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View Poll Results: columbus day
why are we celebrating what should be condemned? 13 31.71%
we can celebrate achievements while disagreeing with motives/means 12 29.27%
columbus day, you say? 16 39.02%
Voters: 41. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 10-08-2012, 04:18 PM   #1
pancakes
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Red face Happy Columbus Day :D

I was contemplating whether the conquering mindset of colonialists should be justification for despising Columbus, who I thought risked his life for the pursuit of knowledge. I came upon this blog... it objectively lays out exactly what is known and what is unknown in an intelligent, organized manner.

It didn't give me the answer I was looking for, but it left me satisfied.

anyway - how do you you all feel about the holiday?

Happy Columbus Day everyone.

http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/..._the_good.html
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Old 10-08-2012, 04:38 PM   #2
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Old 10-08-2012, 04:43 PM   #3
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columbus day is complete bs

columbus didn't discover america, he landed in the caribbean and thought he was in china

america was discovered years earlier by vespuci

columbus day was invented by politicians to pursuad the italian american vote
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Old 10-08-2012, 04:46 PM   #4
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columbus day is complete bs

columbus didn't discover america, he landed in the caribbean and thought he was in china

america was discovered years earlier by vespuci

columbus day was invented by politicians to pursuad the italian american vote
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Old 10-08-2012, 04:51 PM   #5
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The Native Americans were also greeted by settlers who offered them food, smiles, clothing, and rainbows. They were pretty much best friends.
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Old 10-08-2012, 04:51 PM   #6
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Hooray for Colonization. It's forces the uncivilized (according to the colonists) to become civilized.............by the barrel of a gun.
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Old 10-08-2012, 05:20 PM   #7
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columbus day is complete bs

columbus didn't discover america, he landed in the caribbean and thought he was in china

america was discovered years earlier by vespuci

columbus day was invented by politicians to pursuad the italian american vote
Actually you are wrong. Amerigo Vespuci did not discover the Americas, he just drew the maps while on voyage(not his voyage). He was the first to realize that the Americas were not actually Asia as first perceived by Columbus. Amerigo was given credit by Martin Waldsee Muller, as his names were on the maps of what is now modern day North/South America(that is why America is called "America" - you see, Amerigo-America? Woah!!!). Zuan Cabbotto(aka, John Cabbot), was the man who had the first real-colonial discovery of North America. He claimed it for England in 1497. Leif Erikson was the first to discover NA in 1001 ACE.

Hey look, my history degree, although not yet complete, is actually worth something today!
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Old 10-08-2012, 05:38 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by wasp9166 View Post
columbus day is complete bs

columbus didn't discover america, he landed in the caribbean and thought he was in china

america was discovered years earlier by vespuci

columbus day was invented by politicians to pursuad the italian american vote
N/S America were "discovered" from the other direction millennia before any European even thought about heading west across the Atlantic.

Great read specifically about what the Western Hemisphere was like before European colonization began:



Terrific read (as are all of Winchester's books) about the entire history of the Atlantic, with great info about the westward and southward exploration efforts of Europeans and Africans:




I don't think there should be a Columbus Day. I think we could have an "explorer's day" or something similar to honor and recognize people throughout history that explored and documented. Columbus would certainly be amongst them, but it could include Leif Ericson, Cabot, Lewis & Clark, and anyone else that contributed to knowledge.

As an aside, it's interesting to think about what the world would be like today if Columbus had received funding in Italy for his voyages and "claimed" his "discoveries" in the name of Italy instead of Spain.
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Old 10-08-2012, 05:41 PM   #9
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I was supposed to read that book, 1491. I never did.
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Old 10-08-2012, 05:44 PM   #10
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Old 10-08-2012, 07:11 PM   #11
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I celebrate "Italian heritage day" not columbus day.
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Old 10-08-2012, 07:48 PM   #12
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Happy thanksgiving my fellow Canadians!
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Old 10-08-2012, 07:49 PM   #13
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Actually you are wrong. Amerigo Vespuci did not discover the Americas, he just drew the maps while on voyage(not his voyage). He was the first to realize that the Americas were not actually Asia as first perceived by Columbus. Amerigo was given credit by Martin Waldsee Muller, as his names were on the maps of what is now modern day North/South America(that is why America is called "America" - you see, Amerigo-America? Woah!!!). Zuan Cabbotto(aka, John Cabbot), was the man who had the first real-colonial discovery of North America. He claimed it for England in 1497. Leif Erikson was the first to discover NA in 1001 ACE.

Hey look, my history degree, although not yet complete, is actually worth something today!
ummm, he drew maps from what? a dream?
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Old 10-08-2012, 07:52 PM   #14
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Old 10-08-2012, 07:59 PM   #15
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columbus day is complete bs

columbus didn't discover america, he landed in the caribbean and thought he was in china

america was discovered years earlier by vespuci

columbus day was invented by politicians to pursuad the italian american vote
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ummm, he drew maps from what? a dream?
Vespuci's first trip across the Atlantic was 1499. Columbus had made 3 trips to N/S America by then.

So no, he didn't "discover" America. And no it wasn't "years earlier".
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Old 10-08-2012, 08:10 PM   #16
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ummm, he drew maps from what? a dream?
"while on voyage(not his voyage)." He didn't discover America, he rode on someone else's ship while voyaging to South America in 1499, then they sailed up past NA and he wrote the maps from the ship. There is a sailing path up by Iceland/Greenland that takes them from South America right across the Atlantic Ocean. As I said, America was claimed by Zuan Cabbotto in 1497, which was 2 years earlier.

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Vespuci's first trip across the Atlantic was 1499. Columbus had made 3 trips to N/S America by then.

So no, he didn't "discover" America. And no it wasn't "years earlier".
Beat me to it. There are accounts that Columbus actually never made it to NA, but I'm not sure about it.

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Old 10-08-2012, 08:19 PM   #17
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Leifur Eiríksson beat Columbus by about 500 years...

Colonization then - good
Colonization now - bad
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Old 10-08-2012, 08:21 PM   #18
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Colonization then - good
Colonization now - bad
Therefore, I argue that Columbus was justified.
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Old 10-08-2012, 08:33 PM   #19
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"while on voyage(not his voyage)." He didn't discover America, he rode on someone else's ship while voyaging to South America in 1499, then they sailed up past NA and he wrote the maps from the ship. There is a sailing path up by Iceland/Greenland that takes them from South America right across the Atlantic Ocean. As I said, America was claimed by Zuan Cabbotto in 1497, which was 2 years earlier.

Beat me to it. There are accounts that Columbus actually never made it to NA, but I'm not sure about it.
Once we're talking about "discovering" a land inhabited by millions of people with far ranging and diverse cultures/civilizations for thousands of years, we're already being Eurocentric. So from that POV, niggling over details like who saw/set foot on the mainland first as opposed to offshore islands is kinda pointless.

The two things that are important at that point are when it was done, and how well the "discovery" was communicated to the folks back home. There's no doubt Columbus' voyages were important. But "first" is clearly not correct.
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Old 10-08-2012, 09:04 PM   #20
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Once we're talking about "discovering" a land inhabited by millions of people with far ranging and diverse cultures/civilizations for thousands of years, we're already being Eurocentric. So from that POV, niggling over details like who saw/set foot on the mainland first as opposed to offshore islands is kinda pointless.

The two things that are important at that point are when it was done, and how well the "discovery" was communicated to the folks back home. There's no doubt Columbus' voyages were important. But "first" is clearly not correct.
I was strictly talking from a Eurocentric standpoint. Of course, we could get the immigration from Africans to Asia, from Asia to America, etc, but that would be too much.
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