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Gun Talk
Are you a gun fanatic as well? If so, you'll want to talk to other owners about what you own in this forum.

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Old 09-14-2012, 03:07 PM   #201
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If you go with a 14.5" barrel, you need to go with a carbine length gas system for reliability. If you go to a middy w/ 14.5" barrel, you can have cycling issues due to undergassing with certain kinds of ammunition. With high pressure XM193 and XM855 loads you'll generally be fine, assuming you're using Federal/Lake City grade 5.56 ammunition or similar, and not lower pressure variants like Prvi Partisan or German surplus versions. If you use SAAMI spec .223, you can have some issues with short stroking. People have been noticing this issue lately with numerous rifles, including BCMs. The culprit is usually the use of an H buffer or heavier, or a heavier recoil spring. If you use a 14.5" middy, you should only be using a standard recoil spring and standard carbine buffer.
Or, just get a 16" and eliminate this potential (but not guaranteed) issue.
I'm generally not a fan of the 14.5" pinned/welded setups anyways, because really you aren't gaining anything. If you take a 16" barrel with an A2 or similar muzzle device, the rifle is only about 1" longer than a 14.5" non-NFA setup w/ a pinned 1.5" muzzle device. 1" makes no difference for maneuverability in CQB or on the square range.
Also, you're stuck with your setup. If you want to change gas blocks or muzzle devices, or just need to take them off for maintenance, you can damage or destroy your barrel in the process when trying to take the muzzle device off. You generally need a gunsmith to do this also. If you get a 16", it's simply a matter of screwing the device on and off. You gain an inch in length, but eliminate a massive headache.

Just my $0.02.
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Last edited by Reedo302; 09-14-2012 at 03:08 PM.
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Old 09-14-2012, 03:41 PM   #202
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reedo302 View Post
If you go with a 14.5" barrel, you need to go with a carbine length gas system for reliability. If you go to a middy w/ 14.5" barrel, you can have cycling issues due to undergassing with certain kinds of ammunition. With high pressure XM193 and XM855 loads you'll generally be fine, assuming you're using Federal/Lake City grade 5.56 ammunition or similar, and not lower pressure variants like Prvi Partisan or German surplus versions. If you use SAAMI spec .223, you can have some issues with short stroking. People have been noticing this issue lately with numerous rifles, including BCMs. The culprit is usually the use of an H buffer or heavier, or a heavier recoil spring. If you use a 14.5" middy, you should only be using a standard recoil spring and standard carbine buffer.
Or, just get a 16" and eliminate this potential (but not guaranteed) issue.
I'm generally not a fan of the 14.5" pinned/welded setups anyways, because really you aren't gaining anything. If you take a 16" barrel with an A2 or similar muzzle device, the rifle is only about 1" longer than a 14.5" non-NFA setup w/ a pinned 1.5" muzzle device. 1" makes no difference for maneuverability in CQB or on the square range.
Also, you're stuck with your setup. If you want to change gas blocks or muzzle devices, or just need to take them off for maintenance, you can damage or destroy your barrel in the process when trying to take the muzzle device off. You generally need a gunsmith to do this also. If you get a 16", it's simply a matter of screwing the device on and off. You gain an inch in length, but eliminate a massive headache.

Just my $0.02.
Your $0.02 is worth more than most others' $1000.

I had read of some of the cycling issues with the 14.5 mids, but since I always run xm193 I didn't think it would be a major issue. That being said, I'll go with the 16inch. Ultimately, you're all right; it's not that much of a benefit and it's a royal pain in the ass. The only thing I was trying to save was a fraction of weight on the end because the additional arm length adds up to more than just the actual ounces you're losing. In this case though, the .5-1 inch probably means nothing.
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Old 09-14-2012, 06:50 PM   #203
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Yeah, the weight savings would really be nominal; especially with a LW profile barrel.
In general I don't like the current 14.5" barrel craze, but I understand why it's happening. If you have no intention of ever changing your setup and don't do your own work, then it's a workable option. Thing is, I can't ever think of a time where I've shot an AR with a 16" barrel and thought to myself "man, I really need a rifle that is one inch shorter." I've been in buildings and rooms with a 14.5" M4 (NFA) and thought to myself that my 11.5" would be fantastic to have, but there's a much bigger difference there.

I had a coworker that wanted a 14.5" pinned non-NFA setup. Somehow he got into the belief that 1" made a huge difference. I noted to him that if he collapsed the stock down one more notch, it basically negated the entire argument. Things that make you go
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Old 09-14-2012, 08:12 PM   #204
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Yeah, the weight savings would really be nominal; especially with a LW profile barrel.
In general I don't like the current 14.5" barrel craze, but I understand why it's happening. If you have no intention of ever changing your setup and don't do your own work, then it's a workable option. Thing is, I can't ever think of a time where I've shot an AR with a 16" barrel and thought to myself "man, I really need a rifle that is one inch shorter." I've been in buildings and rooms with a 14.5" M4 (NFA) and thought to myself that my 11.5" would be fantastic to have, but there's a much bigger difference there.

I had a coworker that wanted a 14.5" pinned non-NFA setup. Somehow he got into the belief that 1" made a huge difference. I noted to him that if he collapsed the stock down one more notch, it basically negated the entire argument. Things that make you go
What's your feeling on 10.5,11.5,12.5 vs 16

I honestly have no idea what to turn my seekins upper/lower combo into. I don't mind at all doing the paperwork for a SBR for it, just don't know what I want to do. I would like to be able to run it in classes and make another work horse type gun(like I'm hoping my mk18 clone will be). I am a huge fan of the seekins design. I also have an extra 10" bar rail I can run on it, so I can turn it into basically anything.

Ultimately it will be a range and probably back up training toy. I want to get a DD or BCM barrel for it. I could also turn it into another MK18 Style rifle too but that seems a little redundant. It might be better to make it more redundant though for training and being used to it, as 10.5 and 11.5 would be pretty close.

I guess im just more rambling out loud trying to figure out what I want.
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Old 09-14-2012, 10:24 PM   #205
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I hear a lot of things on both sides of the isle in relation to the Mk18 10.3/10.5" barrel setups. Some armorers I talk to have mentioned that they've seen them be finicky, and others have said they're fine for reliability, so long as you match the proper buffer with the rifle. I went with the 11.5" to eliminate the guessing game. I think that overall, the 11.5" is the best of all worlds for SBR use. It's short, but not too short.
I like the RECCE look to rifles. I've considered getting a 12.5" barrel upper with a 12" rifle length rail. I've always thought that'd be cool to put together.
I shot next to a guy with a 12.5" upper equipped with a SureFire flash hider (not brake). It was just fine to shoot next to, and I didn't notice any additional concussion. Obviously the 12.5" would be the most pleasant to shoot out of those listed SBRs.

Frankly, I think it all really depends on your personal taste with those lengths. I settled on 11.5" because I couldn't decide between the three, so I just shot for the middle.
One option to do is to SBR the lower, but then have a separate 16" upper. My next 5.56 project is a lightweight DMR 16" RECCE upper. I like the compact nature of the SBRs, but the 16s are so much nicer to shoot.
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Old 09-15-2012, 12:42 AM   #206
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I will be doing this to a rifle soon...not sure which one yet though. I love this look

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Old 09-15-2012, 12:44 AM   #207
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I will be doing this to a rifle soon...not sure which one yet though. I love this look

My sbr is going burnt bronze/black as soon as I get back
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Old 09-15-2012, 12:59 AM   #208
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My sbr is going burnt bronze/black as soon as I get back
Yeah I'm torn on what to do. I don't want to do it to my SBR at the moment at least. I'd have to make every upper I wanted to put on it bronze to make it look right IMO.

And I'd do it to my precision setup I just built out of the 16inch colt upper and the spikes lower, except that lower has the Florida outline and the state seal laser engraved on it. So I'm not sure I want to do it to that.

And I thought about doing it to this lightweight build I'm on right now. Except that the girl I'm building it for/with her in mind is kinda rednecky and loves camo stuff. I'm not going to camo it, but I was going to go with green parts on it (stock, grip, sights, etc.). So that build doesnt really call for it.

I guess I need to build yet another one with some purpose in mind for it. I'll get a Larue or Noveske chainsaw lower, choose an upper, and then have that done in burnt bronze.

Too many builds haha...i'm going to end up with like 6 ARs by the time the m16 an the Preban Lower roll around,
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Old 09-15-2012, 01:08 AM   #209
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Yeah I'm torn on what to do. I don't want to do it to my SBR at the moment at least. I'd have to make every upper I wanted to put on it bronze to make it look right IMO.

And I'd do it to my precision setup I just built out of the 16inch colt upper and the spikes lower, except that lower has the Florida outline and the state seal laser engraved on it. So I'm not sure I want to do it to that.

And I thought about doing it to this lightweight build I'm on right now. Except that the girl I'm building it for/with her in mind is kinda rednecky and loves camo stuff. I'm not going to camo it, but I was going to go with green parts on it (stock, grip, sights, etc.). So that build doesnt really call for it.

I guess I need to build yet another one with some purpose in mind for it. I'll get a Larue or Noveske chainsaw lower, choose an upper, and then have that done in burnt bronze.

Too many builds haha...i'm going to end up with like 6 ARs by the time the m16 an the Preban Lower roll around,
I'm going to be right there with you.

I have my 16" my girlfriend likes black with od furniture and camo xtm panels.

My sbr and .22 dedicated upper are going to be burnt bronze

I have the seekins upper/lower that I'm going to do the whole thing once I figure it out in hydro dipped multi cam

Then I have 5 spikes lowers coming in soon and a polymer pistol lower laying around my house haha. I might sell most of the spikes or just throw them in a safe and forget about them and always have them for the future. I might build one out with spare parts I have laying around( Ctr stock, moe rail, black hole barrel). Who knows I'm just having fun collecting parts right now then I'll figure out the builds ha.
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Old 09-15-2012, 01:47 AM   #210
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Old 09-15-2012, 08:46 AM   #211
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Love that gun, I talked to him awhile ago and he was my deciding factor on going burnt bronze/black
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Old 09-15-2012, 01:00 PM   #212
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Love that gun, I talked to him awhile ago and he was my deciding factor on going burnt bronze/black
I love the seekins look too...that's a bonus.

I have trouble decidin whether I want a Larue, a Noveske, or a seekins setup. I know the answer for many is to just have one of each haha
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Old 09-15-2012, 01:04 PM   #213
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I love the seekins look too...that's a bonus.

I have trouble decidin whether I want a Larue, a Noveske, or a seekins setup. I know the answer for many is to just have one of each haha
Yeah haha. I want a complete noveske, bcm upper, larue obr plus my seekins set up. to much shit to buy. I need to win the powerball, then i'd buy everyone in this thread one of each haha
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Old 09-15-2012, 01:30 PM   #214
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Old 09-15-2012, 02:39 PM   #215
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subscribed in case of future powerball fortune.

You might have to get the airsoft or nerf gun versions living in NY
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Old 09-15-2012, 05:40 PM   #216
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Old 09-15-2012, 06:20 PM   #217
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Fuuuuuu that thing is sexy. Usually not into "flashy" guns but that thing gives me a chub....
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Old 09-16-2012, 04:35 AM   #218
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Call me old, I just like my guns black. Also, I remember the words from my SEAL friend....keep it simple.
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Old 09-16-2012, 07:14 AM   #219
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Call me old, I just like my guns black. Also, I remember the words from my SEAL friend....keep it simple.
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Old 09-16-2012, 11:54 AM   #220
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Painting is a good way to go for protecting a rifle from the elements. Some people gotta be fancy about it though. Me- I just get a couple rattle cans and go nuts.
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