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Old 03-21-2012, 02:16 AM   #221
dallasberry
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Old 03-21-2012, 02:17 AM   #222
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My block was not bored out from what I remember, so yes its like a 3.0-3.1 or so. We sleeved it to run excessive boost all the time and strengthen the cylinder walls.
I believe the difference then is that mine was bored out then had the sleeves installed (iirc).

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My motor does not consume oil irregularly. Every 500-600 miles is crazy, Ive never even added oil into my car before!
Mine consumed about a qt ever 1000miles, then got worse to 600mi or so.. until it finally was 500mi..
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Old 03-21-2012, 06:19 AM   #223
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<snip/>
That being said, is the focus now on the sleeves and possibly how Darton installed them? Was it Chris's engine builder that screwed up?
<snip/>
I would like to point out how fast Brian came to the conclusion that the "head must have lifted" when he first looked at Marcus' engine block in Chris' first video. Even with the L19's.

I would say, even if Darton used the wrong sleeves and put them in the wrong way, Brian really screwed up by demonstrating his lack of knowledge in the diagnosis. Furthermore, he demonstrated hastiness by jumping to conclusions without taking any measurements at all. In fact Chris might have done better by taking the engine block to a fortune teller for a diagnosis!
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Old 03-21-2012, 06:33 AM   #224
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If they didnt measure piston to wall clearance originally, you can bet your bottom dollar they did after being asked a few dozen times in the comments following the first video. That they remained silent on that point and only addressed ring gap in the follow-up video is quite telling. (just like how hpfchris cherry picks to which comments he replies in his forum posts)
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Old 03-21-2012, 10:01 AM   #225
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Jason,

So the typical piston to wall clearance should be??? .004-.005?
Also what causes the bore to ovalize as much as it has? And lastly why do you suspect so much carbon build up on the pistons with only 3k on motor and running e85? It's hard to tell from the video but cylinder 6 looks like deep "creators" In the piston like something went through the motor but again it could be a optical illusion from the video.
For a street engine, somewhere between 3 and 4 thou. Depending on how hard you plan on being with it. We usually put our race engines a tick under 4. Now bore size comes in to play as well, but standard bore...making around 800whp, I would say high 3's under 800, around 3.5. This is with the wiseco heavy duty pistons...piston composition will affect this as well.
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Old 03-21-2012, 10:12 AM   #226
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I would like to point out how fast Brian came to the conclusion that the "head must have lifted" when he first looked at Marcus' engine block in Chris' first video. Even with the L19's.

I would say, even if Darton used the wrong sleeves and put them in the wrong way, Brian really screwed up by demonstrating his lack of knowledge in the diagnosis. Furthermore, he demonstrated hastiness by jumping to conclusions without taking any measurements at all. In fact Chris might have done better by taking the engine block to a fortune teller for a diagnosis!
For me personally, I don't understand why it even left HPF to get looked at elsewhere. Any true speedshop does their own assembly and measureing. Some even have all of the machining equipment in house. 99.9% of the machine shops out there are not experienced enough to diagnose a high powered turbo engine. So if you aren't following up their work with measurements to ensure it was done the way you want, your in for failure....these aren't just words...this is from past experiences. We are picking up the block we will use in Marcus's car today. It will be thoroughly measured for roundness, taper, and clearance for the pistons (EVERY CYLINDER), the main journals will be measured in the same fashion, as well as the rods. Once all that is done, the rings will be fitted and gapped, and the shortblock assembled. If anyone only takes one thing away from this whole mess...take that you MUST follow your machine shops work, or your in for issues. If you don't have the measuring equipment, find someone who does.

Someone had asked about torque plates and the measurements we got from Marcus's engine. Torque plates help put the block in an assembled state to 'simulate' a cylinder head. The variance with and without are mostly insignificant on small bore inlines, but the most it would be is a half a thou to a thou....nothing approaching 15!
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Old 03-21-2012, 11:58 AM   #227
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Jason is very very convincing. He had us believing the ProEFI was the best tuning system available. Then after 5 cars were stuck in our shop that he couldn't help us get running for 5 months I started to believe differently. Then he blows up several cars and is "still" able to convince those owners to come after me and not the tuner. There may come a day when people will stop allowing him to put the blame for failures on someone else. Until then we will see threads like this pop up.

I'm looking forward to a lot of people getting the ProEFI. I saw the Sound Performance Group buy. Then I won't be the only one posting my opinion on that software. We've heard a lot of opinions from customers trying to get the ProEFI working on their cars and this is only the beginning. This information will be coming out. Just wait until a bunch more people get it. This is nearly identical to what I went through with VF when customers were calling me a couple times a month saying their cars blew with the VF kit on it. I told them to speak about it on the forums and nobody did. I was the first to talk about their blown motors and until then everyone was keeping it hush hush. Then customers finally started coming forward with their problems.

Right now the ONLY people posting about how great ProEFI is are those that have never driven their car running properly with the ProEFI in it. Isn't that interesting how there are no videos of ProEFI cars on the street. No customers ranting and raving about how great it is except for those that had their cars blown up with the ProEFI system on it. Lawrence got a leakdown done on his car "BEFORE" he took it to ProEFI after some advice I gave him. I recommend this to anyone taking their car to a tuner.

Chris.

Last edited by HPF Chris; 03-21-2012 at 12:24 PM.
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Old 03-21-2012, 12:05 PM   #228
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Right now the ONLY people posting about how great ProEFI is are those that have never driven their car running properly with the ProEFI in it. Isn't that interesting how their are no videos of ProEFI cars on the street. No customers ranting and raving about how great it is except for those that had their cars blown up with the ProEFI system on it.
Ray is in love with his car all over again.. I spent a entire day at Trona watching that thing do 1/2 mile pulls.. it was ridiculously impressive.

Jim doesn't post on forums to begin with.. but when he does he mentions how well his car has been driving and how he's now sticking with it instead of going GTR. I spoke with him at Trona about it as well.

I mentioned how much better my car was running post ProEFI as well. Mostly that was the tune, but even then my car was likely starting to show the signs of the sleeve failure and it still ran better then it did with the AEM.

I speak with all of these guys, including Charles from TopEnd off the forums.. and they've all had nothing but good things to say about their experience with ProEFI. These are people I trust and people who trust me and would tell me honest opinions .. not one has said anything negative.

Chad's car doesn't count.. and thats fair.. he hasn't driven it since the conversion.. but the rest of us who have.. all agree.. ProEFI + E85 + Traction Control == Pure awesomeness!
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Old 03-21-2012, 12:33 PM   #229
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Why even post ? You come into Marcus's thread to post a opinion response to a factual video.... I dont have a pic that describes this level of fail.

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Originally Posted by HPF Chris View Post
Jason is very very convincing. He had us believing the ProEFI was the best tuning system available. Then after 5 cars were stuck in our shop that he couldn't help us get running for 5 months I started to believe differently. Then he blows up several cars and is "still" able to convince those owners to come after me and not the tuner. There may come a day when people will stop allowing him to put the blame for failures on someone else. Until then we will see threads like this pop up.

I'm looking forward to a lot of people getting the ProEFI. I saw the Sound Performance Group buy. Then I won't be the only one posting my opinion on that software. We've heard a lot of opinions from customers trying to get the ProEFI working on their cars and this is only the beginning. This information will be coming out. Just wait until a bunch more people get it. This is nearly identical to what I went through with VF when customers were calling me a couple times a month saying their cars blew with the VF kit on it. I told them to speak about it on the forums and nobody did. I was the first to talk about their blown motors and until then everyone was keeping it hush hush. Then customers finally started coming forward with their problems.

Right now the ONLY people posting about how great ProEFI is are those that have never driven their car running properly with the ProEFI in it. Isn't that interesting how there are no videos of ProEFI cars on the street. No customers ranting and raving about how great it is except for those that had their cars blown up with the ProEFI system on it. Lawrence got a leakdown done on his car "BEFORE" he took it to ProEFI after some advice I gave him. I recommend this to anyone taking their car to a tuner.

Chris.
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Old 03-21-2012, 12:50 PM   #230
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The only VF car I heard that exploded was a E46 M3 that never rebuilt his vanos and already had a cam issue and still put the kit on anyways.


Marcus. When do we ge to see some teaser pics!?.
Very soon!
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Old 03-21-2012, 12:55 PM   #231
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Chris, while you're in here copy/pasting responses could you answer a question for me. You told me that Jason orders his pistons from you, yet when he ordered my pistons he ordered them directly from Wiseco. Which is it?
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Old 03-21-2012, 12:55 PM   #232
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Originally Posted by HPF Chris View Post
Jason is very very convincing. He had us believing the ProEFI was the best tuning system available. Then after 5 cars were stuck in our shop that he couldn't help us get running for 5 months I started to believe differently. Then he blows up several cars and is "still" able to convince those owners to come after me and not the tuner. There may come a day when people will stop allowing him to put the blame for failures on someone else. Until then we will see threads like this pop up.

I'm looking forward to a lot of people getting the ProEFI. I saw the Sound Performance Group buy. Then I won't be the only one posting my opinion on that software. We've heard a lot of opinions from customers trying to get the ProEFI working on their cars and this is only the beginning. This information will be coming out. Just wait until a bunch more people get it. This is nearly identical to what I went through with VF when customers were calling me a couple times a month saying their cars blew with the VF kit on it. I told them to speak about it on the forums and nobody did. I was the first to talk about their blown motors and until then everyone was keeping it hush hush. Then customers finally started coming forward with their problems.

Right now the ONLY people posting about how great ProEFI is are those that have never driven their car running properly with the ProEFI in it. Isn't that interesting how there are no videos of ProEFI cars on the street. No customers ranting and raving about how great it is except for those that had their cars blown up with the ProEFI system on it. Lawrence got a leakdown done on his car "BEFORE" he took it to ProEFI after some advice I gave him. I recommend this to anyone taking their car to a tuner.

Chris.
Im surprised you chose to comment on the pro efi software this time... why didn't you comment on the diagnosis? sounds to me like your still trying to discredit pro efi anyway you can.
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Old 03-21-2012, 12:58 PM   #233
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Chris, while you're in here copy/pasting responses could you answer a question for me. You told me that Jason orders his pistons from you, yet when he ordered my pistons he ordered them directly from Wiseco. Which is it?
From what I was told, the pistons were ordered by Saad built on the same design as the 1800hp supra pistons. Saad has been working with wiseco for years iirc.
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Old 03-21-2012, 01:16 PM   #234
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Originally Posted by HPF Chris View Post
Jason is very very convincing. He had us believing the ProEFI was the best tuning system available. Then after 5 cars were stuck in our shop that he couldn't help us get running for 5 months I started to believe differently. Then he blows up several cars and is "still" able to convince those owners to come after me and not the tuner. There may come a day when people will stop allowing him to put the blame for failures on someone else. Until then we will see threads like this pop up.

I'm looking forward to a lot of people getting the ProEFI. I saw the Sound Performance Group buy. Then I won't be the only one posting my opinion on that software. We've heard a lot of opinions from customers trying to get the ProEFI working on their cars and this is only the beginning. This information will be coming out. Just wait until a bunch more people get it. This is nearly identical to what I went through with VF when customers were calling me a couple times a month saying their cars blew with the VF kit on it. I told them to speak about it on the forums and nobody did. I was the first to talk about their blown motors and until then everyone was keeping it hush hush. Then customers finally started coming forward with their problems.

Right now the ONLY people posting about how great ProEFI is are those that have never driven their car running properly with the ProEFI in it. Isn't that interesting how there are no videos of ProEFI cars on the street. No customers ranting and raving about how great it is except for those that had their cars blown up with the ProEFI system on it. Lawrence got a leakdown done on his car "BEFORE" he took it to ProEFI after some advice I gave him. I recommend this to anyone taking their car to a tuner.

Chris.

Chris, I have installed more ProEFIs than ANYONE on a WIDE variety of cars/engines. If you like I could post a ton of customer reviews on how their cars run on it. Everyone that I install runs perfectly. Again I do not believe that ANY standalone is a do it your selfer project and they should ONLY be installed by a shop familiar with that particular stand alone!
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Old 03-21-2012, 01:17 PM   #235
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Jason is very very convincing.
so is the truth

sorry that one was below the belt...
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Old 03-21-2012, 01:20 PM   #236
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so is the truth

sorry that one was below the belt...

You cannot hit below the belt with the truth. There is undeniable unquestionable evidence as to what happened.
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Old 03-21-2012, 01:32 PM   #237
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Looks like the build and diagnose is spot on. Looking forward to seeing this build done right and Marcus enjoying why we all chose the E46 M3 as our platform.

After seeing the Saad and Jason video, Chris is still blaming ProEFI for Marcus' motor failure...
:EPIC FACEPALM:

It surprises me...HPF "was" the high standard in taking care of their customers. HPF "was" the king around here but as of lately seems to fall further and further from the top. Such a shame, they've done so much for the E46 M3 turbo industry but now it's time for a new era of tuning and engine building from Saad and ProEFI. Looking forward to what builds they have coming up and more turbo options for enthusiasts looking to go with a turbo.
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Old 03-21-2012, 02:07 PM   #238
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Chris, do yourself a favor and stop posting. Every time you post something, you are chopping away at what little credibility you have left. Take this experience as a learning experience and move on, we all make mistakes!

As for the VF comment, Im starting to wonder how much smoke and mirrors there was in that smear campaign you and your groupies had going on. You guys to date have had more blown motors than any other F/I vendor.

Like I said, move on man!
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Old 03-21-2012, 02:30 PM   #239
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On a lighter note.

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Old 03-21-2012, 02:32 PM   #240
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Chris, do yourself a favor and stop posting. Every time you post something, you are chopping away at what little credibility you have left. Take this experience as a learning experience and move on, we all make mistakes!

As for the VF comment, Im starting to wonder how much smoke and mirrors there was in that smear campaign you and your groupies had going on. You guys to date have had more blown motors than any other F/I vendor.

Like I said, move on man!
+1.

This thread should be about Marcus' epic new build.

There is no credibility left.
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