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Go Back   E46Fanatics > Tuning & Tech > Suspension & Braking

Suspension & Braking
Have some questions about suspension or brake setups for your E46 BMW? Get all your answers here!

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Old 05-31-2010, 09:57 PM   #1
jlcool007
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Meyle VS UUC VS Rogue Engineering FCAB??

So.. which one. the Meyle seems a bit better than stock... stiffer. The RE looks nice with the milled aluminum housing and different durometers for the bushing material and the UUC tops it off with the hybrid bearing/bushing combination.

Which one is going to last me the longest while giving me the most direct experience....? Or are they all somewhat the same?
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Old 05-31-2010, 10:10 PM   #2
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I've used PowerFlex on all three of my E46s and have never had a single problem. They've been fantastic improvements.
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Old 05-31-2010, 10:21 PM   #3
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I'm currently riding on the Rogue street compound versions, and I couldn't be happier. The quality is really top notch, and the way they manufacture the aluminum housing it makes it almost impossible for the bushing to move in anyway that it shouldn't. When I was looking into them I'd heard a decent amount of negative responses for the UUC, but I also heard they have since improved the design. I have yet to hear anything about the new one, hopefully someone can chime in. The only downside I saw to the powerflex was their factory had a fire, so they were basically not available at all, and also there were a few cases of them falling apart after tracking the car. For normal driving I can't see that being a problem though.
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Old 05-31-2010, 11:43 PM   #4
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Where did you hear the UUC had improve their design? I have not heard of any change made. I'd be interested to know what they've changed, if any.
I have their original UUC FCAB and don't have any issue with them. They made some creaking noise at parking lot speed in the beginning, but had been quiet for a year now after greasing with polyurethane grease.

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Old 05-31-2010, 11:53 PM   #5
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I have Meyle and pretty happy with them...and they are the cheapest from them all
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Old 06-01-2010, 02:07 AM   #6
jlcool007
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will i NOTICE a difference between the meyle and rogue... the uuc's seem out of my price range for a bushing lol....

i'm just trying to put the pep back in the step of my 330's steering
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Old 06-01-2010, 08:55 AM   #7
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When they are brand new you probably won't notice a huge difference. But as you keep putting on the miles the rubber ones will slowly get softer and more complacent. The polyurethane will keep their "new" feeling for much longer, and they should last longer.
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Old 06-04-2010, 05:43 AM   #8
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can anyone comment on the powerflex vs rogue? i guess that seems what it's between now.
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Old 06-05-2010, 10:26 AM   #9
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can anyone comment on the powerflex vs rogue? i guess that seems what it's between now.
Yeah - don't get them. You're paying a bunch more than you need to. Also, if you end up buying the soft "street" compound, you're getting basically the same performance as a Meyle, but at several times the cost.

Unless you're going to go with a spherical bearing bushing, use rubber. The problem with all the urethane stuff is that it doesn't allow for the extra twisting of the suspension arms - granted, that what they aim to get rid of, but it's just a performance illusion. When you add in urethane bushings, you get more stress on the suspension arm and things are more likely to break. Think about it, if the twisting that polyurethane bushings aim to correct was really that terrible for performance, why do racecars not use them?

Racecars use spherical bushings because they allow the arm to twist without putting stress on it - which is exactly what rubber bushings do. Now, the reason why racecars use spherical bearings is because they are more bullet-proof than the rubber and are more consistent (e.g. they don't get softer as they wear out - they always maintain the same "give").

Personally, I have rubber FCABs on my racecar - the only bad thing about them is that they tend to wear out and move around more after some time. But I would rather replace them more often and have peace of mind that I'm not adding additional stress to the suspension arms and mounts instead of using poly bits. I will say, though, that my next set of bushings will, in fact, be bearings - but this is a racecar, not a street car.

Oh, and before anyone jumps on me, I do have experience with the poly bushings. Sure, they stiffen things up, but at the cost of adding stress to your chassis and suspension.

All that said, I would urge you to really consider a regular rubber bushing for your street car (it doesn't have to be OEM; Meyle HD are just fine). Hope this helps.
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Old 06-05-2010, 10:38 AM   #10
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Wow, I love informed replies.

OP: you may find it hard to find someone that has a direct "This system is better than this" due to the fact that most people aren't going to go out and buy two new sets of bushings, put one on the car and drive, then switch to another one and drive. For most people, they're replacing a worn out bushing and so the feeling of change that they have would have been felt with almost any brand.

Personally, I love my Meyle HD's. I'm under my car pretty regularly and daily my car in New England (terrible, terrible roads) and after 4,000 miles they look brand new. Granted thats not 20000 or 30,000, but still.
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Old 06-05-2010, 05:24 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by FTWeisse View Post

The problem with all the urethane stuff is that it doesn't allow for the extra twisting of the suspension arms - granted, that what they aim to get rid of, but it's just a performance illusion.

R
What extra twisting are you referring to? Shouldn't the control arms only be pivoting around the axis of the FCAB?
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Old 06-06-2010, 06:19 AM   #12
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What extra twisting are you referring to? Shouldn't the control arms only be pivoting around the axis of the FCAB?
There is always some extra twisting on ALL axes. While the major pivoting occurs around the main axis of the FCAB, other pivoting and twisting, while not as pronounced, still occurs.

This is the exact problem with Urethane RTABs. The rear trialing arm is supposed to move only up and down, right? Well, in a perfect world, absolutely. However, the arm moves inboard and outboard of the chassis depending on cornering. While a urethane bushing will undoubtedly just about eliminate such lateral movement, where are those lateral forces then transferred to? They are transferred to the rear trailing arm pockets in the chassis, stressing, weakening, and eventually cracking the metal. This is analogous to the subframe issue we experience in our cars. Now, while this RTA pocket issue was more of a problem in the E36 chassis, it still persists although not as often.

So, what do I recommend for an RTAB, for instance? A heavy duty HD bushing with limiters. This allows the trailing arms to have some give but then to "max out" at some pre determined point. This is a great compromise because it allows the rubber bushing to do its job but then limits deflection as a urethane bushing would do - and while some extra energy is undoubtedly transfered to the chassis, it's not nearly as much and only occurs under extreme cornering as opposed to a urethane bushing which puts such energy into the chassis 100% of the time.

Another problem with Urethane RTABs is that they have a tendency to crack and disintegrate due to the fact that they are taking so much lateral energy and transferring it to the mounting pocket. Thus, when urethane goes, it completely goes.

There is a huge misconception that stiff or solid is the best way to go for suspension. People don't realize exactly how much of a science suspension is - it's immensely difficult to obtain an optimal setting for a given condition and, even then, you still have to consider the pros and cons of your decisions. There is no such thing as a perfect suspension setting - and I can tell you that "stiff" and "solid" mean relatively nothing in the grand scheme of things.

The only "alternative" material bushings going into my car are hybrid delrin/aluminum subframe bushings. This is ok because the subframe doesn't twist or anything. Everything else is either spherical or rubber.


Note: Everyone has their opinions - there will be people who take the "one axis" approach and others, such as myself, which do, in fact, take accessory, albeit small (but not insignificant), movement into consideration. Ultimately, as I said above, there is no perfect answer - Urethane does the job, I just personally don't care for the liability that comes with it. In my opinion, Urethane is like an all-season tire - ok at everything, but not particularly good at anything.

That said, in my opinion, the best compromise for a street car is going to be HD rubber bushings - HANDS DOWN.
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Old 06-14-2010, 10:23 AM   #13
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We have several options available...

MEYLE which I have on my personal E46 330 and love, but we also have Polyurethane Control from MTC.

You can find all of your options below...

Click HERE to order or for more information.


Please let me know if you have any questions! Feel free to shoot me a PM or email.

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Old 06-14-2010, 10:37 AM   #14
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I went with Karlyn FCABs.

These are built superior to OEM replacements, got them from my local import autoparts store. And are made in the USA.

I went with the poly FCAB pictured in the post above (red insert in black surround) that I purchased from FCP Groton and they were a POS. After a 1000 miles the red part slipped forward on the arm and the slop in the bushing was worst than my blown OEM ones.


The Karlyn FCABs still give me an OEM level of comfort, but they really sharpened my steering input and I haven't had any issues with handling. I would use they're stuff for all my suspension bushings for my DD that I occasionally track. Look up Karlyn online, they have a website.
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Old 06-18-2010, 12:05 AM   #15
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Have 35k miles on the Meyle HD's with no problems.
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Old 08-18-2013, 03:00 PM   #16
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Bumping an old thread.

I need to replace FCAB's and was looking for some more recent opinions.

Use:
325i Daily Driver, no track.
Staggered 68's
Non-Sport suspension, but may change this at a later date.
Driving style: mellow 85%, Flog it 15%.

From the research I have done, I have selected Meyle HD's, let me know if you would recommend UUC, Rogue, or others instead.
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Old 08-18-2013, 03:18 PM   #17
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Meyle VS UUC VS Rogue Engineering FCAB??

Check out powerflex. Lifetime warranty. Bought them myself and couldn't be happier with the results.


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Old 08-18-2013, 03:40 PM   #18
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Check out powerflex. Lifetime warranty. Bought them myself and couldn't be happier with the results.


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where did you get the Powerflex bushings and appx how much did you pay?
Google search makes it look like a European only distributorship.

I am not too hung up on price, to an extent, but will factor that in if all else is equal.
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Old 08-18-2013, 03:56 PM   #19
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leaning toward this:

http://store.uucmotorwerks.com/front...arms-p573.aspx

Unless I can find the Powerflex in the US for near that price.
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Old 08-18-2013, 09:25 PM   #20
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Happy with my Meyle's... been running them for around 50k miles now
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