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Old 08-28-2009, 06:19 PM   #441
Rayce185
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bmwbun View Post
Read your manual.

You bought and paid for a performance car.

If you want to rotate tires and extend your tire life to the maximum maybe you need to be driving a Ford Taurus.

.
A non-M being a performance car? This is news to me
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Old 08-28-2009, 06:25 PM   #442
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bmwbun. Shut up.
I guess I shouldn't be surprised that kpeng's guide to excess maintenance would include rotating tires.

BMW specifically and in writing recommends against rotating tires.

Any guesses why? Or maybe it's another evil plot by BMW to make more money?

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Old 08-28-2009, 06:31 PM   #443
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Originally Posted by bmwbun View Post
You've obviously never driven a Taurus.
Yes, I've only driven BMW all my life
Get your head out of your ass. A non-M isn't a performance car just because it handles better than the standard street car. Just because you guys only got the 6cyl versions with a 170hp entry base doesn't mean that every other car is a Taurus.


And yes, I have driven that Ford, along with loads of other vehicles equipped with a smaller engine
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Old 08-28-2009, 06:44 PM   #444
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You're a car guy then.

You probably already know why BMW recommends against rotating tires.
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Old 08-28-2009, 06:51 PM   #445
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yup, to prevent some noob from tigtening the lug bolts
or to prevent lawsuits from families whose father of the house got killed because of a collapsed trunk jack.... right?

Anyway, tires bed in, lots of tires are directional too. Meaning you can only swap them on the same side of the car front-back. Wear pattern is different front and rear.
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Old 08-29-2009, 04:08 AM   #446
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Originally Posted by Rayce185 View Post
Yes, I've only driven BMW all my life
Get your head out of your ass. A non-M isn't a performance car just because it handles better than the standard street car. Just because you guys only got the 6cyl versions with a 170hp entry base doesn't mean that every other car is a Taurus.


And yes, I have driven that Ford, along with loads of other vehicles equipped with a smaller engine
328i = 193hp
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i heard that this cars go like 300k miles
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Old 08-29-2009, 06:12 AM   #447
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Since u really sound like u know your bmw!!!
I just got in the bmw world!!! I have a 1999 323i manual e46 sedan this yellow light pictured as a tank with water in it keeps popping up what is that and do I have somthing to worry about
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Old 08-29-2009, 06:36 AM   #448
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Since u really sound like u know your bmw!!!
I just got in the bmw world!!! I have a 1999 323i manual e46 sedan this yellow light pictured as a tank with water in it keeps popping up what is that and do I have somthing to worry about
Your wiper fluid is low, homedawg.
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i heard that this cars go like 300k miles
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Old 08-29-2009, 09:51 AM   #449
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Since u really sound like u know your bmw!!!
I just got in the bmw world!!! I have a 1999 323i manual e46 sedan this yellow light pictured as a tank with water in it keeps popping up what is that and do I have somthing to worry about
Read your manual.
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Old 08-29-2009, 02:02 PM   #450
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Originally Posted by marcopolio View Post
328i = 193hp
Yea but a 323 has 170 which is the base model like he said
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I didn't know the 328 was the entry model
It wasn't.
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Old 08-29-2009, 06:23 PM   #451
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BMW does not recommend rotating tires because they have to take into account the lowest common denominator: the American driver. They realize that Americans (and increasingly the rest of the world, unfortunately) are a very letigious group and don't want to take responsibility for:

Jacking up their own car and having it fall on them.

Rotating larger rear tires to the front where they don't belong (people will do this, I've seen it on two occasions) and having an accident because the handling is adversely altered.

Tightening lug nuts too tight and warping rotors, etc.

I'm sure the BMW lawyers have thought up more, the fact is it is just easier for them to say "Don't do it", and have far fewer lawsuits. It's easier for them to print it in manuals distributed world-wide to avoid any confusion.

I've been rotating my (non staggered) tires for years and have never had a problem, on track or off. Many independent shops do it also and, yes, even a few dealers, non staggered set ups, of course.
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Old 08-29-2009, 06:34 PM   #452
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Quote:
Originally Posted by klax View Post
BMW does not recommend rotating tires because they have to take into account the lowest common denominator: the American driver. They realize that Americans (and increasingly the rest of the world, unfortunately) are a very letigious group and don't want to take responsibility for:

Jacking up their own car and having it fall on them.

Rotating larger rear tires to the front where they don't belong (people will do this, I've seen it on two occasions) and having an accident because the handling is adversely altered.

Tightening lug nuts too tight and warping rotors, etc.

I'm sure the BMW lawyers have thought up more, the fact is it is just easier for them to say "Don't do it", and have far fewer lawsuits. It's easier for them to print it in manuals distributed world-wide to avoid any confusion.

I've been rotating my (non staggered) tires for years and have never had a problem, on track or off. Many independent shops do it also and, yes, even a few dealers, non staggered set ups, of course.
Thank you. I rest my case.

If people are too stupid to properly mount tires in any way (not just rotating), then there is no more sense discussing this any further, as those people probably shouldn't do their own oil changes either etc, which undermines the intent of this entire thread.
All I know is that there are no real technical issues with the tires or the car if you rotate your (same sized) wheel setup. Human failure excluded.
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Old 08-29-2009, 07:00 PM   #453
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 23with@e4601! View Post
Since u really sound like u know your bmw!!!
I just got in the bmw world!!! I have a 1999 323i manual e46 sedan this yellow light pictured as a tank with water in it keeps popping up what is that and do I have somthing to worry about
if the light is shaped like a windscreen and there are squirts coming out the top......wait.... Then its probably your windshield fluid. But if the light is square with water at the bottom then you coolant it low, CHECK IT NOW.
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Old 08-30-2009, 11:02 AM   #454
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Why do you rotate tires? Cost. Rotating tires extends the life of your tires so you can therefore save money by rotating.

So why would BMW suggest to NOT rotate?

I believe the theory is this: don't rotate your tires and two of them will wear out at a time (i.e. the rear tires). Be prepared to replace two tires at a time, and the cost of not rotating tires balances out. In other words, rotate your tires and replace 4 tires, or don't and replace 2, albeit sooner and more frequently. I don't know if it actually balances out or not. Also, I drive an XI, so keeping tire diameters the same is more important than for you RWD guys. And of course, plenty of people don't like having old and new tires on their car, for whatever reason.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kpeng View Post
Get the hell out of my thread.
Bun wasn't doing a very good job of explaining the rationale, but he still has a good point and the thread benefits. At least, that's true if you think that we benefit from debate. Your maintenance guide is good and it helps a lot of people (myself included), but I don't think it's perfect.

Last edited by MileHiXi; 08-30-2009 at 11:06 AM.
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Old 08-30-2009, 11:14 AM   #455
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This thread is not for bickering about some silly detail. Please keep this thread on track.

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Old 08-30-2009, 11:31 AM   #456
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A whole bunch of threads just disappeared... interesting.
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Old 08-30-2009, 01:28 PM   #457
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Bun wasn't doing a very good job of explaining the rationale
No surprise there
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Old 08-30-2009, 03:30 PM   #458
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I wasn't even attempting to explain BMW's rationale for recommending against rotating tires.

I simply made the point that when you decide you want to do something that the car manufacturer specifically says not to do in their owners manual, you ought to have an understanding why they recommend against it.

Additionally, you ought to have an idea in your head as to the benefits you intend to gain that more than offset the negatives that drive BMW's recommendation.

Unless of course you just prefer doing excess maintenance. Then you should rotate them weekly, more often if you're a true Fanatic.

.

Last edited by bmwbun; 08-30-2009 at 03:37 PM.
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Old 08-30-2009, 04:30 PM   #459
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Ken, what about engine/transmission mounts? OEM replacements or other?
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Old 08-30-2009, 04:40 PM   #460
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Ken, what about engine/transmission mounts? OEM replacements or other?
Umm i think the manual recommends not replacing these...




































jk
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