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Old 09-18-2011, 11:56 AM   #21
avglushk
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zchild View Post
When I do a simple search concerning these two codes I get the following: P1188 - Oxygen Sensor Heater High Resistance Upstream
P1189 - Oxygen Sensor Heater Type 1 Low Resistance Upstream. Which indicate a possibility of O2 sensors needing replacement.
do u know if there is a way to test O2 sensors?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arsevader
Sorry to hear about your mirror. This is what happens when you don't change your mirror fluid at the recommended intervals.
For Sale: 1. OEM used headlights and corners, see link http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=884565
2. 2 brand new Bosch post cat oxygen sensors
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Old 09-18-2011, 12:04 PM   #22
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No, not off the top of my dome, I'll poke around and do some research... O2 sensors are inexpressive replacement parts that should be done at 100k without exception. Simple search produced the following results: Automotive Oxygen Sensor Testing

By Mandy Concepcion

The O2 sensor measures the oxygen content of the exhaust. The O2 sensor's sensing ability comes about by producing a small voltage proportionate to the exhaust oxygen content. In other words, if the oxygen content is low it produces a high voltage (0.90 Volts - Rich mixture) and if the oxygen content is high it produces a low voltage (0.10 Volts - Lean mixture). Although theoretically the O2 sensor should cycle between 0.00 volts and 1.00 volts, in reality it cycles between 0.10 volts and 0.90 volts.

A GM O2 sensor signal stuck at 450 mV is an indication of an open O2 sensor circuit (signal wire) or faulty O2 signal ground. The 450 mV value (GM) is called a bias voltage and it is not the same for all manufacturers. Some manufacturers employ a dedicated O2 sensor ground. Such a ground lead is attached to the engine block or chassis and feeds an ECM O2 ground pin only. The O2 circuit is then grounded through the inside of the ECM electronic board by this ground wire. A loss of this ground would also put the O2 sensor signal at around 450 mV, which also makes it look like an open circuit. The same holds true for Chrysler, but these use a different O2 bias voltage, which is usually 2.00 to 4.00 volts

1) A few key issues are very important in the analysis of O2 sensor signals. 2) An O2 sensor will cycle between 0.10 to 0.90 or almost 1 volt. 3) An O2 sensor has to reach the 0.8x Volts amplitude mark while at full operation. 4) An O2 sensor also has to reach the 0.1x Volts amplitude mark while at full operation. 5) Full operation means the engine is fully warmed up, O2 sensor above the 600 deg. F. operating temperature, and no fuel or mechanical problems present. 6) The O2 sensor must cycle at least once per second, which would show 3 cross counts on the scan tool PID. 7) Silicone is the leading cause of O2 contamination. 8) It is easier for an O2 sensor to go from rich to lean than vise-versa. 9) O2 sensors tend to fail on rich bias. In other words, they tend to shift their cycling to the upper side or rich side of the voltage scale. 10) Contrary to what many people think, an O2 sensor WILL NOT cycle by itself. The O2 sensor cycle is a direct result of the ECM response to the changes in the mixture. 11) Any time the O2 cycles and crosses the 0.450 volts mark, the system is in CLOSE-LOOP. 12) Even though an O2 sensor is cycling and crossing 0.450 volts (ECM in close loop) it DOES NOT mean that it is working properly. 13) O2 sensor operation is extremely important not only to keep HC & CO emissions low but also to the NOx as well. 14) Proper O2 sensor cycling will determine the catalytic converter's efficiency. The catalytic converter needs the O2 sensor cycling at its proper amplitude and frequency for it to function at its maximum efficiency. 15) An O2 sensor with a high voltage reading does not necessarily mean that the mixture is rich or high in fuel content. An EGR valve problem will send the O2 signal high as well.
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Last edited by Zchild; 09-18-2011 at 12:27 PM.
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Old 09-18-2011, 12:09 PM   #23
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thanks...

Now i'm thinking it's either O2 or may be ignition coils. I think I need to drop my car at the shop and do diagnose of those things.

Really interesting case. My car drives fine. Idles smooth. But i still have these codes. I'll keep u guys updated.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arsevader
Sorry to hear about your mirror. This is what happens when you don't change your mirror fluid at the recommended intervals.
For Sale: 1. OEM used headlights and corners, see link http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=884565
2. 2 brand new Bosch post cat oxygen sensors
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Old 09-18-2011, 12:10 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avglushk View Post
do u know if there is a way to test O2 sensors?
there is...http://mr2.com/TEXT/O2_Sensor.html
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Old 09-18-2011, 12:11 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zchild View Post
No, not off the top of my dome, I'll poke around and do some research... O2 sensors are inexpressive replacement parts that should be done at 100k without exception. Simple search produced the following results: http://www.********nosticsandpublish...or-testing.htm
that link doesnt work Z.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arsevader
Sorry to hear about your mirror. This is what happens when you don't change your mirror fluid at the recommended intervals.
For Sale: 1. OEM used headlights and corners, see link http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=884565
2. 2 brand new Bosch post cat oxygen sensors
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Old 09-18-2011, 01:18 PM   #26
Zchild
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Automotive Oxygen Sensor Testing

By Mandy Concepcion

The O2 sensor measures the oxygen content of the exhaust. The O2 sensor's sensing ability comes about by producing a small voltage proportionate to the exhaust oxygen content. In other words, if the oxygen content is low it produces a high voltage (0.90 Volts - Rich mixture) and if the oxygen content is high it produces a low voltage (0.10 Volts - Lean mixture). Although theoretically the O2 sensor should cycle between 0.00 volts and 1.00 volts, in reality it cycles between 0.10 volts and 0.90 volts.

A GM O2 sensor signal stuck at 450 mV is an indication of an open O2 sensor circuit (signal wire) or faulty O2 signal ground. The 450 mV value (GM) is called a bias voltage and it is not the same for all manufacturers. Some manufacturers employ a dedicated O2 sensor ground. Such a ground lead is attached to the engine block or chassis and feeds an ECM O2 ground pin only. The O2 circuit is then grounded through the inside of the ECM electronic board by this ground wire. A loss of this ground would also put the O2 sensor signal at around 450 mV, which also makes it look like an open circuit. The same holds true for Chrysler, but these use a different O2 bias voltage, which is usually 2.00 to 4.00 volts

1) A few key issues are very important in the analysis of O2 sensor signals. 2) An O2 sensor will cycle between 0.10 to 0.90 or almost 1 volt. 3) An O2 sensor has to reach the 0.8x Volts amplitude mark while at full operation. 4) An O2 sensor also has to reach the 0.1x Volts amplitude mark while at full operation. 5) Full operation means the engine is fully warmed up, O2 sensor above the 600 deg. F. operating temperature, and no fuel or mechanical problems present. 6) The O2 sensor must cycle at least once per second, which would show 3 cross counts on the scan tool PID. 7) Silicone is the leading cause of O2 contamination. 8) It is easier for an O2 sensor to go from rich to lean than vise-versa. 9) O2 sensors tend to fail on rich bias. In other words, they tend to shift their cycling to the upper side or rich side of the voltage scale. 10) Contrary to what many people think, an O2 sensor WILL NOT cycle by itself. The O2 sensor cycle is a direct result of the ECM response to the changes in the mixture. 11) Any time the O2 cycles and crosses the 0.450 volts mark, the system is in CLOSE-LOOP. 12) Even though an O2 sensor is cycling and crossing 0.450 volts (ECM in close loop) it DOES NOT mean that it is working properly. 13) O2 sensor operation is extremely important not only to keep HC & CO emissions low but also to the NOx as well. 14) Proper O2 sensor cycling will determine the catalytic converter's efficiency. The catalytic converter needs the O2 sensor cycling at its proper amplitude and frequency for it to function at its maximum efficiency. 15) An O2 sensor with a high voltage reading does not necessarily mean that the mixture is rich or high in fuel content. An EGR valve problem will send the O2 signal high as well.
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Old 09-18-2011, 02:02 PM   #27
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HOLY guys...... quit jackin this guys thread.

323ifever,
the popping you hear is the intake manifold - when your car is running lean, (correct me if im wrong) detonations will occur in ur manifold.

Big Possibilities:
crankcase vent valve + assosciated hoses
lower intake boot
fuel pump
maf

1.Smoke Test
2.CCV vac test
3.Fuel Pressure Test
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Old 09-20-2011, 11:36 AM   #28
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Need some help with solving a CEL. Came on about 4 months agowith a 1189 code after I did not put on the gas cap correctly. Reset using my ODB II and all has been fine until recently. Check the gas cap and seemed ok so reset again. This time came up with 1188 and 1189 after about 50 miles. I reset again and the light came on again after abou 10 miles with 1189 only. I did a frame freeze dump and have the following info.

Error Code: P1189
Possible Causes:



Freeze Frame Information:
1. DTC for which Freeze Frame was Stored - P1189.
2. Fuel System 1 Status - Closed Loop.
3. Fuel System 2 Status - Closed Loop.
4. Calculated LOAD Value - 10.20 %.
5. Engine Coolant Temp - 199.40 F.
6. Short Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1 - 15.63 %.
7. Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1 - 8.59 %.
8. Short Term Fuel Trim - Bank 2 - 13.28 %.
9. Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 2 - 10.16 %.
10. Engine RPM - 2,349.00 Rpm.
11. Vehicle Speed Sensor - 22.99 Mph.


Monitor Information:

1. MIL - ON.
2. Misfire Monitor - Complete.
3. Fuel System Monitor - Complete.
4. CCM Monitor - Complete.
5. Catalyst Monitor - Not Complete.
6. Heated Catalyst Monitor - Not Supported.
7. EVAP Monitor - Complete.
8. Secondary Air System Monitor - Complete.
9. O2 Sensor Monitor - Complete.
10. O2 Sensor Heater Monitor - Complete.
11. EGR Monitor - Not Supported.
12. NMHC Monitor - Not Supported.
13. Nox Adsorber Monitor - Not Supported.
14. Boost Pressure System Monitor - Not Supported.
15. Exhaust Gas Sensor Monitor - Not Supported.
16. PM Filter Monitor - Not Supported.

I do have a slight rocker gasket oil leak - could this be the culprit? and could the gas cap also cause this problem? I am not experiencing any performance problems or gas mileage problems - it is just a pain having the light on, and I really DO NOT want to take this into the dealer to solve...I had enough problems with them trying to fix a headlamp flicker problem - a simple grounding issue (they wanted to replace both LCM's at a total cost of >$2k!!!)

Ideas and any help would be appreciated on this one..
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Old 09-20-2011, 11:55 AM   #29
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I'm fighting these codes too. So far I replaced CCV and hoses, lower boot and no luck. MAF is fine. If u fix these codes post here what was wrong.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arsevader
Sorry to hear about your mirror. This is what happens when you don't change your mirror fluid at the recommended intervals.
For Sale: 1. OEM used headlights and corners, see link http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=884565
2. 2 brand new Bosch post cat oxygen sensors

Last edited by avglushk; 09-20-2011 at 11:56 AM.
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Old 09-20-2011, 12:16 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avglushk View Post
I'm fighting these codes too. So far I replaced CCV and hoses, lower boot and no luck. MAF is fine. If u fix these codes post here what was wrong.
Avglushk,
You post alot in other people's threads about your problem to everyone, not everyone's problem for codes isthe same. There is numerous possibilities.

Get a fuel pressure test and a smoke test.
Or your going to waste a lot of money in the long run if you go off of other people's expeiences.
Refer to past problems to find a connection, or a stand out symptom to further diagnose with specific tests. These forums are good for reference and direction.
These guys help out with the checks you can do on your own , like finding a hole in your lower boot, but I can guarantee no one on this forum can read about a problem and 100% nail the problem and fix without proper tests.

You have already thrown parts at your car, (ccv and all hoses) (200$)not to say it's not good preventative maintenance, because it is.

You could keep doing your stratedgy and you will spend more on parts and time, then you would by getting a proper diagnoses.
Just look at those threads were guys list off thousands of dollars in parts they have tried over months and months of banging there heads against the wall, they all end up taking it in for better diagnoses.
Say this guy solves his problem with a fuel pump being the issue, then you go and buy a pump, replace it, find out it doesnt fix the problems. Instead... You should spend 50-80$ on a smoke test and fuel pressure test specifically , and you find out you have a leaking/broken hose. You replace it for 10$ yourself.
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Old 09-20-2011, 12:26 PM   #31
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r u stalking me

i'm just trying to gather more info on these codes. But thanks for your suggestions.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arsevader
Sorry to hear about your mirror. This is what happens when you don't change your mirror fluid at the recommended intervals.
For Sale: 1. OEM used headlights and corners, see link http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=884565
2. 2 brand new Bosch post cat oxygen sensors
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Old 09-20-2011, 12:39 PM   #32
MercForHire
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Mass air flow related problems.
It happened to my family x5 when the secondary air flow sensor was bad.
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Old 09-20-2011, 02:24 PM   #33
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r u stalking me

i'm just trying to gather more info on these codes. But thanks for your suggestions.
No problem, I only speak because I have the same p0173 p0170 p1189 p1188 situation
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Old 09-20-2011, 07:18 PM   #34
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No problem, I only speak because I have the same p0173 p0170 p1189 p1188 situation


I actually listened to you and dropped my car at firestone today for a computer diagnose and smoke test
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arsevader
Sorry to hear about your mirror. This is what happens when you don't change your mirror fluid at the recommended intervals.
For Sale: 1. OEM used headlights and corners, see link http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=884565
2. 2 brand new Bosch post cat oxygen sensors
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Old 09-20-2011, 07:45 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avglushk View Post


I actually listened to you and dropped my car at firestone today for a computer diagnose and smoke test
Hey Awsome! How much was it?
Let me know how it went
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Old 09-20-2011, 08:06 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bmwci323 View Post
Hey Awsome! How much was it?
Let me know how it went
90$. Results tomorrow.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arsevader
Sorry to hear about your mirror. This is what happens when you don't change your mirror fluid at the recommended intervals.
For Sale: 1. OEM used headlights and corners, see link http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=884565
2. 2 brand new Bosch post cat oxygen sensors
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Old 09-21-2011, 09:44 AM   #37
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well... dude from firestone just called me. He said they did smoke test. No leaks. WTF. He said he's gonna call some technician and see what else could it be. I'll post update after he calls me again.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arsevader
Sorry to hear about your mirror. This is what happens when you don't change your mirror fluid at the recommended intervals.
For Sale: 1. OEM used headlights and corners, see link http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=884565
2. 2 brand new Bosch post cat oxygen sensors
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Old 09-21-2011, 10:46 AM   #38
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No offense but, why did you bring it to Firestone??? Chances are they aren't going to find anything! Please keep us updated on what they find.
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Old 09-21-2011, 11:12 AM   #39
bmwci323
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avglushk View Post
well... dude from firestone just called me. He said they did smoke test. No leaks. WTF. He said he's gonna call some technician and see what else could it be. I'll post update after he calls me again.
Avglushk,
You might feel bad that you couldn't find A vaccum leak, but don't be discouraged, you now ruled out 75% of the possible parts being the issue.
You can no move your thoughts over to fuel delivery. (fuel filter,fuel pump,fuel pressure regulator)

Have you ever changed your fuel filter? I would regardless if it is the issue anyways, you can find them online for 10-20$. It's general maintenance and your car is going to love It.

What are all your exact codes again?
And when's the last time your plugs were changed, have u pulled them and taken a look?

Last edited by bmwci323; 09-21-2011 at 11:15 AM. Reason: Edit
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Old 09-21-2011, 11:24 AM   #40
avglushk
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bmwci323 View Post
Avglushk,
You might feel bad that you couldn't find A vaccum leak, but don't be discouraged, you now ruled out 75% of the possible parts being the issue.
You can no move your thoughts over to fuel delivery. (fuel filter,fuel pump,fuel pressure regulator)

Have you ever changed your fuel filter? I would regardless if it is the issue anyways, you can find them online for 10-20$. It's general maintenance and your car is going to love It.
U r right. I'm not upset. Firestone actually did find something. They found that i dont have a leak

As for fuel filter i replaced that 10-15K ago. I'm thinking O2 sensor. But based on what i read here looks like bad O2 sensor causing car run rich not lean. Am I wrong?

Plugs are fine did them when i had 118K. Now I have almost 153K.

Now I have only one code: p1189

Edit: OK. So the guy called me. Said tested O2 sensors - they are fine. Also did fuel pressure test - fine. He mentioned that air box was missing one clip and MAF sensor connector was a little loose.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arsevader
Sorry to hear about your mirror. This is what happens when you don't change your mirror fluid at the recommended intervals.
For Sale: 1. OEM used headlights and corners, see link http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=884565
2. 2 brand new Bosch post cat oxygen sensors

Last edited by avglushk; 09-21-2011 at 11:39 AM.
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