Recongnize pharmacist petition

Originally Posted by kaput

This is BS. Do you know how much a Pharmacist makes???

My wife is a tech at Target, and her boss clears $180,000 a year before bonuses. And this is small town PA... LA, NYC and other major cities would pull 3 times that easy.

Technically, they are not allowed to administer shots/medication. My wife is fully trained to do so, and has to give everyone their flu shots, and the pharmacist, which spent 6 years in school, and did a residency cannot...

It is more about untying the hands of a trained person according to the law.

Yes I do know how much they make. Starting out of school, you can easily make 120k (even more in rural areas where there is a stronger need). Doctors and dentists have been able to bill for counseling for years, pharmacists are just now wanting a slice of the pie. I think this is BS, as counseling should be something you provide as a courtesy to your patients. I am a dentist and never bill my patients for showing them how to brush and floss or providing information on how to quit smoking, even though I could.

A pharmacist can take a CE course and administer vaccinations too. Nothing special there. Counseling of patients has always been one of the job duties of a pharmacist. There is no hand tying going on unless you're talking about the ability for a pharmacist to charge for their advice. I have never heard one single pharmacist complain that they are not being adequately compensated for their services. They may not get the appreciation or the title of doctor, but they make plenty of money.

Originally Posted by tinman831

Yes I do know how much they make. Starting out of school, you can easily make 120k (even more in rural areas where there is a stronger need). Doctors and dentists have been able to bill for counseling for years, pharmacists are just now wanting a slice of the pie. I think this is BS, as counseling should be something you provide as a courtesy to your patients. I am a dentist and never bill my patients for showing them how to brush and floss or providing information on how to quit smoking, even though I could.

A pharmacist can take a CE course and administer vaccinations too. Nothing special there. Counseling of patients has always been one of the job duties of a pharmacist. There is no hand tying going on unless you're talking about the ability for a pharmacist to charge for their advice. I have never heard one single pharmacist complain that they are not being adequately compensated for their services. They may not get the appreciation or the title of doctor, but they make plenty of money.

i counsel patients all the time
i do not care to get reimbursed for that as i do agree that was what i signed up for.....if i do start getting paid for counseling, then sure why would i disagree??

Originally Posted by tinman831

Yes I do know how much they make. Starting out of school, you can easily make 120k (even more in rural areas where there is a stronger need). Doctors and dentists have been able to bill for counseling for years, pharmacists are just now wanting a slice of the pie. I think this is BS, as counseling should be something you provide as a courtesy to your patients. I am a dentist and never bill my patients for showing them how to brush and floss or providing information on how to quit smoking, even though I could.

A pharmacist can take a CE course and administer vaccinations too. Nothing special there. Counseling of patients has always been one of the job duties of a pharmacist. There is no hand tying going on unless you're talking about the ability for a pharmacist to charge for their advice. I have never heard one single pharmacist complain that they are not being adequately compensated for their services. They may not get the appreciation or the title of doctor, but they make plenty of money.

I completely agree. Maybe it is the people I know, and feel they would not abuse the system. Those in a chain (Target, walmart, etc) would not have these options. Only the private shops, small business types could, or even would if anything.

I just think they need a little more in terms of what they are allowed to do. Meaning that they are healthcare providers, but cannot (it is illegal) to give out medical advice, even though they have the knowledge, and more to the point, have more knowledge in terms of medications. They have access to the persons histories, and can cross reference the other drugs that person is on.

Having the ability to make suggestions to a person, who they have a history with regarding a drug that might work for them would be great. But according to law, they are not allowed, unless they say something like "There are many options out there to reduce chronic pain from fibro, I would ask your doctor about drugs like __________". She didn't actually give advice, but stated there are many drugs out there like this name brand.

To me it is funny. People trying to keep educated people like pharmacists from having the ability to help, yet those same people will go to WebMD for a diagnosis and treatment plan.

Dang, tinman...why you gotta steal my thunder Don't we deserve of be recognized as HC providers...aren't we?

Originally Posted by tinman831

Yes I do know how much they make. Starting out of school, you can easily make 120k (even more in rural areas where there is a stronger need). Doctors and dentists have been able to bill for counseling for years, pharmacists are just now wanting a slice of the pie. I think this is BS, as counseling should be something you provide as a courtesy to your patients. I am a dentist and never bill my patients for showing them how to brush and floss or providing information on how to quit smoking, even though I could.

A pharmacist can take a CE course and administer vaccinations too. Nothing special there. Counseling of patients has always been one of the job duties of a pharmacist. There is no hand tying going on unless you're talking about the ability for a pharmacist to charge for their advice. I have never heard one single pharmacist complain that they are not being adequately compensated for their services. They may not get the appreciation or the title of doctor, but they make plenty of money.

Originally Posted by kaput

I completely agree. Maybe it is the people I know, and feel they would not abuse the system. Those in a chain (Target, walmart, etc) would not have these options. Only the private shops, small business types could, or even would if anything.

I just think they need a little more in terms of what they are allowed to do. Meaning that they are healthcare providers, but cannot (it is illegal) to give out medical advice, even though they have the knowledge, and more to the point, have more knowledge in terms of medications. They have access to the persons histories, and can cross reference the other drugs that person is on.

Having the ability to make suggestions to a person, who they have a history with regarding a drug that might work for them would be great. But according to law, they are not allowed, unless they say something like "There are many options out there to reduce chronic pain from fibro, I would ask your doctor about drugs like __________". She didn't actually give advice, but stated there are many drugs out there like this name brand.

To me it is funny. People trying to keep educated people like pharmacists from having the ability to help, yet those same people will go to WebMD for a diagnosis and treatment plan.

Pharmacists are not trained to diagnose illnesses which is why they cannot provide medical advice. You can have the entire Pharmacopeia memorized in your head, but if you do not have the knowledge to diagnose an illness, how will you know what medication to prescribe to a patient? This is the scope of practice for a pharmacist. If they want to diagnose and provide medical advice, then go to medical school (I know of a pharmacist who did this).

Originally Posted by BruceWonder

Dang, tinman...why you gotta steal my thunder Don't we deserve of be recognized as HC providers...aren't we?

I do believe pharmacists are health care providers. It's only under the eyes of the government that they get the short end of the stick.

Originally Posted by kaput

You need to become a certified Pharmacist. Schooling is brutal, and long, and you are required and responsible for many lives.

Sure the money is great, but she commutes 150 miles a day, and works 80 hour weeks... Just saying.

Originally Posted by kaput

Your reading comprehension skills are horrible. My wife is a Pharmacy TECH... Not a Pharmacist. Her boss makes $180,000 a year, commutes close to 150 miles a day and works 80 hour weeks (some are 40, most are 60, October through December is 80+).

I never once said my wife was a pharmacist, and further to the point, if she made $180,000 a year, do you honestly think I would own a 10 year old M3 with lighting problems?

And the "scam medicare/medicade" thing you have going on is BS. There is absolutely nothing they can do to scam anyone. Sure, there might be a few mom and pop shops that have the ability, but major chains are not easily capable (unless you are truly a scam artist, and have only the intent to steal from people). You and crazy cat lady would make a great couple.

Indefinite pronouns, Deal With It.

Absolutely nothing??? You must think lawyers can't scam anyone either. major chains are fully able to scam too. They will do it until they get caught and owe millions of dollars as a result of class action suits.

Finally, if her avg work week is 60, you shouldn't call that "80 hour weeks" its not accurate. Are you including commuting time?

The real question is, will pharmacists be held accountable for providing inaccurate treatment plans and be open to legal action just like doctors are if someone dies from their advice?

Originally Posted by dniper71

The real question is, will pharmacists be held accountable for providing inaccurate treatment plans and be open to legal action just like doctors are if someone dies from their advice?

Pharmacist approves the drug order. If the Dr prescribe the wrong drug...its our responsibility to correct it.

Originally Posted by BruceWonder

Pharmacist approves the drug order. If the Dr prescribe the wrong drug...its our responsibility to correct it.

That makes you potentially liable, how much is malpractice insurance again?

Originally Posted by rohde88

That makes you potentially liable, how much is malpractice insurance again?

employer will play for it...but a pharmacist can always buy extra coverage.

Originally Posted by BruceWonder

employer will play for it...but a pharmacist can always buy extra coverage.

damn, so prescription meds are going to cost more!

Signed - As a pharmacy college drop out (SJU) I know its a brutal course of academics, and that was prior to the PharmD requirements.

Originally Posted by BruceWonder

employer will play for it...but a pharmacist can always buy extra coverage.

I don't know the details to all this, so my opinion may be based on faulty grounds.... but I think if this stride to have pharmacists give medical advice opens up the door to the same accountability and insurance regulations that doctors face today, I don't think thats going to be good for anybody, especially the pharmacists. If I was a pharmacist, I think I would be better off giving out advice that I won't be held liable for....

Originally Posted by flashtwosix

why they are not even "real" doctors

Couple things

1. no one said they were Real doctors.

2. They actually are doctors just not MD's(doctor of pharmacology).


Pharmacists go through 4 years of schooling I think they are qualified to give shots. I'd bet they are qualified to give shots in semester 1(my GF was in her 1st semester of dental).

signed, thanks for putting this up.

I'm currently a P2 student in pharmacy school and fully back this petition. Pharmacists are already held liable for their actions. If an incorrect strength of drug is given the liability falls back onto the pharmacist that was working and they can be sued for the mistake and can be charged with a crime as a result, especially if that error results in a death.

As far as "now they will be counseling" pharmacists do that now as it is a legal requirement to offer counseling on any new prescription that someone brings in to the pharmacy. Most of the time a patient will deny this consultation and if you pay attention to your receipt at most chain pharmacies it will tell you if you denied the counseling or not. So the claim that pharmacists are just going to scam Medicaid out of money is just ignorant.

Originally Posted by kaput

You need to become a certified Pharmacist. Schooling is brutal, and long, and you are required and responsible for many lives.

Sure the money is great, but she commutes 150 miles a day, and works 80 hour weeks... Just saying.

schooling is not that hard. i have a doctor of Pharmacy degree also from the University of Houston

Originally Posted by DylloS

exactly. Ignore this chick that thinks she knows all.

Originally Posted by DylloS

another stupid post by you. They are by definition health care providers.

what's your problem dude. why are you so hostile and aggresive. calm down dude and go get laid or something. geez

Originally Posted by kaput

Sure the money is great, but she commutes 150 miles a day, and works 80 hour weeks... Just saying.

....
so her one way commute is 75 miles?
and she's working 40 to 80 hours a week?

man, you must really love your wife...