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Great Plains & Rocky Mountains
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Old 11-21-2010, 10:48 PM   #2421
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Yea I am
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Old 11-21-2010, 11:01 PM   #2422
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actually there are several options for a full ti exhaust for the e46 m3.
yeah, the stock muffler is well over 50 lbs. the dixis rear muffler (iirc) is 8-10 lbs. there are several problems with a full ti exhaust including being SOL if any part of it cracks. there are very few places that can repair ti.
Isnt ti a pretty strong metal? I know it is more brittle than steel though. I am talking about the Masterscheift cat back. Goes for $2500 from a few vendors.
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Old 11-21-2010, 11:05 PM   #2423
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ti is rather strong, and also VERY light
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Old 11-21-2010, 11:09 PM   #2424
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Isnt ti a pretty strong metal? I know it is more brittle than steel though. I am talking about the Masterscheift cat back. Goes for $2500 from a few vendors.
you are right.

once ti cracks or shears, not much you can do to properly fix it (i.e. weld it). i only know of one shop that can do it properly. if an exhaust's fitment is good and it is properly installed, you shouldn't have any issues.

meisterschaft does have a ti exhaust available. i have never seen one in person. i had meisterschaft sec 1 and 2 (ss versions) and the fitment was really good. they were part of my non-ti kreis-sieg exhaust. i have seen pics of the full kreis-sieg exhaust in ti but never in person.

if the meisterschaft sec 1, sec 2, and rear muffler (all ti) together are $2500, that is a steal compared to prices of which i am aware.

to give you an idea, the full kreis-sieg exhaust (ss) retailed for $5500-6000. iirc, the ti version was well over $12k. then again, most of the cost is in the "valvetronic" muffler.
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Old 11-21-2010, 11:11 PM   #2425
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ti is rather strong, and also VERY light
very true.

when i first got my dixis muffler, i was seriously mesmerized by the build quality but also "shocked" at how light the muffler was. i sold it soon after i got it though. i decided to go a different route.

looking back, man, i went through a lot of different exhaust configurations....and i am going to have a new one soon....
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Old 11-21-2010, 11:12 PM   #2426
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but then once you find the perfect one,
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Old 11-21-2010, 11:18 PM   #2427
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but then once you find the perfect one,
very true...i am never happy with the darn exhaust on this car but that is the downside of the s54: the exhaust note.

i went from stock to stebro rear muffler....
then dixis rear muffler...
added supersprint sec 1 then sec 2....
bought milltek muffler and sec 2 but sold it because i got the full ks exhaust.
ks exhaust with stock headers sounded great. it sounded better with vf stage 1. there was zero drone in the cabin....then i went with vf stage 2 which required headers and high flow cats....the drone was bad with those, meisterschaft sec 2, and ks muffler. i put in oem sec 2...quieter exhaust note but drone was lessened only slightly. then i swapped in milltek sec 2. exhaust note was a bit quieter still with drone much lessened. now, with sound deadening we are doing and adding re x-pipe with evc (in place of milltek sec 2), we will see how this works out. with the evc, i can modulate the exhaust note a bit since it is not just open/closed. that in combo with ks muffler's open and closed modes gives me some flexibility in terms of the exhaust note and drone level. i am confident with the new sound deadening we are using (oem audi wax...seriously), we should be good but this will also help imo. we shall see though....
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Old 11-21-2010, 11:35 PM   #2428
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hmm it seems the section1 and 2 are both $998 each, the muffler is $2700
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Old 11-21-2010, 11:37 PM   #2429
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hmm it seems the section1 and 2 are both $998 each, the muffler is $2700
that sounds about right but still pretty cheap for ti imo.
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Old 11-21-2010, 11:38 PM   #2430
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that sounds about right but still pretty cheap for ti imo.
I know, to me that price is worth it. I want to get an E46 M3 next and the plan was to eventually boost it. However I am starting to love the fact of an NA build. I am not a fan of superchargers, or turbo lag. And I love the rasp from the m3.
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Old 11-21-2010, 11:47 PM   #2431
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I know, to me that price is worth it. I want to get an E46 M3 next and the plan was to eventually boost it. However I am starting to love the fact of an NA build. I am not a fan of superchargers, or turbo lag. And I love the rasp from the m3.
n/a build certainly has its appeal. i thought of doing that but ended up going with vf s/c. i don't regret it. the car could be faster and quicker, but overall, i am happy with the results. we will see what the custom aquamist w/ injection setup (direct port) does for my car. i am glad that i do not have to rely on w/m injection, but i may not see as much benefit as i would like. i did it more for "safety margin" and the cooling effect than power. if i don't get any power gains, i am fine with it. but based on others' past experiences as well as some rudimentary calculations in combination with extensive discussion with one of the best w/m "customizers" out there (jeff @ howerton engineering...who happens to be a gt sponsor), we might see a gain of a few whp....we shall see. just for fun, there is some betting going on over on gt as to how much gain the car will see....
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Old 11-22-2010, 12:15 AM   #2432
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How much can a e46 m3 be built to pull on just na? I know some rough numbers for m54b30 but nothing about the s54. If my dad gets one then I want to slip in the intention of a hpf, maybe stage 2.5 for the rebuild

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Old 11-22-2010, 12:20 AM   #2433
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How much can a e46 m3 be built to pull on just na? I know some rough numbers for m54b30 but nothing about the s54. If my dad gets one then I want to slip in the intention of a hpf, maybe stage 2.5 for the rebuild

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iirc, the highest n/a hp number i saw was just over 400 chp. i don't know what the highest done is.

a lot of folks like hpf....you will never see me buy anything from hpf regardless of how "good" or "wonderful" it is. then again, this is coming from what i know and have seen of hpf....if they paid for everything for a stage 2, 2.5, or whatever, i would never go for it. but that is just how i am, i guess....
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Old 11-22-2010, 12:31 AM   #2434
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iirc, the highest n/a hp number i saw was just over 400 chp. i don't know what the highest done is.

a lot of folks like hpf....you will never see me buy anything from hpf regardless of how "good" or "wonderful" it is. then again, this is coming from what i know and have seen of hpf....if they paid for everything for a stage 2, 2.5, or whatever, i would never go for it. but that is just how i am, i guess....
Hhmm... well his other idea for a new car is a mustang with like a 500+ cubic inch engine that gets peak torque at 2800 rpm stock, so its going to be tough to persuade him, even though turing and stopping are nice luxuries that come with a bmw and wow that was a big long sentence oh well you get the idea.

Why wouldn't you do a hpf kit? Just because of the nature of a turbo kit and the lag that comes with it or because of something with the company? The general opinion about the company seems good, but I haven't really been looking at it 100% seriously since there's still no e46 m3 in our driveway...


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Old 11-22-2010, 12:42 AM   #2435
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Hhmm... well his other idea for a new car is a mustang with like a 500+ cubic inch engine that gets peak torque at 2800 rpm stock, so its going to be tough to persuade him, even though turing and stopping are nice luxuries that come with a bmw and wow that was a big long sentence oh well you get the idea.

Why wouldn't you do a hpf kit? Just because of the nature of a turbo kit and the lag that comes with it or because of something with the company? The general opinion about the company seems good, but I haven't really been looking at it 100% seriously since there's still no e46 m3 in our driveway...


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gotcha on the mustang. i am not much of a ford fan but i can appreciate what can easily be done with such a car. long sentence, perhaps, but it cannot be as long as tom nigel's

hpf's kits are decently made. they have had their share of issues as expected with any tuner's stuff. it is the company that is so undesirable to me. also, a lot of hpf owners just rub me the wrong way. but it has a lot more to do with the company and past practices as well as my interaction with them (in addition to disasters my friends experienced with them). the amusing and ironic thing is how hpf bashed vf on forums for supposedly the same thing....but what vf supposedly did was so much less than what hpf has done. hpf's business practices are the direct opposite of what i believe and do. many folks are fine with it; i am certainly not. but whatever. it is a free country, and folks can do what they choose, i guess.

but yeah, if they gave me $100k (or whatever arbitrary amount) to spend on their stuff, i would not spend a cent of it for their products.
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Old 11-22-2010, 12:52 AM   #2436
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Neither are we, but my dad had a 67 musstang and a 68 camaro back in the day, so that's part of the appeal.

I understand your reasoning. I don't know the company very well, but honestly hearing your opninon does not surprise me. I think a lot of tuners run some sketch buisnesses, its just part of the trade... one of the only local porsche aftermarket shops here in kc had some sketch buisness practices too. It didn't help their owner wasn't much of a buisnessman, but I think that happens alot - the owner is just somone who likes to go fast and doesn't care to run the buisness propely. In the end, that shop had to close down last summer I think.

At the end of the day, you just hope your car runs like it should and you didn't get screwed out of your money. (Says the 16 year old sophomore in highschool whose only ever owned one car )

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Old 11-22-2010, 01:42 AM   #2437
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Just found this vid, should be good judging by the title. About to watch

http://www.youtube.com/user/HPFChris.../1/jQ5I6z-n0SM
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Old 11-22-2010, 02:01 AM   #2438
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Which vid is it? The vf supercharger vs hpf turbo drivability one? I watched it yesterday and it seemed pretty fair. The vf had coldstart and idle issues. Was a bit choppy with the smg in like reverse and did some weird engine surging thing on the highway between 1500 and 2500 rpm. Hpf was also much faster.

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Old 11-22-2010, 02:06 AM   #2439
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An s54 is at it's peak when it leaves the factory, there is extremely low potential for big na power with a BMW six, if you throw 30k at an s54 you'd be lucky to see 500 at the rear wheels, at that's not 500 streetable hp, that's a s54 with alpha n, and stacks, equal length headers, giant cams, impracticall compresion, popcorn idle becuase of really lopey cams, and you will run on 110oct or meth tune, and you would do a $5k rebuild every 30k miles
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Old 11-22-2010, 02:17 AM   #2440
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Obviously I meant streatable, or even daily drivable.

Pei330ci was able to get like 450 whp on a na m54 I think, but that was a built drag car... and he used nos at the strip.

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