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Old 09-10-2014, 10:48 AM   #1
Lps5053
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After Market Headers (NO CATS) 90 degree o2 spacer or stack non foulers

I've been doing some research on this topic and found that stacking the spark plug non foulers may or may not be enough to keep a check engine light off. My concern is if there is even enough room to stack two of them plus the o2 sensor. I haven't received my Bimmer Brakes V1 headers yet but I'm trying to cover all my bases for when they get here.

Browsing on m3forum led me to 90 degree angle o2 sensor spacers (such as this one: http://store.42draftdesigns.com/O2-S...cer_p_306.html ). Would it be better to just buy two of the angled ones and be done with it? I haven't started this header project yet so I don't know what kind of room I'll be working with or even where the bungs are on the V1 headers but any help is appreciated.

Also what is the size of the bung and thread pitch that I should be looking for? Most I see is M18 x 1.5
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Old 09-10-2014, 03:47 PM   #2
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http://www.bigdaddiesgarage.com/mini-cat-cel-fix.html came across these. Might try it out for $100.
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Old 09-10-2014, 04:05 PM   #3
Lps5053
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The reason I asked about the 90 degree one was due to space limitations that I have heard about. I can stack spark plug defoulers one on top of another (if there is enough room) for cheaper then that thing but I appreciate your input.
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Old 09-11-2014, 09:32 AM   #4
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bump anyone?
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Old 09-11-2014, 01:00 PM   #5
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Here's what I used that worked. I was worried a 90 piece alone wouldn't work so I found these on ebay with an extension included. Some advice, the bimmerbrakes bungs are too close together to thread these angles into place. I put them in before installing the headers then tightened the locking nuts once the headers were in pointing them in whichever direction necessary for the 02 sensors to fit. I haven't had any codes thrown so I'm pretty confident in the trick but who knows if you can replicate the results. That's just my experience, good luck.

Edit: Found them http://www.ebay.com/itm/O2-oxygen-se...af4288&vxp=mtr
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Old 09-11-2014, 02:16 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blizzardz21 View Post
Here's what I used that worked. I was worried a 90 piece alone wouldn't work so I found these on ebay with an extension included. Some advice, the bimmerbrakes bungs are too close together to thread these angles into place. I put them in before installing the headers then tightened the locking nuts once the headers were in pointing them in whichever direction necessary for the 02 sensors to fit. I haven't had any codes thrown so I'm pretty confident in the trick but who knows if you can replicate the results. That's just my experience, good luck.

Edit: Found them http://www.ebay.com/itm/O2-oxygen-se...af4288&vxp=mtr
Blizzard, thank you so much for your reply. I had read that people had problems stacking the o2 spacers which is why I started looking into a 90 degree bend. So your suggestion is to put these 90 degree o2 spacers threaded into the header prior to installing them in the car and then making everything tight once they're at the correct angles? Any other tips are greatly appreciated!
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Old 09-11-2014, 03:25 PM   #7
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Yeah that's why I went with them, my non foulers didn't have the clearance to stack so unfortunately to implement the angles I had to remove one of the headers after dealing with the CEL for a couple weeks...

But yes, thread them in as far as possible with them still being movable with the angle pieces only at first. Then put both headers in position with only maybe one or two nuts barely on the studs just so they're still movable and won't fall off. Next choose the right direction for them to point, one of mine is actually pointed towards the ground but no worries since the subframe brace still protects it. At that point I'd put the straight extensions into the angles if you plan on using them. After that I just held the angles in the right direction and tightened the locking nut. Then I put the 02 sensors in and all the nuts on so the headers were in their final position flush against the block. Then last I made sure all the clearance was good between the piping, angles, and extensions so there wouldn't be any annoying metal on metal vibrations when the car is running.

I think that's pretty much everything I can remember regarding the angles specifically.
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Old 09-11-2014, 03:35 PM   #8
Lps5053
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Originally Posted by blizzardz21 View Post
Yeah that's why I went with them, my non foulers didn't have the clearance to stack so unfortunately to implement the angles I had to remove one of the headers after dealing with the CEL for a couple weeks...

But yes, thread them in as far as possible with them still being movable with the angle pieces only at first. Then put both headers in position with only maybe one or two nuts barely on the studs just so they're still movable and won't fall off. Next choose the right direction for them to point, one of mine is actually pointed towards the ground but no worries since the subframe brace still protects it. At that point I'd put the straight extensions into the angles if you plan on using them. After that I just held the angles in the right direction and tightened the locking nut. Then I put the 02 sensors in and all the nuts on so the headers were in their final position flush against the block. Then last I made sure all the clearance was good between the piping, angles, and extensions so there wouldn't be any annoying metal on metal vibrations when the car is running.

I think that's pretty much everything I can remember regarding the angles specifically.
Well this is a huge help. I should get the headers tomorrow and the o2 spacers this coming Tuesday and then the following weekend they will be going in. I have to get it right the first time since I'm going to h2o the following weekend and don't want to run into any problems on the way down
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Old 12-01-2014, 08:51 AM   #9
CtRick
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Just out of curiosity did those angle fittings work for you Lps5053? Was thinking of running a some headers on my 323ci.

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Old 12-01-2014, 10:15 AM   #10
Lps5053
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Just out of curiosity did those angle fittings work for you Lps5053? Was thinking of running a some headers on my 323ci.

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I was able to get one of the spacers on (bank 1) but I couldn't figure out a combination to get enough room on bank 2 so unfortunately the CEL comes on for only bank 2 post cat o2 sensor
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Old 06-23-2016, 01:04 PM   #11
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90 degree extender or straight extenders?

Bumping this thread as i'll be installing my headers this weekend, and i want to get this right the first time.

My aftermarket eBay Headers, have post sensor bungs that are 1" long, so I'm wondering if this stock height is long enough to prevent any CEL?

I also bought a threaded 90 degree O2 sensor adapter, which came with an extra 1" long extension.

My plan is to use the 90 degree adapter on one bank, and use the 1" extension on the other bank. I am hoping with the bungs already being 1" long, that the total length should be long enough to prevent any CEL.

Since i haven't done this yet, I am worried about whether there is enough room to fit all these extenstions.

If anyone here has installed Catless headers, and used threaded O2 adapters/extensions to prevent CEL, please let me know what configuration you used, and whether it has worked. Thanks
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Old 06-23-2016, 01:40 PM   #12
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Dleef can you get a bunch of pictures? It might be a little trial and error to get it right. You should be ok with clearance.
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Old 06-23-2016, 11:16 PM   #13
dleef
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Here are some photos guys:



As you can see, the post O2 Sensor bung is already extended about 1" from the main flow:



This is the picture of the angled O2 extender i got. There are two parts: an angled part, and a straight 1" extender



I'm wondering of the O2 bung is already long enough to prevent any CEL.

Since i haven't fitted it yet, i'm not sure if the O2 extenders will even fit on it. My plan is to put the angled part on one back, and the 1" extender on another bank, and hope no CEL is triggered.

If anybody has done this before and has input/feedback, please let me know.
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Old 06-24-2016, 11:12 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dleef View Post
Here are some photos guys:



As you can see, the post O2 Sensor bung is already extended about 1" from the main flow:



This is the picture of the angled O2 extender i got. There are two parts: an angled part, and a straight 1" extender



I'm wondering of the O2 bung is already long enough to prevent any CEL.

Since i haven't fitted it yet, i'm not sure if the O2 extenders will even fit on it. My plan is to put the angled part on one back, and the 1" extender on another bank, and hope no CEL is triggered.

If anybody has done this before and has input/feedback, please let me know.
I know for a fact that it is not long enough, you need to have the o2 sensor fully out of the way.
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Old 06-24-2016, 11:47 AM   #15
dleef
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Originally Posted by zander271 View Post
I know for a fact that it is not long enough, you need to have the o2 sensor fully out of the way.
My O2 sensors are short - they are less than 1/2" and are out of the way without any extension.
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Old 06-24-2016, 12:27 PM   #16
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one wont be enough. I have known people to use two, but they still had cats as well. Others have posted online using two and working. Good luck making it all fit, I ended up using the lower holes for my main O2 sensors, and left the second ones off at the plug.
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Old 06-24-2016, 12:48 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dleef View Post
My O2 sensors are short - they are less than 1/2" and are out of the way without any extension.
From my research that won't be enough. You need to use the 90 degree O2 extensions on both post cat sensors. Fitment wise it works but how I'm not sure. You would be one of the first to take pics.

Are you in Vancouver BC or WA?

Btw we need to work on your picture taking skills LOL. Don't take this the wrong way. Those are blurry as all get out.
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Old 06-24-2016, 01:39 PM   #18
dleef
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Originally Posted by zander271 View Post
From my research that won't be enough. You need to use the 90 degree O2 extensions on both post cat sensors. Fitment wise it works but how I'm not sure. You would be one of the first to take pics.

Are you in Vancouver BC or WA?

Btw we need to work on your picture taking skills LOL. Don't take this the wrong way. Those are blurry as all get out.
There are 2 pieces to the 90 degree extension: an elbow, and a straight 1" extension. Each one extends the path about 1" or so. I plan to use one piece for each bank, to extend the stock location another 1" from the stream. I am hoping this will be enough.

Are you suggesting i need to use both pieces (for a total 2" extension, past the already 1" stock extension) past the stream? This seems like overkill to me. Are you just speculating this? or have you tried this, or know first hand this is what is needed to avoid a CEL?

I am in Vancouver BC. Sorry for the pictures, I did it on my iPad in a hurry, didn't bother to focus it properly because, its just for an online forum
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Old 06-24-2016, 01:43 PM   #19
dleef
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BKMrSteel View Post
one wont be enough. I have known people to use two, but they still had cats as well. Others have posted online using two and working. Good luck making it all fit, I ended up using the lower holes for my main O2 sensors, and left the second ones off at the plug.
Do you know the total length of extension past the main exhaust flow path? Because extensions can come in all shapes and sizes (1/2" -1.5"), so I'm trying to figure out how long an extension i should use to avoid a CEL with cat-less Headers.

My proposal is to use additional 1" extension past the already 1" long O2 bung holes, which results in 2" total clearance past the exhaust flow path. I think this should place the O2 sensors far enough to prevent any CEL.

I truly appreciate everyone's help and comments, but it seems like some of you 'might' be just speculating or guessing.
I would really appreciate if anyone has actually tried, how long of an extension you used, and what the results were. Thank you.
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E46 330CI Complete DIY Project

Done:
Hawk Pads, Painted Calipers, Michelin Tires, VCG, OFHG, OPG, re-packed tensioners, Belts, NGK Plugs, LEDs, GM5 relays, PS Pump, KONI Yellows, VANOs Rebuild, Starter, MeyleHD RTABs, MelyeHD Control Arms+FCABs, Motor & Tranny mounts, UUC EVO3 SSK+DSSR, UUC Sway Bar

TD:
Flex disc, transmission seals


Last edited by dleef; 06-24-2016 at 01:46 PM.
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Old 06-24-2016, 04:07 PM   #20
zander271
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dleef View Post
There are 2 pieces to the 90 degree extension: an elbow, and a straight 1" extension. Each one extends the path about 1" or so. I plan to use one piece for each bank, to extend the stock location another 1" from the stream. I am hoping this will be enough.

Are you suggesting i need to use both pieces (for a total 2" extension, past the already 1" stock extension) past the stream? This seems like overkill to me. Are you just speculating this? or have you tried this, or know first hand this is what is needed to avoid a CEL?

I am in Vancouver BC. Sorry for the pictures, I did it on my iPad in a hurry, didn't bother to focus it properly because, its just for an online forum
Sorry for the confusion. I mean the original bung length won't be enough to trick the post O2 sensors. When I say "original bung length" I'm talking about not connecting anything to the header. Just bolting it up and putting the O2 sensors in. With regards to the 90 extension and the length to use. I don't know what that is.

I'm guessing these are the ones your purchased?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/O2-oxygen-se...af4288&vxp=mtr

Or

http://www.bigdaddiesgarage.com/angled-cel-fix.html#O2 Simulator Angled Big Daddies Garage

+ this

http://www.bigdaddiesgarage.com/mini...el-fix.html#o2 Simulator Mini Cat Big Daddies Garage

Quote:
Originally Posted by dleef View Post
Do you know the total length of extension past the main exhaust flow path? Because extensions can come in all shapes and sizes (1/2" -1.5"), so I'm trying to figure out how long an extension i should use to avoid a CEL with cat-less Headers.

My proposal is to use additional 1" extension past the already 1" long O2 bung holes, which results in 2" total clearance past the exhaust flow path. I think this should place the O2 sensors far enough to prevent any CEL.

I truly appreciate everyone's help and comments, but it seems like some of you 'might' be just speculating or guessing.
I would really appreciate if anyone has actually tried, how long of an extension you used, and what the results were. Thank you.
Sorry most including myself have been wondering the same question. There was a thread where I got a bit grumpy because no one would answer my questions as to what 90 angle to get. I know about as much as you do about it currently. I wish I could point you in the correct direction. Someone needs to post pics of everything installed....if you wanted to wait I'm happy to be the guinea pig. Heck you could even come to Seattle and watch me install them.

The only hold up is I'm waiting on something to come in the mail. Once I get it I can schedule my baseline dyno and then install my headers. I'm interested to see what my car sounds like with the stock ZHP exhaust.
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330xi Mods:Front Koni Yellow Struts and Rob43 Rear 9 Way adjustable Rear Dampers,H&R Sport Springs,Supreme Power Drop Hats,ZHP 5 speed shift knob

Last edited by zander271; 06-24-2016 at 04:18 PM.
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