E46 Chassis News Nitto Invo - E46 Chassis Street and Track Review

Nitto's newest tire, the Invo has been getting a lot of attention around here, and with the 330i in need of new tires it only made sense to get a set and see what they were all about.

First thing you'll notice when you see the tires is the very atypical tread design. I've become very accustom to the highly directional, swooping tread design seen on so many high performance tires. My first reaction was not the most positive, but as I got use to the design it really grew on me. The highly angular lines in the tread blocks has an edge to it that you don't find on any other tire.

With a brand new set of tires, I figured I should get a new set of wheels to match. I love the look of the Velocity Motoring CSL style wheels, so much that I simply order up another set from them (read about how I started the CSL wheel craze here). I took my shiny new wheels and tires to the great guys at Bavarian Performance Group. If you're in the Boston area I really can't say enough about the service BPG provides. They're close to the city (new location in Winchester) and support the local enthusiasts and racers.

With the new tires on the first thing I noticed was the noise level, or I should say the lack of noise. The difference in noise level was significant, especially on the highway. This has made highway cruising that much nicer, and I noticed that the Invos don't seem to tramline on road ruts, which around here is basically all roads.

My first thought was that in exchange for the reduction in noise I was going to get tires that didn't have what I wanted in the grip department, but I was wrong. Around town the grip levels were at least what I was expecting and then at the track they were even better! At the track it took me a session and some advice to get my tire pressures right, but once I got that dialed in the tires were excellent. I got great braking feedback feel and noise and tons of feedback on the corners with slightly less squeal than I was expecting. With the great feedback there was a couple times when I keep my foot in with confidence when I know I would have backed off with a less responsive and grippy tire.

With a track day and a good number of street miles on the Invos I have to say that I'm a fan. The combination of great handling, road noise, street-ability and track-ability add up to an all around excellent tire. If you're in the market for a new set of tires check out the new Nitto Invos, I don't think you'll be disappointed!

For more technical details, sizing, and the official website see this thread -
http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=565645

For other enthusiasts reviews see these threads -
http://bimmerfest.com/forums/showpos...61&postcount=3
http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=591945

I was going to start a thread: 'tram-lining gone' after my six or so weeks with the invos in 18" dimension. I never got round to it but it's so true no more tramlining especially on the highway...

would you compare these tires to t1-r's or even PS2's?? as far as overall performance.

nice review, had mine for about 5 months now, love them on the street dry and rain.

Originally Posted by mcr_driver

would you compare these tires to t1-r's or even PS2's?? as far as overall performance.

This bimmerfest member reviewed them vs the PS2 -

http://bimmerfest.com/forums/showpos...61&postcount=3

Tim

got these same tires on my 20's for my m5.........love them so far, but i haven't tested these in wet conditions yet

These look pretty sweet, anyone know their approx life?

Not wanting to be the first to put negativity in this thread... but I have herd that this tire has a "squishy" side wall. I like good response from my tires and my car. I'm considering these and I don't think this would sway me too much as they seem to be a very nice set of tred. I've been a big fan of the 555 before prduction was cut. Those of you that are running these tires how do you feel about this aspect? I've seen many very good comments and more than a couple very hateful ones. But not any coming from a BMW driver.

i have this tire on both my c-class and e60 535i........i love it so much.. great price with quiet and good response on dry and rain......i had t1-R before...not as quiet as invo....

Thanks bro!

I love the INVO -- it grips well and definitely does its job of reducing as much road noise as possible. it's a very comfortable and performance=oriented tire...also great in the rain. Had them on my M3 for the last year ,and they wear well, too

and theyre not _too_ expensive. I only wish they made them in 275 -- becuase I use invos i haveto run 285's out back :/

wheres the best place to get nittos? tirerack doesnt carry them apparently

nevermind.. i found out they dont make invos in 265/30/19

I have a set for sale. haha pm me. 255 35 20 and 285 30 20

Originally Posted by koven

nevermind.. i found out they dont make invos in 265/30/19

I saw that too

I have a set and do not like them.
In the morning they feel squishy or not sure footed. WHen they get warm they feel better but it takes a while.
After 20K miles they're still mostly quiet but it's the tread design that is the reason because they are very hard tires.
At least they last a while. I love the radical look of the tread design.
Not bad but if you're looking for bang for the buck I'd recommend Yokohama S.Drive or Bridgestone RE960 over the Invo.

i need to change the rear tires on my m3.. and i found this deal on ebay.. you guys think i should buy it?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/2-NEW...mZ370065368577
they are good for an m3?

cool

Originally Posted by mcr_driver

would you compare these tires to t1-r's or even PS2's?? as far as overall performance.

To answer this question and to weigh in on a very important vehicle option - tires - there is no comparison.

I bought my '04 ZHP coupe w/ PS2's already on it in July, 2007. Within the last month, the rears finally needed replacing (one was completely flat w/ no repair option - I had two nails within 90-degrees of each other). I researched tires and opted to go for the Nitto Invos as replacements (rear ONLY - my fronts are fine) based on this and other threads. Pros/Cons to everything in life but here's the breakdown of my experience:

• I gambled based on another thread (don't recall where) when mixing the existing PS2's as fronts and the new Nitto Invo's as rears. It didn't work out in this instance and is only fair in pointing this out when presenting my experiences with the Nittos. Having said that, there are other factors here that prompted me to actually register w/ e46fanatics so I could share my experience - tire choice is IMPORTANT!
• Tramlining was awful and immediately apparent. I increased the tire pressure for the Nittos up to 40psi (another forum post recommendation) and that resulted in marginal improvement. Still nothing I would consider acceptable. It's certainly possible that the exaggerated feel I experienced was also related to the mix in tire dynamics (PS2 fronts; Nitto Invo rears). Regardless, holding a straight line on the freeway at cruising speeds was not possible. Taking a long-radius turn (freeway) at anything other than Ford-Fiesta speeds was uncomfortable - my ZHP had been demoted.
  
  There are numerous other posts w/out mixed fronts/rears who have also complained of tramlining. A six-week break-in period for a tire might be OK to some but it wasn't palatable to me at all.
• Sidewall strength was noticeably weaker. Flex was easily felt and left me very uncomfortable when taking my normal route to work (90+% freeway travel with 3 long radius transitions from one freeway to another).
• These rears do NOT hook up. It was very easy to get the rears to lose grip under higher than average acceleration but well below WOT off the line (straight line speed or diving through a corner w/out DSC enabled). I know they were brand new but the "sticky" factor that the PS2s ALWAYS had just wasn't there.

All said, I had the Nittos for rears for 2 weeks total - approximately 300 miles worth of travel. My local Discount Tire was nice enough to immediately respond to my concerns and ordered my PS2 replacements and even matched a much better price I found at a competitor. As soon as I got my new PS2s on and returned the Nittos to Discount, my ZHP was once again my ZHP.

The difference can't accurately be summed up in a forum post but I couldn't ever recommend the Nittos. For those out there having better luck or who are happy and satisfied with their Nittos.........GREAT!!! I'm not posting to bash Nitto but forum posts are often very persuasive so I wanted others to get a PS2 --> Nitto --> PS2 comparison. I haven't seen anyone else post any real comparison information so thought it was time. Obviously, I have no hard data other than what I experienced from my driver's seat so do with this what you want.

Take care.......

--TLI

Originally Posted by tli

To answer this question and to weigh in on a very important vehicle option - tires - there is no comparison.

I bought my '04 ZHP coupe w/ PS2's already on it in July, 2007. Within the last month, the rears finally needed replacing (one was completely flat w/ no repair option - I had two nails within 90-degrees of each other). I researched tires and opted to go for the Nitto Invos as replacements (rear ONLY - my fronts are fine) based on this and other threads. Pros/Cons to everything in life but here's the breakdown of my experience:

• I gambled based on another thread (don't recall where) when mixing the existing PS2's as fronts and the new Nitto Invo's as rears. It didn't work out in this instance and is only fair in pointing this out when presenting my experiences with the Nittos. Having said that, there are other factors here that prompted me to actually register w/ e46fanatics so I could share my experience - tire choice is IMPORTANT!
• Tramlining was awful and immediately apparent. I increased the tire pressure for the Nittos up to 40psi (another forum post recommendation) and that resulted in marginal improvement. Still nothing I would consider acceptable. It's certainly possible that the exaggerated feel I experienced was also related to the mix in tire dynamics (PS2 fronts; Nitto Invo rears). Regardless, holding a straight line on the freeway at cruising speeds was not possible. Taking a long-radius turn (freeway) at anything other than Ford-Fiesta speeds was uncomfortable - my ZHP had been demoted.
  
  There are numerous other posts w/out mixed fronts/rears who have also complained of tramlining. A six-week break-in period for a tire might be OK to some but it wasn't palatable to me at all.
• Sidewall strength was noticeably weaker. Flex was easily felt and left me very uncomfortable when taking my normal route to work (90+% freeway travel with 3 long radius transitions from one freeway to another).
• These rears do NOT hook up. It was very easy to get the rears to lose grip under higher than average acceleration but well below WOT off the line (straight line speed or diving through a corner w/out DSC enabled). I know they were brand new but the "sticky" factor that the PS2s ALWAYS had just wasn't there.

All said, I had the Nittos for rears for 2 weeks total - approximately 300 miles worth of travel. My local Discount Tire was nice enough to immediately respond to my concerns and ordered my PS2 replacements and even matched a much better price I found at a competitor. As soon as I got my new PS2s on and returned the Nittos to Discount, my ZHP was once again my ZHP.

The difference can't accurately be summed up in a forum post but I couldn't ever recommend the Nittos. For those out there having better luck or who are happy and satisfied with their Nittos.........GREAT!!! I'm not posting to bash Nitto but forum posts are often very persuasive so I wanted others to get a PS2 --> Nitto --> PS2 comparison. I haven't seen anyone else post any real comparison information so thought it was time. Obviously, I have no hard data other than what I experienced from my driver's seat so do with this what you want.

Take care.......

--TLI

When I heard about the Nitto's, I also did the same thing as you, that is first replace the rears as a test measure. In my case though, tramlining did not increase with this mixed match-up and in addition I continued taking corners like before. True, though, regarding tire-roll. Further research led me to increasing the tire pressure than for OEM, upon which tire-roll was eliminated. Despite the side-wall roll, I couldn't really pinpoint anything the Nitto's lacked over the Michelins (for street use). It was at this point that I was motivated to go NITTO all-round and guess what: I immediately felt a noticeable decrease in tram-lining. To this day, tram-lining is no longer that big of an issue as was with the Michelins. And finally, driving in rain has been as assured as it was when I had the OEM tires. I can safely say, despite/especially for the price paid, these tires perform well for street paces...