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The Tire Rack's Tire & Wheel Forum
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Old 06-22-2002, 09:22 PM   #1
mcabr
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If you let air out of tires before shipping does weight decrease?

I am shipping some wheels to a guy and he asked me if I let any air out of the tires. Does that decrease weight at all? I thought that air was just measured in pounds of pressure not actual weight that it would add to shipping.
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Old 06-22-2002, 09:39 PM   #2
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Fill them with Helium to make them lighter. j/k

I shipped my Type 44 17" wheels/tires with Fedex Ground and the cost was ~16 dollars each.
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Old 06-22-2002, 11:13 PM   #3
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not really...

(sorry for the general nerdiness of this post but I'm taking physics this summer)

actually air has a density of about 1.3 kilograms per meter cubed, which I'm pretty sure works out to be 0.00004697 pounds per cubic inch, which isn't very much at all. so no, letting the air out probably won't make that big of a difference. actually, you could figure it out if you knew your rim radius, tire radius, and tire width, but I promise it couldn't be much at all. plus letting the air out might screw up the balance, which your buyer might not appreciate.

just my 2 cents
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Old 06-22-2002, 11:20 PM   #4
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If I was buying, I'd want air in the tires (unless I specifically said I don't want air in them). But then, wouldn't that throw off the balance, etc. and what not? No?
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Old 06-22-2002, 11:30 PM   #5
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That is what I thought

I didn't think that air would matter but I am no science buff so I just thought that I would ask. The guy I am shipping to wanted to pay less for shipping so he asked me that. Well I didn't think that was possible. I got ripped on shipping because I paid 40 for boxes and then 107 for shipping and then ebay took like 13 bucks for fees. Whatever.
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Old 06-22-2002, 11:44 PM   #6
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Rotate your air...

Does it still have the winter air installed? If it does, you should swap to summer air immediately for better performance.

Switch back to winter air when it starts to get cold again.

Those of you in California can continue to use your "all-season" air without concern.

Check local shipping laws to see if your recipient's state allows unlicensed importation of used tire air. He may be liable for importation duties or fines if the air is not declared at the border.

Watch for next week's tech bulletin on muffler bearings.

- Rob
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Old 06-23-2002, 12:15 AM   #7
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Re: Rotate your air...

Quote:
Originally posted by Rob Levinson * UUC Motorwerks
Does it still have the winter air installed? If it does, you should swap to summer air immediately for better performance.

Switch back to winter air when it starts to get cold again.

Those of you in California can continue to use your "all-season" air without concern.

Check local shipping laws to see if your recipient's state allows unlicensed importation of used tire air. He may be liable for importation duties or fines if the air is not declared at the border.

Watch for next week's tech bulletin on muffler bearings.

- Rob
You're kidding right???
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Old 06-23-2002, 01:19 AM   #8
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Re: Rotate your air...

Quote:
Originally posted by Rob Levinson * UUC Motorwerks
Does it still have the winter air installed? If it does, you should swap to summer air immediately for better performance.

Switch back to winter air when it starts to get cold again.

Those of you in California can continue to use your "all-season" air without concern.

Check local shipping laws to see if your recipient's state allows unlicensed importation of used tire air. He may be liable for importation duties or fines if the air is not declared at the border.

Watch for next week's tech bulletin on muffler bearings.

- Rob
Isn't there a federal law on this as well?
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Old 06-23-2002, 08:39 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally posted by Sean`02///325ci
well there are 2 good reasons i can think of other than weight savings to let air outof the tires.
1.) Air pressure increases with temperature and your buyer mght be aware of this fact and does not want to risk getting blown tires by FedEx. It can get pretty hot inside those trucks.

2.) Without air the tire by itself acts like a soft suspension absorbing those little shocks instead of the rims getting the brunt of it.
I hate to disappoint you, but in regards to the above:

1) It would have to be well into the hundreds of degrees to worry about that. The boxes would be in danger of bursting into flame before increased tire pressure from heat was a factor.

2) Just the opposite - an inflated tire protects the rim better.

How to ship wheels with tires mounted:

- Leave them inflated fully.

- Tape a big circular piece of cardboard to each side to protect the wheel itself.

- Use lots of tape around the entire assembly to make sure the cardboard does not come off.

- Rob
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Last edited by Rob Levinson * UUC Motorwerks; 06-23-2002 at 12:48 PM.
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Old 06-23-2002, 12:45 PM   #10
als
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Like this, Eddie gave me this:
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Old 06-23-2002, 02:09 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by Rob Levinson * UUC Motorwerks


I hate to disappoint you, but in regards to the above:

1) It would have to be well into the hundreds of degrees to worry about that. The boxes would be in danger of bursting into flame before increased tire pressure from heat was a factor.

2) Just the opposite - an inflated tire protects the rim better.

How to ship wheels with tires mounted:

- Leave them inflated fully.

- Tape a big circular piece of cardboard to each side to protect the wheel itself.

- Use lots of tape around the entire assembly to make sure the cardboard does not come off.

- Rob

Yup... that's how I ship wheels and how I have them shipped to me!


Plus, the shipping cost is pretty reasonable... it was less then $15 a wheel the last time I did it... from IL to NJ...


peace
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Old 06-23-2002, 04:07 PM   #12
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Re: Rotate your air...

Quote:
Originally posted by Rob Levinson * UUC Motorwerks
Does it still have the winter air installed? If it does, you should swap to summer air immediately for better performance.

Switch back to winter air when it starts to get cold again.

Those of you in California can continue to use your "all-season" air without concern.

Check local shipping laws to see if your recipient's state allows unlicensed importation of used tire air. He may be liable for importation duties or fines if the air is not declared at the border.

Watch for next week's tech bulletin on muffler bearings.

- Rob
Classic man, classic! You missed your calling as a writer! LOL
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Old 06-23-2002, 05:31 PM   #13
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So from oregon to florida

Is 107 total a good price? The wheels are going pretty far and I put some crosses of stacked cardboard on top and bottom to protect the wheel. Is Fedex the cheapest shipper?
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Old 06-23-2002, 08:58 PM   #14
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Re: Rotate your air...

Quote:
Originally posted by Rob Levinson * UUC Motorwerks
Does it still have the winter air installed? If it does, you should swap to summer air immediately for better performance.

Switch back to winter air when it starts to get cold again.

Those of you in California can continue to use your "all-season" air without concern.

Check local shipping laws to see if your recipient's state allows unlicensed importation of used tire air. He may be liable for importation duties or fines if the air is not declared at the border.

Watch for next week's tech bulletin on muffler bearings.

- Rob
In florida you can either use standard summer air and it's just fine too instead of paying that ungodly price for the special "all-season" crap they have out in CA.
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Old 06-23-2002, 09:19 PM   #15
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Re: Re: Rotate your air...

Quote:
Originally posted by EvilGenius
In florida you can either use standard summer air and it's just fine too instead of paying that ungodly price for the special "all-season" crap they have out in CA.
That may be so, but the CA air has a higher treadwear rating. That FL stuff is cheap but needs replacing more often.

If you can find a wrecked Toyota with original factory-fill air, use that stuff. The JDM air is really good, we can't get that stuff here. Some stupid EPA regulations or something like that.

Anybody else got a dead horse that needs beating?

- Rob
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Old 06-23-2002, 09:35 PM   #16
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Re: Re: Re: Rotate your air...

Quote:
Originally posted by Rob Levinson * UUC Motorwerks

Anybody else got a dead horse that needs beating?
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Old 06-24-2002, 08:23 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally posted by Sean`02///325ci
Hate to disappoint you Rob, but your first point makes little sense. It's a well know fact that any considerable increase in temperature will increase the air pressue and that compunded with any exterior force exerted on the tires can result in a blowout. i don't understand how can you attribute them to the boxes catching fire
Sean, I am not expressing any "opinion" here. A temperature increase that would change tire pressure noticeably to the point that the tire was harmed (i.e. a presure increase well over 70psi, or 90% greater than normal street pressure) would have to be around 300-500 degrees. Very hot track tire temps may be halfway to this point, and tire pressure does not increase anywhere near the safety limits of a tire's pressure. "Boxes bursting into flame" refers to the greater than 400 degree temp required for paper items to catch fire. Do you really think the inside of a UPS truck gets that hot?

Quote:
My second point is again dictated by common sense. One puts soft material like cotton wads or foam to prevent undue stress on any material. A concept similiar to a deflated tire acting as a soft material to absorb vibrations or shocks. a deflated tire or softer material absorbs shocks, an inflated tire will transfer shcoks to the next componet in queue and which is the rim i believe.
i don't understand how can you state that a inflated tire is a better deal here. i mean from any perspective you look at it the delfation will help not HARM the wheel. Very much like softer springs has less stress on the chassis unlike stiffer springs, because ....the former absorbs the vibrations and the latter transfer the shock waves.
Again, this logic is entirely backwards. A shipped tire does not see anywhere near the shocks that is does in normal driving! An inflated tire is specifically designed to protect a rim from shocks - that is the reason the pneumatic tire was invented, before that we had solid wooden wheels like on horse carts. And, to make things even worse, a deflated tire cannot even protect itself as well... if (and only "if" as I cannot imagine a shipping shock this great) the assembly took a solid hit, the deflated tire would be damaged by contact with the rim in a way that an inflated one would not. It's the exact same thing as driving on a flat tire - the tire doesn't come out so good, does it?

There seems to be something really wrong with some technical answers we see on a lot of message boards... the really wrong thing is "opinion". There are no "opinions" in a technical answer. You answer from solid facts or solid experience and guessing = garbage.

When a technical question is asked, I expect one of only three things: 1) solid numbers or 2) extensive experience, or 3) silence.

- Rob
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Old 06-24-2002, 08:28 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally posted by Rob Levinson * UUC Motorwerks

Again, this logic is entirely backwards. A shipped tire does not see anywhere near the shocks that is does in normal driving! An inflated tire is specifically designed to protect a rim from shocks - that is the reason the pneumatic tire was invented, before that we had solid wooden wheels like on horse carts. And, to make things even worse, a deflated tire cannot even protect itself as well... if (and only "if" as I cannot imagine a shipping shock this great) the assembly took a solid hit, the deflated tire would be damaged by contact with the rim in a way that an inflated one would not. It's the exact same thing as driving on a flat tire - the tire doesn't come out so good, does it?
Exactly what I was going to say!!!

Sean, using your logic, we should all be driving around with uninflated tires... which is probably the worst idea I've ever heard!

peace
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Old 06-24-2002, 08:40 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by atyclb
I just hope everybody has switched to aftermarket air at this point.

OEM air is for bimmer.org pansies!
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Old 06-24-2002, 08:46 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally posted by atyclb
I just hope everybody has switched to aftermarket air at this point.

OEM air is for bimmer.org pansies!
Okay, I was going to save this as a "new product release announcement" for when it is finally ready...

UUC is working on EPA-certified "Enhanced Pressure Air". By super-stacking oxygen molecules, we are able to get a 24.6% effective increase in air pressure without any additional weight! Drive around with normal comfort, and get racecar performance and low shipping weight all at the same time! Are my engineers cool guys, or what?

Now you can drive around and yell out the window to all your buds... tell 'em your latest mod, "EPA EPA!!!"

Part #EPA-WOT, only $49 per can

Oxygen sold seperately.

- Rob
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