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General E46 Forum
This is the place to get answers, opinions and everything you need related to your E46 (sedan, coupe, convertible and wagon) BMW!

View Poll Results: What is the Best WATER PUMP if you are not getting the Stewart Water Pump:
GEBA 16 11.59%
GRAF 25 18.12%
BOSCH 33 23.91%
HEPA 5 3.62%
BMW OEM Remanufactured 59 42.75%
Voters: 138. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 10-01-2011, 12:13 AM   #41
Megalocnus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paraklas View Post
Having investigated all the available options (when my pump bearing failed) I chose to get the Stewart one. At least now I know that there's one thing less to break in my car.

So, IMHO the best replacement water pump for the E46 is the Stewart. If it's not an option, get the OEM and monitor it every once in a while.
+1.
I chose the Stewart water pump because it has an upgraded bearing and well built steel impeller. My car's next coolant system overhaul will be due in two years and I won't be ordering a pump.
This pump is the only aftermarket part I've put in my car...

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Old 10-01-2011, 02:11 AM   #42
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Interesting. Never heard of a soleri pump. is it identical to the pictured genuine BMW one?
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Old 10-01-2011, 02:22 AM   #43
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i just checked.. saleri and genuine BMW appear to be different.
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Old 10-01-2011, 09:26 AM   #44
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stewart, ebay/thread
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Old 10-01-2011, 09:49 AM   #45
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I have had my Graf pump in my car for about 30k miles now and no issues with it even after our 71 days of 100+ deg weather this summer! However, the original BMW pump that I pulled out at around 60k seemed to be perfectly fine... the bearings seem to be in very good shape, no signs of wear on the impeller either. So I would either go with a Stewart or BMW pump at the next cooling refresh. I'm leaning towards the Stewart thought, just so I don't have to mess with it ever again most likely.
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Old 10-01-2011, 09:52 AM   #46
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I was overheating at the track in 100 degree weather. In an effort to keep temps down, I'd probably upgrade to the stewart pump if I were going to replace it.
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Old 10-01-2011, 10:11 AM   #47
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When my radiator failed I did cooling system with GRAF WP. 35K later everything is fine and it was pretty hot summer here in NJ. Next one will probably be OE.
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Old 10-01-2011, 11:27 AM   #48
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I was overheating at the track in 100 degree weather. In an effort to keep temps down, I'd probably upgrade to the stewart pump if I were going to replace it.
yeah for track cars a stewart is a must

Quote:
Originally Posted by E46Mango View Post
i just checked.. saleri and genuine BMW appear to be different.
Mango...

the Water Pump you buy at the BMW Dealership is it OEM or OE?
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Old 10-01-2011, 01:17 PM   #49
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i just checked.. saleri and genuine BMW appear to be different.
Hmm... What's different about them? Not saying you're wrong, just curious. It's been a few months now, but I seem to remember seeing a pic of the BMW one and all the markings were in the exact same place minus the BMW propeller.

I dunno, the guy seemed very honest and to know what he was talking about, and every other part was OEM (several different manufacturers of course).

And I did misspell it before... It is Saleri.
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Old 10-01-2011, 02:26 PM   #50
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I went with Stewart after reading their information. Maybe a sucker for marketing but it looks like cheap insurance to me. One bonus after a proper cooling sys. rebuild is, I no longer glance at the temp gauge waiting for the dread melt-down to greet me.
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Old 10-01-2011, 04:50 PM   #51
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It's funny to see all this obsessing over a water pump which might as well be changed. It's not just the impeller, but the bearings, and that nice little o-ring that seals everything up too. Everything will wear out at some point. I figure it's a lot like those lifetime oils or long life spark plugs. You might as well change them out every few years, and, at that point why spend gobs of money on a water pump?

For the premium that the Stewart pump commands, you could invest that money elsewhere. Like those two heater core hoses that most kits don't seem to include.

And, white knuckles, I sure hope you're checking the temp gauge at least once in a while.
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Old 10-02-2011, 07:20 AM   #52
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Every water pump listed is getting an approval by someone on here! I'm thinking about changing my water pump after having 135,000+ miles on the stock on in the florida heat and it still not failing on me. I'm guessing Stewart water pump wins the poll
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Old 10-02-2011, 08:17 AM   #53
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OEM is the way to go.
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Old 10-02-2011, 02:11 PM   #54
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Every water pump listed is getting an approval by someone on here! ..... I'm guessing Stewart water pump wins the poll
That is why with the Stewart you know exactly what you are buying. You ain't buying opinions on what worked when on whoms car but something that worked and continues to work in all cases, on everyone's car.

The Stewart is expensive but if OEM purchased at the dealership is the next best option that costs around $130 paying $50 more to fail safe the most fail prone part of your car is a sound investment.

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Old 10-02-2011, 02:19 PM   #55
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That is why with the Stewart you know exactly what you are buying. You ain't buying opinions on what worked when on whoms car but something that worked and continues to work in all cases, on everyone's car.

The Stewart is expensive but if OEM purchased at the dealership is the next best option that costs around $130 paying $50 more to fail safe the most fail prone part of your car is a sound investment.

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Old 01-20-2012, 09:59 PM   #56
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so i got this graf water pump in the mail today. No offense to anyone who has had no problems with this.....but upon my first gaze....and my friends...and my girlfriends ......and the later 2 know nothing about cars. we all agree that it looks cheap. So i ordered the stewart pump....it has a lifetime warranty.....as far as graf spot welded tin....bmw 60,000 mile and then it dies plastic or upgraded composite total junk...there is no way in he$$ that cheap piece of what they want to call a water pump is going on my car.....I talked to one of the designers of the stewart water pump earlier today. He explained to me that an engineer that works for them ran an e36 and had the water pump fail if he remembered correctly. They bought every pump on the market and took a look at all the flaws....the decided that the bearing needed to be bigger....the impeller better. and the shaft to have a larger diameter for strength. Flowing 20% better doesnt hurt

If we can just make a radiator for the steptronic that wonk crack. We can then whithin reason stop looking at the coolant gauge

and have an expansion tank made that will accept the stock sensors.....made out of aluminum. forget this 100,000 miles im going to replace everything because BMW,BEHR and GRAF wants to make a buck peddling junk...my 2 cents....but not my $500 after the next 100,000.

In a post on another forum a guy tore into the plastic expansion tank and noticed a float system that runs vertical in the expansion tank.....the coolant stick is on the top end..the float is connected to the stick on the bottom end...when the coolant gets low the float slides down on top of the sensor at the bottom of the tank....in turn turning your low coolant light on.....
So basically...this is a square box with a rod and float inside of it that is causing the destruction of your engine. Its not that they are not cheap to buy and we cant change them. Its the damage they do if we cant catch them in time or replace them early on. If the tank cracks at the top. There still could be enough coolant in the bottom of the tank to keep that float up and not show the low coolant light..So really...if your not looking at your gauge, your car over heats if this system fails and the orange warning light that should grab your attention fails to do so. A thermostat set up drilled or screwed into the bock that is adjustable to whatever temperature you want connected to a bright red light and a noise maker would do a pretty good job. I know zionville sells this stuff at a premium.....Im thinking more of a do it yourself or design it take it to your welder and machine shop guy type stuff.

If i wasnt sending the GRAF back...i would use it to hold down paper

Last edited by glhx; 01-21-2012 at 01:29 AM.
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Old 01-21-2012, 02:08 AM   #57
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in looking at the e36 aluminum thermostat housing....with its mechanical thermostat. And my plastic thermostat housing with its electric thermostat.
Why not put an adjustable temperature sending (or one from another car with the ranges to trick to computer) The 5 series looks like it can be removed or old 92 325i.....we use the sending unit to trick the computer into thinking everything is ok and running the right temperatures. It used to control the electric thermostat ad now it will control the computers peace of mind. we then run the e36 aluminum with its mechanical thermostat and have no more problems with heat cycling.
>>>>>>we can get the housing for $25 and 88 degree celsius thermostat for $25. The stock system runs way hot at 113 Celsius....this to me seems way hot and bavauto sells a mechanical that runs 88celcius. in my older cars thats 220farenheit....i would not be happy if my car was running even 200farenheit and BMW says thats ok....maybe it is but some people dont think so and i dont think so....i will find a sending unit and post it to trick the computer....if you know of one that will thread in...let me know. no wonder the cooling system fails.

I dont know exactly what this temp sending unit on the e46 plastic thermostat is telling the computer.....is it one temperature...is it many temperatures following a map system? I do know its 2 wires. one seems like a hot and the other one ground....the computer will either send a hot voltage...or connect a ground and the thermostat opens at the desired temperature...so is this really an electromechanical system run by a solid yes or a solid no from the computer or is it a range? if it is, there is no reason why an ADJUSTABLE temp sending unit drilled into the aluminum housing telling the computer everything is ok ,wont work. and then another one to control the above thread dash light.

note....this looks very similar to zionville set up and please let me know....are they using an early 90s 325I coolant temp sensor for their set up??..... http://www.zionsvilleautosport.com/s...54ALUTHERM.htm ......zionville thermostat housing for e46

housing for the e36.............11 53 1 722531K
thermostat for the e36.........11 53 7 511580S
sending unit?????????.....http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/moreinfo.php?pk=40586 ..link to what i think could work.....need help with the temp ranges on this to see if the e46 computer will talk to it correctly.

put that sensor in that housing (drill & tap) and run that thermostat...plug it into your computer......lets find out if that sensor works though...someone will know....and run a lot cooler. Radiator and expansion tank will like this....less heat....less pressure on crimped connected radiator and thin walled expansion tank

If your non mechanical friend..spouse...or you see a large red light on the dash controlled by actual engine block temperature sensor that you set up to tell you at whatever temp you want as in 2nd temp sensor in the thermostat housing (controls the red dash light)...and not an expansion tank sensor that COULD and might not tell you of failure...your going to notice that and if it is directly into the blocks coolant system, you will get more accurate ideas of....omg my @!#$ engine block is about to die. Just food for thought....keep in mind....this is my first BMW....and i have never touched the cooling system i am about to replace...yet ....but in looking at it and having a plastic oem thermostat housing in my hand, and having many experiences with other cars with these similar fail safes built in or designed in by other car brand forums. I am searching for solutions on how to make this problem never happen again. Whatever i find....if you are interested, i will post here. i think i can get this to work...if so i will send this thermostat housing back with the cheap graf water pump....and then start working on cheap fixes for the rest of the cooling system....maybe welding tanks on the old radiator....maybe all of this has been done and i just have not seen it yet..im new here

Last edited by glhx; 01-21-2012 at 04:14 AM.
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Old 01-21-2012, 10:46 AM   #58
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The stock system runs at 100 degrees celsius , and we have a mechanical thermostat that can be heated by an electronic heater thus lowering its opening temp.(done when engine load is increased)

The stock thermostat isnt a problem..

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Old 01-21-2012, 12:03 PM   #59
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the stock system is electric with a mechanical fail safe.

the mechanical fail safe opens the wax controlled thermostat at 110 which is really hot on the cooling system. this is the system on all other cars that opens at 90 degrees and has been around for close to 80+ years.....Here is one reason i dont like this.....water boils at 100 celsius...it turns into steam...steam creates pressure....pressure trashes weak plastic and crimped radiators. your systems crash at 100,000 miles....how do you know your thermostats are not making you drive around at higher than boiling temperatures

the little plug in on the thermostat controls a heater. This heater a resistor that is controlled by the computer. The resistor is a variable resistor, and as the computer sends it voltage it gets super hot and opens the thermostat....the less it sends the more closed the thermostat is. the more it sends the hotter it gets and the more open it is

if that little resistor fails....it will not throw a check engine light but it will shoot a code that the code reader can see.

Here is the problem that your temp gauge wont show you....temp gauge is designed within a range of safe and not safe 75-113. 110 will not show up as being overheated in your temp gauges range....because on most cars it is considered the safe zone....but its still too hot for even a well designed system that doesnt have thin walled pressurized expansion tanks and crimped radiators. If that resistor goes bad the computer will see a bad reading....it may keep the thermostat closed completely and never open it at all.....in some cases it may keep it open all the time and the car never get to operating temperature. The fail safe is of the old mechanical wax design so it will open.....it just opens at a hot 110 which is almost overheating......bottom line.....after 100,000 miles your not just replacing the thermostat for thermocycle and heat cracking....your replacing the variable resistor that tells the computer what to do (which gets super hot in itself). You could be running hot and never know it......your computer could be telling your car to run hot and never know it......you might be driving around in mechanical fail safe mode right now and not know....and...your gauge will never tell you anything because 110 is with Lin the gauge safe range. This being in high temp mechanical mode all the time could be the primary cause for system failure....most cars like 90....zionvilles expensive mechanical replacements run at 90.....bavauto sells a mechanical set up for the e36...it runs close to 90

I would rather my car run close to that all the time and not be controlled by the computer....i would like to know either the resistor size in that heater to simulate it or the electrical value range the computer is seeing to trick it....Thats what these high end set ups are doing. I can check this by measuring the resistance of my current thermostat resistance values from the time i start the car to the time it gets warm or hot....i will then locate a temp sending unit that has this same range....this will tell the computer that it is controlling the thermostat still....and it wont be

look at zionvilles cheaper set up....the aluminum plate is there to hold it or pinch a lower temp mechanical wax thermostat. they have disconnected the computer controlled part by separating the thermostat itself from the resistor....the resistor is still in there telling the computer that all is well. The thermostat is now like the older design and is opening at a set rate controlled by temperature instead of the computer. They sold me just the plate for $40 shipped...some grinding of the electric thermostat area and removal will allow me to put a mechanical in there......But Mezier will sell you an inline thats faster to install and replace thermostat
look at their more expensive set up....it has a temp sender with it...i think its there to fool the computer....what they sell you for $400...you might be able to make for $50 including the m50 e36 aluminum housing and mechanical thermostat....no more high temps you dont know about and no more thermocycle.....+ lower cooling system operating temperatures...and less pressure on the system....no more electric thermostat fails and you dont know it.....plus running at those high ranges....i think the thermostat could be the problem and maybe the main source of many of the problems....heat and pressure dont like plastic...this thermostat tells the car to have both. Maybe the expansion tank isnt cheaply made...maybe it just gets too hot and too pressurized for the way that it is made

Last edited by glhx; 01-25-2012 at 01:00 PM.
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Old 02-06-2012, 03:40 PM   #60
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what are your thoughts on these two water pumps? a reman one and one made out of aluminum
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