E46 BMW Social Directory E46 FAQ 3-Series Discussion Forums BMW Photo Gallery BMW 3-Series Technical Information E46 Fanatics - The Ultimate BMW Resource BMW Vendors General E46 Forum The Tire Rack's Tire Wheel Forum Forced Induction Forum The Off-Topic The E46 BMW Showroom For Sale, For Trade or Wanting to Buy

Welcome to the E46Fanatics forums. E46Fanatics is the premiere website for BMW 3 series owners around the world with interactive forums, a geographical enthusiast directory, photo galleries, and technical information for BMW enthusiasts.

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact contact us.

Go Back   E46Fanatics > E46 BMW > General E46 Forum

General E46 Forum
This is the place to get answers, opinions and everything you need related to your E46 (sedan, coupe, convertible and wagon) BMW!

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 06-03-2009, 03:16 PM   #1
jeffro3000
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 2,812
My Ride: 2000 328i
Exclamation Interesting info regarding oil drain interval

http://www.sae.org/technical/papers/2007-01-4133
Quote:
Abstract:

Engine oils are subjected to a series of industry standard engine dynamometer tests to measure their wear protection capability, sludge and varnish formation tendencies, and fuel efficiency among several other performance attributes before they are approved for use in customer engines. However, these performance attributes are measured at the end of tests and therefore, do not provide any information on how the properties have changed during the tests. In one of our previous studies it was observed that engine oil samples collected from fleet vehicles after 12,000 mile drain interval showed 10-15% lower friction and more importantly, an order of magnitude lower wear rate than those of fresh oils. It was also observed that the composition of the tribochemical films formed was quite different on the surface tested with the drain oils from those formed with fresh oils. The objective of this investigation is to demonstrate how the friction and wear performance changed with oil drain intervals. A fleet of three vehicles was run in Las Vegas and oil samples were collected at various drain intervals from 3,000 miles to 15,000 miles. As in the previous study, the results showed that the aged engine oils provide lower friction and much improved wear protection capability. These improvements were observed as early as the 3,000 mile drain interval and continued to the 15,000 mile drain interval. The composition of tribochemical films formed on the surface with the 3,000 mile drain interval is similar to that formed with the 12,000 mile drain interval as seen before. These findings could be an enabler for achieving longer drain interval although several other factors must to be considered.
Moral of the story: Those of you who change oil every 3-5k to be on the "safe side" are being counterproductive.

Don't change it too often and increase wear.

Don't change it too seldom and increase wear.

There's a sweet-spot, if you will.



BTW - Thanks to jpr for initially sharing this article.

Last edited by jeffro3000; 06-03-2009 at 11:18 PM. Reason: Added another bold.
jeffro3000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Ads by Google

Guests, get your FREE E46Fanatics.com membership to remove this ad.
Old 06-03-2009, 03:19 PM   #2
SeanC
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: TX
Posts: 4,037
My Ride: 330i
How interesting! One could extract a lot of useful from that article

Thanks for sharing
__________________

Sapphire Black MetallicNatural BrownSilver Cube e46 330i ZHP/ZCW/6MT - Sold
HellrotDove Grey e36 ///M3 - RIP
Alpine WhiteTanSand High Gloss e46 330i SunRoofLess/5MT
SeanC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2009, 03:24 PM   #3
habbyguy
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Mesa, AZ
Posts: 655
My Ride: 2003 330i ZHP
So... the best thing to do is to talk your buddies into letting you "help change their oil" at 3-5,000 miles, and then offer to "dispose of it" for them for free. You just don't have to tell 'em you're going to "dispose of it" by pouring it into your engine!
__________________
'03 ZHP - Silver Gray Metallic - 6MT - Alcantara/Aluminum Cube - Heated Seats - Winter Package - Xenon - Dice Silverline - Clear Corners - Permanent Grin
habbyguy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2009, 03:28 PM   #4
albeee
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 45,801
My Ride: Fit, Z4, XJ6
my magic number is 7500 miles
__________________


Quote:
Originally Posted by VALMONT View Post
stancewerks is for dudes who pick up dudes for a little stretch and poke.
albeee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2009, 08:29 PM   #5
jeffro3000
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 2,812
My Ride: 2000 328i
bump.

waaay too many people need to see this.
jeffro3000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2009, 08:41 PM   #6
BMWespresso
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Miami
Posts: 1,558
My Ride: 2005 325CI
Pure BS, for what it cost to analyze my oil, I just change it and you can see the smile on the engine 5K me majic # plus I enjoy doing this
__________________
BMWespresso is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2009, 08:42 PM   #7
MileHiXi
Banned
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Colorado
Posts: 884
My Ride: '02 330xi
Nice...

I'M NEVER CHANGING MY OIL AGAIN!!!!!!!!










Seriously tho, looks like I may be switching to once a year, or around once every 10k-15k miles, with a biannual filter swap.
MileHiXi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2009, 08:56 PM   #8
jeffro3000
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 2,812
My Ride: 2000 328i
Quote:
Originally Posted by BMWespresso View Post
Pure BS, for what it cost to analyze my oil, I just change it and you can see the smile on the engine 5K me majic # plus I enjoy doing this
you dont have to get an analysis. I've done one so far, and i've got a few more to do. So far it's pointing to about 9-10k. (on mobil 1 0w-40)

On my next change i'm going to let the SI count down to 5k miles and see how it's doing at that point. Using the SI is the best way to determine oil life to begin with, but i wasnt thinking about this last time i changed and forgot to reset it . So mileage is all i have to go by this time...
jeffro3000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2009, 09:01 PM   #9
TKC
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: San Jose, CA & Dallas, TX
Posts: 20,231
My Ride: 330cic & R6
Send a message via AIM to TKC
Quote:
Originally Posted by BMWespresso View Post
Pure BS, for what it cost to analyze my oil, I just change it and you can see the smile on the engine 5K me majic # plus I enjoy doing this


This has been argued for ages.

I change mine every 5k and my bimmers are at 109k, 139k, my last bimmer was at 178k before I sold her, and my jeep is at 230k miles right now. I'm not worried.
__________________
EUROPROJEKTZ - Director, NorCal Chapter
TKC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2009, 09:02 PM   #10
mkodama
Registered User
 
mkodama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 33,167
Quote:
Originally Posted by habbyguy View Post
So... the best thing to do is to talk your buddies into letting you "help change their oil" at 3-5,000 miles, and then offer to "dispose of it" for them for free. You just don't have to tell 'em you're going to "dispose of it" by pouring it into your engine!
I remember reading about an service technician that brought used oil home from his work and used it in his own cars, because he found it just a waste when people insisted the oil be changed every 3-5000 miles when he knew the oil would be good for 10-15,0000 miles.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BMWespresso View Post
Pure BS, for what it cost to analyze my oil, I just change it and you can see the smile on the engine 5K me majic # plus I enjoy doing this
LOL, you think you are smarter than the SAE? Wow. Well, before I say anything else mean, do you use Mobil 1 0w-40 and if you do, could you ship it to me if I pay for shipping?
__________________

mkodama is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2009, 09:03 PM   #11
GoingNuts
Just Nuts
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: London
Posts: 7,253
My Ride: 2004 330Ci
Excellent article. So the lubricity increases as the oil gets more mileage. That means the longer the oil change interval the better. I am definitely sticking to my sweet spot of 45k miles or 6 years interval.

Last edited by GoingNuts; 06-03-2009 at 09:06 PM.
GoingNuts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2009, 09:05 PM   #12
ETA
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Nashville, TN
Posts: 64
My Ride: 02 330 ci
Yah but..

Ever had one of those cars that you could feel a smoother/quicker/ whatever word that describes improvement right after your oil change and then it slowly fade away as time went by?
ETA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2009, 09:05 PM   #13
wdeerfield
Registered User
 
wdeerfield's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Clifton Park, New York
Posts: 3,497
My Ride: 2009 E90, 2011 F10
I like to do it every 7500 which for me is twice a year. i do it once i put the skis away and then i do another in the fall when i take the skis out.
__________________

2009 MBM E90 | ZPP | ZSP | ZCW | CA | 6FL | NAV | XENONS | 18x8.5 VB3s ET30/25
2011 JB F10 | ZPP | ZSP | ZCW | 6FL | NAV | 331s Square
wdeerfield is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2009, 09:10 PM   #14
GoingNuts
Just Nuts
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: London
Posts: 7,253
My Ride: 2004 330Ci
Quote:
Originally Posted by ETA View Post
Yah but..

Ever had one of those cars that you could feel a smoother/quicker/ whatever word that describes improvement right after your oil change and then it slowly fade away as time went by?
Yes, that's called the placebo effect. It happens after spark plug change, coil change, new floor mat, or washer fluid change. Sometimes a pair of new shoes has that effect too.
GoingNuts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2009, 09:12 PM   #15
jeffro3000
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 2,812
My Ride: 2000 328i
Quote:
Originally Posted by TKC View Post


This has been argued for ages.

I change mine every 5k and my bimmers are at 109k, 139k, my last bimmer was at 178k before I sold her, and my jeep is at 230k miles right now. I'm not worried.
Yea you're right. No one knows more than you.
jeffro3000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2009, 09:14 PM   #16
mkodama
Registered User
 
mkodama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 33,167
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffro3000 View Post
Yea you're right. No one knows more than you.
Especially automotive engineers who publish research articles.

Good article jeffro
__________________

mkodama is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2009, 09:18 PM   #17
eu_miki_80@yahoo.c
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: detroit mi
Posts: 139
My Ride: 99 323i, 2000 323i
so you guys agree with this but you do not agree with BMW recommendation regarding lifetime transmission fluid?
eu_miki_80@yahoo.c is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2009, 09:19 PM   #18
jeffro3000
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 2,812
My Ride: 2000 328i
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoingNuts View Post
Excellent article. So the lubricity increases as the oil gets more mileage. That means the longer the oil change interval the better. I am definitely sticking to my sweet spot of 45k miles or 6 years interval.
*whoooosh*

there it went. right over your head.

I think the forum would be better off if you refrained from posting in this thread. This is about data backup up by research. You have nothing of this sort.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoingNuts View Post
Yes, that's called the placebo effect. It happens after spark plug change
Spark plugs: Not placebo.

The rest: Placebo.
jeffro3000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2009, 09:20 PM   #19
BodyMan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Straight outa Lowcash
Posts: 1,971
My Ride: 2002 325i
My car runs better after I wash and wax it.
BodyMan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2009, 09:20 PM   #20
SeanC
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: TX
Posts: 4,037
My Ride: 330i
Quote:
Originally Posted by eu_miki_80@yahoo.c View Post
so you guys agree with this but you do not agree with BMW recommendation regarding lifetime transmission fluid?
maybe we could, if you explain us what do the two have to do with each other?
__________________

Sapphire Black MetallicNatural BrownSilver Cube e46 330i ZHP/ZCW/6MT - Sold
HellrotDove Grey e36 ///M3 - RIP
Alpine WhiteTanSand High Gloss e46 330i SunRoofLess/5MT
SeanC is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Censor is ON





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:41 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
(c) 1999 - 2011 performanceIX Inc - privacy policy - terms of use