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Old 05-21-2012, 09:34 PM   #41
Mango
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This thread was quiet until you made your ridiculous claims of ZHP control arms featuring ALL-NEW GEOMETRIES FOR SHORTER STEERING RACK FEEL.

ZHP arms AND Meyle arms feature STIFFER AND MORE DURABLE BALL JOINTS for improved longevity and response. PERIOD.

No "proof" is needed. What's stiffer metal or nylon/rubber? Are you seriously asking this question? Why do people use Poly bushings over OE fluid-filled?

I'll say it again: for all intents and purposes, Meyle HD and ZHP control arms are the same. One cannot feel the difference. I've installed every control arm set under the sun, have driven all of them. ZHP control arms are great in that they're Genuine ///M parts, but they're used because they're stiffer and more durable--period. If you think your ZHP arms have wacky angles and are making your steering rack shorter, go right ahead. You cannot sit there and tell me that if I removed my Meyle HD arms right now and replaced them with ZHP arms that I'd magically have a shorter steering ratio: BS

Not even sure why I entertained your fantasies. If it was a troll, it was a damn good one.
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Old 05-21-2012, 09:36 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TerraPhantm View Post
I had ZHP and non ZHP arms side by side at one point. They were identical asides for the balljoint. Even the stamped numbers were the same. I'll see if I can dig up the pictures I took
If the stamped numbers were the same you either had ZHP or non-ZHP arms side by side?
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Old 05-21-2012, 09:43 PM   #43
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It is clear who is posting bs information, like the sway bar being thicker or ZHP having shorter springs. Lol these have been ruled out years ago by well respected fanatics. There is nothing in my post that I bs about. I leave it to the readers to decide.
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Old 05-21-2012, 09:50 PM   #44
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I'm talking about 15mm lower than non-sport and the front ZHP swaybar is 24mm vs 23mm and 23.5mm.

Don't try and put words in my mouth and take the spotlight off you. Lets see if your theory turns out that ZHP control arms have different geometry offering a shorter steering ratio feel.
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Old 05-21-2012, 09:52 PM   #45
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BTW, here's the ZHP suspension kit showing the swaybar.

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Old 05-21-2012, 09:53 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by E46Mango View Post
BTW, here's the ZHP suspension kit showing the swaybar.

I don't see springs.
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Old 05-21-2012, 09:54 PM   #47
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Mango, front ZHP sway bar is 23.5mm not 24. I mean I don't wanna argue over .5 mm, but
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Old 05-21-2012, 09:58 PM   #48
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Mango, front ZHP sway bar is 23.5mm not 24. I mean I don't wanna argue over .5 mm, but
I'll say this. With a solid bar, 1-2mm is a mild difference. Not earth shattering, but it is slightly stiffer to a noticeable extent.
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Old 05-21-2012, 10:07 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by JohnIBarr01 View Post
I don't see springs.
Re-read my response to that. I said 15mm lower than non-sport. You (or someone else) was claiming the ZHP had a tighter feel. I was clarying that that person should know if they're comparing to non ZSP/ZHP springs. ZSP/ZHP is 15mm lower than non-sport.
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Old 05-21-2012, 10:09 PM   #50
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Mango, front ZHP sway bar is 23.5mm not 24. I mean I don't wanna argue over .5 mm, but
Direct from ECS's site: This kit includes your control arms, shocks & struts, bump stops, 24mm front sway bar & bushings, and all related hardware for an easy install.

.5mm whatever. Lets focus on your claim on ZHP control arms having different geometry which offers (in your words) a feel of a shorter steering rack.
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Old 05-21-2012, 10:14 PM   #51
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Originally Posted by E46Mango View Post
Re-read my response to that. I said 15mm lower than non-sport. You (or someone else) was claiming the ZHP had a tighter feel. I was clarying that that person should know if they're comparing to non ZSP/ZHP springs. ZSP/ZHP is 15mm lower than non-sport.
I was being sarcastic.

But yes, I said the ZHP had a tighter feel. And I also said in the same post that it was a tighter feel than both the ZSP and non-ZSP cars.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnIBarr01 View Post
I'm not a physics or geometry major. But I drive a ZHP almost every day as my personal car, and non-ZHP 330i's (ZSP and standard) at work every day. The ZHP has a tighter steering feel and turns quicker than the non-ZHP 3'ers.
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Old 05-21-2012, 10:20 PM   #52
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Cool. Waiting for Terra's pics.
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Old 05-21-2012, 10:25 PM   #53
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Not that it matters, but the ZHP kit comes with a 23.5mm sway bar - http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts...=31&fg=95&hl=1.

In any event, having put that kit on my car, I can say that the difference between the ZHP arms and the non-ZHP OE arms are the ball joints. The shape and heft of the arm is essentially identical between the two. However, if you flip the arm over the ball joints are beefier on the ZHP arms.

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Old 05-21-2012, 10:27 PM   #54
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Indeed beefier. Just like Meyle vs non-ZHP. I'm very familiar with ///M control arms having owned an E36 M3 myself and replacing three sets on various ///Ms. Very nice units, indeed. (never have seen a set fail either--all metal design)
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Old 05-21-2012, 10:34 PM   #55
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very technical... I think the engineers are out!
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Old 05-21-2012, 10:35 PM   #56
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I've been very happy with them. Hopefully you're right that they will last the rest of my ownership of the car

The difference in the outer ball joint is readily apparent:

ZHP seen here - http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1666979
non-ZHP OE here - http://www.ecstuning.com/BMW-E46-325..._Arms/ES49278/

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Old 05-21-2012, 11:01 PM   #57
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The balljoints themselves usually don't fail on the ZHP and ///M arms. It's the rubber casing that does. Means replacing the control arm. My friend's E36 M3 control arms have torn balljoint casing. All grease has leaked out. So I just changed the whole arms for him.
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Old 05-21-2012, 11:20 PM   #58
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what the difference??? It its broken it has to be replaced!
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Old 05-21-2012, 11:27 PM   #59
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Quote:
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If the stamped numbers were the same you either had ZHP or non-ZHP arms side by side?
The only difference externally is the outer ball joint - the actual wishbones are the same, hence the same stamped numbers. (These numbers don't correspond to the part numbers BMW sells since the wishbone and balljoints aren't sold separately).

I couldn't find the original pics, but I did find a bimmerfest post where I uploaded the (admittedly crappy quality) pictures that I took. You can see them here: http://bimmerfest.com/forums/showpos...3&postcount=12 You'll notice that the ZHP arm has metal surrounding the joint, while the non-ZHP arm has what looks like plastic surrounding it.

If you look at the full thread, there are some better quality pictures showing the differences in the first post.
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Old 05-21-2012, 11:33 PM   #60
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Originally Posted by TerraPhantm View Post
The only difference externally is the outer ball joint - the actual wishbones are the same, hence the same stamped numbers. (These numbers don't correspond to the part numbers BMW sells since the wishbone and balljoints aren't sold separately).

I couldn't find the original pics, but I did find a bimmerfest post where I uploaded the (admittedly crappy quality) pictures that I took. You can see them here: http://bimmerfest.com/forums/showpos...3&postcount=12 You'll notice that the ZHP arm has metal surrounding the joint, while the non-ZHP arm has what looks like plastic surrounding it.

If you look at the full thread, there are some better quality pictures showing the differences in the first post.
Thanks for looking into this.
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