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Old 08-01-2010, 08:46 PM   #1
t84toy
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UNLEASHED true power 323ci SC ...What are your numbers??

After 1 1/2 year of hard work and numerous upgrades . I manager to find the right person for my TUNE. Finally accomplish what I was looking for.
These are my numbers --First number is original super lean tune from { .. } ... Second numbers are from LWR Tuning ........

I have a 2000 323ci with the following :
Rotrex Super Charge Kit . All intercooler piping and supercharger intake pipe upgraded for better air flow vs the old pipes.. Upgraded Ebay intercooler . Ebay headers .Two 3" magnaflow mulffer to 3" exhaust pipe. All of these upgrades are put on a stock motor. This is my dyno number and still has room for an xtra 20 hp. My new goal will be posted soon.. Final number is >>280 WHP<<
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Old 08-01-2010, 08:51 PM   #2
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that's awesome bro' very good news for other 323 owners on here... very cool
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Old 08-01-2010, 08:54 PM   #3
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Great job on the ride gives me hope
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Old 08-01-2010, 08:55 PM   #4
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dope! engine bay pics?
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Old 08-02-2010, 04:52 PM   #5
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Thanks guys.. More pic..
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Old 08-02-2010, 08:17 PM   #6
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How much PSI? also any pics of the actual dyno graph?

I don't know how you can pick up 80whp from changing piping and an intercooler. I think you had a previous install problem with the hardware. Is it possible that they just fixed your hardware so there were no more install problems and didn't touch the tune? My friends 323 with that kit made 265whp with exhaust and cats.
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Old 08-02-2010, 08:44 PM   #7
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Which generation Rotrex? C-30?
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Old 08-02-2010, 08:55 PM   #8
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any transmision problems? i want to supercharge mine, but the transmision gurus keep telling me that it wouldnt hold the power.
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Old 08-03-2010, 01:02 PM   #9
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who did the welds
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Old 08-03-2010, 08:03 PM   #10
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Running 9 PSI .. That is the actual Pic of the dyno sheet ..David you better than anybody know, that people change PIPES and UPGRADE intercooler to achieve more HP . That is exactly what I did. I still have a lot more to learn

As far as issue with the installation of the hardware and all extra..Well, they were none at all .. NO LEAKS>> Happy to say I did it right..
For whatever reason in anybody book ,the main issue here was a very BAD very LEAN original tune. My issue a few months ago was >>not a small AFM, not a small fuel pump,not 6 small injector, and NOT A BAD CAM SHAFT SENSOR ($120 plus) it was simply a BAD AFM.

With all respect tell your friend to get his car RETUNE ....
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Old 08-03-2010, 08:09 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Activ3 View Post
How much PSI? also any pics of the actual dyno graph?

I don't know how you can pick up 80whp from changing piping and an intercooler. I think you had a previous install problem with the hardware. Is it possible that they just fixed your hardware so there were no more install problems and didn't touch the tune? My friends 323 with that kit made 265whp with exhaust and cats.
Nowhere does he say only piping was changed. He states it was tuned after that too. So please slow down on your reading before making a conclusion.

I'll post dyno sheets as soon as they're downloaded to my laptop.

To start, the "hardware" on this car was garbage(this always was one of the first kits ever made for a 323, I'm sure its improved over the years) Too many restrictions in the system flow wise. It was one of the first kits, I don't blame the ghetto piping and horrid tuning in that DME, it was one of the first. That's absolutly fine. It happens. Live and Learn, Build and Blow up. Its how it goes.

Ceaser personally changed his intake pipe, installed a larger intercooler, some ebay headers and a 3" exhaust himself months ago. There was no issues with this. The issue was the tuning. I was beating him in the 1/8th mile everytime. Explain that when it's supposed to put down 265WHP and I'm only putting down 220WHP. Shoulda been the other way around.

We straped his car on the dyno and it made a measly 196whp @ 9 PSI with the tune in it. Why...the tunning was running an 18:1 AFR from 4000-7000 RPM. Really huh....how is it possible make to power with that AFR and boost. VERY unsafe there.

The DME was then retuned after that dyno run....all that was done was add more fuel. The AFRS were then about 16:1...car put down 235WHP. Not bad. Moving up. Keep just adding fuel and fuel, messed with the VANOS a bit since it was left untouched by the orignial tuner of the kit. Car got down to about 14.2:1 AFR's on boost and put down 280WHP. There is where the 24lb injectors said no more. Idealy this car should be doing 13-12:1 AFRS on boost. Cant since it ran out of injector.

Currently in the works for this car now is, new properly sized and routed intercooler pipes. 32-36lbs fuel injectors and an M3 or Walbro fuel pump and more time on the dyno. This car should be hitting over 300 to the tire when it's done.

So David, maybe you and your friend should hook up with us at LWRTuning/PAW Motorsports for yourselves to see what your cars are really capable of We really know how play with power and not only on BMW's.

Remember, experience and knowledge is what makes power. Not a silly catch phrase to sell products
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Old 08-03-2010, 08:10 PM   #12
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That is a Rotrex C30-94 .. The weld were done by a old friend with patience . And no transmision problem..
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Old 08-03-2010, 08:21 PM   #13
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Quote:
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That is a Rotrex C30-94 .. The weld were done by a old friend with patience . And no transmision problem..
Car is a 5 speed too. I think the guy was thinking you're an automatic trans.
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Old 08-03-2010, 08:59 PM   #14
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Couldn't of said it any better
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Old 08-04-2010, 12:01 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JackEatsEmoKids View Post
Nowhere does he say only piping was changed. He states it was tuned after that too. So please slow down on your reading before making a conclusion.

I'll post dyno sheets as soon as they're downloaded to my laptop.

To start, the "hardware" on this car was garbage(this always was one of the first kits ever made for a 323, I'm sure its improved over the years) Too many restrictions in the system flow wise. It was one of the first kits, I don't blame the ghetto piping and horrid tuning in that DME, it was one of the first. That's absolutly fine. It happens. Live and Learn, Build and Blow up. Its how it goes.

Ceaser personally changed his intake pipe, installed a larger intercooler, some ebay headers and a 3" exhaust himself months ago. There was no issues with this. The issue was the tuning. I was beating him in the 1/8th mile everytime. Explain that when it's supposed to put down 265WHP and I'm only putting down 220WHP. Shoulda been the other way around.

We straped his car on the dyno and it made a measly 196whp @ 9 PSI with the tune in it. Why...the tunning was running an 18:1 AFR from 4000-7000 RPM. Really huh....how is it possible make to power with that AFR and boost. VERY unsafe there.

The DME was then retuned after that dyno run....all that was done was add more fuel. The AFRS were then about 16:1...car put down 235WHP. Not bad. Moving up. Keep just adding fuel and fuel, messed with the VANOS a bit since it was left untouched by the orignial tuner of the kit. Car got down to about 14.2:1 AFR's on boost and put down 280WHP. There is where the 24lb injectors said no more. Idealy this car should be doing 13-12:1 AFRS on boost. Cant since it ran out of injector.

Currently in the works for this car now is, new properly sized and routed intercooler pipes. 32-36lbs fuel injectors and an M3 or Walbro fuel pump and more time on the dyno. This car should be hitting over 300 to the tire when it's done.

So David, maybe you and your friend should hook up with us at LWRTuning/PAW Motorsports for yourselves to see what your cars are really capable of We really know how play with power and not only on BMW's.

Remember, experience and knowledge is what makes power. Not a silly catch phrase to sell products
I don't know how old the kit is, but I believe the 323/325 kit includes 30lb injectors. Do you think that if there were 30lbers in there the afr would've been better? No way AA could've sold so many kits running 18:1 at redline. If you're seeing the need for a fuel pump and you're not close to 400whp then the stock pump or filter is going bad. That car will not need to upgrade the pump even with the 36lb injectors maxed. Experience would tell you that at that point the pump or filter should be checked first. Both mine and Julio's car made 340+whp on the stock fuel pump, and after Julio's last tune on his 36lb injectors he trapped 116mph with his built motor and the stock fuel pump. Have you measured the fuel rail pressure while the car was on the dyno during a pull? Can you also explain how messing with valve timing other than the factory settings is going to drastically improve AFRs? Can you also explain how larger piping and intercooler will keep the same PSI with a belt driven supercharger setup? If the charge piping was extremely restrictive, you would've seen a pressure change while possibly making more power.

When my car was SC'd my car trapped higher than any other M52tu/M54 on a stock motor so far. I've actually outtrapped every TT kit on the stock motor as well, even with my little 2.8L, and we both know that Nick knows what he's doing. I outran the lighter TT car even after it had a dyno tune.

Experience and knowledge? No offense, but your experience is extremely limited compared to the other big players in the game. If you're really experienced, you know that used kits are garbage. Piping, hoses, etc., are never the same, and all parts are never included.

As a tuner you should know that hardware accounts for a lot of problems, especially when you're getting KITS from a company. Some people's cars, even with kits from tuners you respect, never idle correctly and still sometimes experience drivability problems and lean AFRs, and I've never attributed them solely to the tune. I know this from personal experience and 40+ hours of labor and diagnosis with that specific car, and not once have I complained or mentioned it on the forums. These are F/I kits on used old cars, they aren't always going to be perfect.
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Old 08-04-2010, 12:14 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by t84toy View Post
Running 9 PSI .. That is the actual Pic of the dyno sheet ..David you better than anybody know, that people change PIPES and UPGRADE intercooler to achieve more HP . That is exactly what I did. I still have a lot more to learn

As far as issue with the installation of the hardware and all extra..Well, they were none at all .. NO LEAKS>> Happy to say I did it right..
For whatever reason in anybody book ,the main issue here was a very BAD very LEAN original tune. My issue a few months ago was >>not a small AFM, not a small fuel pump,not 6 small injector, and NOT A BAD CAM SHAFT SENSOR ($120 plus) it was simply a BAD AFM.

With all respect tell your friend to get his car RETUNE ....

Have you checked your fuel pressure at all? more flow does mean more power, but you would also experience a change in PSI at the manifold. My friends car had AFR's in the 12s at redline. Honestly I think you need to check your fuel pressure. You can't honestly believe that kits were sold with 18:1 afrs at redline... they'd all blow up.
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Old 08-04-2010, 12:17 AM   #17
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Old 08-04-2010, 01:29 AM   #18
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18:1... Dayum.
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Old 08-04-2010, 07:25 PM   #19
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To answer all your doubt ...Check it..
What is left of the original kit is very little.The original piping (gone) in this kit was old.The original intercooler (gone)was upgraded. Injector are still the original 24lbs that came with the kit.This was one of the first kit put on those model .. Has the company learn and made changes within the years.. I strongly believe so..

Yes you are right, used kits are garbage. That is why I finish replacing all those old parts..The supercharger itself is new, believe it still has a few months on warranty left ,there is less then 2000 miles on it. Thanks to AA on the exchange due to malfunction

Never said anything about AA..But after 7 hours of the car being strap to the dyno ,I was told they couldn't do it.They stated it was running extremely LEAN and they didn't what to continue ... Their diagnostic was I needed a 330 AFM, 36 lbs injector , bigger BOV return line and a M3 fuel pump ..OH !! They replace the cam shaft sensor which I believe was GOOD. All this just to dyno tune my car.. You know WHAT ?? They were wrong !! The car was only in need of a NEW AFM..
Personal experience ?? Don't ever recall me leaving my car over there for 40+ hours and you working on the car after all those upgrade.. Maybe with previous owner and all the old components.
Not looking for 400 hp.. Happy with what I have. Proud of the upgrade I did myself being it the first BMW I work on with no BMW experience..I sure you are proud of what you have done with yours.I know yours is the fastest one around base on that model and it being stock.Now I believe my car has the highest WHP on a stock motor..
Dave I believe you are not reading the post correctly and coming down with your own conclusion. And yes the car was retune.. Running smooth and idle is smooth as Hell..Can't be better ..Lets meet up so you can see.. Homestead?

ALL AND ALL QUIT THE BASHING DAVE ... AND TO ALL OTHER LETS SHOW SOME 323 DYNO #..
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Old 08-04-2010, 07:37 PM   #20
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Check out this rolling shot. PRETTY stickers.
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