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Go Back   E46Fanatics > Tuning & Tech > Driveline, Engine & DME Tuning

Driveline, Engine & DME Tuning
Talk about driveline improvements, NA tuning and DME tuning your E46 BMW here. This includes diffs, intakes, exhausts, chips, software and OBD tuning.

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Old 01-02-2012, 01:50 AM   #1
flashmeow
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Is there a difference in the tune/map for MS42 323 vs MS42 328

I doubt I will get any serious attention until I start my engine swap but I was wondering if there is any difference in the DME map for MS42 (M52TUB28 vs M52TUB25)?

I have no background knowledge of the above topic but something is telling me that the map for the 328 and 323 is the same.

I am asking because my DME has a few more re-flashing capabilities before it is locked (BMW puts a limit on how many time you can flash your DME using the factory tools). I don't want to waste my flash allocation flashing my DME to the "328 map" when the "328 map" is the same exact thing as the "323 map."

I am planning to swap in a M54B30 engine and everyone (it makes perfect sense) is telling me to flash my DME to the 328 map so I can get the most out of the engine.

Yes, I know I can get a customized tune and I also know that in order to get 100% efficiency than I need to run/install the proper DME/ECU for that specific engine. THis is my long term goal but my short term goal is to run my swapped motor with my stock tune.
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Old 01-02-2012, 01:55 AM   #2
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i would guess that since its a larger engine, tho marginally, if anything at least the fuel map would be different. i cant imagine a company like BMW using the same fuel maps for an engine with 300cc more capacity. If they did, i think the power differnce between the 2 would be smaller, and one wouldnt be as smooth in its tractability and fueling, etc.
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Old 01-03-2012, 12:44 PM   #3
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there's an easy way to not hit the 10-flash limit with the BMW tools. you just uncheck a box (there's no real physical limit, beyond the flash memory itself, which is way more than you'll ever use). I'd just flash the ECU with the B28 tune and call it a day. you can get the cable/hardware for around $50.
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Old 01-03-2012, 09:05 PM   #4
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This is stupid. You are swapping the engine in a 323 for that of a 330, but aren't going to get the MS43 DME to control the engine? Why the eff would you do that??
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Old 01-03-2012, 10:05 PM   #5
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This is stupid. You are swapping the engine in a 323 for that of a 330, but aren't going to get the MS43 DME to control the engine? Why the eff would you do that??
why are you so mean? I remembered you being sweet and friendly.

anyhow..I am not going to swap to the MS45.1 or MS43 DME due to complications. there are different sensors between the MS versions. for example, Throttle body (mechanical vs electronic), Air Intake Sensor, DSC, MAF, etc
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Old 01-03-2012, 10:08 PM   #6
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there's an easy way to not hit the 10-flash limit with the BMW tools. you just uncheck a box (there's no real physical limit, beyond the flash memory itself, which is way more than you'll ever use). I'd just flash the ECU with the B28 tune and call it a day. you can get the cable/hardware for around $50.

can you elaborate on the "un check" box to get unlimited flash. I do have the factory tools to flash my ECU.

I am going to shark my DME afterward. I have a feeling I can reuse my 323 shark injector. the shark injectors are DME version specific (not model. so it doesn't matter if you have a 328 or 323). also, the shark injector protected by VIN # (for copy protection) so I have a feeling I can reuse my shark.

nothing is solid and everything is a guessing game. I just have to wait and see.
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Old 01-03-2012, 10:25 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by flashtwosix View Post
why are you so mean? I remembered you being sweet and friendly.

anyhow..I am not going to swap to the MS45.1 or MS43 DME due to complications. there are different sensors between the MS versions. for example, Throttle body (mechanical vs electronic), Air Intake Sensor, DSC, MAF, etc
Harness is the same...you just need the DME.

Why aren't you swapping the whole thing? Are you just swapping running gear, because that won't function well if you don't swap the cams.

You are better off doing the swap the right way instead of creating a headache of potential problems.
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Old 01-03-2012, 11:10 PM   #8
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Harness is the same...you just need the DME.

Why aren't you swapping the whole thing? Are you just swapping running gear, because that won't function well if you don't swap the cams.

You are better off doing the swap the right way instead of creating a headache of potential problems.
I think the wirehareness is different. i pulled up the wire diagram and saw that the pin layout on the WDS were different for the DME version.

I dont understand what you mean by the running gear. I am just going to take out my old motor and dropped in a "new motor."
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Old 01-03-2012, 11:41 PM   #9
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Running gear is the crank and conrods and pistons...

I just don't know why you wouldn't go all out and get the new MAF, Throttle Body and the rest. Good luck, I'm done commenting.
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Old 01-04-2012, 08:46 AM   #10
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Running gear is the crank and conrods and pistons...

I just don't know why you wouldn't go all out and get the new MAF, Throttle Body and the rest. Good luck, I'm done commenting.
Thanks for the luck. However, lets not be too condescending. it wasn't too long ago when you were in my shoes so dont forget where you came from.

I remembered when you retrofitted your intake manifold and people like Iceman was giving you an attitude (on here and BF). The only difference here was that you were asking newbie questions and I am making a choice based on my feasibility analysis (constraints such as time, resources, labor, cost, etc). however, u are more welcome to pay for my TB, DME, wire harness, etc and come over and help me wire it. I will make you lunch.

lastly...as i mentioned it is my long term goal to get a custom tune and/or proper DME

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Old 01-04-2012, 11:44 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by flashtwosix View Post
I doubt I will get any serious attention until I start my engine swap but I was wondering if there is any difference in the DME map for MS42 (M52TUB28 vs M52TUB25)?
Hello Flashwosix,

Yes there is some very substantial changes across both engines and stock software's

The first photo attached is the M52TUB28 98RON VANOS Spark map and the second is the M52TUB25 98RON VANOS spark map.These are just two maps I randomly pulled among over 2000+ maps in the Ms42 calibration data. There is some difference clearly. Cheers!



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Old 01-04-2012, 12:02 PM   #12
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wow. thank you for confirming that the map are different. I appreciate that.
I hope the picture you posted is an actual picture of the DME map and not some random picture you pulled off the matrix on google image cuz I would feel really stupid for falling for it

again, thanks to everyone for their comments (TO INCLUDE HORNUNG).
I am not arguing that switching to the MS43 or MS45 is a bad idea. I know that this is the best method to get the optimum performance out of my engine. However, due to my constraints I need to stick to the 328 Map in the short term.

I appreciate everyone advice. I don't want to give people the impression that I am ignoring it because I disagree. I don't have the rescources to do a proper swap yet (that is why).

thanks again

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Hello Flashwosix,

Yes there is some very substantial changes across both engines and stock software's

The first photo attached is the M52TUB28 98RON VANOS Spark map and the second is the M52TUB25 98RON VANOS spark map.These are just two maps I randomly pulled among over 2000+ maps in the Ms42 calibration data. There is some difference clearly. Cheers!



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Old 01-04-2012, 12:10 PM   #13
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wow. thank you for confirming that the map are different. I appreciate that.
I hope the picture you posted is an actual picture of the DME map and not some random picture you pulled off the matrix on google image cuz I would feel really stupid for falling for it
No problem and yes they are real LOL

All the best
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Old 01-04-2012, 05:20 PM   #14
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but the 3.0 has larger injectors than the 2.5. That in itself is going to give you a problem.
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Old 01-04-2012, 07:21 PM   #15
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but the 3.0 has larger injectors than the 2.5. That in itself is going to give you a problem.
yes, but I am running on a 328 map in the short term. people (to include a few famous members on here such as 4ngie) ran a 3.0 engine using the 325 injectors and maps without issues. of course the only issue is that you will not get 100% full optimal performance. that of course will come from a 330 map or custom tune which will cost money.

I can flash my 323 map to 328 map for free. I also "think" i can reuse my MS42 shark to give it an "closer" edge.
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Old 01-05-2012, 10:15 AM   #16
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isn't the fuel system different? 323,328 vs 325,330 How the fuel pressure is controlled?
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Old 01-05-2012, 12:05 PM   #17
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You won't be able to reuse the shark. If it doesn't see the exact same stock map, it won't go.

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yes, but I am running on a 328 map in the short term. people (to include a few famous members on here such as 4ngie) ran a 3.0 engine using the 325 injectors and maps without issues. of course the only issue is that you will not get 100% full optimal performance. that of course will come from a 330 map or custom tune which will cost money.

I can flash my 323 map to 328 map for free. I also "think" i can reuse my MS42 shark to give it an "closer" edge.
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Old 01-05-2012, 12:54 PM   #18
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isn't the fuel system different? 323,328 vs 325,330 How the fuel pressure is controlled?
Fuel pressure for all 2.5 and 3.0 e46 are the same (3.5 Bar). I am running stock injectors, rail, fuel pressure, pump, etc. The only thing that is different is the engine.

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Old 01-05-2012, 12:57 PM   #19
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You won't be able to reuse the shark. If it doesn't see the exact same stock map, it won't go.
I hope that is not the case. There is only one way to find out. I will try and report back. Some say the shark is protected by VIN #. This is the reason why after the flash, the shark injector requires an additional 5-10 seconds to do a final recording. People say the final recording is the copying of the vin# and thus the copy protect activation.

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Old 01-05-2012, 01:02 PM   #20
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I've had zero luck getting the Shark back on my own car, and I'm supposed to have a copy of my stock software...

Quote:
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I hope that is not the case. There is only one way to find out. I will try and report back. Some say the shark is protected by VIN #. This is the reason why after the flash, the shark injector requires an additional 5-10 seconds to do a final recording. People say the final recording is the copying of the vin# and thus the copy protect activation.

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