride: 14 Impala FXST M796
Quote:
Originally Posted by bagher View Post
pretty sure only missionary position sex with your wife is legal in VA

That's just because VA's sodomy law hasn't been thrown out yet. It may have been already, I don't know


Sent from BimmerApp mobile app
__________________
NOVAbimmer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2014, 01:42 PM   #16
bagher
Registered User
 
bagher's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Vienna, VA
Posts: 17,876
My Ride: Neocon outrage
Send a message via AIM to bagher Send a message via Skype™ to bagher
Quote:
Originally Posted by NOVAbimmer View Post
That's just because VA's sodomy law hasn't been thrown out yet. It may have been already, I don't know


Sent from BimmerApp mobile app
Didn't cuccinelli sue to get them reinstated
__________________
** Removed **
bagher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2014, 06:35 PM   #17
Zell
Registered User
 
Zell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: wow such city
Posts: 5,776
My Ride: Has no throttle
Quote:
Originally Posted by 5ynd1cat3 View Post
The tyranny continues.


Sent from BimmerApp mobile app
Freedom is such tyranny wow
__________________
Zell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2014, 08:19 PM   #18
MDydinanM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: East Coast
Posts: 754
My Ride: is a ///M
MDydinanM is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2014, 09:05 PM   #19
Marshmallow
Yacht Club Libertarian
 
Marshmallow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: South Joisey, Mid MI
Posts: 2,021
My Ride: E46, Quattros, Miata
Quote:
Originally Posted by NFRs2000nyc View Post
Im sure Im in the minority on this issue. I don't think it's right for anyone to be forced to do or serve someone they don't want to.

I support this as well. So far you have me and Sentaruu! You aren't alone!
__________________


2003 BMW 325xiT "Audrey"
1990 Audi 90 Quattro Sport 20v "Chloe"
1993 Audi 90 Quattro V6 "Lydia II"
1994 Mazda Miata R-Spec Race Prep "Natasha"

Marshmallow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2014, 10:14 PM   #20
NOVAbimmer
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: VA
Posts: 12,593
My Ride: 14 Impala FXST M796
Click image for larger version

Name:	ImageUploadedByBimmerApp1392434038.856333.jpg
Views:	73
Size:	66.0 KB
ID:	546606


Sent from BimmerApp mobile app
__________________
NOVAbimmer is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Censor is ON





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:37 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
(c) 1999 - 2011 performanceIX Inc - privacy policy - terms of use